heel-toe problems
 

sup everyone. i know i sound like some little kid who doesnt know what he is doing and dont give a shit about my 8 but dont get me wrong. i love my 8 and i try and keep as much care as possible. that being said, if you downshift without heel-toeing does it hurt the car? i have tried many times but i cant seem to do it with my boat for feet. 16 years old with size 15. lol with shoes its totally impossible and without i still have no room for my feet motion. :confused:

Hurt the car? No. Heel/Toe shifting is an advanced driving (racing) technique, not a requirement for driving a manual.

I can how it would b hard with size 15 gunboats! :)

It's hard for anyone really, the footwell is just tight. I've found that using the blade of my foot works a bit easier than an actual heel-toe (though I'm terrible at the blade method). Instead of using your heel, use the right edge of your foot to blip the throttle. If you're new to driving stick, it's going to be a pain to learn to do it efficiently either way. Best way to learn if you've never done it before is to learn to downshift by rev-matching first and then begin to add the braking as you become proficient with rev-matching.

Oh, and be careful learning this, it's easy to get crossed up if you're not familiar with it and get yourself into trouble. Just make sure you have room to screw up.

Naw, you will be fine w/o heel toe. Heel/toe is mainly to keep your revs matched w/your gear so that we you engage the tranny, your car doesnt jerk. If that were to happen in a tight turn, you could lose control.

thats good to know :) yeh when i dont heel-toe i have to be real gental so i dont jerk because usually people driving with me are not used to sitting in a stick so they bitch on the littlest of jerks that i dont even notice lol. its almost like they havent been in a car worth while thier whole life! when i accelerate they shoot back into the seat and they hate it. well i just tell them thats acceleration for ya and alot of people would be more than happy to be in the seat that they are in :P

but make sure your not using the transmission to slow you down! i have a size 10 and it is set up perfectly for me...

oh shit.... im afraid i have been using my transmission to slow down >< damn it. i guess thats what i get for not looking into it. my dad is the one who taught me to drive stick. not that he tought me very well i actually taught myself (wrong i might add) i feel like a stupid shit asking this but i have to find out sometime or another, but how do you downshift without using the trany and not toe-heel shit? sorry im a bit angry right now :mad:

Ok, stupid question: where on the pedals, and which ones, do your heel and toe go?

your heel is supposed to go on the gas to pump the revs ( to match the tranny blah blah) and your toe goes on the brake. im not going to explain it because i suck at explaining things and i know very little about how it goes and shit as you can tell

a *Very* quick rundown of what happens during a heel-toe downshift.

1. start braking by gently stepping on the brake pedal with the ball of your right foot

2. clutch in

3. *here is the tricky part* while braking AND depressing the clutch, gently turn your right foot in, while the ball of your foot still holding onto the brake pedal, use the outer edge/heel part of your right foot to gently blip the gas pedal. WHILE all this is going on, you should be downshifting to the lower gear with your right hand

4. once gear change is complete, gently release clutch, rotate right heel back to inline with brake pedal, and you have just performed a heel-toe downshift.

there's really nothing that I can tell you that will make you instant heel-toe downshift master, all you can do is just practice, practice, practice.

RX-8 has VERY good pedal spacing for heel-toe downshift, so just take your time learning and eventually you'll get it :p

Well its not really reccomended to down shift at high rpms..that puts a lot of stress on you whole drivetrain...

Well, under normal conditions I simply throw the car in neutral to slow down and then just brake normally to stop unless I'm expecting to accelerate again.

Now, if - for example - I'm going to go around a corner and come out in 2nd gear, I usually brake and clutch in, put the car into 2nd, corner and as I come out of the corner, rev-match (give the throttle just a little blip while releasing the clutch, no heel-toe) and accelerate out normally.

Heel-toe is typically used to keep the car more stable during high-speed cornering (all that shifting I do during "normal driving" would have the car behaving terribly in a race setting, but it's fine for the street). It also allows for more efficient acceleration during a corner exit. Also, slowing down with engine braking isn't the worst thing ever, I find it useful for hills and other situations that require a very small amount of deceleration, and in applications like that (downshifting one or two gears), the wear should be minimal. I just wouldn't be using it to slow your car ALL the way down on a regular basis.

I think the heel toe thing is unnecessary for us "regular folks who might wear tennis shoes or an occasional python boot. . ." , but if you must try to drive like a race car driver, practice the heel toe in the driveway with the car in neutral. Apply the brake and then blip the throttle. This way you can get a feel for how the rpms are affected watching the tach when you blip. :)

so engine braking is alright just as long as you dont do it at high rpms (i figured that much) and you dont do it as lower gears to slow yourself completely down. i never engine brake in 1st. when i get to 2nd i put in the clutch and brake with the brake itself :P only thing im frustrated about is trying to shift as smooth as possible. i have been driving stick for almost a year now and i havnt got where it is smooth lol

Not H&Ting won't hurt a thing except wear the clutch out a bit sooner. As others have said, it's not a requirement unless you're racing. Otherwise, it mostly:

1) Makes for a much smoother driving experience
2) Makes you feel like a real driving enthusiast snob
3) Sounds terrific ;)

Forget your heel. You can do it, but it takes room to get your heel over and top of the throttle. It's awkward. As people suggested, it's far easier to just catch the throttle with the side of your foot. Pretend you're trying to sprain your right ankle and let your foot kinda flop over, while keeping your toe on the brake. Kinda like you're trying to karate-chop kick the throttle, lol...

Well, down shifting - unless done almost perfectly - makes driving even LESS smooth and is actually something that's very hard to do well. The smoothest way to slow down is to just neutral it and hit the brakes, you won't feel a thing. If you need to accelerate, just put it back into the appropriate gear and do your best to match the revs up as you engage the clutch (matching the rpms is what makes for a smooth shift). To be smooth on up shifts, just let all your motions come naturally - if you're forcing anything (shifting too fast, clutching too abruptly, etc), you're going to probably elicit a pretty nice jerk. The best shifts (even when racing) are smooth and natural. It also seems that the less you think about being smooth and natural, the smoother it gets. Go figure.

i'll give it a try :) maybe there will be "enough" room for my boat lol. i think i may go out for a drive and concentrate on being smooth while shifting. hope i dont hit anything while im daydreaming about what im doing wrong/right lol

well the main reason im anal about downshifting is im worried about wearing my clutch and if i just brake im affraid of wearing my brakes down. i get so many mixed messages from kids at school and from what i read and shit lol

Trust me, new brakes are A LOT cheaper than a new clutch. I'd look to be wearing those out first. Plus, unless you're really romping on the brakes a lot, you shouldn't have anything to worry about for quite a while.

cool :P thnx alot guys. had my doubts about this club when i first joined (alot of jerks) but now it seems cool. i think it would rock if it had a chat log thing... like when you log in you can be in a chat room. sound korny? i think it sounds pretty cool

Oh my goodness, are you serious? There's NO WAY my feet will reach both pedals! Size 6 womens? Yeah right.

I do it backwards but it works for me...when I do it. I brake with the heel and twist my foot out to give it gas with my toe. I think it's more natural but whatever works really.

you will need to turn your right foot all the way out and actually use your heel to blip the throttle then :p

try it with the car parked and see if your foot can reach the gas pedal :p

I use heel to toe when I having fun around the corners :D

All right, I'll give it a try tomorrow.