Mazda sells 156 RX-8s nationwide in January
02-16-2009, 09:57 AM
#1
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U.S. RX-8 '09 sales figures *updated monthly*
January: 156
February: 155
EDIT: I'll be updating this monthly from now on, just curious to see how sales pan out this year. Original post/thread follows...
Kinda sad, a 40% decline from January 2008.
The only upside is that it looks like the Series II is becoming an "unintentional" limited edition (due, obviously, to the economy...I think it is a great refresh).
So there might be well under 2000 RX-8s sold in the US this year if this keeps up, which means worldwide production will probably be under 5000. That's Ferrari-like exclusivity.
I hope Mazda actually produces a 2010 model (maybe with some new colors or return of the Shinka trim), as some manufacturers are skipping a model year (for example, no 2009 Evo).
http://mazdausamedia.com/content/maz...ary-2009-sales
February: 155
EDIT: I'll be updating this monthly from now on, just curious to see how sales pan out this year. Original post/thread follows...
Kinda sad, a 40% decline from January 2008.
The only upside is that it looks like the Series II is becoming an "unintentional" limited edition (due, obviously, to the economy...I think it is a great refresh).
So there might be well under 2000 RX-8s sold in the US this year if this keeps up, which means worldwide production will probably be under 5000. That's Ferrari-like exclusivity.
I hope Mazda actually produces a 2010 model (maybe with some new colors or return of the Shinka trim), as some manufacturers are skipping a model year (for example, no 2009 Evo).
http://mazdausamedia.com/content/maz...ary-2009-sales
Last edited by PotatoSoup; 03-03-2009 at 09:13 PM.
02-16-2009, 10:44 AM
#5
Oh, just wishful thinking. If Mazda, due to the poor economy, had to decide between another year of the present RX-8, vs. 16X engine development in the same/a new platform, I would hope they would pursue the latter. After all, there are plenty of new vehicles already sitting portside in Long Beach. I'm just sayin'.....
02-16-2009, 11:02 AM
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Oh, just wishful thinking. If Mazda, due to the poor economy, had to decide between another year of the present RX-8, vs. 16X engine development in the same/a new platform, I would hope they would pursue the latter. After all, there are plenty of new vehicles already sitting portside in Long Beach. I'm just sayin'.....
1) The RX-8 has now recouped its development cost and is a profitable vehicle.
2) The 16X is still just a development concept, and would only cause Mazda to lose money if they launched it now, especially in this economy.
High-volume, bread-and-butter cars like the Camry and Silverado require 2-3 years of production to recoup their development costs, and are usually on a 5-year cycle.
Specialized sports cars, like the RX-8, take longer which is why the RX-8 is on a 10-year cycle.
The ONLY way this would make sense is if Mazda had a 16X car ready for production immediately and it would be profitable from Day 1. Otherwise, as I and others have advocated, the RX-8 should live out its intended production life. It will remain Mazda's only rotary car until at least 2013.
Last edited by PotatoSoup; 02-16-2009 at 11:05 AM.
02-16-2009, 11:18 AM
#7
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The Series II version of any car sells FAR less then the series I so this isn't much of a surprise. Especially when you consider RX-8 sales have been pretty low anyways. The most sought after models are always the ones produced in the fewest numbers and those at or near the end of the model life cycle. The R3's will be the most sought after in the future. Not because they were rare but because they were the best. The fact that they are the most rare will just make finding them a bit harder.
02-16-2009, 11:36 AM
#9
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The ONLY way this would make sense is if Mazda had a 16X car ready for production immediately and it would be profitable from Day 1. Otherwise, as I and others have advocated, the RX-8 should live out its intended production life. It will remain Mazda's only rotary car until at least 2013.
2nd jgtc did a interview with someone at mazda on their thoughts on the future in this series. the way he spoke, he made it look like in a couple of years they will have a new car in the series, instead of the fc (i mean FD, i guess i love the FC to much lol) that still in the series. now i am not saying your opinion is wrong or anyting, but i just disagree with the 10 year concept. every one else in jgtc has gone on to newer models except mazda. to me that person from mazda seemed pretty embarrased by that.
Last edited by alfy28; 02-16-2009 at 11:43 AM.
02-16-2009, 12:00 PM
#10
That's why I said "just wishful thinking" [and not necessarily sound fiscal logic].
In principle I concur with your assessment, but a bold move on Mazda's part isn't out of the question.
In principle I concur with your assessment, but a bold move on Mazda's part isn't out of the question.
With respect, that makes no sense. You are comparing a "done-deal" production vehicle to a concept.
1) The RX-8 has now recouped its development cost and is a profitable vehicle.
2) The 16X is still just a development concept, and would only cause Mazda to lose money if they launched it now, especially in this economy.
High-volume, bread-and-butter cars like the Camry and Silverado require 2-3 years of production to recoup their development costs, and are usually on a 5-year cycle.
Specialized sports cars, like the RX-8, take longer which is why the RX-8 is on a 10-year cycle.
The ONLY way this would make sense is if Mazda had a 16X car ready for production immediately and it would be profitable from Day 1. Otherwise, as I and others have advocated, the RX-8 should live out its intended production life. It will remain Mazda's only rotary car until at least 2013.
1) The RX-8 has now recouped its development cost and is a profitable vehicle.
2) The 16X is still just a development concept, and would only cause Mazda to lose money if they launched it now, especially in this economy.
High-volume, bread-and-butter cars like the Camry and Silverado require 2-3 years of production to recoup their development costs, and are usually on a 5-year cycle.
Specialized sports cars, like the RX-8, take longer which is why the RX-8 is on a 10-year cycle.
The ONLY way this would make sense is if Mazda had a 16X car ready for production immediately and it would be profitable from Day 1. Otherwise, as I and others have advocated, the RX-8 should live out its intended production life. It will remain Mazda's only rotary car until at least 2013.
Last edited by Huey52; 02-16-2009 at 12:03 PM.
02-16-2009, 12:35 PM
#11
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i strongly doubt that will be the case. for starters, mazda and other car companies dont rely on their sports car to make the company money. its the accords, mazda3, civics, etc that does that.
2nd jgtc did a interview with someone at mazda on their thoughts on the future in this series. the way he spoke, he made it look like in a couple of years they will have a new car in the series, instead of the fc (i mean FD, i guess i love the FC to much lol) that still in the series. now i am not saying your opinion is wrong or anyting, but i just disagree with the 10 year concept. every one else in jgtc has gone on to newer models except mazda. to me that person from mazda seemed pretty embarrased by that.
2nd jgtc did a interview with someone at mazda on their thoughts on the future in this series. the way he spoke, he made it look like in a couple of years they will have a new car in the series, instead of the fc (i mean FD, i guess i love the FC to much lol) that still in the series. now i am not saying your opinion is wrong or anyting, but i just disagree with the 10 year concept. every one else in jgtc has gone on to newer models except mazda. to me that person from mazda seemed pretty embarrased by that.
In that book, he describes how the RX-8 was conceived and developed for a 10-year cycle. Remember, the FD, in Japan at least, also saw what was essentially a 10-year cycle. So there is precedent.
And anecdotally, the 10-year cycle for the RX-8 seems to be holding true. Series I ran 5 model years from 2004-2008, and Series II will now take the next 5 model years (2009 through 2013), unless Mazda chooses to kill it early and leave a gap until the next RX car (if there is one in fact).
So based on this, I will continue to stand by my assessment that there will not be a new Mazda RX car until 2013 at the earliest...of course, I'll retract my opinion if we start seeing strong evidence to prove otherwise (i.e. legitimate "90% production ready" concept car, actual spy shots, etc.).
02-16-2009, 12:48 PM
#12
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I'm going by Jack Yamaguchi's book on the RX-8. While it may be inaccurate with regard to some technical details (horsepower, etc.), I think it remains the most in-depth, definitive source on the actual RENESIS/RX-8 development programs and its history.
In that book, he describes how the RX-8 was conceived and developed for a 10-year cycle. Remember, the FD, in Japan at least, also saw what was essentially a 10-year cycle. So there is precedent.
And anecdotally, the 10-year cycle for the RX-8 seems to be holding true. Series I ran 5 model years from 2004-2008, and Series II will now take the next 5 model years (2009 through 2013), unless Mazda chooses to kill it early and leave a gap until the next RX car (if there is one in fact).
So based on this, I will continue to stand by my assessment that there will not be a new Mazda RX car until 2013 at the earliest...of course, I'll retract my opinion if we start seeing strong evidence to prove otherwise (i.e. legitimate "90% production ready" concept car, actual spy shots, etc.).
In that book, he describes how the RX-8 was conceived and developed for a 10-year cycle. Remember, the FD, in Japan at least, also saw what was essentially a 10-year cycle. So there is precedent.
And anecdotally, the 10-year cycle for the RX-8 seems to be holding true. Series I ran 5 model years from 2004-2008, and Series II will now take the next 5 model years (2009 through 2013), unless Mazda chooses to kill it early and leave a gap until the next RX car (if there is one in fact).
So based on this, I will continue to stand by my assessment that there will not be a new Mazda RX car until 2013 at the earliest...of course, I'll retract my opinion if we start seeing strong evidence to prove otherwise (i.e. legitimate "90% production ready" concept car, actual spy shots, etc.).
which is why the interview the guy from mazda seemed pretty embarrased when asked what is the future for mazda in the JGTC series, compared to other car companies with new models in the series. i would be embarrased too if the nascar of japan is still using a 15year old design. where all the cars are using pretty much current models. especially when you have a rx8 out in the market, but wont compete in the gt300 class.
like i said, i dont think your opinion is wrong, but i jsut dont see mazda keeping the 8 for a full 10 year cycle. if the 8 was like the FD then yes i can see it. but we all know that is nto the case.
Last edited by alfy28; 02-16-2009 at 12:52 PM.
02-16-2009, 01:05 PM
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Isn't the current RX-8 essentially 16X-ready? The 16X has nearly the same dimensions as the Renesis, so shouldn't Mazda be able to drop it into the RX-8 with minimal changes? That approach might be a good way to launch the 16X, assuming it is production ready, of course. Doing that would renew interest in the RX-8 and provide a channel for sales of the 16X.
02-16-2009, 01:13 PM
#14
Yep, the external dimensions of the 16X are the same or very close to the Renesis from what I've read. Therefore mechanical fitment plug & play. Exactly what I was "wishful thinking." 
Isn't the current RX-8 essentially 16X-ready? The 16X has nearly the same dimensions as the Renesis, so shouldn't Mazda be able to drop it into the RX-8 with minimal changes? That approach might be a good way to launch the 16X, assuming it is production ready, of course. Doing that would renew interest in the RX-8 and provide a channel for sales of the 16X.
02-16-2009, 01:29 PM
#16
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The 1st gen RX-7 went from model year 1979-1985 which as 7 years. The first update was in 1981 and the second of this generation was 1984. The 2nd gen RX-7 went from model year 1986 to 1991 which was 6 years. The S4 version was from 86-88 and the updated S5 version was from 89-91. The 3rd gen RX-7 lasted a whopping 3 years in the US, from 1993-1995 but through about 2002 in Australia and Japan albeit in very small numbers. This was a total life cycle of 10 years and the only rotary to hit this.
The RX-8 is currently at year 6 in it's lifecycle and I only see it lasting another year or 2 before it gets cancelled. It's probably not going to make 10. It doesn't mean I don't see another rotary in the future. There may be a slight lag period where there is none.
The RX-8 is currently at year 6 in it's lifecycle and I only see it lasting another year or 2 before it gets cancelled. It's probably not going to make 10. It doesn't mean I don't see another rotary in the future. There may be a slight lag period where there is none.
02-16-2009, 01:29 PM
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With respect, that makes no sense. You are comparing a "done-deal" production vehicle to a concept.
1) The RX-8 has now recouped its development cost and is a profitable vehicle.
2) The 16X is still just a development concept, and would only cause Mazda to lose money if they launched it now, especially in this economy.
High-volume, bread-and-butter cars like the Camry and Silverado require 2-3 years of production to recoup their development costs, and are usually on a 5-year cycle.
Specialized sports cars, like the RX-8, take longer which is why the RX-8 is on a 10-year cycle.
The ONLY way this would make sense is if Mazda had a 16X car ready for production immediately and it would be profitable from Day 1. Otherwise, as I and others have advocated, the RX-8 should live out its intended production life. It will remain Mazda's only rotary car until at least 2013.
1) The RX-8 has now recouped its development cost and is a profitable vehicle.
2) The 16X is still just a development concept, and would only cause Mazda to lose money if they launched it now, especially in this economy.
High-volume, bread-and-butter cars like the Camry and Silverado require 2-3 years of production to recoup their development costs, and are usually on a 5-year cycle.
Specialized sports cars, like the RX-8, take longer which is why the RX-8 is on a 10-year cycle.
The ONLY way this would make sense is if Mazda had a 16X car ready for production immediately and it would be profitable from Day 1. Otherwise, as I and others have advocated, the RX-8 should live out its intended production life. It will remain Mazda's only rotary car until at least 2013.
Live out its life until 2013 while selling a handful of cars in 2008? Five more years? I don't think so.
02-16-2009, 01:30 PM
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yes i know the FD had a 10 year cycle. but the difference betwween the 2 is, FD has a huge support for aftermarket where RX8 has pretty much nothing when you compare it to FD and other cars in teh same catagory.
which is why the interview the guy from mazda seemed pretty embarrased when asked what is the future for mazda in the JGTC series, compared to other car companies with new models in the series. i would be embarrased too if the nascar of japan is still using a 15year old design. where all the cars are using pretty much current models. especially when you have a rx8 out in the market, but wont compete in the gt300 class.
like i said, i dont think your opinion is wrong, but i jsut dont see mazda keeping the 8 for a full 10 year cycle. if the 8 was like the FD then yes i can see it. but we all know that is nto the case.
which is why the interview the guy from mazda seemed pretty embarrased when asked what is the future for mazda in the JGTC series, compared to other car companies with new models in the series. i would be embarrased too if the nascar of japan is still using a 15year old design. where all the cars are using pretty much current models. especially when you have a rx8 out in the market, but wont compete in the gt300 class.
like i said, i dont think your opinion is wrong, but i jsut dont see mazda keeping the 8 for a full 10 year cycle. if the 8 was like the FD then yes i can see it. but we all know that is nto the case.
Anyway, I honestly don't believe that either aftermarket support or JGTC contention are going to weigh heavily on Mazda in deciding when/if they kill the RX-8 and/or introduce a new model. If it was that important to them, I think they would have gone with a true RX-7 replacement instead of the RX-8.
But I'm sure their guy was embarrassed, but anybody in his situation could say something like "Oh yeah, things suck now, but we've got a new car on the way in a couple years!" just to save some face.
As for using the 16X in the current RX-8, sure, that's a possibility. But who knows what kind of issues they're working through with regard to reliability, durability, etc?
You have to ask yourself why they would bother with significant upgrades to the RENESIS (EMOPs, extra injectors) if they were planning on just introducing the 16X in the RX-8 during its last years of production (MY2011 or later)...?
NINJA-EDIT: I have said in other threads that I would not be surprised if the RX-8 was cancelled in export markets or all markets before 2013. What I've been consistent on is that I do not believe we will see a new RX car before 2013. As RG said, there may indeed be a gap between the death of the RX-8 and the appearance of a new RX.
Last edited by PotatoSoup; 02-16-2009 at 01:33 PM.
02-16-2009, 01:42 PM
#19
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I know you're well-aware, I just brought it up to make a point. I used to follow JGTC when they would occasionally show it here on the old Speedvision. I wish they still showed it here in the US.
Anyway, I honestly don't believe that either aftermarket support or JGTC contention are going to weigh heavily on Mazda in deciding when/if they kill the RX-8 and/or introduce a new model. If it was that important to them, I think they would have gone with a true RX-7 replacement instead of the RX-8.
But I'm sure their guy was embarrassed, but anybody in his situation could say something like "Oh yeah, things suck now, but we've got a new car on the way in a couple years!" just to save some face.
As for using the 16X in the current RX-8, sure, that's a possibility. But who knows what kind of issues they're working through with regard to reliability, durability, etc?
You have to ask yourself why they would bother with significant upgrades to the RENESIS (EMOPs, extra injectors) if they were planning on just introducing the 16X in the RX-8 during its last years of production (MY2011 or later)...?
NINJA-EDIT: I have said in other threads that I would not be surprised if the RX-8 was cancelled in export markets or all markets before 2013. What I've been consistent on is that I do not believe we will see a new RX car before 2013. As RG said, there may indeed be a gap between the death of the RX-8 and the appearance of a new RX.
Anyway, I honestly don't believe that either aftermarket support or JGTC contention are going to weigh heavily on Mazda in deciding when/if they kill the RX-8 and/or introduce a new model. If it was that important to them, I think they would have gone with a true RX-7 replacement instead of the RX-8.
But I'm sure their guy was embarrassed, but anybody in his situation could say something like "Oh yeah, things suck now, but we've got a new car on the way in a couple years!" just to save some face.
As for using the 16X in the current RX-8, sure, that's a possibility. But who knows what kind of issues they're working through with regard to reliability, durability, etc?
You have to ask yourself why they would bother with significant upgrades to the RENESIS (EMOPs, extra injectors) if they were planning on just introducing the 16X in the RX-8 during its last years of production (MY2011 or later)...?
NINJA-EDIT: I have said in other threads that I would not be surprised if the RX-8 was cancelled in export markets or all markets before 2013. What I've been consistent on is that I do not believe we will see a new RX car before 2013. As RG said, there may indeed be a gap between the death of the RX-8 and the appearance of a new RX.
True, but when you have ppl like Keiich pretty much telling ppl on tv whats wrong with the 8. i do not think mazda wants to continue with that path of getting bashed for not having this or that etc.
also with cars like AE86 , S13-15, 350z and now the 370z, FC-FD still getting alot of support, but a very small number for the 8. i feel mazda is ready to jump to their next car. which i feel would be in 2011-2012 or even sooner. i know you feel that aftermarket doesnt determine their choice. but i feel tah it does, if there is none, then only a small amount of ppl will buy that car. just like in teh case of the 8.
as for JGTC, i feel that it does help choose what car companies are willing to put out. just like when nissan dropped the R34 and put in the z, toyota droped the supra for the SC. Image is important in japan. JGTC is the most popular sport being viewed on tv besides J-League. i lived their for 17 years and also half japanese my self .
personally i think rx8 was just a inbetween car, like what windows ME was to windows xp. just enough to get buyers of their car to see if there interests are.
lol but we probably go back and forth on this subject. so ill stop posting my opinion
we wil just have to wait and see.
Last edited by alfy28; 02-16-2009 at 01:51 PM.
02-16-2009, 02:07 PM
#22
It was nice knowing all of you. 
Actually in the state the economy is in I don't see it as being that bad. Other car companies are already announcing the death of their sports cars. Mazda will always be rotary, so I don't care if they kill the 8, their will always be another rotary as long as Mazda is around.
Also considering that GM is killing entire car companies like Pontiac, Hummer, Saab, Saturn. Mazda is doing pretty good.
Actually in the state the economy is in I don't see it as being that bad. Other car companies are already announcing the death of their sports cars. Mazda will always be rotary, so I don't care if they kill the 8, their will always be another rotary as long as Mazda is around.
Also considering that GM is killing entire car companies like Pontiac, Hummer, Saab, Saturn. Mazda is doing pretty good.
Last edited by AJ's Shinka; 02-20-2009 at 01:37 AM.
02-16-2009, 02:25 PM
#23
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Quote" personally i think rx8 was just a inbetween car, like what windows ME was to windows xp"
You must really hate RX8's.... Windows Me was more like a Yugo, or maybe a Pinto with the exploding gas tank.
You must really hate RX8's.... Windows Me was more like a Yugo, or maybe a Pinto with the exploding gas tank.
02-16-2009, 02:44 PM
#24
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but i am not comparing the 8 to windows me for glitches, but comparing it to Microsoft just putting out a OS till windows xp came out. but a part of me feel s the 8 is just a car they put out as a test mule to be honest with you. i think they needed feedback so they can improve from their current design. but didtn have time, since nissan was putting out the 350z. but that is just me thikning in la la land lol.
but nah i dotn hate the 8, its a good car.
Last edited by alfy28; 02-16-2009 at 02:57 PM.
