"Drilling" factory sway bar.
I recall reading a few posts concerning the possibility of redrilling the factory sway bar for slightly stiffer settings. I would like to try this to experiment with stiffer sways as opposed to buying a new set up and perhaps not liking the end result.
Can anybody provide some insight on the outcome and process? |
I haven't done this myself, but all you are doing is reducing the moment arm (lever length) of the bar. The change in stiffness will be the ratio of the original lever length divided by the new length.
I even remember seeing a post by Team RX8 where the tip of the bar was put in a press to increase the flat area in order to reduce the lever length even more. |
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I've done it to the rear and might do it to the front for some more flexibility. I never bothered to calculate the effect (you can't just look at the bar stiffness % change, need to include springs, motion ratios, and roll center) but it was one thing I did to turn a very pushy car to slightly loose.
Very easy and worthwhile mod. Be careful with the chassis-side studs. All of mine snapped so I replaced them with bolts/nuts. |
Originally Posted by cwatson
(Post 4339228)
(you can't just look at the bar stiffness % change, need to include springs, motion ratios, and roll center)
I stated that the change in stiffness for the bar is related to the lever arm lenth change, which is accurate (assuming same size bar OD/ID). I wasn't talking about oversteer/understeer ratio with takes into account the front and rear roll stiffness (which is a combined stiffness of anti-sway bars, springs, and chassis rigidity). The percent change in stiffness that I am talking about is just for the bar. Changing the hole location for the factory bar will only have about a 15%-20% change in bar stiffness. Not saying that it isn't noticeable, but it is a very small change in comparison to almost all aftermarket bars. For example, the Racing Beat anti-sways have a 117% increase in stiffness for the front and a 166% increase in stiffness for the rear. |
Originally Posted by JCrane82
(Post 4339240)
I stated that the change in stiffness for the bar is related to the lever arm lenth change, which is accurate (assuming same size bar OD/ID). I wasn't talking about oversteer/understeer ratio with takes into account the front and rear roll stiffness (which is a combined stiffness of anti-sway bars, springs, and chassis rigidity). The percent change in stiffness that I am talking about is just for the bar. Changing the hole location for the factory bar will only have about a 15%-20% change in bar stiffness. Not saying that it isn't noticeable, but it is a very small change in comparison to almost all aftermarket bars. For example, the Racing Beat anti-sways have a 117% increase in stiffness for the front and a 166% increase in stiffness for the rear.
i dont know, that was what he said, just providing some input here. |
Originally Posted by EricB
(Post 4339279)
maybe thats all thats needed? When i was speaking to NYC DriftKing, he said he returned to stock bars because the back end of the car would keep kicking out while doing mountain runs.
i dont know, that was what he said, just providing some input here. If you like the way the car currently drives/handles (regarding oversteer/understeer ratio), then keep the front to rear roll stiffness ratio the same. If you want more understeer then increase front roll stiffness or decrease rear stiffness. Opposite if you want to increase oversteer. Just remember that too much roll stiffness compared to vertical spring stiffness will cause you to lift a wheel in a hard corner. 4 tires will always get better traction than 3. Increasing roll stiffness (via anti-sway bars), without increasing spring stiffness, should be considered carefully. |
^Exactly. Omar is just a crazy driver :lol:
With my setup (Stance coilovers, Progress Tech sways, and same rim and tire size all the way around), car is planted and actually understeers a bit which is most likely due to my rear sway on full soft rather than full stiff. So it depends on your setup and you're driving style. |
Originally Posted by HockeyRX-8
(Post 4339301)
^Exactly. Omar is just a crazy driver :lol:
So it depends on your setup and you're driving style. |
Originally Posted by JCrane82
(Post 4339129)
I haven't done this myself, but all you are doing is reducing the moment arm (lever length) of the bar. The change in stiffness will be the ratio of the original lever length divided by the new length.
I even remember seeing a post by Team RX8 where the tip of the bar was put in a press to increase the flat area in order to reduce the lever length even more.
Originally Posted by JCrane82
(Post 4339240)
I stated that the change in stiffness for the bar is related to the lever arm lenth change, which is accurate (assuming same size bar OD/ID). I wasn't talking about oversteer/understeer ratio with takes into account the front and rear roll stiffness (which is a combined stiffness of anti-sway bars, springs, and chassis rigidity). The percent change in stiffness that I am talking about is just for the bar. Changing the hole location for the factory bar will only have about a 15%-20% change in bar stiffness. Not saying that it isn't noticeable, but it is a very small change in comparison to almost all aftermarket bars. For example, the Racing Beat anti-sways have a 117% increase in stiffness for the front and a 166% increase in stiffness for the rear.
Thanks for the provided link. I should have searched harder. |
Originally Posted by JCrane82
(Post 4339240)
I stated that the change in stiffness for the bar is related to the lever arm lenth change, which is accurate (assuming same size bar OD/ID). I wasn't talking about oversteer/understeer ratio with takes into account the front and rear roll stiffness (which is a combined stiffness of anti-sway bars, springs, and chassis rigidity). The percent change in stiffness that I am talking about is just for the bar. Changing the hole location for the factory bar will only have about a 15%-20% change in bar stiffness. Not saying that it isn't noticeable, but it is a very small change in comparison to almost all aftermarket bars. For example, the Racing Beat anti-sways have a 117% increase in stiffness for the front and a 166% increase in stiffness for the rear.
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just giving someones point of view on swaybars, not applying to everyone of course :)
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Originally Posted by EricB
(Post 4339479)
just giving someones point of view on swaybars, not applying to everyone of course :)
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I can provide a custom modified one if you're interested. I flattened the tubular end some more in a brake press and then installed two sets of stiffer end link position holes with a drill press. Most people do it redneck style with a hand drill and that looks close enough eye ball approach ...
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Originally Posted by TeamRX8
(Post 4340022)
I can provide a custom modified one if you're interested. I flattened the tubular end some more in a brake press and then installed two sets of stiffer end link position holes with a drill press. Most people do it redneck style with a hand drill and that looks close enough eye ball approach ...
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Originally Posted by TeamRX8
(Post 4340022)
I can provide a custom modified one if you're interested. I flattened the tubular end some more in a brake press and then installed two sets of stiffer end link position holes with a drill press. Most people do it redneck style with a hand drill and that looks close enough eye ball approach ...
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Has anyone applied this to the R3 sway bars?
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Originally Posted by IHitCones
(Post 4346063)
Hey, I resemble that comment.
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Originally Posted by JCrane82
(Post 4346093)
Resemble? Resent perhaps?
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Originally Posted by Moby
(Post 4346072)
Has anyone applied this to the R3 sway bars?
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Your head is more likely filled with urethane than the swaybar
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Originally Posted by TeamRX8
(Post 4340022)
I can provide a custom modified one if you're interested. I flattened the tubular end some more in a brake press and then installed two sets of stiffer end link position holes with a drill press. Most people do it redneck style with a hand drill and that looks close enough eye ball approach ...
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Originally Posted by cwatson
(Post 4347021)
...you could even do it on the car if you're lazy.
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It's easy if you drop the lower radiator brackets and drop it out the bottom rather than fish it out the side, though I won't admit how many times I did it the wrong way ...
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I drilled mine on the car with a hand drill. It's a good free mod but ultimately I bought stiffer adjustable bars.
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