Help: Greddy turbo installed..idle problem
 

Hey guys,

I had my GReddy turbo kit installed this week and got the car back yesterday. It is running great, but when the car comes down to idle, such as at a traffic light, the idle drops down real low, the car tries to go dead (and sometimes does) then it bounces around and stabilizes. Anyone have any ideas about why this is happening?

I have the original GReddy kit (blue), blow off installed, and GReddy Profec boost controller.

The installers did a very professional job and the car runs like a bat out of hell, and I only seem to have the idle problem.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

sounds like your bov is too loose.

tighten it up 1/4 turns at a time until it gets better

I dont think the installer is really that professional if he cant even solve this problem.

Have you tune it yet ? EMB suck ass, u might want to upgrade it to the EMU if u want a better car.

Check the BOV, and for loose hoses. But please upgrade your engine management asap.

clean ur maf..................that can be an issue right there idling...........

Thanks for the info
 

Hey...thanks for the replies. I too believed the BOV was too "loose". They said when I took it from them that I would need to do some tweaking....that they would let me tune it. The install was real nice though. I'll post some pictures soon.

I bought an emanage ultimate, but nobody could tell me how to set the jumpers, etc. I am aware GReddy has an upgrade kit. I plan to do this asap. Can someone tell me what this will gain me, as far as overall performance? I seem to be getting some stumbling, especially in the higher gears. It is quite difficult to drive really. I'd like to enhance drivability if anyone has any suggestions, I'd appreciate it. My only turbo car experience was a pretty much stock Mitsu 3kgt twin turbo.

Anyway, thank you very much and I'll make some changes to the BOV as well as tune up the Profec and see what happens, and let you guys know.

Important: Did it come with the original hoses or someone put on new ones?

The Greddy kit shipped with crappy hoses that would fail and cost you an engine. Also, I think you need some kind of restrictor on the oil line. Fix that stuff and you have a fine kit. Don't fix it and you risk your engine.

Also, look for posts by mysql101, He has the Greddy kit.

Posts picts and dyno results when you can.

whats your a/f scracp the crapp emb... intx!!!!

EMB is garbage.

but he really needs to SEARCH

Stop looking for easy answers, u will never learn.

Not installing an oil restrictor could cause bearing failure within the turbo, but unless you get an oil leak, or start burining a lot of oil, this will not cause engine failure - only the turbo will break. Still a good idea, though.

Answers to the problems...
 

Go easy on me guys. I'm not looking for the easy answers out of laziness. I'm looking to you for your experience. You have all been there and done that, and I really appreciate your help. I have been doing my homework.

When I took the car in to have the system installed, I gave them the definitive fixes sheet that I printed from the forum. I asked them to perform items 1 and 2. Apparently, that sheet got lost, and they didn't do it. With that said, I have determined my major problem is the #2 fix. My wastegate signal is currently tapped from the intake manifold....bam...big problem. I'm having all the symptoms that is caused by tapping off the intake. Stumbling, rough idle, car goes dead, running rich...eye watering rich...BOV opening up WAY too often, even though I stiffened it up.

The shop is going to relocate the line as described in fix #2. I also have an oil restrictor on order. Why the hell didn't GReddy put this restrictor in???!! Anyway, they are going to take care of all of these. I can't decide if I will do fix #3, get the Int-X, or the emanage ultimate upgrade kit. If anyone can tell me what seems to work best for all of you, I will go that way. I want my setup optimal.

I have an OBDII scan tool that gives me the A/F ratio, but I have not checked it yet. I have a WB O2 with A/F gauge, but it is not currently installed. I suppose I should go ahead and install that this weekend. I do have an exhaust temp gauge installed. It is running about 600 Deg C at idle with peak of about 1.2k Deg C.

Thanks again for the help.

Changing the location of the WG signal will not fix any of those problems. You can fart around with the emanage and improve the way the car runs, but my personal suggestion is just to get an Intx. If you stay with the emanage, sever the P2 injectors and get it tuned, that should improve things considerably.

Your OBDII A/f is not accurate....hookup your Wideband so you can get some decent results. You will see what I mean when you do it. The stock O2 doesn't like A/F muck below 12.0

Re: wideband O2
 

As for the wideband O2, are you guys connecting it strictly as a monitor, or are you putting it where the factory WB is?

It seems there is a lot of conflicting information on the boards. Mazdamaniac says that the relocation of the wastegate vacuum line will fix the problems I am seeing as stated in the definitive GReddy fixes. Now I have a message saying that won't fix anything. I have seen some say to use the emanage ultimate, some to use the Int-X. I know this stuff is not one size fits all. However, what I am having trouble undestanding is how GReddy even released this kit if it had that many problems. And what further aggitates me is that they are charging for their fixes, when they should be free since they screwed it up. Who said anything was fair though.

I think you are confusing MM's post somewhat. Severing the injectors, which is one of the Greddy fixes will minimize many of the problems you are experiencing. Relocating the WG signal just makes the car somewhat more driveable by making the boost less sensitive to throttle position. The emanage ultimate is not plug-n-play. It can work, but it will require patience and talent. The Intx is more-less plug-n-play. Even with the base map that comes with the Intx your car should run almost like it did stock. Tuning it further is a good idea though as all cars are a little different. It will increase your reliability and net you a few more HP.

Two years ago I was were you are now. I went through the same thing. I highly recommend the Intx.

Regarding definitive fix #2
 

Here is the excerpt from MazdaManiac's definitive GReddy fixes. I have marked in bold why I thought this (relocating the WG signal) was what was needed to fix my troubles. Again, my trouble is stumbling, eye watering rich exhaust (carbon too), rough idle, and the car stalls out when I stop at a red light, or if I let it go back to idle. See below...or am I going nuts!! Keep in mind I have BOV installed, but I have a boost controller, so my boost is not spiking to 20 PSI. I have the Defi gauges. The boost was spiking to 11 according to the peak display, but I have it tuned down now, and I am driving her easy.

Apparently the Int-X is the best thing going, and if it is almost completely plug and play, then all the better.

Problem #2 is a little more complex and troubling, but the solution is equally simple.
Because Greddy chose to acquire the wastegate signal from the manifold rather than the turbo outlet, the turbo is constantly trying to produce boost. Nominally in all other systems I have either built or worked with, the wastegate signal is plumbed to the outlet of the turbo so that it will open when there is no need for boost.
Because the wastegate doesn't open at part throttle, the turbo spools up to very high boost levels - possibly beyond 20 PSI. This boost has nowhere to go as the kit is shipped and ends up stalling the compressor. Those with blow-off valves installed find that the valve often opens, causing a rich condition and stumbling as well as idle problems and stalling.Unchecked, this over-speed condition will eventually destroy the turbo's bearings or worse. It also causes the PCM to retune for the lost air on BOV-equipped vehicles. Furthermore, it may damage the throttle body (some have experienced this, IIRC) and puts a lot of stress on the rest of the cold side of the system.
The fix is to simply install a vacuum nipple in the outlet pipe of the turbo and plumb a line to the wastegate. You can use an 1/8" nipple with an 1/8" NPT fitting tapped into the pipe. This can be done in about an hour with simple tools and a drill and the parts are available at Home Depot and the like.
The drawback is that the net maximum boost in the intake manifold will be about 2 PSI lower on cars not equipped with boost controllers. Those with boost controllers can program in the desired target boost and the net benefit is that the controller will have finer control over the boost since the cracking point will be effectively lower due to the earlier availability of pressure. This means equally fast spool without the surge and less over-shoot. This fix is absolutely essential to the survival of the turbo itself.
It also has the side benefit of making the part throttle/off-idle drivability much easier because the throttle isn't always fighting boost. Now you are not forced to spin your wheels every time you leave a stop light (though you still can if you want to).

Somebody...anybody....is this my major problem?

ok....I am going to move the WG signal to the turbo outlet and see what happens. I will upgrade to the Interceptor-X asap.

The stumbling I mention in fix #2 is a result of "unused" boost. That is not the only tuning issue, just one of the many possible causes for that behavior.

Ryan has given you good advice, though I can't say I'm a particular proponent of the Int-X.
It does work really well out of the box in that it produces good, safe power, but it is not a good solution if you want OEM-like drivability and compliance since it is effectively an alpha-n system.

Thanks
 

Jeff...thanks for jumping in.

I have an oil restrictor sitting in a box on my front porch. That is going in asap. Hopefully tomorrow or Monday. I will be moving the line for the wastegate/boost pressure signal to the turbo outlet area as well. I'd like to develop more power and increase the boost down the road, but I just want the rich idle, stumbling, and stalling to go.

I did quite a bit of research, as well as talking to my brother about where to tap the pressure signal, and he says same as you, that it should always be tapped near or on the turbo compressor output or the housing. He says many turbos come tapped already for a hose barb.

You seem to have extreme experience with all of the flavors of emanage. In your opinion, what is the best thing for me to do? I want this absolutely right, and I want it ready for HP increases. My BOV is vented to the atmosphere. I understand that this can cause some problems itself, especially since the mass airflow sensor is right at the air intake. I found a nifty solution from GReddy which will fit my Type RS BOV. It is a threaded-in piece that goes in place of the nozzle which is spring loaded and prevents premature pressure release at low RPM and idle. Here is a link to it at ATP turbo. Do you have an opinion on this device, or blowing off to the atmosphere in general? I can do without the swoosh sound, lol.

The link is:
http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/me...egory_Code=BCS

Thanks again Jeff. By the way, I love the ever changing avatar. :)

I use a BOV vented to atmosphere. It isn't a problem if you tune for it.
The EMU is good out to whatever power level you like.
It has, like every other solution, its own drawbacks. Its capabilities are only constrained by the abilities of the person doing the tuning.

I tightened my BOV down pretty tight this evening, and it really helped a lot with drivability. The power delivery is much smoother as well. I hope to get both the oil restrictor and the relocation of the vacuum lines to the turbo outlet done this weekend, or Monday. I guess an upgraded ECU is forthcoming, and in the meantime, I'll do the wire cut to the injectors and load the new maps. I'll try to get some pics of the installation up this weekend as well. So much to learn...so little time.

Fixed!! Definitive fix #2 took care of the problem.
Thanks for the help everyone.