Summer vs All Season tires
 

Hey guys! I live in Columbus Ohio and have an 8 that I tend to drive only when the weather is good. I have a second car, but do occasionally have to drive the 8 in winter /rain weather. Currently I have some no name all weather tires that SUCK!

So I'm thinking of buying some new ones, either Ultra High performance summers or Ultra High performance all season tires. Anyone have any experience with these two types of tires? Is their a big difference in traction in dry weather? I know the topic of snow tires and how critical they are has been beaten to death, but I am curious how big of a diff all season tires vs. summer tires really makes, in say, the rain. I ask this only because since day one on my current all season tires, my performance has been downright bad.

Is this going to be the case with most all season tires? I'm not looking to spend an arm and a leg (found some for around $100/tire that got good reviews), and the only thing I care about is how well the car grips (don't care about comfort, road noise, etc). Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.

Well an all season tire is a jack of all trades, master of none, so its a compromise. If you want superior handling and traction, summer tires are usually the way to go. Although when it is 40F or below, they tend to become ineffective, since they are hard as a brick.

If you dont plan on driving the car in winter and snow and winter temperatures, than you will be alright with summer tires. However if you plan on driving in light snow or in the freezing temps, it would be advisable to go for the high performance all seasons. I would say high perf all seasons are much better than a regular touring all season tire. But the difference between a high performance summer tire and high performance all season tire is like night and day.

The real question is what is really your priority, do you want superior handling tires or a compromise tire. What type of driving do you do and so forth.....all determinating factors as to which tire would be right for you.

Pirelli PZero Nero tires FTW!

I currently have Falken ZE512's on mine, which is an ultra high perf. all season. They're not as good as the bridgestones, but I can drive in the snow and they're a lot quieter. Not sure if I will buy the same thing again, the car just doesn't handle like it used to

If I do get summer tires, could I keep my current all season tires for use later when winter rolls around again? Or should you not re-mount used tires?

Good summer tires can have very good traction in the rain. If you get some light snow and don't want to get snow tires, get All Season.

I rotate summer and winter tires every year without any problems. I've had close calls in both conditions where I am VERY glad that I had weather-specific rubber on my car, and now that I know how much traction I can get there's no going back.

Summer - Falken Azenis RT-615
Winter - Nokian Hakkapilettas

The difference between all-season tires and the Azenis is enormous. IE, don't try them until you're ready to buy them because nothing else will match up afterwards. (MAde that mistake with R-comps at an autocross...) The grip and response of the Azenis is on a whole other level, and I drive on mine 8 months out of the year, autocrossing nearly every weekend, and they still last me a bit more than a calender year. More expensive, yes, but I would take good rubber above just about any other performance mod out there.

I live in an area of New Englad with very inconsistent weather. We occasionally have blizzards, and sometimes we have no snow at all during the course of an entire winter. It makes tire choice on performance cars a pain.

On my EVO, I wore out the stock advans quickly (sort of underwhelmed with them too). The car was a death trap with them (yes even with 4wd) in the snow. I got Pirelli P-Zero Neros and it was decent in the snow, great in the rain and mediocre in the dry. I was sort of moderatley satisfied most of the time. In the spring, fall and summer I really wish I had gone with an agressive summer only tire. In the winter I was glad I had something that was surviveable in the snow and not miserable to drive when it wasn't snowy (aka real winter tires). In the end though, I was mostly non-plussed with the whole thing. In the end I did the same thing with my C class, but as that isn't really a performance car like the EVO or 8, I didn't miss the uber traction and response much.

My Dad with his MazdaSpeed MX-5 went the winter/summer tire route. He has blizzaks on 16" rims for the winter and Kumho Ecsta MX's for the summer on the stock wheels. He's in love with the car in the summer but hates it in winter.

Having yet to find a really satisfactory solution I am thinking of the following either:

A) Buy sticky summer rubber mount it up, and panic/figure it out later.
B) Buy sticky summer rubber and for winter buy a really good all season tire. Decent normally and surviveable in the snow.
C) Buy a sticky summer tire, a cheap set of wheels for my winter tires and just mount them up when absolutely necessary (I figure with air tools and a garage that won't be that big a deal to do every now and then)

Thoughts?

I'll second that! These tires are awesome; I hardly noticed a difference in grip between these and my OEM Bridgestones. I did go up to a 245 width though; maybe that helped. And although not as good as a snow tire in the winter, I got through the past two snowy seasons (MD) without any trouble.

Pros:
Good dry performance
Excellent wet performance (compared to stock)
Cheap - about $150/tire
Good winter performance
Quiet

Cons:
Compromise between Cold/Warm performance
A little out of the O.P.'s price range (edit: I'm only saying this because you mentioned the $100 option, no offense intended if it sounds that way)
Probably heavier than stock if you go up a size (I'm reaching here)

If they SUCK!, why the hell would you want to reuse them - especailly in the worst possible road conditions?

It's a bit annoying to have to swap, but worth it for the best set up for the conditions. If $$$ is an issue then all season is the answer. For the most part, the rubber is a mixed-bag, so to speak. So you'll get the benefit of longer life, no swapping, winter control - basically more bang for the buck. It'll cost you in the summer fun, tho.

See above. If you're buying 2 sets of tires, why would you NOT get summers & winters?

Dunlop WinterSport M3 on the stock wheels - great f8ckin tire! I was dissapointed in our snow fall this winter b/c I never had enough snow to really mess around in.

Stock Potenzas are going on the new wheels soon . . .

I should have specified; they suck in warmer weather.

Real winter tires are rotten to drive on when its not actually snowy. My issue is there are really only a handful of days a year when there is actually any snow on the ground. Driving around on blizzaks day to day when there is almost no snow isn't very plesant. If I lived in vermont, it would be a different story.

I know someone here (chicago burbs)who uses falken summer tires in the summer and Pirelli PZero Nero M+S in the winter. I got the Pirelli's last fall for my 8, and in the 245 size like someone else has mentioned. In this area we only seem to get a few big snows a year, and the snow removal is pretty good.

You definitley loose some grip in the corners on dry pavement, but you only notice it if you are driving aggresively. For example, I took a curve the other day aggresively and slid all four tires briefly - if i had summer tires on they would have most likely stuck.

I'm probably going to end up just keeping the pirellis on year round rather than paying DT to remount tires twice a year.

To me it's woth having two sets of tires. The Blizzaks go on around November 1 and come off March 31. I will make one change though. When this set of Blizzaks wear out (at least one more seasonn), I will move to a more performance-oriented winter tire. The winters around here are erratic, and if the weather really sucks, I just call it a snow day and stay home.

Nothing better than having purpose-built rubber on during the summer!

I still haven't swapped yet, and I'm in RI as well. The M3s are not bad - they seem to be a true winterSPORT tire - not just a "snow" tire. Basically, cruising speed is still pretty f8ckin fast, and I don't feel like the performance suffers on "nice" winter days.

Option C is okay (although "sticky summer" turn into "rock hard hockey puck" below 50ºF) but, as others have suggested, option B really makes no sense. The only advantage of all-seasons is that they're the only tire you need—you can "get by" with one set of tires, and you don't have to bother switching tires twice a year. But if you already have summer tires, you must use either all-seasons or winter tires in the winter, and winters beat all-seasons hands down.

Realize there are TWO main types of winter tires: Tire Rack calls them "Performance Winter" (for dry winter roads, icy roads, and light to moderate snow) and "Studless Ice and Snow" (for big time snow ). To your point, yes, Blizzacks and other "Studless Ice and Snow" tires feel odd and squirrely when there isn't much snow on the ground. But "Performance Winter" tires, like my Dunlop M3s, are great when it's 30ºF and the roads are bone dry—plus they can handle the few snow storms and the occasional blizzard you get in Rhode Island.

So the best option, IMHO, is option D: sticky summer from April - Thanksgiving, performance winter the other four months.

Bridgestone Potenza 960 AS Pole Positions
 

Bridgestone Potenza 960 AS Pole Positions

These tires are remarkably good in wet weather.
TireRack - Review of PolePositions

This is a repost from another thread.
These tires are fantastic, please ask your tire dealer about them.
(Chances are, he's already using them on his car)

Option B doesn't sound so bad if you don't get much snow. We've had probably 4 days of snow here this last winter season, which is not much by our standards as sometimes we can get up to 20 snow days (I would guesstimate) per season. But if I had put on all winter tires and it snowed 5 days the whole season I'd be wishing I just put the all-season tires on. At least 90% of the time I'm getting better grip.

I was unaware of the difference between the studless snow type tires and the high performance winter tires. That sounds like the ideal solution. Maybe mount them up to some cheapie rims, or get some ssr comps for the summer

If you only drive when the weather is good, and only when the temps are above 45, then by all means go for summers. I have had Pirelli PZeroNero all seasons for 30,000 miles and are about to buy another set, I like them so well.

My recommendations, after running a bunch of different tires on several cars, are as follows:

1) No "All seasons" They just suck compared to dedicated rubber overall.

2) Summer:
a) Not too worried about cost: Bridgestone RE 050 A PP. Fantastic grip wet or dry, quiet, smooth, excellent braking.
b) Trying to save some money: Avon Tech M 500. Nearly as good as the 050, but not quite there. Cheaper.

I dont think there are better tires available at either price point. And the 050 is so good, that I really dont feel like I need even better performance for a street car.

3) Winter
a) Performance winter (give up some ice traction for good dry performance): Contiwintercontact TS 810. If you dont mind spending more, the Pilot Alpin is also excellent.
b) Snow tire (as safe as you can get in bad weather, but dry performance will leave you cold): B'stone Blizzak Revo or the Michelin X-ice, the latter is a better tire.

G/L

Thanks great follow up. I'll probably go the winter performance route. I was thinking about kumho ecstas. I was thinking about going the mx route vs spt as I'll be tracking the car this summer.

I may go with the new Bridgestone Potenza RE-01R
Supposed to be faster than the Azenis. Hey that's what they said.
But sucks in below 40 degrees. Like it ever gets that cold here in South Mississippi.

Get some Toyo T1R's. Very good in the dry, yet surprisingly good in the wet. Also look at Goodyear Eagle G1-D3's.