RX-8 vs. S2000?
 

My buddy and I have a bet going. He has his S2K, manual (first gen), and I've got my 2005 GT, manual.....

In the summer the regional airport holds autocross events and we want to hit it up.

Any clues on how our times would differ? Who would win, who would lose? Because the loser owes the winner a 6-pack.....

Driver dependent

Assuming very similar driving styles and experience. Are the cars THAT similar?

If you assume all subjective factors are removed and only the raw numeric factors are left (weight, power, wheelbase, width) the S2000 will win.

The 8 is close enough though, that yes, the better driver will likely win.

This is stock vs stock, including the same tires. The presence of any mods will toss this entirely out of the window, as will any dramatic difference in tire compound.

stock vs stock, 2sk got better chance on both track and autocross.
They are really close anyway.
At the end it really comes down to driver.

I race with straight performance both not stock 2 car length behind on me it is near 100-150 kg lighter than my 8 is not stock but i don't have pulley or ecu tune

If you have ignition,intake,exhaust,headers,flywheel,pulley,4. 77 or5,125,17'' or 18''lightweight wheels,ecu tune and fresh engine and your car weights must be near 1200 kg's

Clean Winning :)

I find this hilarious! No only would the race be close, but the cars are so vastly different style wise.... We have 4 doors and 4 seats, whereas the S2K only has two and two, and yet we're THIS close! Well done Mazda.... well done.

You are looking at attributes which only have tertiary impact.

It's slightly better on power to the ground, lighter by 200-300lbs, shorter wheelbase, superb suspension, etc...

There are really only 2 reasons that 8 can sit that close to it in subjective performance:
1) The 8 has a lower center of gravity thanks to the higher sitting engine in the S2000 vs the much lower Renesis in the 8
2) The 8 has a lower polar moment of inertia thanks to an engine that sits farther back

In the hands of a talented professional, the S2000 will set faster lap times because of the lower weight, shorter wheelbase, and better power-to-weight ratio.

In the hands of an amateur, it is easier to drive the 8 at it's limits than the S2000 at it's limits, so it is likely that they would set faster lap times in the 8 than in the S2000. As skill and training go up, this will swing back toward the S2000.


All my subjective opinion

You posted this up now for next summer?

My bet is for you to start saving up your beer money now ...

At least it's only a 6-pack :)

you're looking at this the wrong way! he's got like 9 months to practice driving, and we know the S2000 owner will be out shopping for new sunglasses...

On a track the better power to weight of the s2000 puts the rx-8 on the back foot.
At an autocross, that might not matter so much. In that case, it comes down to driver vs driver, and also tires/alignment vs tires/alignment. Should be fun :)

Having driven both cars (AP1 S2000 and R3 RX8) in stock form on comparable tires, back to back for several autocross runs, my money is on the S2000 by considerable margin. That shorter wheelbase and less weight are very advantageous - even more so on a tight course (it can also be a liability, particularly in those AP1's, but I found it to be far more docile than people portray them as).

That said it's really all about tightening that nut behind the wheel.

The S2000 will beat the RX8 assuming that you guys are comparable in driving skill. You will need to be substantially better to overcome the difference between the car's capabilities.

On the other hand, if you have 9 months....swap an F20C into the RX8 and you'll be laughing :p:

Look at the SCCA classing. The RX-8 is in CS while the S2K is in BS. Which one do you think is faster?

Don't forget in stock form the S2k comes with a 245 in the rear so the slipperly bastard has more grip. I have fought the S2k vs RX8 battle all summer with my coworker. Ofcourse the S2k has RS3s and is setup for STR vs my Koni's and Ventu V12 POS in CS-R. Drivers are both intermediate skill level. We are able to match each others times when we swap cars. It is my first year in the 8 after owning a STR prepared miata.

I lose regularly by 2.5 secs. But, I survived the season and he was flatbeded home after a stub axle shat itself on his last launch of the year. I WIN!

Driving style, I would say both cars are driven the same way. Both have to be up in their power band to have any grunt, both have great brakes, both are very well balanced and love to turn.

Still laughing at this one..

"you're looking at this the wrong way! he's got like 9 months to practice driving, and we know the S2000 owner will be out shopping for new sunglasses..."

RIWWP nailed it...

Spy work over the winter:
Find and read "Going Faster" It does a great job of telling you what is going on in the car.
Tell us what kind of tires you have, make, model, size, age, and treadwear rating.
Tell us what kind of tires he has, same data, most important is treadwear.

Folks on the list will be able to make air pressure recommendations based on above. That is about the only adjustment you can control, unless you happen to need tires over the winter... Then we can make recommendations....

Also, if you have not, look at the $100 thread in my signature. Make sure you are running in tip top shape. I would help more, but live in Florida.

And, make sure to tell HIM to bump up his tire pressures to keep the tire from separating from the wheel. 8 to 10 psi is a good number for HIM to start with, maybe 12 for HIM in the rear. Um, you are NOT going to do this. Encourage him to buy a go-pro, so we can see the results.

In the book, really read up on trailing throttle oversteer, and trail braking...

I have owned a 03 S2k ad now own a 07 rx8...
both a great car. but under high speed, the rx8 suspension give me way more confidence. (since the car feels more balance)
on the other hand, the S2k give me feedback and I can feel everything the car is doing.