Mikro

I thought this thing was supposed to be a 2700 lb S2000 and 350z killer. Now it will be outclassed by a WRX.

WRX:

0-60: 5.7 sec
1/4 mile: 14.4 sec
slalom: 62.8 mph

veloceracing

guys the car isnt out yet and gearing hasnt been finalized, so lets see what happens ok?

Dan

I really don't care if the WRX beats the 8 by .1 in the quarter. If you want an ugly exterior* with a $20 interior, then go get a WRX, personally I like to have the interior of my car be better than a Tercel and I can give up the extra tenth off the line. :P

The 350Z is not even in the same class, it's a two door. Come on guys!

*IMO, I know some people like the WRX, just not me.

hercdriver

I think an important point is being overlooked. Mazda has already said they want this car to open up a new class of car. So comparing it to a rally car like the WRX serves no purpose. Nor does comparing it to any exotic. The S2000, not exactly, when you look at class of vehicle. 2 door versus 4 door, usuable back seat versus 2+2 that is almost useless. I really haven't found a good comparison and I think that is exactly what Mazda wants. I also think it is exactly what they should want.

Dan

I agree, the S2000 is not a good comparision, 2 vs 4 door, convertible vs hard-top, 32k vs 27k (estimate). The S2000 is a much better comparision to the Z3.

Off the top of my head the RX-8 compares really well to the Maxima, both 4 door, both "sport sedans", both similarly priced. The Maxima with 255hp vs the RX-8's 250 estimated. The Nissan has a curb weight of over 3,200 pounds

Maybe the IS300, maybe the Passat, but I think the Maxima is the most direct competition.

BTW, the Z8 weighs over 3,500 pounds, does that mean it doesn't handle well?

Conundrum

iTrader: (1)

Does R&T say when we can expect to see RX-8?

I saw a very small coverage on the Detroit Auto Show on Consumer Guide's site, it says 2004 Mazda RX-8.

Link

Johnny

December 2002 at the latest. Its the 2003 Rx-8 not a 2004, which means it will be released this year.

Dan

Um, no. It could come out in 2003 and still be a 2003 model. Plenty of manufacturers release cars in mid-year for new model introductions. I'd say Spring 2003, but maybe I'm wrong.

Dazz

Being in Australia it could be a month or so before we get the latest issue of Road and Track, so does anybody know if they gave any definite acceleration times as well as any in gear acceleration times like 30-50, 40-60, 80-100 etc?

FritzMan

Hey guys, this is my first post. As a 6+ year owner of an FD chassis, the most important thing I was looking for in the RX-8 was weight. Mazda's primary intention on this car, beside technology advertising, is to be an emotional vehicle to drive. Mazda has typically achieved this through power to weight ratio (RX-7s, Miata). Regardless of acceleration times, lower curb weight promises better braking, willingness to turn, and 'tossabiliy'. Since the Renesis engine will probably have limited output hencements, maybe squeezing 20-30 though breathing bolt-ons (after 6 years with an FD, no turbos thank you very much!), curb weight further gains importance as the main foundation to the potential of this vehicle. I thinks it's imperative that the car holds a 2850 lbs maximum weight. Personally, I'm hoping he quoted the gross weight (not curb weight), although the title bar at the end of the article did indicate curb weight.
Besides that, I'm very pleased with the design.

KrisA

The RX-8 should be able to carry about 700 lbs of people and cargo, that gives it a gross vehical weight rating of about 3500lbs. So I highly doubt the 2950 was the gross. 2950 for a fully loaded model isn't too bad. A basic car should be about a 100 lbs less.

The acceleration times were guesses, there was no instumented testing.

FritzMan

Sorry, I meant 'weight as tested'. Typically coolant, gas, and oil increase a vehicle's weight by 150 lbs or so.

Again, the weight concern is not about the acceleration, it's about the handling due to weight. Sure, some may say it's a 4-door and sub-3000 is actually pretty good. But this is a "driver's" vehicle and to do that they have a strong weight reduction priority (ie: carbon drive shaft, and light-weight seats). In all honesty, no matter how you slice it, the RX-8 really a two door vehicle with two 'access doors'. While it would more than meet my 'four-door' needs, I don't think Mazda can use that as an excuse for weight comparison to other mid sized sedans sporting rear four doors. 2700 lbs curb weight is not asking the impossible, Mazda should look at their own fleet for weight comparison. My Protege ES four door has a curb weight of 2700 lbs and it has heavier seats, steel hood/trunk, and a block engine at least 100 lbs heavier than the Renesis. While the protege may have a smaller wheelbase, it is much taller and likely has more glass than the RX-8 would.

With competitors like the Subaru and looming Evo coming out with better acceleration and potentially better handling numbers, the RX-8 needs to make sure it will at least out handle them (a though job with the Evo's CV and anticipated same price range).

Rexate

I completely agree Fritzman, I am buying the RX8 for handling, and I expect the handling to above other cars in the same class/price range. Just like the RX7s and Miatas have the best handling in there class/price range. If the RX8 will weigh around the 2700lb mark the RX8 most likely will out handle anything in it class/price range. Now if it weighs 2950lb I can't say the same, the EVO might be able to take it in the corners, but hey either car is not out in the US. I'll be test driving all of them, Z, EVO, RX8 but right now I got a feeling the RX8 will be my #1 pick unless Mazda really messes it up. Also I just read in Car & Driver that Lotus will be bringing the Elise here in 2004 for $38k!! OMG 1700lb rocket!!!

N1XRR

Well, even a weel driven AWD DSM will out-accelerate the RX-8. So why are you even comparing the 0-60 times of an AWD car to the RX-8? My friends Talon TSi AWD pulled a 6.2 0-60, thats .3 seconds 'faster' than what the car was originally suposed to do. Why? Because magazines tend to give somewhat-accurate numbers. I bet the WRX will do a high 5 second 0-60 with the correct driver.

Now, the RX-8 is NOT an AWD car, so comparing it to the acceleration of the Lancer Evo, WRX or any other AWD is pointless. Even in the 1/4 mi the driver can mean as much as a second in the time.

spwolf

hmm... since my r&t didnt arrive yet I will have to go to the store and purchase one ;-)... however, comparing RX-8 to WRX or Evo is useless, it is different kind of car... what you are getting is a package - looks good, feeels good, drives good & costs little... WRX or EVO might be able to beat it out in few categories but overall, RX-8 so far seems like a winner baby

p.s. this seems like a mostly North American forum but if you want nice handling, get a new Mini Cooper S... nothing handles that well... I am gonna be shopping for new car early next year and RX-8 fits nicely into that plan, any1 knows when will it be released in Europe?

my03_rx8

yeah i was looking for a good slightly used rx-7 till i read the arctil and found that there is much differance in the two.
rx7 around $20,000 0-60 in 4.9sec and 1/4 mile in 13.5
rx8 around $26-30k 0-60 in 6.0sec and 1/4 mile in 14.5
plus its 8 years newer

FritzMan

How specific does one want to get for car comparisons? Are we only comparing RWD vehicles with rotary engines? It shouldn't matter what wheels are driven, or where the engine is placed, or, for the general public, what type of engine it is. The point is about Mazda delivering a 4 door vehicle with sporty dynamics for a sub 30K price. And yes, the Evo and WRX can be included because they to, fulfill that role quite well.

KrisA

Price and vehical intention is the only good way to compare vehicals. With that in mind the 30K RX-8 will compete directly with the STi, EVO VII, IS300 etc. Anyone who thinks that the average RX-8 buyer won't cross shop the "rally" cars is kidding themselves.

IMO the RX-8 will stack up nicely against the STi and EVO. It will have less power, but weigh less and handle better. It will trade their AWD systems for an interior that screams sports car not economy car.

RX - 8

For those of you who havent seend the Road and track article yet, here is a link to it

http://www.rx-8.com/images/roadandtrack.pdf

ps, its in adobe acrobat format, so you might need to downlaod that if you dont have it.

spwolf

actually, thats an year old article... ppl here were talking about new article in April 2002 edition of R&T

RX - 8

sorry about that, i actuallyed posted the article before i read it, now it makes sense!!