Clutch Problem???????
 

I've posted before about the clutch in the RX8. I have never raced the car on the track but have taken off with a slight clutch drop(3000-4000RPM Drop) and 9000RPM gear switch here and there. But thats about it. I say most that own a RX8 do what I do. I really do baby my car!

My problem is when I'm in First gear and at low speeds (3-10mph) and I engage the clutch fast, I hear clank noise. It also does it when I back up and then engage the clutch. But every other gear and when I have it above 10MPH I never hear it. Is it because I'm engaging too fast?

Does anyone else hear this? I know the warranty for the clutch is up I think at 1 year or 12,000 miles. Well thats what Mazda Corp says........

What do you guys think this is? Any help would be great!

Take it into the dealer. There was another member with the same problem who suspected a loose PPF. He never found out exactly what the problem was but they fixed the noise.

CRH

a lot of us have had problems. myself included. i had to get an attorney involved. take it to them and make sure you get documentation of your visit.

I now remember what the problem was on several vehicles-the flywheel bolts were loose and causing a clunking/rattling/creaking sound on engagement.

CRH

Thats what I believe it is. I know the Through-Out bearing have been out ever since 100 miles were on the car. But everyone said it was normal so I didnt think anything of it. I have almost 11,000 on the car so I need to get this checked before 12,000 miles or 1 year hits so my warranty is still good for the clutch.

Well what happened? I may have to print this out and show them. I hate dealing with shit like this. Your clutch, Fly wheel, bolts or anything of that sort shouldnt be going out at such an early time.

exactly. there is no reason why we should have to have threads like this when we just got our cars. I don't trust the transmission in this car. With all that people have had go wrong I begin to wonder when my time will be. I love my car but that is always lingering in the background for me. Do any of you guys feel the same way?

12000 mile warranty on the clutch.... wow Mazda has faith in that part of the car don't they?

Reasons for the transmission and clutch problems?
 

If you are basing this statement on the complaints posted on this forum, your premise that "..very many of the RX-8 owners in the US have severe problems..." is not statistically supportable. Those with problems post, those with no problems don't. How many posts have you read that report no problems with their transmissions? How many RX-8's have this problem versus how many don't? How many RX-8's are on the road in Europe versus the US? Without that kind of data, your statement is a subjective judgment based on very little data. There apparently some problems with the transmissions/clutches, but your characterization of it is misleading and cannot be supported by the anecdotal data on this forum.

This sounds to me like yet another somewhat disguised, self-serving, US-bashing statement from oursmug cousin across the sea. You seem to be saying: We drivers in Europe KNOW how to drive a manual transmission, but you in the US don't, so that's the "problem"? If so, I don't buy it.

It's simple. I've said it before, the car is too cheap in the US. Too many 16-30 year olds are driving it like they stole it. The average Australian wage is about the same as the average US wage, but the car costs over $43500USD here. For the cheapest variant....

The more you pay, the better you look after something. And the more expensive cars are the domain of the better off financially.....ie, older drivers.

16-30 year olds?!!? That's quite an age range to be generalizing driving habits. Sure maybe middle aged men and women are driving 8s like an oldsmobile, fine. But I would argue that there is a huge difference between the maturity of a 16 year old and an 18 year old and a 25 year old. You can't just lump them all together and say that everyone younger than you drives irresponsibly.

I would also like to point out that the RX-8 is marketed as a sports car, and when driven as such, should be able to take it without performance degredation. I drive my 8 in a spirited manner once and a while for sure, but at 5800 miles, I would think the tranny would hold up slightly better than my previous car, a honda accord with over 100k miles on it. As of now, I'd rather have the honda transmission back, it was slicker shifting than the Rx8 is now with 20 times the mileage!

Now, I'm only 23 years old (obviously a horrible driver), I've driven manual transmission cars for 8 years, and never have experianced such rapid transmission quality degredation. I don't drive my 8 like a buick, but I do baby the car and am never hard on the tranny.

As was mentioned previously, think about the hundreds (thousands?) of 23 year olds with 8s that have not had tranny problems. Clearly, there were an above average number of 8s that shipped with bad trannys. Please don't make this an issue about people that are different than you breaking thier car's just because it hasn't happened to you. "Oh the americans are hard on thier cars, they have too many automatics and don't know how to drive stick... those young whippersnappers drive to crazy and break thier cars." Gimme a break, stop whining, and grow up.

Thank God i'm 31 ;)

I think your limits should be set to 16 - 23.5 :D

Other cars have problems with thier trannys too.. when I was getting my shift forks replaced, I did some research and G35 owners were having rebuilt trannys and bent shift forks also.

Dejavu?

http://g35driver.com/forums/showthre...tranny+problem

http://g35driver.com/forums/showthre...tranny+problem

Yeah.... but those cars actually have torque so tranny problems could more easily be attributed to driver abuse ;)

PS - don't get me wrong, I much perfer my redlike above 7k over low-end torque :)

Our cars may lack power per revolution of the engine, but the fact that they rev higher could also be attributing to driver abuse. I think a launch from a torquey engine at 3k is much easier on the tranny than a 7k launch in our car...

I can go with that. Still, the problem is with the drivers, not the car. Not 100% of the time, I make allowances for the odd manufacturing defect....but 90% easy.

The car is just too cheap over there, if Mazda made it 10 grand dearer the gearbox/clutch problems would all but disappear. So would their RX-8 sales, I know! 300 million people have market power, be happy that spare transmissions are cheap too!

Gomez.

I tend to agree, thats why I pointed out that other cars G35 for example, have problems also. However, I feel it's a combination of factors, not one or the other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gomez
It's simple. I've said it before, the car is too cheap in the US. Too many 16-30 year olds are driving it like they stole it. The average Australian wage is about the same as the average US wage, but the car costs over $43500USD here. For the cheapest variant....

The more you pay, the better you look after something. And the more expensive cars are the domain of the better off financially.....ie, older drivers.
Gomez hit it right on the nose, i can't believe how many posts in the past year talking about how to shift i've never driven a standard tranny before. as far as the price point thing $50,000 aus. is not uncommom to pay for an 8, the car is a cherished piece of fine machinery. Very few people have sold their cars in Australia. Just look at ebay 20-30 car for sale, going to buy a EVO or WRX when i sell this thing. The RX-8 is a great car, lets not diminish it's value anymore.

I agree with you- there are some small percentage of actual manufacturing problems (pressure plate bolts backing out) in some of the early trannys, but I think 95% of the failures are from abuse. I too see so many kids getting the RX8 as their first car and beating the shit out of it, dropping the clutch at 7k rpm to try and beat their friends in a race. I think Mazda could have chosen a stronger tranny that would handle more abuse, but if not abused, I feel comfortable that my 6MT is going to last a long, long time.

Mazda sell 2000 RX-8's a year in Australia.....so we've got about 3000 here. I've never seen an Australian report of a transmission failure. I've know of one guy who's had a clutch issue. There are plenty of Aussies who post on this forum.

3P I don't feel the same way regarding the strength of the transmission. Last year there was talk about Judge Ito wrecking two or three of his transmissions while running 14's in the 1/4 mile. That got the fear started. Then I installed nitrous and people kept telling me that I would break my engine and break my trans. I figured, if anything, I would lose my differential, first. I based that thought on the history I read about the FD. (SR Motorsports' Ray Lockhead didn't help matters much when he recently mentioned to Sport Compact Car mag in the feature spread on SR's RX-8 that the factory differential is known to break when power levels exceed the factory levels, or some statement similar to that.) Let me tell you the abuse I have subjected my Renesis/RX-8 to and you tell me if there is are inherent weaknesses.

1) When I talked about installing my nitrous system last year, I was cautioned by those who know the rotary much better than I that any detonation would cause seal failure. During the testing/tuning phase of my install my Renesis experienced loads of detonation from time-to-time. I was smart enough to get off the throttle when I heard it but the point is that the seals are still intact and the car runs better than stock.

2) With my nitrous system in operation I have, on a couple of occasions, accidentally run into the fuel cut during unexpected losses of traction. This was said to be a sure engine-killer. Again, my engine still runs great.

3) Right around the time I got the nitrous system sorted out was when Ito was losing his transmissions. That led people to caution me about my trans. My specualtion was that if we launch our cars at reasonable RPM's and not the redlines mentioned by the magazine guys we should be okay. Also, "bang-shifting" is not what the factory trans is made to do. If we actually avoid trying to shift gears quickly and, instead, shift in a very relaxed manner we will discover quicker shifts to be much easier to accomplish. Both of these approaches have worked for me as I am now running steady 12.7 in the 1/4 mile and have never had a hint of tranny trouble. When I stopped trying to yank the shifter from gear to gear and developed a more refined approach I found my shifts getting very quick and almost sequential in nature.

4) I thought I might experience some differential trouble when I get to the high-11 range but I am much more confident and here's why; since installing my R.B. swaybar set I almost never get wheelhop. There has been an occasion or two where I did experience wheelhop with the nitrous armed. On those occasions I TRIED to break my differential by keeping the throttle to the floor as I figured that was the time it would go, if any. Guess what? My differential still works as it is supposed to and the car is still very reliable. Enough that I drive it in any weather as long as there is less than a couple inches of snow on the road.

5) With my 9 lb. flywheel it is possible to accidentally hit gears that you didn't intend. I found that out the hard way at 80 mph. Shifting into second gear at that speed causes the engine to hit 11,500 rpm. I have done that twice and the engine ain't complaining. Not that I wanted to do that but this engine has forgiven me my idiocy on many levels.

My point is that there are all kinds of stories and, yes, there have been some problems with clutches out there. However, I have experienced none of those things that people predicted about the RX-8 as long as I treated the car with respect and maturity. Even during the times I didn't, the car cut me some slack. It is my belief that the RX-8/Renesis are very durable and capable if we are intelligent in our driving.

Those are my thoughts and feelings, anyway.

CRH

This talk about clutch-drops is complete BS... I've NEVER dropped my clutch. I don't drag race, and I know how to drive a standard damn well. Also explain to me how abuse could possibly lead to reverse gear disenganging by itself on me.

Do some people abuse the 8 and break stuff? Sure, but I think the VAST majority of tranny complaints you're seeing on this board are from responsible owners (regardless of age/experiance) that are having honest manufacturing related issues.

And car cost factoring in? BS... I was a valet for 2 years and you wouldn't believe how many 30-40 year olds would be pulling in with ferraris that they 'drove like they stole them'. Don't generalize , it makes you sound ignorant.

Charles,
Very insightful response. I remember the Poll on how long it would take for people to start breaking things after installing their turbo. Unless I missed one BAS with his PPF loosening (possibly?) is the closest we have heard thus far.

I will make sure to watch how you shift when we get to Road Atlanta next week. I want to see how your shifting is different than mine. It is routine for me to 'get some rubber' when shifting into 2nd & 3rd. I didn't say much, just a little squak or chirp.

well charles that does make me feel better. especially since I am not driving hard. I didn't buy the car to get "kills" on the road. I am glad that you have taken it to extremes to get a good feel for what it can do. Does nitrous have any severe long term effects?

3p0

Trying not to turn a clutch thread into a nitrous thread I'll just say that I have been using my nitrous since last July and I have had no trouble of any kind. In all of my messing around with it I also did a top-end comparison with a really nice 3000GT and forgot I had the nitrous on. He and I spent quite a while well into the triple digits and I realized that I had the spray on for more than 30 seconds, or so. The engine still runs good and at only 55 h.p. I am still using the factory spark plugs. Search for nitrous and read through my several pages for more details and some photos.

RX8'r- My shifting is not something to behold as I am just an idiot with a cool car. However, the light fly makes rev matching(when I am in the mood) much easier and with a light fly quicker shifts are a necessary component of smooth driving because the RPM's drop quicker. The N flash has a mild RPM hold feature as part of the upgrade so it seems to lend itself well to the light flys. As Charlie recommends, so too shall I; before we do your flywheel next weekend get the N if you don't already have it.

My guess with BAS's PPF is that he didn't torque the Hell out of the 8 nuts and 1 bolt that hold it on so it loosened up with the added vibration and torque of a turbo.

CRH

Hahaha. Mate, this whole thread is about generalisations. Generally, what are the reasons for clutch and transmission problems in the US? I have put forward my general theory on why they fail in the US, the thread starter says no problems in Europe, I say no problems in Australia.

As all three markets get the same engine/gearbox package, let's hear your theory on why we have next to no failures and your cars are exploding like grenades????
Generally speaking, of course.... :)

Gomez.

Generally speaking... I think the reason is not a matter of who has failures and who doesn't. Its a matter of statistics. There are a lot more Rx8s in the US and a lot more US members on this forum. So... probability comes into play and you see a disproportionate amount of US cases of tranny failure.

I don't have the hard data on sales figures, if anyone knows I would be interested to take a look at them. But I wouldn't be surprised to see US RX-8 sales at least 10x that of other countries, we simply have a bigger market. (cheap gas doesn't hurt either). The sample size of non-US RX-8 owners on this board simply isn't large enough to get a good idea of tranny reliability. Also, ALL our manuals are the high-output renesis... maybe the 6 speed just isn't up to the task of 9.5k rpm, and due to the numbers, you hear about this happening more in the US.

Also (WARNING, possibly insulting generalization ahead) americans like myself appear to like complaining about stuff more that other people ;) While we're busy trying to find someone to sue for our broken tranny... people in outher countries are just getting them fixed quietly and going on about thier business hehehe.

27000 RX-8's were sold in the US last year, 42000 were exported from Japan.......9000 were bought by the Japanese themselves. (Source: Mazda Media)

So the US took just over half the total RX-8 production run.....

Alrighty, so the majority of RX-8s in existence are within the US and the majority of the board members are in the US (I imagine, plz correct me if I'm wrong). So I think it makes a lot of sense that you hear a lot more about transmission problems from the US. Also, Americans tend to put more mileage per year on cars, so a higher incidence of reliability problems makes a lot of sense.

By the numbers you posted, there are 15,000 non-US RX-8s out there, 9000 of them in Japan, 6000 split up among every other country that imports them. So think of how many english-speaking, non-US RX-8 owners are out there... probably not a whole lot in comparison to the 27,000 US owners.

The numbers seem to speak for themselves. Here's an example, say you ask 2700 people if they watch a particular TV show. Say 5% of them say they do. Now you ask 600 people the same question and 0% of them say they watch the show. Does that mean that nobody in the region that the 600 were picked from watches the TV show? No it doesn't, you have to look at the margin of error for the sample size. The basic margin of error can be calcuated at 1 / square root of the sample size. Margin of error for 2700 = +/- 1.9% while at 600 it is +/- 4%. So if you have a result of 0% on a sample size of 600, then the actual result could be as high as 4% while the actual result for the 2700 sample could be as low as 3.1% Which baisically tells us that you can't possibly say one country breaks more transmissions than the other without gathering some scientific data.

well i had said this before that i was having problems and now finally bringing it to the dealer today let see what they say.my 2 will not go in on high rpms . wish me luck

Good Luck! I have a service appt. on the 22nd... loaner car ready and all, just in case :( I'll feel bad being without my baby, but if I get a brand new tranny out of the deal I'll be pretty happy. If that one is all yucky after 6k miles, then I'll be willing to admit its my 'American' driving style that breaks it ;)

Well just came back from dropping the car and explained to them that when i try to put 2 between 5000 to 7000 rpms it grinds and he told me iam reving it to much lol what a dork.I told them to have a mechanic look at it.so i will find out tommorow.

No.....there are 24000 non-US 2004 RX-8's out there. Total production was nearly 51000, the Japanese kept 9000. As I said, 42000 were exported and you guys got 27000 of them. The Canadians got a few thousand, we got a few thousand, and the Europeans got the bulk of the rest.....5000 went to the UK, actually.

No-one except Mazda can talk specific percentages, generally speaking though :) , anecdotally, you guys are the toughest on the drivetrain.

Gomez.

Ok getting the car back today as they told me nothing is wrong he said they check the linkage on the trans and the snchro everything looks good.

Question is could they really check the snchro if they didnt pull the trans out ????

Well, they certainly couldn't SEE the synchro's. BTW, there is no linkage either. The shifter goes directly into the top of the box.

you think thats what causing the problem ?? i wonder if i can just have someone take my tranny down and check.

i be taking my car to a trans place to get a second opinion.

cas2themoe,
I have the same problem. Going to get it looked at soon. Did you you ever take it in to have it checked out? Also, do you hear it when you start the car also? Damn annoying. First tiem I heard it I was showing the car off to my fiance and we both heard the rattling noise when I accelerated. Got to love those first impressions.