RX8 Problems Please Help ***
 

Hi ive just purchased an RX8 (bit of an impulse buy):crazy:

After test driving for 15minutes all seemed fine, it was alittle lazy on take off but after a few mins drove normally. After purchase i started driving it home after 90miles the engine light flashed and the car went extremely slugish ie going up a small high on the motorway i found my self dropping to 3rd just to keep the car going as the power just wasnt there to pull it up the hill, but then back on the flat it was running like a morris miner, slowly rebuilding speed. It was also stalling all the time and wouldnt restart without bump starting it. Ie every round about, giveway sign, stop sign, yadda yadda you get the drift*.

When i got back home i had someone come out and connect a gadget up to tell me what the engine light flashed for, it turned out to be the num1 coil. He also found oil in the air filter pipe.

After all this im now having trouble even getting it to start, and even when it does it cuts straight out again.

Hes advised me to get a coil and change that first, and go from there.

Does this sound like ive bought a lemon? and should quit before i start? or does it sound not to expensive? (under 1k)

Please help as ive already spent 3k buying the car and really dont want to be wasting more if the cars never gonna be right.

If you have any experince with this type of problem please help. Thanks All:doh:

I would definitely changes the coils/plugs first.

From your post, it feels like buying a 3k fixer upper was a poor decision you made.
Apparently, I think you are way in over your head.

If you're willing to make the time and monetary commitment, read through the forum.
There is a lot of good info here if you're willing to take the time to sift through the noise.

Your stated issues are:
* starting
* lack of power
* stalling
* idle quality

There are many threads for each of these.

Your friend pointed you in the right direction by starting with the ignition system. The fix can range anywhere from replacing coils/plugs (few hundred) to replacing the motor (thousands).

Unless you want to roll your sleeves up, My gut feeling is that you might be better off selling off your car to a knowledgeable person willing to bring the car up to snuff. You don't strike me as the type of person who will part out a car.

Ive ordered the plugs/coils and ht leads, it seemed good on the test drive. ive driven a friends one before but that was alot newer. it seemed about the same though it was on the ride home all started going wrong. After these bits have been fitted i'll post up a continuation. main thing that worried me was the oil in the air intake pipes. Is that normal? or sound problimatic? thanks for the replys

If the rest of the car is in good condition then even if you have to replace the motor, it will still likely be under the 10k marker.

I hope the coils fix it. Good luck!

That car cost you only $3K:eek::eek::eek:

Coud you describe a little more the nature of that purchase? Sounds like the car might need a lot of work:SHOCKED:

Check the battery voltage as well, make sure the alternator is running.

If it ran good once, likely it can run good again. They are right with plugs and coils. There are 2 good threads in my sig. Let us know how it goes.

By chance is it 3k UK pounds?

That's a good possibility.

Otherwise, I cannot imagine anybody buying an RX-8 for $3K US dollars that wouldn't need a significant amount of work.

I hope the OP didn't rush to purchase an RX-8 for a super "deal" thinking that the car is something like a Honda Civic or a Toyota Corolla:SHOCKED:

Oil in the intake is most likely from someone overfilling the oil. Lots of threads on that. Part of the poor running could be from that getting the mass air flow sensor dirty. There are a lot of threads on that, too - search something like "MAF sensor" or "MAF cleaning." You can get a spray can of cleaner for that.

You're definitely doing the right thing replacing wires coils and plugs. Lucky that only one coil went bad. I had two, on the same rotor, suddenly go bad. Took out an 02 sensor and the cat in under 10 miles of driving. And the last 5 miles felt a lot like what you described.

Ken

£3000 as some asked £or$.
Ive changed the faulty coil this morning.

Now the water coolent lights come on but ive checked that and its full. (light wont go off)
Engine lights on. (will reset monday)

Ive also sprayed a full tin of carb cleaner through out the air intake pipes to get rid of all the oil and left them to dry out. On the dip stick it seems to be on max so im guessing the last owner overfilled it.

Now the car is starting again. But after about 2minutes of running its spluttering abit but doesnt cut out like before. Also the engine sounds ratterly when you rev it but same again it only does this after the engine has had a few minutes to heat up, from cold you can rev it and it sounds fine.

Ive checked the battery thats fine.

And cleaned the mass air flow sensor which did look dirty. hasnt made much differents though.

Any comments/Help Welcome

If the ccolant light is the one that looks like a radiator, that's pretty common. The float that works the sensor gets heavy with age and sinks. You can replace the tank, or just pull the plug and check the coolant visually every now and then.

Read the codes before you clear the engine light.

Ken

3K UK pounds sounds like a decent deal ($6K US approx is a little on the low side, but right arround the ballpark, you got a good deal)

Congrats on the purchase, keep reading the forums, as a very unique sportscar, with a one-of a- kind engine, it needs a little more attention than your average petrol-burner, but these are very good cars when you know their unique "quirks"

The engine uses up oil... this is normal for a rotary
The radiator light will light up, (as long as th etemperature gauge still reads normal you should be fine.
Pre-mixing 2 stroke oil into our fuel 1/100 ratio or lower will further protect your engine
These engines run very hot, so if you sit idling in a car park you are cooking your engine's electronics (alternator/ coils/plugs etc) The better you manage your heat, the more durable the engine.

These cars are not particularly powerful, but they trully shine on teh handling department, and the engine when in good repair is as smooth as a jet turbine.

Both lights have gone off now
I hit the coolent tank with a hammer and that solved one problem, and the engine light went off after starting the car up a few times.

Only thing now is the lack of power at low revvs and knocking noise (about 1.06min into video, as my foot comes of the acc you can hear it) it only does this when the car reaches normal temp. not when its cold.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQwGOo0R0Yo <--- sorry about the sound but you can make it out

Thanks for all the help so far, seem to be getting somewhere slowly.

Also i read up that this maybe caused by the SSV (secondary shutter valve) being dirty or possibly the CAT? does that make sence?

You are using High test/premium (93 octane or better) petrol right?

The renesis engine does NOT like the low octane/ cheap fuel.

A clogged cat(alytic converter) would give you a Sulfur smell after driving it, (and you can check under the car and see it glowing red from overheating) it can also cause the knocking/lack of power you are describing. (and it was common on the early models)

Have you taken it to a dealer to check what ECU "flash" is programmed into your car's "brain" (more of an issue with US spec cars, but worth checking out a well) they can also run a compression test on teh engine to ensure it is in good health (Compression test out of warranty costs about 100 USD though)

Engine gone.

I'll have to try that on mine. Of all info in the coolant tank threads, nobody thought of that one before. And it's such a satisfying solution to so many problems.

Ken

About starting issues - I literally made a thread about this. Check my sig.

About that knocking noise... Sounds rough man. On the other hand, my car has been making a similar noise as well since I replaced coils and plugs. Runs fine though. Ended up that my issue was a vacuum leak for the "popping" noise.

Ive run a full tank of Esso's finest thorugh it since i had it 2days ago but havent a clue what the previous owner used.

Ken-x8* defo get the hammer too it, was well satifying after the troubles im having, i just tapped it on each side of the water tank and hey presto light went out.

Regarding the CAT, being abit of a novice to all this if i just remove the cat and start the car is it going to damage anything running it with most the exhaurst missing? or by doing this and trying the car without it, ie it runs better without it? then just buy a new one.

Takeing it for a check at the local dealership is going to be my last resort, but is starting to look unavoidable :(

I was thinking the same thing. Very clever.

Removing cat won't harm the car. Seems you have good diagnostic sense. Try running without it.

NOTE: An unmuffled rotary engine is wicked loud, like a chainsaw from hell.

The engine losing power and smoothness after it gets warm feels like your motor has lost nominal compression.

If the engine is on its way out, you can premix. You might get a few hundred more miles out of it.

It may be good idea to take it in for a compression test. Make sure you hold on to your receipts for coils and spark plugs, and let the technicians know they are new.

thing with taking the cat off & running without the exhaust is that it will be UNGODLY LOUD so it will be very hard to notice any other sounds (like the knock youre looking to eliminate)

Also, the car has pre- and post cat o2 sensors, so running catless may trigger a CEL (engine light) hopefully someone here running a "test pipe" (cat delete, non "road legal" pipe) can confirm

If you have te time & tools and would rather try to save some cash, you can remove the cat & visually inspect it (shine a light through it and look to see that it is not melted on the inside, or clogged)

I'll check with the torch first but sounds like i should start the car even if the only outcome is to wake the kids in the morning! should get them up. If not sounds like a trip to mazda for the com test.

Thanks all for the info very helpful

I'll update in a few days in detail to let you know the outcome good or bad

It seems like it's hit or miss with the cel for the cat. I got a 04, and my cel comes on for the missing cat. While my buddy with an 05 has been catless for over a year with out a cel.

Engine lights off. Cats checked (sounded lovly catless), Plugs/coils all new.
and ive regained most of the power i think, its not slacking when pulling up hills anymore anyway.

But the idleing problems back after a 5mile run, and its cutting out when i take my foot off the gas and again still wont start up when hot.

Also it sounds like a sowing machine.

Cars booked into mazda for the compression test etc for wednesday next week. Will update again after that.

Good luck.

bah humbug :( compression test shows 6.8/6.9/0 need rebuild. thanks for the help though all cars now on ebay
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-MAZDA...item336bede7b7

Sorry it didn't work out. :(

Hm... I'd throw it in your garage, and save up the few grand to get a new engine...

Maybe an FD engine? because that is ungodly cheap...

haha streetGT, ive infact just bought an engine among almost everything else for this car and spripped it down to a shell and interior. i desided in the end to rebuild the full car.

Also after intensive chats with Mazda and rebuilders of the rotary engines i found out that if these dont start when there "HOT" its ethier Plugs/coils or compression. (Poss a slow RPM starter but very unlikly)

I should hopefully have this back on the road by friday

Wow! A turnaround! Best of luck!

Wow Just read this and big ups on the decision to rebuild the car. Looking forward to seeing pics of the rebuild. Make sure you keep us Updated. Start a build thread my man.

try my link http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?s...1&l=1bb6c1fb3c

not sure if this will work, but all pics will be uploaded too here:evil_laug

Hi could one of you with an RX8 please have a look at a wire order for me please.

At the rear of the engine just behind/below the black part of the air intake theres 3 wires with different coloured plug fittings (pritty much in the center / back part if your looking under the bonnet)

Blue / White and black

there vertical so could you please tell me the order there suppost to be in?

Ok sorted out the three wires after hours on google.

Now I have the new engine in and running, but hey presto new problems lol

Whats been changed
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
231 13b engine (Remanufactured)

Coils (Mazda Originals [New])

Plugs (Mazda Originals [New])

Leads (New)

Water pump (Mazda Originals [New])

All Gaskets through and through (Mazda Originals [New])

Battery (Optima Red Top Starter Battery RT-U 4.2 8004-250) 12V, 50Ah
Cold Cranking Amps815 CCA
Capacity (EN): 50Ah

Almost every pipe to silicon (New) a few i couldnt get in silicon have been cleaned out


Problem Now
~~~~~~~~

The car wont idle at norm and stalls if it drops below 1500rpm or there abouts.

And refuses to start when hot.

As long as i keep the revvs above 1500rpm the car runs perfect and now sounds fantastic.


Any surgessions welcomed as im totally out of ideas...

Also forgot to mention the ECU has been reset (Ignition light on [2nd click] 20 fast pumps on the brake peddle and the oil gauge moved as it should to indicate a reset)

Any codes that you are getting currently?
You can try and force in two quick drive cycles if you can keep the car running long enough.

Does the power feel smooth and fine above that 1500 rpm mark up to the redline?

Also, when you had everything apart replacing the motor, did you clean the SSV valve while it was easy to get at?

BC.

Congratulations on the install.
Have you checked for vacuum leaks?

BTW, you may want to ask a moderator to move this to the Troubleshooting subforum with a more descriptive title, such as, "Self-installed new engine along with some new issues." You might get better responses that way.

Ye everything was cleaned before putting it back together. and theres no dash engine light or codes on the plugin.

Above 1500rpm ive had it upto 100mph and it got there without any judders or hold backs. also revving up to full revvs theres no sound of misfire or problems there.

I double checked the throttle valve and air intake valve before dropping it off with mazda as ive read these are common problems.

I kinda gave up, so its with mazda dealership now lol for compression and ECU check up thismorning at 10am just on the offchance its something serious.

I dropped it of lastnight and one of there guys drove it and said it drives like a new car apart from the low idle but they'll go over everything in the morning.

figures X'ed

Good luck.
As long as it runs strong, it sounds encouraging.

As a bandaid, you might want to consider getting an Accessport. With that you can bump up your idle speed. It's also handy for a lot of good stuff, like increasing oil metering, raising redline, lowering radiator fan kick in threshold, and such.

I would clean the MAF, Check the tube for oil residue. Reset and clean the ESS.. Check the SSV as stated. and ensure the CAT isnt clogged.

Post back with results

Had the results today from mazda.

Compression from cold
318rpm on 1st housing
5.6
5.8
5.6

2nd housing
321rpm
6.1
6.1
5.9

From Hot
1st housing
337rpm
5.8
5.6
5.5

2nd housing
336rpm
6.0
5.8
6.0


The guy said there not the best they've ever had but are in there pass freshold.


Faults found.
Lower raid hose not sercur enough but not leaking. (Needs pushing on more)
Starting issue when hot was a failing starter motor. cry cry another £301+vat
The idleing issue solved itself so they linked up a laptop to the car and did emisions and idle and revv check and there was half a dozen lines on the screen (you proberbly no what this is but i got lost here) and the top two are suppost to mirror each other but were'nt quiet the same, they put this down to coils. even though id changed them one of the coils had become faulty from the previous broken engine so theyve recommended i change all four again. so another £96+vat each

Total price breakdown for this car

Broken Car £2000
8x Coils £921.60 (First set got fried by damaged engine) (Mazda)
4x Plugs £117.60 (Mazda)
Set HT leads £27.80 (Performance part)
Remanufactured 231 13b Engine £1300
Starter motor £316.70 (Mazda)
Stainless steel full exhaust system £540 (Third party performance exhaust)
Water pump £127.20 (Mazda)
Inlet manufold gasket £144 (Mazda)
Outlet manufold gasket £72 (Mazda)
Exhaust gaskets £25 (Mazda)
Other gaskets Approx £100 (Mazda)
Spax set 35mm shocks/springs £467 (Third Party Set)
Lightened fly wheels £65 (Had these free from a friend though)
Front passenger drop link £9.50 (Ebay) (Mazda Part)
Silicon Hose kit £180 (Third party manufacturer)
2x Compression tests £72 each = £144
Battery (Optima Red Top Starter Battery RT-U 4.2 8004-250) 12V, 50Ah (Cold Cranking Amps815 CCA)Capacity (EN): 50Ah £180

Total Labour £460
My own time (Approx 35hrs)

Total £7132.40

But the car is now like new so in some ways it was worth it

Car now has 255hp on rolling road, and drives like a brand new car with 0 millage engine

Would i recommend doing this yourself?

Honestly **YES** go for it if you have the spare time & cash, was a very intresting and a learning curb. + Ive got a car im gonna really enjoy driving on the weekends. Also i'll never sell this car as its not worth what i spent on it so it'll live out the rest of its life pampered :evil_laug



If you do go to buy one of these cars (not as a project) My advise is to ask the owner if you can get mazda to check it over before you buy it. It'll cost you around £80+vat but could save you huge bills.
And if it doesnt start when HOT ethier leave it were it is or get a mazda specilist to compression test it first before you part with any cash...

Wait... They told you these numbers passed the compression test??

6.1kp is like 87ish psi right??

Man I'm glad I didn't waste my time going try to get a new engine.

https://www.rx8club.com/attachment.p...6&d=1266716801

No idea a new engine though is around 6.7-7.4 on average, so its not all that bad

Your compression numbers look low. Definitely run premix. Will boost your compression and extend the reman.

I think the experience of replacing your engine is definitely worth something more than the price paid for the parts. Your next engine replacement, whenever that will be, will be familiar territory and the know how stays with you.

I think it's really cool that you decided to stick with the car. I wish you fun times.