RX8 - Automatic vs. Manual ? For U.S.
 

Just a general question. I am looking at purchasing an RX8 soon. Own a 99 Miata and 00 Jeep.

Looking at the difference on specs with both cars having the grand touring package, price is about 800 USD difference, higher for manual. Not too bad. Not much other difference with this package 18" wheels, LSD, sport tuned suspension all on both.

Difference is for power HP is stated, ( I know there is much discussion here), at 197 for the automatic and 238 for the manual. Auto has these paddles on wheel, which I guess are like the BMW M3.

I will have to teach my spouse to drive a stick. hmmmm. Could be very interesting.

From you folks that may have looked at both, what's your opinion on which to buy. Did the difference in HP come into play in your decision ? Did they feel different if you test drove both ?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks Harvey :)

You will not likely find a unbiased opinion on the A/T vs M/T on this forum. I like the A/T but wish it had the 238 hp. I suggest you drive both and decide yourself.

Re: RX8 - Automatic vs. Manual ? For U.S.
 

No, the systems are not at all similar. RX-8 has a regular slushbox auto transmission with gear selection control, like Audi/Porsche/VW Tiptronic and many other "-tronic" systems (including BMW on 5 series, Mercedes, Chrysler, etc etc.).

The BMW SMG system on the M3 is a true semi-auto gearbox (or semi-manual, if you prefer) where it has a real manual 6 speed transmission with a clutch, but instead of a clutch pedal and shift lever it has hydraulic actuators moving the clutch and shift forks. The computer controls the actuators, and the shift paddles trigger the computer. The only similar systems are on the Toyota MR2 spyder, the Maserati Cambiocorsa, Ferrari F1 gearbox, and Alfa Romeo SeleSpeed.

My advice - get the manual. The RX-8 shift action and clutch are among the best ever installed in a road car, and are a real pleasure to use. IMHO, they add to the enjoyment and satisfaction of driving this car. However, my wife and I would never buy a vehicle with an auto transmission, since neither of us likes auto transmissions in any form at all, so we are definitely biased in favour of MTs...

If you never rev the manual's engine over 7K rpm, you'd never notice the extra power - below 7K rpm, the power curves are nearly identical. Then again, the rush as the engine passes 6K and zips to 9K is extremely nice! :D

Regards,
Gordon

The beauty of this car is the balance and feel, the absorbing of big irregularities by the suspension and the quietness. The staying flat around corners and the anti-squat. The acceleration coming out of a curve and the linearity. I may be missing the sound or power of the 8-9 K RPM's, but I suspect a good driver can get a lot out of the AT for 95% of the comparison, and be able to relax when rush hour traffic makes constant shifting a burden for most people. I might suggest those with AT's might even be more attuned to other thrills of this car than the high rev. potential.

One thing to consider about manual vs auto is that IMHO there is much more control over the car with a manual. In addition to enjoying the car's handling by just using the accelerator and riding along with it, I find it really enjoyable to be in the correct gear and be able to accelerate out of a turn effectively. Or just just lifting off the throttle and slowing due to engine braking which I find an auto does not slow as much when lifting and tends to just keep going. I just find that I can control a manual car so much more than one can with an auto. So the car may be fun with an auto, but I think it is twice as fun with a manual.
And although many people will talk themself out of a manual because of traffic concerns, I actually haven't found it a problem driving in heavy traffic. Especially on a car with a decent gear box, it isn't as big a deal as it is sometimes made out to be. I've driven Hondas for a while, so the gearboxes and clutches I'm used to are very nice feeling, so I've never had problems in rush hour. Now if the gearbox was a pain in the butt to use, was notchy as heck, or the clutch was really heavy, then it may be a problem. But I didn't feel that the RX8's gearbox and clutch would be a problem either when I drove a friend's RX8.

For me, the MT/AT question hinged on Los Angeles traffic. I owned a MT RX-7 for ten years back in the 80's, and it was fun and I loved driving it about town. But traffic became progressively worse, and toward the 1990's it became almost intolerable and I bought an AT Stealth when my beloved RX-7 was stolen.

The traffic has worstened since and I haven't regretted having the AT. I've noticed an upsurge in traffic in the last month. It took me 25 minutes to go 5 miles last week, the longest it's taken me from Venice to Playa Del Rey, at 3pm on a Wednesday. It takes 15 minutes from Venice to Santa Monica Library though Mapquest says it should take 5 minutes to travel the 2.4 miles. Prospects are for worse traffic as more people move into LA. You can almost drive in West LA using only the brakes, allowing the AT transmission, in gear, creep your car forward without touching the gas pedal...I'm exaggerating a bit. But in any case you rarely go higher than 2nd gear...sorry, I exaggerated again. I think this applies to a lot of metropolitin areas; but probably doesn't apply to people in their 20's who should be able to tolerate an MT due to their youthful excess of energy.

If you live in a suburb or rural area, definitely get the MT for the fun and control, or you will miss out on a great experience. But those stuck in major metro areas, have medical problems, are older...or are unfortunate to have all three conditions, should get the Automatic.

I bought the RX-8 AT as a car to be stuck in traffic most of the time, but having fun driving after 10pm when traffic finally thins a bit. BTW, I can take early retirement in three years and will get the manual transmission RX-8 for tooling around Maui or Central California.

Re: RX8 - Automatic vs. Manual ? For U.S.
 

Be warned

Harvey the RX8's stick is the stick from Heaven. In fact it is so good that I won't let my wife touch it. I can't face the consiquences.

The control issue is accomplished with the paddles. You have to experience it to believe it (and they are soooooooooooo ergonomic. I just came back from a very twisty coastal road (Lake Huron) and control was what I was enjoying most!

Gotta go with the Automatic
 

It appears I may take the buy-back on my red 6-speed with nav. I'm strongly considering getting a blue automatic. The RX8 is fun to shift, but I just don't feel the tranny is as snickety as the Miata. Here's why I prefer the automatic. Things aren't as easy as they used to be.

*It's hard to shift gears and use the cell phone at the same time. I don't want to use the speaker and have to interrupt whoever I'm talking with.

*My right hand is needed a lot to operate the nav system. Also, I find sometimes my right hand accidentally bumps the nav button while shifting, so I have to re-program my nav system at 90 miles per hour.

*It's hard to shift while holding a cup of coffee, even with Mazda's free red cup. I keep spilling it all over me, as I do a shift.

*Why do we need so many gears? I learned on a 3-speed and that seemed fine. Sometimes with 6 gears, I forget which gear I'm in, so how do I know which one to go to next?

*I have to eat on the go a lot and it's difficult to squirt ketchup on the fries while shifting.

*Since I've grown older, I find I need to blow my nose and clean my glasses more frequently, making the shift knob difficult to move as well as messy.

*Thank God I quit smoking!

Frankie

I love the paddle shifts in my auto
they are really fun

I drive a WRX. The previous car was a 99 miata. So I don't really care what you get. I'd just like to add a thought to this equation...

The debate between the AT and the MT has gone on for years and will continue to do so till the end of the automobile. You can hear good points from both sides. But in this case there is one undisputable factor:

The shifter of the Miata and the RX-8 are a gift from heaven. They are so precious that he who is truly one with his (or her) car would never consider anything else.

The only way in hell that I'd consider an AT on this car would be if I had only one arm or only one leg.

JMHO. ;)

6 MT owner myself, but just curious.....is the AT with paddle shifter pretty quick when you use the paddles when changing gears? How intrusive is it...for example, will it let you hit the rev limiter? DO you have to use the paddles to shift back to 1st when at a stop light?

There are some good auto/manuals and there are some "duds". Trying to ascertain if the RX8's is one of the "good ones" (not that I 'd trade my 6 MT).

Test drove the AT RX8 in the track :)

The paddle shift does work well.. Not as good as SMG in BMW of course but it is not bad at all

To your questions:

No it does not allow you to hit the rev limiter it changes for you.

No you can shift to 1st when travel over 40 kmh.

It is particular frustrating when you have a very tall 2nd gear.

Even Gan san in Best motoring said the 6MT 2nd 3rd 4th and 5th need to be retuned (meaning shorter??). Oh well... if the 5th gear shorter it will decrease the top speed. Not that it is a priority in a country limited their car to 180kmh electronically

Manual ............. just manual.

If you feel your wife may have a difficult time learning stick then you will want to get a auto if you really love the car.

Test drive both and see what you think. Does it meet your goals in both forms and if not make a decision from that.

Whatever you get however congrats and the best of luck to you!

Guys I want to saysomething about my automatic. I dont know if the Rx8 feels the same way with stickshift. When I start pushing the pedal hard and then I let go a little it startsfeeling like the car is begging you to keep pushing the fuckin thing and dont stop! I love it its so crazyand odd. Ive never been ina car that felt like this when flooringg the accelerator for a little bit. Hard to explain I hope you guys with stickshift Rx8 gothrough something like this b/c itfeels awesome man.

I have a manual, it was the first manual transmissioned car I ever owned. I drove a friend's mercury with a stick for about a half hour, just to make sure I could get the rx-8 home... took about a week for me to get to the point where I didn't embarass myself, and about 2-3 weeks to really start having fun. 5-6 weeks later, I hate driving automatics :)

If you are buying the car for the look, I guess it would not matter if it is MT or AT. If you are buying the car for "fun to drive" factor, then AT would not make much sense. Personally, getting a car like this one with AT is somewhat idiotic I think.

bon
thats a really stupid remark

Gimme a break!
AT is not the same, and will never feel as responsive as MT. But to imply that this car wouldn't be fun to drive on a curvy hill simply because there's an extra 300ms lag when you downshift or b/c the torque converter is eating a fraction of its very good power... now THAT'S idiotic!

Re: Gotta go with the Automatic
 

I suppose you will be spending the winter in Florida......That's just great!!! You're too good to be true!!!

FUNNY
 

:D :D LOL English it is funny

I did not say it would not be fun. Probably not as fun as MT I meant. They call this car a sports car and again, to me, a sports car with AT doesn't come very natural. It might be just me. I really don't mean to offend anyone who likes to drive AT.

By the way, the HP difference between AT and MT is about 20% isn't it? I think that IS a lot. Also, people talk about less than 1 second difference in accelaration with other cars. Now, if you compare those numbers for this between MT and AT. I think that is a huge difference. Of course, there is the price difference. Whether or not it is worth to others? that I don't know, but it is to me.

Wow ! Thanks to you all for the great feedback and clarification. i am very familiar with tip tronic as we also have a Passat GLX 4 motion w/ tiptronic.

To make the decision looks like I can summarize the following :

1. Better test drive both first.

2. No real gain until > 6M RPM so let her wind out to evaluate performance relative to HP difference.

3. Make believe we are at an auto - x with the Mazda sales guy in the pass seat to evaluate turn in - out , breaking rear wheels, power out, serpentines, sweepers, etc.

4. Do not use the navigator, cell phone, drink coffee, etc. while test driving. However navigating through excel spreadsheets, playing guitar, eating soup in car is fine. Just kidding -

I think the consensus based on your responses is leaning toward manual.

You folks are a hoot !

Thanks for your comments - more are always welcome, and I will keep all informed.

What was the comment about regarding a buy - back ? Can some one explain this ?

;)

When in "paddle mode" I downshift to second gear for stop signs (no need to go down to first) and it stays in second gear right through to the acceration. In answer to your last question, you can find other threads that discuss the buy-back. Just look around in the forum or use the search on the menu up top.

My automatic is a breeze
It works in manual too, with ease
Paddle-shifters are just great
I will NOT return my RX-8!

What is the max RPM that you can get the car into without hitting rev limiter? Is it near or in redline at least a little bit?