Shifting technique - am I killing my tranny?
 

Lately if I shift from 2nd at mid to high rpms into 4th the gears grind consistently. Of course the clutch is pressed all the way to the floor. Am I shifting too fast for the syncros to catch up? If I pause in neutral for a moment no grinding occurs.

Thought I was being gentle--I've seen videos of people shifting pretty hard on this car...


Please help
-AC

Never had that problem. I can shift fast and never have any grinding. Maybe you need a little more practice. I have no idea dude!

weird... so it grinds as you slide the stick into 4th? or when you engage the clutch while the stick is in 4th?

FS

Yeah, that is strange...I've only (it made me cry) grinded going into reverse...I would take it to the dealer and have them check it out, just in case.

Weird. I go from 2nd to 6th all the time, and never had a problem. Maybe you should get it checked out.

Actually this doesn't surprise me - the synchros are designed work in order - and if you rush a shift, you will get a bit of a grind, especially if your revs aren't matched. If you're going 2nd to 4th, why are you rushing the shift. You're sure not shifting for accelleration if you are skipping gears. Slow down and go for smoothness.

I'd bet nothing is wrong with the gearbox ... the fact that if you slow the shift down, you don't get grinding shows that.

Why skip third gear? Isn't the point of having a manual transmission to go thru the gears? If you don't like shifting, get an automatic. :confused:

same problem (kinda)
 

I have the same problem happen in my car sometimes, but mostly just going from first to second, and only if i'm driving it hard and i'm slamming it into 2nd gear at high rpm's. It's strange - i'll have my clutch all the way in, and as i'm throwing it into second, it'll stick in the midway point between nuetral and 2nd, and just grind. Then i really have to force it back up to nuetral to stop the grinding (clutch is still in of course) and then it'll go right into second. It only does this sometimes, and it's never done on accident or purposly - it just happens. Sometimes it'll even do it if i'm in second and coming to a stop and taking it out of gear. It's deffinatly something we should probably have the dealer look at - i'm planing on taking mine in within the next month or so to have it checked out. Anyone else experiencing this problem that might know whats going wrong?

I guess some people (like Elara above) like to redline their engine but then run out of road to continue accelerating, so they shift straight into a high gear.

no that doens't sound right, i've driven more then 10 different stick cars, i skip gears all the time and never grinds, u should get it check out buddy.

This has happened to me once, but I've had this happen to me on an old MT I used to drive as well. It doesn't happen regularly (at least to me) so I'm not worried. Probably human error.

You probably need to be little more deliberate with your shift actuation. You are probably going to fast, and letting up on the clutch just a little too soon as you pull the lever into 4th gear. The idea with driving a stick is being smooth, not quick.

DEFINITELY check it out...sounds bad! was your's used? do you know its driving record?

maybe someone kicked the tranny's ass before you got it, YIKES!

did I just say that?

"kicked the tranny's ass"

I have nothing against transexuals, BTW

same as you here

I bought my 8 brand new last August, so nobody has kicked the tranny's ass. This is my first manual transmission but I've never grinded the gears because of error on my part, I learned fast and am driving pretty smoothly/

On my drive to work today it grinded on a 3 > 4 shift at about 7K rpms. I'm going to the dealership for an oil change and tire rotation, so what's the best way for me to explain this problem? I don't want to deal with any dealer BS like them telling me I abused it.

Does it grind when you slowly, deliberately shift? If it does, you've got a problem. If it doesn't it's likely your technique.

have them put in a new shift fork...it should be covered under warranty

I bought my 8 new, with only 5 miles on it (i test drove it with 3, and put the extra 2 on it on my test drive). The grinding happens when i shift fast going into a higher gear (ex: 1st to 2nd) or when i'm slowly downshifting (ex: 3rd to 2nd), and it always sticks and grinds in the same spot - with the clutch all the way in, while it's all the way in. it doesn't seem to do it on any of the other gears, however, it did it once going into 4th from 3rd, but it only grinded a bit on the way into the gear - nothing near as bad as what it does going into second. As far as "abusing" the tranny goes, i've only grinded on accident once - it was when i first got the car and i was putting it in reverse. it felt like it went in, but to my supprise, it didn't. i quickly put back in the clutch, not letting it grind long at all (maybe 1 second max), and put it the rest of the way into gear. I've never done it since.

I had this problem, but it happened only after a cold start. dealer told me it was a result of having 'cold transmission' fluid. I think he was right, since the problem seems to subside after the car is fully warmed up.

I've had the experience on various mannual transmission cars that i've owned that if you don't shift them properly they'l grind. for example make shure that you're shifting to the center of the gear port. Some times if you are shifting and put preasure on the gear ports (shifting diagonaly instead of straight into the port) it will grind.

Also having the car fully warmed up before reving it makes A LOT OF SENSE. Most fluids are not distribuited evenly inside youre car (oil, tranny, diferrential, coolant, ect) so reving your car cold (7000 RPM shifts) just adds more wear to the parts.

Finnaly shift with confidence. Sometimes if you try to shift too fast you end up shifting it half way by the time you start letting go of the clutch. On cars with crappy clutches you will not notice it but our cars have a very good clutch so it will start to grab as soon as you start to take preasure of the peddal. Ever notice on those videos where they shift fast that they are also pulling on the shift knob as if they wanted to ripp the thing off. Of course it isn't their car so why should they care if they do rip it off or if they dammage the tranny.

Anyway the best advice I can give you is not to do it every day. Don't shift your car at 7000 RPM comming back from work, there is a reason they call us weekend wariors (you abuse your car on weekends, you take good care of it douring the week).

Hope this helps.

In regards to the comment about troubles with a 2->4 shift, you should always go into the next gear when you are shifting hard, even if you don't intend to use it. This is because the syncros are designed to shift sequentially. If you go slowly, it doesn't matter. I used to have a problem like this on my Miata, where I couldn't make a 5->3 shift that came at the end of a long straight without grinding. The solution was to shift into 4 without letting out the clutch, then into the 3. This lets the syncros mesh properly.

I have had the problem with the 1->2 shift at high rpms in my 8 and also had it in my Miata. I believe its mainly technique, coupled with the fact that the transmission and the PPF flex slightly, especially in these low gears, so you must be very deliberate with the 1->2 shift and do it slower than the other gears. I doubt its an actual problem with the transmission. Of course, this behavior is worse when its cold. Red-line lube in the tranny and shift turret helped alot in my Miata; I bet it would help the 8 also.

I've had this same problem and I have the same habit of skipping gears. I do 1-2-5, 1-2-6, 1-2-3-6, you get the point. Mine grinds pretty badly between 3rd and 4th when I'm accelerating hard at high rpms. I told the dealer 2x and they just keep saying "could not duplicate" on the report.

I skip gears all the time, but not under heavy acceleration. The transmission wants to do what's most efficient, so if you're under heavy acceleration, it wants to go through all the gears to keep on the most efficient part of the torque curve - which maxes out at something like 4500 RPM, or maybe higher, I'm sure someone can look it up. Skipping ahead to a taller gear is inefficient under heavy acceleration and will put undue pressure on the crankshaft. You don't want to do that, and that's probably why you're having a problem.

What you want to do if you're skipping a gear is let off the gas, and slow your rate of acceleration. That's when it makes sense to skip a gear. The transmission/synchros are "happy" with a skip under those circumstances.

One more thing that was alluded to here, It is nuts to run the engine at 7,000 RPM cold, for reasons that were explained in a previous post.

Personally, I shift somtimes without the clutch and I've never had a grind. If you know when the tranny wants to shift, you don't need the clutch. I've had several manual transmission cars in my years, and after I've driven them for a while, I can usually shift without the clutch because I get to know the torque curve. But if you're grinding WITH the clutch, then you're not reading the car's feedback very well. At all. Nothing personal!

It does...noticeably.

Best,
Bill