Mazsport?
Is Mazsport still in buisness. I want to get some intercptor info.
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No
but ask away - someone may be able to help ... |
no.
what info do you need? |
I am trying to tune a customer built rx8 with cust. instlled Power Mod piggy back, sfr turbo kit. I can not get enough fuel in under 6k rpm low boost under 6psi. It is not gonna happen! I checked the injector duty cycle the primary 2 & high power come on late so there is not much for the piggy back to modifie from the injector circuit. it has (4) 550cc injectgors & stock primary.
I heard thge interceptor is a good ecm to use. I am stuck & feel realy bad for my customer.any advice is appreciated |
Check the fuelpump and the fuelfilter its a well known problem.
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Originally Posted by Bruce Merrill
(Post 3141208)
I am trying to tune a customer built rx8 with cust. instlled Power Mod piggy back, sfr turbo kit. I can not get enough fuel in under 6k rpm low boost under 6psi. It is not gonna happen! I checked the injector duty cycle the primary 2 & high power come on late so there is not much for the piggy back to modifie from the injector circuit. it has (4) 550cc injectgors & stock primary.
I heard thge interceptor is a good ecm to use. I am stuck & feel realy bad for my customer.any advice is appreciated |
I used the Powermod with some success when I first turboed my car . That was with stock injectors and running about 7-8psi if i recall . I do remember having a lean spot somewhere around 4000rpm that I was having difficulty with tuning out . I imagine your larger injectors are making the issue worse as you cannot scale the injectors with the Powermod .
I found many of my issues went away once I figured out how to stop the ecu from building excessive fuel trims . Can help with that if you wish ? You will need a scan tool to see what the fuel trims are ...... However I now run a flash tuner and have made no alterations to the primary injectors or injector staging and don't see an issue there anymore so I can't see why you can't richen it up with the Powermod . I currently run 280cc p1s 480ccP2s and stock 380cc secondaries and am pushing 325whp at 11psi although I'm only running 8psi till about 4500rpm. |
Power Mod is one off. Most people use the Access Port for the RX 8
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when we change the injectors, do we have to change the fuel pump too? may be you have to change the fuel pump, i don't know. my car is using the 680CC with primary and 750CC for outside secondary. if you wanna see my map, let me know, and my car still use 40% injector cycle, adn i am running 8psi and 11psi.
let me know if you need to see it steven |
I would tell your customer to switch to the cobbs access port, however you will have to move his maf from the pressure side to the pre-turbo side.
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/\ the Powermod will work although it will always be less than ideal as it is map based .
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Originally Posted by FazdaRX_8
(Post 3141919)
I would tell your customer to switch to the cobbs access port, however you will have to move his maf from the pressure side to the pre-turbo side.
As long as the MAF tube is the correct size and length, it can operate in a blow-through mode. |
well the fuel pump & filter are good. remember I have lean under 6k. the fuel trims as far as i can tell last time i checked were around zero under boost. it is like a light switch at 6k(when the power inj. come on) i have been working with sfr for 2 months now over the phone. & power mod tech. I have been threw the whole car. i cant get the afr under 13:1 under boost below 5500rpm. some times it does but usually not.
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Double check your fuel trims - I adjusted all values (except 500 rpm) below 0psi by what ever the fuel trims were .
I can tell you that i definately did not have this issue once i had it sorted . What duty cycle are you seeing on your P1s ? |
1 Attachment(s)
Like this . Leave the values shown in the 500rpm row at zero otherwise you will have starting issues . Ignore the boosted values as well as this map was from when i was using a combination of flash tool + Powermod
Note the values between 3500 and 4500 take even more fuel out than the rest of the map - I found bogging in that range before i did that. If you think about how your fuel trims work - they take fuel away from the entire range . So if you have say -16 under load (like I did) that effetively means if you inputted 99 in a cell in the powermod you are only adding 99% to an 84%fuel output = 167% . If you add 99% to a 100% fuel output you get 199% . So you lose 32/199 (or 16%) of your possible fuel delivery by not getting fuel trims to zero - hence your issue . Also note that it takes several drive cycles for the long term fuel trims (LTFT) to stabilise so you will always see 0 straight after diconnecting the battery. Hope that helps . Attachment 276807 |
Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 3143831)
Like this . Leave the values shown in the 500rpm row at zero otherwise you will have starting issues . Ignore the boosted values as well as this map was from when i was using a combination of flash tool + Powermod
Note the values between 3500 and 4500 take even more fuel out than the rest of the map - I found bogging in that range before i did that. If you think about how your fuel trims work - they take fuel away from the entire range . So if you have say -16 under load (like I did) that effetively means if you inputted 99 in a cell in the powermod you are only adding 99% to an 84%fuel output = 167% . If you add 99% to a 100% fuel output you get 199% . So you lose 32/199 (or 16%) of your possible fuel delivery by not getting fuel trims to zero - hence your issue . Also note that it takes several drive cycles for the long term fuel trims (LTFT) to stabilise so you will always see 0 straight after diconnecting the battery. Hope that helps . http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s...wermodfuel.jpg judging from your fuel map did you change the primary1 injector(the 2 that have there own rail. i see you took out quite a bit of fuel (-16) in the idle areas. This car only has 550cc inj. in the prim2 & power. sfr sais that is all i need. from my testing it may be wrong. What injectors did you change & what size did you use? Thnk you for being so helpfull guys! |
No- the p1s are stock (280cc) the p2s are 480cc and the secondaries are stock(380cc) .
Larger injectors than this are not required at the power level I am at 320-330whp . The -16 values are there to stop the pcm generating large fuel trims . The simplest thing to do is watch the LTFT under load IE open loop (does not take much load to get into OL) . I would be very surprised if your OL fuel trims are 0 or even close to that as you have made major changes to the air intake and how it behaves . Now apply that value to all the cells below 0.6psi . Above that you will need to retune once the fuel trims settle back down to close to zero . Disconnecting the battery may be a quicker way to get to where the trims are settled. |
Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 3147016)
No- the p1s are stock (280cc) the p2s are 480cc and the secondaries are stock(380cc) .
Larger injectors than this are not required at the power level I am at 320-330whp . The -16 values are there to stop the pcm generating large fuel trims . The simplest thing to do is watch the LTFT under load IE open loop (does not take much load to get into OL) . I would be very surprised if your OL fuel trims are 0 or even close to that as you have made major changes to the air intake and how it behaves . Now apply that value to all the cells below 0.6psi . Above that you will need to retune once the fuel trims settle back down to close to zero . Disconnecting the battery may be a quicker way to get to where the trims are settled. |
fuel injectors hook up wrong?
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Originally Posted by Bruce Merrill
(Post 3148933)
maybe ther is a problem with this car that i am missing. the seccondarys dont start working till 4500rpm we are making boost below that & can not get enough fuel to the engine. i will watch the fuel trims more closely. we are very rich above 6000rpm.
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Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 3149632)
A powermod log i did showed the secondaries kicking in (20%) at 3370rpm and about 3psi boost .......
they are wired exactly how poer mod shows it to be done. i went threw the wiring several times. six injectors on six channels. are you using the fueler map? |
here is some of the log - Rad told me the PM logged the secondaries only ......
3213 RPM 0.2 "Hg 13.1:1 A/F 33% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3233 RPM 0.1 PSI 13.1:1 A/F 34% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3235 RPM 0.4 PSI 13.1:1 A/F 40% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3244 RPM 0.9 PSI 13.1:1 A/F 49% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3275 RPM 1.1 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 58% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3295 RPM 1.5 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 66% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3316 RPM 1.8 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 72% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3333 RPM 1.9 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 84% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3347 RPM 2.3 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 92% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3357 RPM 2.5 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 95% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3372 RPM 2.8 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 95% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 20.4% DC OUT 3.60ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3413 RPM 3.2 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 93% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 21.0% DC OUT 3.68ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3389 RPM 3.4 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 96% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 21.8% DC OUT 3.86ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3445 RPM 3.7 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 97% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 22.7% DC OUT 3.95ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3489 RPM 4.1 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 93% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 23.4% DC OUT 4.02ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3478 RPM 4.3 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 93% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 23.5% DC OUT 4.06ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3470 RPM 4.6 PSI 10.6:1 A/F 96% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 24.1% DC OUT 4.14ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% |
Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 3151597)
here is some of the log - Rad told me the PM logged the secondaries only ......
3213 RPM 0.2 "Hg 13.1:1 A/F 33% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3233 RPM 0.1 PSI 13.1:1 A/F 34% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3235 RPM 0.4 PSI 13.1:1 A/F 40% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3244 RPM 0.9 PSI 13.1:1 A/F 49% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3275 RPM 1.1 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 58% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 0.0% 3295 RPM 1.5 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 66% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3316 RPM 1.8 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 72% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3333 RPM 1.9 PSI 12.3:1 A/F 84% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3347 RPM 2.3 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 92% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3357 RPM 2.5 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 95% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 0.0% DC OUT 0.00ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3372 RPM 2.8 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 95% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 20.4% DC OUT 3.60ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3413 RPM 3.2 PSI 11.5:1 A/F 93% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 21.0% DC OUT 3.68ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3389 RPM 3.4 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 96% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 21.8% DC OUT 3.86ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3445 RPM 3.7 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 97% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 22.7% DC OUT 3.95ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3489 RPM 4.1 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 93% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 23.4% DC OUT 4.02ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3478 RPM 4.3 PSI 11.0:1 A/F 93% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 23.5% DC OUT 4.06ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% 3470 RPM 4.6 PSI 10.6:1 A/F 96% TPS 5.00V MAP IN 5.00V AFM IN 24.1% DC OUT 4.14ms 0% FUEL 0 IGN 62.1% |
1 Attachment(s)
FYI . P1 duty cycle - done this morning
this is with 8psi 3500-4500 9psi 5000 10psi 5500 11psi 6000-8000 |
Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 3157734)
FYI . P1 duty cycle - done this morning
this is with 8psi 3500-4500 9psi 5000 10psi 5500 11psi 6000-8000 primary2 work from around 4k & uo on mine high power/ 3rd stage come on around 6k on mine. i am unsure as to what your data reflects above |
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