Curt’s Gr8t 8 Turbo Build
 

I’m writing this build thread w/ the intention to make a positive contribution to the community from which I’ve learned so much, pro & con, about our cars and FI over more than a decade. Hope the challenges…, resolutions…detailed in my build thread will add to the reservoir of useful information and be of assistance to others who may choose to undertake the same. Some quick data points:

• Forum join date: 1Q06
• Initially investigated FI: 3Q07 – 1Q10. Backed away b/c I was uncomfortable w/ hardware, software, tuning options.
• ~1Q17 (car long paid off, & warranty expired, ;-) Had a revived interest in potentially boosting my 8 and began investigating FI again. Pleasantly found a more mature aftermarket offering IMO improved hardware, S/W, and tuning options.

Many thanks to this forum, it’s admins., contributors, those who’ve posted build threads, & all who’ve been committed to driving theory, experiential or substantiated knowledge, and improvements particularly w/in the Major Horsepower environment. Below are a few, but by no means an exhaustive list:

• Brettus
• Mazda Maniac
• Rotarygod
• Kane
• RX-Tuner
• Gregs
• Charles Hill
• Mysql101
• RotaryMachineRX
• tdiddy
• ChrisRX8PR
• Strokercharged95gt
• JimmyBlack
• TeamRX8
• and more…

Most valued build thought: “At some point, everything's gonna go south on you... everything's going to go … you can either accept that, or you can get to work. That's all it is. You just begin. You do the math. You solve one problem... and you solve the next one... and then the next. And If you solve enough problems ... you'll have the reward of driving a rad 8. ;-) Adapted from Mark Watney, “The Martian”

My Approach:

• Read, read, read, avoid mistakes, and incorporate lessons learned by others.
• Plan. Work systemically. Installation sequence is important.
• Be methodical, organized, and work the plan.
• Do no harm

Most valued build tools:

• Assorted 10, 12, 14, & 17mm sockets and wrenches
• 4 ½” grinder
• Floor jack & stands

2005 RX8 GT, BB

• Purchase date: 1Q06
• Purchase mileage: ~ 50 mi.
• New engine @: ~80k
• Current mileage: ~140k
• Current compression: ~ 740 kPa / 107 PSI @ 220rpm (front & rear rotors

BOM:

• Kit: RX8Performance
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  • Precision Turbo CEA Billet 6266sp dual ball ceramic bearing turbo. V-band in and out, .82 A/R. (Sept. 2018 - May 2021)
  • Precision Turbo CEA Billet 5862sp dual ball ceramic bearing turbo. V-band in and out, .82 A/R. (May 2021 - present)
  • Precision Turbo 46 mm wastegate and spring kit allowing 17 different boost level combinations.
  • Tig Welded 11 Gauge 100% Stainless Steel manifold
  • Tig Welded 3 inch Stainless Steel downpipe with v-band wastegate port
  • Bead rolled 6061 Aluminum charge tubes
  • Synapse Blow-Off valve with recirculation fitting, hose and clamps
  • Large Bar and plate front mount Intercooler (12" Sept. 2018 - May 2021, 8" May 2021 - present)
  • Adjustable Intercooler mount to accommodate aftermarket bumper covers
  • High Quality Reinforced Silicone Couplers
  • Stainless Steel T-Bolt Clamps
  • 3.5 inch Cold Air intake with MAF Air Straighter
  • Passengers side motor mount bracket and mounting hardware
  • Braided stainless steel oil feed and return lines with hardware
• Tuner: 1st Brettus........, then self

Aux.

• Borla exhaust
• BHR de-catted midpipe w/ resonator
• RX8P 72mm dual-pass aluminum radiator
• Mitsubishi N3R3-18-400 starter
• DW200 255 lph fuel pump
• Rex D585 ignition coil upgrade kit
• RX8P high capacity oil pan
• Higher pressure oil regulator kit
• Flex-a-lite 420 low profile fan
• Lower temp, 165-175F, oil cooler thermostats (removed)
• L: NGK R6725-9s (aka NGK 6448 / 7420-9), T:6725-10s
• Yellow (P1: Y (476) / Sec: UN-Y (850) / P2: UN-Y (850) injectors
• oil filter relocation kit

Monitor, Tuning & Control:

• Greddy Profec B Spec 2 EBC
• ***AEM 30-4900 WB failsafe gauge, AFR & boost ...(Very useful gauge...allows data-logging of boost & afr profile mapping against rpm/ time)
• Prosport IAT gauge
• Prosport coolant temp gauge
• Prosport oil temp gauge
• Prosport fuel pressure gauge
• M/E & Tactrix 2.0 MAF tune

Engine Rebuild & Hardening:

• Atkins closing kit (w/all seals & springs)
• Turblown precision stud kit
• Pineapple solid dowel kit
• Pineapple HD water seals
• Street Port (...on initially boosted engine. No porting on current engine)

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Let’s get at it… So, first up…prep-work (some shown above):
- dry ran assembly of the kit
- heat wrapped manifold, & downpipe
- 2nd dry run fit after wrapping.
- drilled & tapped intake & charge tubes
- installed intake and charge hose fittings

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First matter of install business was to prepare my 8 for install, and tackle fuel system work:
- lifted my 8, and drained the oil
- removed under cover, air box, TB, & UIM
- battery h/b relocated to trunk a while back
- installed new fuel injectors (Sec & P2) and swapped existing yellows into P1
- installed fuel pressure sender
- pressure tested fuel system. (Greg, Thx for pointing me to this process!)

Fuel system pressurization process: https://workshop-manuals.com/mazda/r...ion/page_3937/

- unfortunately, the pressure test revealed a fuel leak.
- removed, inspected, greased, & re-inserted fuel injectors. (Brett, Thx for the best practice assist)
- Retested & confirmed fuel leak resolved.

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While working top-side I continued w/ gauge senders, AP hardware delete and oil filter relocation.
- Installed water, oil & fuel press senders
- removed air pump hardware
- plumbed vac hoses to OMP, & jet air (while UIM was off)
- removed deleted AP vac hose, & plugged solenoid
- installed oil filter relocation kit head mount
- started playing w/ ideas for catch can and remote oil filter mount


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Next transitioned to working underside…
- removed ~200 F OEM :nono: and installed 175F oil cooler thermostats :yesnod:
- removed the three structural braces
- removed OEM oil pan
- installed new high capacity oil pan
- discovered that the turbo oil drain port on the pan was obstructed by the trans bell housing
- ground trans bell housing to create clearance to terminate turbo oil drain
- installed new spark plugs

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Turbo setup looks real clean, looking forward to the build, subscribing....

Impressed with your systematic approach to the task . Looking good !

Clean install so far, and good pics. Nice to see one of these kits up close - quality looks good.
That trick with greasing the injector seals is a killer!

FMIC mounting…
- mounted IC w/ the RX8P bracket
- attempted to re-install the crash bar, but couldn’t…
- discovered two issues w/ the RX8P IC mount:
1. the IC position obstructed remounting of the crash bar.
2. the RX8P bracket obstructed the CAI access into the engine bay.
- Resolution: designed my own IC bracket, which resolved both issues.
- cut off the bottom ½ of the crash bar to increase direct airflow to more bars of the IC. (adopted idea from Discotech’s thread)
- re-mounted crash bar w/ IC mount

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Looks good. Put some plumbing tape on the AN fittings as they can leak

• Test 1: ~ 7 PSI air leak at BOV. Resolution: Loose hose clamp, and not completely seated BOV nose flange.
  • Test 2: ~ 10 PSI black expansion cap blew off. :yelrotflm Trip to Lowes ...replaced with hard PVC coupler w/ cap.
    • Test 3: @ 20 PSI, leak down rate is ~ 3 psi over 60 secs.

- Vid: Pressure test vid (May have to cut & paste in browser):
https://photos.app.goo.gl/yam3FziVfGRLagk58

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W/ system successfully pressure tested…finished running & plumbing vac & charge hoses…
- removed pressure tester, and reinstalled CAI & TB couplers.
- normalized jet air & OMP (w/ chk valves), and oil filler vac hoses.
- ran UIM charge / vacuum hoses to BOV
- fitted tee @ UIM rear port (...to support EBC & AEM vac/boost source)
- ran charge section hoses to WG and EBC control module

Edit: I rerouted the WG control lines. They now route over the trans then down to the WG. Much better routing for their protection as shown in last pic.

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Rerouted WG control lines.

W/ engine bay work complete, transitioned to electronics…
- located required signal sources:

• 12V: from main
• 12V switched: source from main, relay switched “on” via tap to interior fuse #3 (Aux pwr)
• 12V Headlight: from main fuse box, #10 (Headlight low)

- bundled, wrapped, and pulled wires & vac/charge hose into passenger compartment
- dismantled interior console & dash
- mounted 3-gauge dash mount console

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• Ckt 1: Profec B2 EBC
• Ckt 2: AEM AFR/boost failsafe
• Ckt 3: IAT and coolant temp (on dash)
• Ckt 4: fuel press and oil temp (on center console)

- assembled relay / fuse box
- wired relay / fuse box, gauges, and EBC

Note: Mad respect for those who do this slow, tedious work for a living.

- modified ashtray area for Greddy EBC...
- installed gauges, and EBC

See gauge start-up vid: (May have to cut & paste into browser):

Note: The Prosport coolant & oil temp, and fuel pressure gauge backlights transition:
- white (when headlights off)
- red (when headlights on)

You Tube

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First start-up!
- she started easily...like pre-turbo, but…
- first start-up vid:

You Tube

- bad news:

• loud...exhaust manifold leak. :-/
• oil leak, which turned out to be multiple sources: filter reloc head mount & oil pan

***Note: installing new hardware is exhilarating. Removing new hardware is NOT. :wallbash:

- began diagnosis and resolution of exhaust mani leak
- removed recirc, comp inlet, midpipe, DP, & detached turbo from mani.
- removed oil drain and moved turbo forward in the space
- cleaned garage before proceeding... out of frustration and b/c it was a mess. :mad:

Delivering the package…
- labored long literally to remove mani... (challenging.)
- finally, the baby is DELIVERED! Turbo & mani out.

**Note: First time install and removal was a BEAST!

- discovered the exhaust leak was a result of the studs still being too long to accommodate the mani runner tight radius bends! The studs were making contact w/ the runners, prohibiting the mani from seating fully, and creating likely ~ 1-2 mm gap along entire bottom of mani to engine. Smh

• though I ground the studs initially... I failed to confirm them short enough. :wallbash:
• See pics: The red & black marks are the lengths of the bottom left & middle studs respectively. You can see the mani backplate to runner distance is too short to accommodate the stud length.

- So, it’s the grinder again for the offending studs and confirmed them short enough for the manifold to fully seat.


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QA little mani work…
- I took the opportunity having removed the mani to address another *potentially* contributing issue I identified early on but chose to initially ignore. IMO the kit is well designed from a flow and quality of fabrication perspective.

- However, I found the distance between the mani middle runner and turbine mount too tight for my install comfort. With the turbine mounted to mani, my turbo (6266) compressor clocking range was limited thereby increasing the difficulty of simultaneously achieving a proper turbine seal and comp. outlet facing out into the passenger wheel well…all in a tight work space.
**Note: I’m not saying that installation as is was not possible, simply that it made the task more difficult.

- So I sourced a local fabricator to "work" the middle runner over (away from the turbine mount) creating ~ 15-20 deg. additional clocking, which resulted in a much easier install. See the pre & post comp outlet best clocking position pics below.


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Note: Bestcompressor outlet clocking position before reworking ex-mani.

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Note: Bestcompressor outlet clocking position after reworking ex-mani. Gained 15-20 deg. additional clocking range.

So, moved on to addressing the oil pan leak.
- removed oil pan, cleaned sealant, and re-installed.
- after allowing oil pan sealant to cure refilled her w/oil
- started her again...
- better…, but still had an exhaust leak!! :wallbash:
- …and small, but present oil leak as well. :wallbash:
- vid: 2nd engine start: (May have to cut & paste into browser):

You Tube

"At some point, everything's gonna go south on you... everything's going to go … you can either accept that, or you can get to work. That's all it is. You just begin. You do the math. You solve one problem... and you solve the next one... and then the next. And If you solve enough problems, you get to ...” drive a rad 8. - Excerpted from Watney, “The Martian”

- So, addressing the exhaust leak first…this time used soapy water to t-shoot & confirm source(s) of leak. (Travis – Thx for the best practice assist.)
- Yep,… exhaust leak still at mani B-L & B-M studs. “
- re-drained oil and started disassembly... BOV, comp inlet, motor mounts, midpipe, WG, DP, turbo, etc.

NOTE: I took this opportunity to address another challenge to achieving a tight mani seal. The OEM nut only has flats across the first ~1/2 of the nut.
- So, the nut is inaccessible straight on (d/t runners),
- inaccessible from beneath (d/t engine iron flange);
- leaving a ~ 45 degree window to access the nut.
- And since the nut only has flats on the first 1/2 of its width, the "grippable" portion recedes away as you tighten it. Perfect storm!

- bought standard 10x1.5mm nuts, but they didn't work for tight locations...too big, & require 17mm vs. 14mm wrench
- ultimately resolved by:

- https://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...-_-1206-_-CONF

- final config was to use the standard 10x1.5 nuts on easy access, upper mount locs, and OEM nuts w/ flanges ground off installed backwards on lower tight mount locs.
- reassembled EVERYTHING, filled her w/oil and started her.
- Note: install / removal of the turbo and mani get somewhat easier as you learn the ins & outs of it w/ practice. Even fitted the turbine cover this time.
- She fired right up & purred like a big cat. E-mani leak resolved! :bluesuit:

- I dunno..., but I thought I saw her smile. :yelrotflm

- Vid: 3rd engine start vid:

You Tube

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Tight window to reach the lower ex-mani nuts. :cussing:
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Two of three bottom ex-mani nuts are inaccessible w/ a standard 14mm wrench.
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My solution: modify the nuts fitted to the difficult access positions.
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Ok, now on to the slippery oil leak…
- on further inspection the oil leak seemed to be emanating from the sensor mount.
- so ordered a new oil level sensor o-ring.
- removed oil pan again, cleaned sealant again
- installed oil level sensor o-ring w/ a tiny bead of Permatex ultra grey for good measure (see pic, post o-ring repair. Nice and clean.)
- re-installed the pan again
- after allowing sealant to cure refilled her w/oil
- started her again
- leak resolved!! :bluesuit:



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Looks great so far! I'm excited to see how this kit works for your car as I may consider it in the future. Up until this post I've been stressing the though of a modified Greddy kit or a full-on 13B-REW swap.

Thanks, Furansu! Yeah, I plan to keep the forum updated w/ my results and impressions throughout tuning...

I still need to work proper IC, rad, & oil cooler ducting & sealing. Current running temps are:
- coolant temp ~ 195-200F
- oil temp ~ 180F

She needs new beefier sneakers :ylsuper:

- Purring in the garage after fresh oil, filter, and tank of gas w/ premix…

Sealing the rad will help with this but IC being so low and blocking flow to the rad will be something you will be fighting .

They are set at 196F (91C) . No point setting them any lower than that .

That is great looking work and a wonderful job of explaining all the bumps along the path. Do you have an idea of the number of hours invested into the project? The testing and rework should also be included because there is always rework. Are you using Mazda Edit for the tuning? Did you happen to do some Dyno runs before starting this project and are you planning to do some runs after the tuning is finished? Pretty sure everyone would be interested in the results.

Northzone,
Thanks...appreciate that.

- Really good question. One I'd not considered b/c I actually enjoy the journey, as much as I know I'll enjoy the car. I initially estimated ~100+ hrs working evenings & weekends. On more thought it was probably closer to 150 hrs physical work: car & component/assembly prep and install. MANY more hours when considering kit & aux. component research & selection, sourcing, and installation sequence planning w/this being my first install.

- Yes, I'm using M/E for tuning.

- No, I had no interest in dynoing pre FI, but I'm sure I will once the kit is sufficiently tuned.

Note: Simply tuning w/ a 1.5# spring she feels like her old self...w/ OCD. :)

I am using the mazdaspeed front bumper as it gives me more room to duct air to the radiator

• Tires (this week)
• Mazdaspeed body kit w/ proper ducting
• coil overs

Wasn't going to pull the trigger for add'l spend until heart surgery was confirmed to successful. :)

Update: Tuning is going well... More to come soon.

Looks like the dynosheet was removed but from what I saw, at 5PSI, that thing is making good power. Talk about a sweet powerband with that table-top flat torque curve.

Yeah...I'm pretty pleased w/ the progress to date. :) :) :) Compared to stock...sheeesh...she's a new car...a beast!!

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EDIT: Later identified that I had a boost leak at this time between the manifold and block resulting in delayed spool, HP, and torque. However, it accentuates the significantly increased flow when APVs open.

...another... :) :) :)
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Congrats! Your horsepower really takes off at 7k... Is that some type of valve or extra boost or what? Most rx8 dyno are usually flatter up top.... Also what boost level?

SC95gt, Thanks!

Brett noticed the same and indicated that the below that he generated was likely more accurate. Same M/E data but "managed" differently. I don't doubt him as he's very experienced w/ M/E, and I am not. Obviously, M/E is doing some data "smoothing" and the resultant dyno is dependent on your start / stop points of the data generated from the pull. It appears to be an "art", not a science that I'm still learning :dunno:

Edit: Regarding boost: I saw peak of 10.0. So, these were liklely somewhere in the 9.5-10 range.

Regardless, she is a blast to drive. So smooth, and power on tap. :)


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Well even in paradise... the rain will fall. Using an older laptop, one of my sons, which is slow, gets hung, or crashes...I've managed to render my ECU into an unresponsive state. For the record when attempting to flash it M/E returns the message: "You should use firmware as base file for this ECU." I've come to understand that this is the result essentially if the flash transfer is interrupted, e.g. dongle comes out, laptop crashes, battery dies, you try to start engine, etc. So, as I have committed to share the good, bad, and ugly in my build experience... this obviously is a downer... :sad:

So, she is unresponsive at the moment. But as we know... this is a big boys game. If you get in it...things WILL happen.

At some point, everything's gonna go south on you... everything's going to go … you can either accept that, or you can get to work. That's all it is. You just begin. You do the math. You solve one problem... and you solve the next one... and then the next. And If you solve enough problems, you get to come home. All right, questions?” - Mark Watney, “The Martian”

So, off to Mazda tomorrow to find out what m/b done to get her back up...

Thankful. Contacted Epifan (M/E) who advised (and this is a cut & paste, :yelrotflm) - "Just flash it again! This message appears when you read information about ECU."
Though I had multiple times ...so I thought..., nevertheless somewhat doubtful...I rebooted the laptop again, and initiated the flash making sure to allow the laptop plenty of time to complete each action. It walked me through the flash as normal, ...success, and she's purring again. :)

Lesson learned from this little episode:

1. Be very deliberate when flashing as there are potential dangers.
2. Attach dongle w/ care tonot bend any OBDII pins
3. Ensure dongle is securely attached & undisturbed throughout the process
4. Use a reliable a laptop w/ sufficient battery charge
5. Allow sufficient time for each action to fully complete
6. Never rush, interrupt, or perform w/ a suspect battery. :nono:

Power looks pretty damn good to me for a 2nd gear log .Those other logs are likely showing that odd shape due to a rise in revs as you step on the clutch at the end of the run. A 3rd gear log at same boost will show more power ..especially around 4000 , as spoolup is much better in 3rd .

Good results. A few Qs:
Is your target boost 10psi, or will you go higher in the long term?
What RPM are you hitting target boost (need to use 3rd gear or higher for this)?
Have you dialed in the boost controller for best spool yet? I find it interesting how the various EBC settings can change the boost curve.

Jimmy,
Thanks ...appreciate that!

• As reliability is one of my primary objectives... I'll likely run 7 & 9 psi short-term. Long-term I'm investigating / planning to run E30 to both increase safety margin and power a bit. At that time I'll likely run 9 & 12 psi.
• I've only been doing 2nd gear pulls, and primarily focusing on correlating my EBC SET and GAIN % to peak psi achieved at this point. So, I can't say at what RPM peak is achieved. At some point not in the too distant future I plan to do some 3rd gear pulls which will provide more data.
• No, I plan to focus on optimizing spool next. I believe there m/b some gains here.

Yeah, I'm still learning & experimenting w/ how the various settings combine to affect power, trq curves, and drivability.