NA Upgrade Path
 

Since receiving my new car, I have been doing a lot of research (on this forum). I am getting the MazdaSpeed suspension - that I decided upon. Brakes seem strong so I am leaving them be for now. That leaves me looking at performance.

I did immediately think about getting a Greddy turbo. But I did pay for the extra warranty, so I am going to hold off on this. Instead, I am thinking about this NA route:

+20HP - Canzoomer – custom tuned to about 13.5:1.
+8HP - RP High Flow Cat.
+3HP - Racing Beat or Hymee catback
+2HP - Racing Beat REVi intake.
+??HP - Light Flywheel (MazdaSpeed – installed by Mazda).
+??HP 16lb Wheels.
+??HP Unorthodox Underdriven pulleys.

I have included what I hope would be the approximate HP gains. I have left some as ‘??’ because I don’t know what they are. Anyone know :confused:

I’ve started by obtaining a CAN scanner and I am going to order the Canzoomer next week.

I am hoping that what I have selected will allow me to see some good performance gains and remain NA. I am also hoping that with this setup will allow me to return to nearly stock very easily so that I can get warranty work done (if needed)

And feedback from the board would be greatly appreciated before I start spending silly amounts of money. Anything left out, anything you would do differently based on experience. Am I remaining streetable (I think I am :rolleyes: ).

Thanks for the help

check with nemesis8, http://www.nemesis8.com/ . he proberly have most of ur upgrade plus extra.

Mod on my car:
RB intake,
canzommer [13.6:1 ... I retuned it to 13-13.2:1 now],
random tech high flow,
RP duct.
RB swaybar (front/rear and front endlink)

My car pull like 194 whp on the dynojet w out the duct. I already having alot of fun on track. Maybe the next upgrade will still be my tire or coilover

https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...4&postcount=70 (my dyno graph)

Thanks NHK. Out of interest, why did you tune down to ~13.2?

Get it this way.

1. RB REVi Air Intake & Ram Air Duct
2. RP Performance hi-flow cat (or Random Technology hi-flow cat that Can zoomer sells with their CZ kit)
3. Cat Back Exhaust (more for great sound & looks) that will give you a few hp)
4. Canzoomer Piggyback ECU - Get this after you get the other stuff as the other stuff may change you A/F ratios. YOU HAVE TO TUNE THIS.

Pullies are a waste of money (& I have them). The flywheel is nice but realize it is a very labor intensive mod to put in. You ave to drop the tranny.

Depending on how your car dynoes, you can get anywhere from about 16 to 25 whp from that setup.

Unfortunately gains don't add up that way. Even those numbers are subjective. I'm going to be optimistic and say that you'll get 15hp or so from all of that. The lightweight flywheel on it's own will give you the biggest acceleration difference but it doesn't affect your horsepower.

just wanna to stay at the safe side. I also try to get those Mr dyno to check what a/f mixture pull the most hp .. as long as both run is consistance. I don't need to know the real dyno number.

A/F
1. 13.6:1 vs 13.2:1
2. 13.2:1 vs stock (zero map -- 12.9~13.0:1)

I am just curious to find out more about this engine.
Note: I just send my canscan back to Dan for repair.

I've always been fuzzy on the weight of wheels/pulleys/flywheel when it comes to acceleration. I know it does not directly affect HP. It seems that its not a direct power to weight relationship either. Its to do with the rotational mass. But I have never really understood the full effect that it is having. I'm still learning and I haven't read more than 1% of this great forum (even though I have put a lot of hours into reading it).

Thanks for the great information. I was hoping to get more than 15 hp total, but you guys are very respected here, so you are much closer to the mark than my wishful numbers :)

from my experience I was able to measure ~8-10hp difference between my 13.0 (89 octane map) and 13.5 maps (93 octane map) from my dyno simulator program i wrote (about 205rwhp compared to about 195rwhp)

IMO if your worried at all about money I'd get the CZ and high flow cat first - they will be the best bang for your buck. The rest of the list becomes very pricey for what actual gains you get out of them.

Most of the threads I have read seem to indicate that the CanScan is a little flaky. Now it could be that I am hearing only the vocal few that have had problems. So I opted for the AutoEnginuity unit. I can use it on my Miata too. And my friend with a 350z wants to make some use of it too.

How do your maps compare to stock? Or is the 13.0 map your stock map?

Rotor,

I saw ur graph somewhere before. btw, is the 13.5 maps have 205 whp or 195 whp?

still remember there is a member here got 206 on the stock engine w 12.4:1 mixture

https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...6&postcount=33

wow... thats a blast from the past. That was my original shot at a 13.0 map.

I did something like 15 or so runs between the finalized maps, the 13.0 map was consistanly in the 195-203 range while the 13.5 map was consistanly in the 205-215 range... I was just going by more the bottom end of the norm in my quote above rather then the runs where all the planets seemed to align properly.

stock it was right around 12.6:1

Thanks for the information Fanman.

I'm going to get the Canzoomer firt, simply because I am actually looking forward to tuning it. I know I will have to do it. It just sounds like a blast!!! I love learning new things.

Any comments on the RP cat vs. Random Tech. cat? I mean noise level as well as potential HP gains. I thought about going with the RP unit because a lot of people seem to think its not much louder.

I know what you mean by the exhaust is more for sound than HP. It'll probably be my last mod. But wheels are the same. I love car handling (good job I bought an 8 then, huh?), which is why I want light wheels -- but they also make a big statement in the looks department.

for the wheel wise.. this will have alot of rubber for ya

http://www.good-win-racing.com/mazda...topic.php?t=53

and it is 17.2 lbs per rim

http://www.good-win-racing.com/mazda.../21-1051b.html

Yeah, they're cool aren't they. I've been to his house and seen that car. Probably what put the seed about buying an 8 in my mind!!

And as you say - a lot of rubber.

Historically I've always wanted the least amount of rubber needed. I still have the stock 225's and to be honest, they seem fine. I think you can get slightly stickier 225s if needed. I may be wrong, but I've always considered wide tires to be great for straight line speed, but worse in the bends. The wider the tire, the greater the difference in speed between the inside and outside edge of the tire while turning. Of course I could be smoking weed and making this up for all I know.

If this logic does indeed work, then I am thining about SSR 18x7.5 which weigh 15.8lbs (max tire width 225).

BTW, just wanted to say. This forum is GREAT. Full of insightful and knowledgably people. I thank you all.

I used to drive a integra with 195's, i upgrade it to 205's (want to goto 225's) to get the extra traction on the cornering. hmm ... after i read ur comment, I am not sure whether a wider tire better or narrow tire better

but I am sure wider tire w rim will be heavier.
kumho 275's (27 lbs) + this enkei rim (17.2 lbs) ~= 44.2 lbs

Btw, will the rim rub at all. to the caliper or the fender wall. :)

No prob

TireRack says the wheel will fit. Cross fingers. I'll check into it more before ordering though :)

Just be aware you may have to "re-tune" the CZ unit if you get it first, as adding on additional mods may alter the A/F ratio. That is usually why people get it after they have put on the rest of the stuff. Hp gain from a hi-flow cat will be approximately the same whether you are getting the RP unit, Random technology , or SR Motorsport. The loudest would be the RP unit as it does not have a resonator on it. The other 2 units you do (SR Motorsports you can order it with or without the resonator). It really depends on you. Some like it a bit louder, some don't. There is a video in the video section that has a clip of a posters car with an RP Supercat & RB exhaust.

Just be aware when you get a narrower rim (7.5") wile you lose weight, you are also losing a bit of cross section of the wheel. This will compromise handling a bit. It depends what you want more, less weight or greater overall grip. If you want grip, then go stay with a slightly wider rim (8").

I'm probably being a bit dense. I'm back at work, after being called back in...

Do you mean that the 18x7.5 with a 225 tire has less corss section then an 18x8 with a 225 tire?

Or are you saying that an 18x7.5 can only have up to a 225, whereas an 18x8 can have up to a 245 (or is it 255 - I'd have to check that). So I'm limiting my ability to upgrade to a bigger tire later?

Sorry for being a dumbass.... :confused:

https://www.rx8club.com/mazsport-104/finally-plug-play-ecu-68392/ check this out, brightnova.

So, you going to get one? :D

The first. With a 7.5" rim you will get slightly less lateral stability with a 225/45/18 tire vs. if you have it on an 8" rim. I've seen some people put a 275 on a 8" rim, but have ran into some handling issues with them. 245's ideally fit on a 8"to 8.5" rim. Will they fit on an 8" rim. Yes, but the wider the rim, the little bit better your handling will be. For the 225's you might notice a bit of difference between a 7.5" rim & the current 8." Just be aware that you might save a pound (7.5" vs. 8" version) but give up a little bit of handling. Not sure what youa re into. If it is all out tracking the car, then stick with the 8".

I really wanna see how much they can come up with a N/A engine. btw I think the power is good enough for me at the moment for the track day. Remember u gonna go to turbo someday, I guess this might be better than cz for ur case