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Replaced the gasket between exhaust manifold and cat with a Walker-OEM style yesterday. Now it doesn't sound like a clapped out 1990's Honda Civic anymore.
Idle MAF rate is still lower than I'd like (~4.5 g/s). Even at its worst, the old engine showed 4.8-ish. The low LTFT is around +8% but medium and high are less than +1%. I smoked the intake but didn't find anything, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I'm not going to lie: break-in periods are the WORST. I can already tell there's more power on-tap even below 4k rpm. I want to wring it out to 9k in the WORST WAY.
Regarding engine break-in, RotaryGod makes a compelling argument that dovetails nicely with my desire to not wait to enjoy my reman...
Originally Posted by rotarygod
I agree with the run hard breakin. Let's face it, at the speeds the engine turns, those wimpy little springs under the seals aren't what is holding them to the walls of the combustion chamber. It is the inertia of the seals but more importantly the pressure of the gasses within the engine. At low loads and low speeds, we don't have as much of either. The seals aren't really wearing in as quickly. Any small irregularites are also more likely to be skipped over by the seals too. Running it hard at first holds pressure against the walls and allows the seals to break in very quickly and evenly. The 1st 20 miles of a new engines life are the most critical ones. None of this matters what type of engine it is.
People like to say that you are also breaking in the bearings. Untrue completely. If your oil is doing it's job properly, there is never any metal to metal contact in bearings. It can't really break in if it never touches anything. The only time you ever see evidence of metal to metal contact within bearings is when the oil system fails or when a car has been sitting a long time without being started and the oil has drained out of the engine. Any markings you see are not from breaking in but rather another source.
Breaking in an engine in this manner will result in a better sealing engine that makes mroe power. Several auto manufacturers rev their engines up to redline immediately after they warm up on the first startup. Race teams do this as well. They don't do it because they get rebuilt every so often. They do it because it makes more power and that plus reliability are what is needed to win a race. Time between rebuilds is irrelevant.
Slow gentle breakin periods that are recommended are the worst way to break in an engine. Ponder this, if something is done wrong once, and then the same thing is done wrong again and again until it becomes common practice and widely accepted, when does this wrong become right? The fact is that wrong never becomes right but rather the perception of what is wrong and right changes.
Here's how to properly break in a new engine. The very first time it is started let it warm up to normal opperating temperatures. You don't want to floor it immediately after it starts up as some oil has flowed off of the bearings and you need time for it to recirculate. Once at warm up temperature, drive hard! take it up through the gears at full throttle several times. Drive the engine hard for about the first 20 miles. Then change the oil and the filter. Yes after only 20 miles. The hard break in on the seals (not the bearings) has left some metal shavings in the system that need to be removed. Only mineral based oils should be used during breakin. Drive the rest of the first 500 miles as you normally would the car. At 500 miles change the oil and filter again. At this point you can switch to synthetics if you want to. I run them in my rotaries. I don't care what the manual says. Results say more than words in a book. Over half of your break in was done in the first 20 miles and the other half was done in the next 500 or so miles. That's it. No need to baby the car around. You'll most likely make less power in the long run this way. This is a very different way of thinking but it works.
Regarding engine break-in, RotaryGod makes a compelling argument that dovetails nicely with my desire to not wait to enjoy my reman...
I agree with that. I followed Pinapples recommendation which is only baby it for 500 miles IIRC, then change oil, then send it. But I changed the oil at 1000 and 2000 miles as well. It's not a new engine so just drive that bitch.
Pineapple Racing
Recommended Engine Break-in Procedure
Page 2
2. After engine reaches operating temperature, bleed air from cooling system as necessary per factory service manual.
3. Check oil level.
4. Allow engine to run for approximately 30 min. in neutral varying rpms, then turn off. allow the engine to cool, then change oil and filter.
5. Especially for turbocharged engines: make sure spark and fuel mapping are safe for engine break-in. We recommend the engine tuner prevent the engine from exceeding recommended break-in operation specifications.
6. For the first 500 miles of driving, allow engine extra time to warm up before driving the car and do not exceed 4000rpm. Turbocharged engines should run minimal boost during the first 500 miles.
7. Change oil and filter at 500 miles.
8. From 500 to 2000 miles, gradually increase engine rpm and load to the point of occasionally bringing the engine rpm to 7000 using no more than ¾ throttle.
9. Dyno-testing/tuning is the best way to get the most out of your new engine. While not necessary for non-turbo applications, it should be done for turbo cars.
10. Check oil level frequently during break-in. During break-in, any engine can consume a noticeable quantity of oil. Running an engine low, or out of oil, will void your warranty.
Failure to follow break-in instructions does not necessarily cause immediate engine failure. BUT we have found it will greatly shorten the life of many of the components.
For example, we have seen oil control rings loose ½ their life from lack of break-in. Consider your hard earned money and time when deciding a break-in procedure.
These instructions are not intended to supersede any other engine builder’s recommendations. They should have been chosen for their skill and knowledge. If they cannot provide you with the technical support you require, consider that the next time you look for an engine builder.
Oil Recommendations:
Manufacturer: any quality brand of oil is OK except Pennzoil. I dislike this one brand for buildup reasons.
Startup Oil Weight: For startup use a dead dinosaur(mineral based) oil in a 0w20 through 10w30.
S2 starter I assumed, I get about 280-290RPM on mine. 275RPM is good for the latest S1 starter.
My starter was replaced under warranty over 10 years ago when I complained about long/slow starts during the winter.
Maybe it has to do with the trunk relocation. I ran 1/0 gauge wire (which turned out to be SWG and not AWG, not that it matters a whole lot) from B+ directly to the starter. I kept the factory (4 gauge? 6 gauge? Whatever it is, it's about 1/2 as thick as the 1/0 SWG) wire from there to the rest of the wiring harness.
I tied B- directly into the chassis in the trunk with 1/0 SWG. I also upgraded the ground from the LIM to the chassis near the air pump to 1/0 and cleaned the crap out of and added dielectric grease to the grounds on the front crossmember and top of the engine.
Beyond that,
Originally Posted by Kamal El
How is your engine?
It's going fine. I haven't put as many miles on it as I'd like so I'm only up to about 300 right now. It's incredibly smooth relative to the hunk of junk that it replaced and the fuel trims are all between 0 and +6%. No complaints.
It's been fine but weather and scheduling have made putting miles on it difficult.
Welcome to January 107th.
I'm at 700 miles but I haven't done a compression test since that first one. I plan to do an oil change and compression test this weekend. Probably take care of trans and diff fluids at the same time.
Got the oil, diff, and gearbox fluids done. Managed to damage some of my crapptacular wiring for the sensors feeding my arduino gauge so now the oil temp is intermittent. Will have to redo that.
Was going to do the compression test but plans changed when some asspirate tried to pass my wife on the left while she was turning left. She's fine but the CX-3 is going to need new rear driver side door and possibly some frame work. We'll see.
Compression test results! (840.7 miles, ~600 ft elevation, ~30.14 inHg barometric pressure) Front rotor Rear rotor Trailing plugs (because they were already out). Front on left, rear on right.
Last edited by NotAPreppie; 04-24-2018 at 07:37 AM.
Thanks. We filed a claim with the other guy's insurance. They called back telling us where to take our car for an estimate. Then they called back again asking to speak with us because they are investigating whether he is actually covered. Hopefully they are just trying to figure out if his Lyft app was in "driver mode" or not. If not, his insurance should cover it. If so, Lyft should back him up.
I hope.
I'm satisfied. I'm hoping the rear rotor numbers come up a bit but what can you do?
My only complaint about the engine (aside from Mazda's engineering shortfalls) was the crunchy threads on the front-most oil injector port. It was a little scary trying to run a tap in and out while keeping metal shavings out. I think it's safe to say I succeeded since it was the front rotor and that's pretty strong.
I'm glad you're satisfied. I went with a guy called turbo Clinic. Says that he builds for Mazda. When I went to his shop I must admit I was impressed but I can imagine how having less-than-perfect compression numbers can be frustrating with this car. I don't have a Mazda compression tester so I hope to have him do the compression test with the engine outside of the car.
So far my rebuild
Turbo Clinic? Be prepared to be frustrated and disappointed when your rebuilt motor doesn't last very long. Often he only replaces all the gaskets and seals, cleans the engine components, sprays them down with graphite sprays and stuff to make them appear like they were resurfaced and treated from basic phone quality pictures, paints the outside of the block to look cool, slaps it together and throws it back in your car. It's cheap because you're getting what you pay for, and he earned the bad reputation that he has because of his business practices and how he has taken shortcuts. Do your research and question everything. Check your rebuild in person frequently and ask for invoices or receipts for all the parts used in your rebuild along with any claims of treating or reconditioning/resurfacing of any parts. Get pictures of everything. Do what you must to protect yourself. Hell, even tell him you want to be there when your motor is assembled.
He can have a temper at times and I wouldn't be surprised if he read this post and gets pissed off. Freedom of speech is awfully nice, and I'd rather say something than nothing at all. Here's to hopes that he has either changed his ways from the past and/or you get the rebuild you were promised.
Back on thread topic: Thanks OP for everything you are providing in this thread. I have this thread bookmarked and saved so in the not too distant future I will reference all of this for when I buy a Mazda reman online similar to how you did to install in my 8. Your contribution to the forum and community is greatly appreciated.
Turbo Clinic? Be prepared to be frustrated and disappointed when your rebuilt motor doesn't last very long. Often he only replaces all the gaskets and seals, cleans the engine components, sprays them down with graphite sprays and stuff to make them appear like they were resurfaced and treated from basic phone quality pictures, paints the outside of the block to look cool, slaps it together and throws it back in your car. It's cheap because you're getting what you pay for, and he earned the bad reputation that he has because of his business practices and how he has taken shortcuts. Do your research and question everything. Check your rebuild in person frequently and ask for invoices or receipts for all the parts used in your rebuild along with any claims of treating or reconditioning/resurfacing of any parts. Get pictures of everything. Do what you must to protect yourself. Hell, even tell him you want to be there when your motor is assembled.
He can have a temper at times and I wouldn't be surprised if he read this post and gets pissed off. Freedom of speech is awfully nice, and I'd rather say something than nothing at all. Here's to hopes that he has either changed his ways from the past and/or you get the rebuild you were promised.
Back on thread topic: Thanks OP for everything you are providing in this thread. I have this thread bookmarked and saved so in the not too distant future I will reference all of this for when I buy a Mazda reman online similar to how you did to install in my 8. Your contribution to the forum and community is greatly appreciated.
Say it ain't so! I thought i did do good enough research on them. I did ignore a couple of red flags because i thought he wasn't sure whether or not i gave him my core or a junkyard core. So i sent him a vid of me removing my engine after I delivered it to him for reassurance. I don't take getting ripped off too kindly. I'm an angel until you **** me then you'll wish you've never met me.
I'm glad you're satisfied. I went with a guy called turbo Clinic. Says that he builds for Mazda.
Unless this is his side gig, he's blowing smoke up your skirt. Mazda have their own facility with their own staff to build engines.
The fact that it doesn't look like he masked anything off before spraying the blue stuff on has me a little concerned.
Originally Posted by Xero Ryuu
Back on thread topic: Thanks OP for everything you are providing in this thread. I have this thread bookmarked and saved so in the not too distant future I will reference all of this for when I buy a Mazda reman online similar to how you did to install in my 8. Your contribution to the forum and community is greatly appreciated.
Thanks and you're welcome!
Just keep in mind that this is all anecdotal and there's no large body of statistically relevant evidence. Your experience may be very different from mine.
I'm glad you're satisfied. I went with a guy called turbo Clinic. Says that he builds for Mazda.
Unless this is his side gig, he's blowing smoke up your skirt. Mazda have their own facility with their own staff to build engines.
The fact that it doesn't look like he masked anything off before spraying the blue stuff on has me a little concerned.
Yeah that's a bunch of BS. He does not build for Mazda, he has a business account and gets parts from them sometimes for rebuilds. He often builds for smaller dealers or people who are having hot start issues and want his super cheap $1,800 starting rebuild price (just new seals and gaskets and calls it a day, often not great quality parts at that price) just to get the car back on the road to get it sold.
03-19-2018, 06:27 PM
..... I think it's past it's prime !
