Just test drove the RX8, some thoughts from a BMW driver
 

I just test drove the RX8 at a dealer which is my second time driving one. I originally drove my step fathers RX8 when he first got it but never really pushed the power of it sicne it was brand new . . .

Anyway, I currently drive a 330i Manual which is an awesome car but here is my viewpoint on the RX8

First of all, I love the looks of it, there is something about the design that just makes this car look so damn good and has that sports car appeal.

The Interior is beautiful, the quality seems very good, everything felt tight, the seats are VERY comfortable, the steering wheel fits perfectly in your hands and the Manual snicks away shifts beautifully.

The RX8 handles very flat and neutral and definitely feels lower to the ground with less body sway then my bimmer. The steering is nicely weighted (though it could be a drop heavier), provides excellent feedback and I love the noises you hear when driving. It's so nice to get into a car that isn't muted with a ton of sound deafening. Taking off from a stop is good, the power always feels like it's there, the wheels feel very connected to the road and I really love the turn in response.

So far so good . . . but here is the one thing I have to say really turns me off . . .
The engine when revved out feels F L A T !!! It is very weird because I was expecting at the higher rpm's (after 4000 or 5000rpm) for the car to zoom to redline but it kept the same exact travel throughout the rpm rev range as the first 4000 to 5000. And to top it off, it really doesn't feel quick while doing it. It's almost like the car is slowly going through the rpm's without much sensation.

My 330's engine flings up to redline and has a real pull to it.

The RX8 I drove had 1400 miles so maybe it loosens up a bit but I really don't know or maybe it's because I am used to the bimmer's engine ?!

If it wasn't for this, I would most likely be trading in my car for one.

Re: Just test drove the RX8, some thoughts from a BMW driver
 

Guys ... 71 views and no comments ?!

Do the current owners of this car agree with this or am I off basis here because I am used to a very flexible engine or does this car break in after certain amount of time ?

Can you fill me in on your opinion ?

TIA

Re: Re: Just test drove the RX8, some thoughts from a BMW driver
 

I think it's because this has become old hat around here. Another owner of another car coming here to tell us all how our 8s don't have enough oomph :p

I love my 8 - but if you want to keep your beemer- that's ok with me. I'm more into handling than torque.

I drove a 350Z from the dealer and thought it had 0 top end and died after 4100 RPM..actually it felt like butterfly after 4100 RPM (one of them pretty yellow and black ones). Anyway....I'm used to my 94 Rx-7, so of course the 350Z is a dog to me. well ok, its looks like a pig but drives like a dog. Anyway, the point is you have a BMW, its a different kind of car. It sounds like the rx8 is not for you.

The difference you feel in the rev'ing is very characteristic of rotary engines. That's what I felt the first time I drove it as well. But for myself I enjoy the sensation. When you push the car to around 7k rpm it feels almost the same as 4k rpm. Especially the engine noise. Its very smooth so you won't feel the engine vibration or much engine noise. Keep in mind the redline is 9k, so relatively speaking you can push this engine to higher rpm's than a piston engine. As for torque, if you get to test drive it again try letting it stay in gears up to 7k or 8k before you shift, see if you get a better pull. Also keep in mind this car isn't a "torque" heavy car, it is consistent through its acceleration. Hope this helps a bit. Happy New Year.

Re: Re: Re: Just test drove the RX8, some thoughts from a BMW driver
 

Before this becomes a thread of bimmer vs. rx8, please let it be clear that I am a car enthusiast, not just a BMW enthusiast . . .
There are way too many excellent cars being produced not to keep an open mind.

I did not come here to troll since I can't stand trolls . . . I've had 2 RX7's & a Milennia 'S' and I love Mazda's as well as many other cars.

Well a few things. Say what you will about how easy revving your 330 is but most reviews and owners rave about the Renesis's eagerness to rev. I tend to agree. Regardless, the 8 will beat out your 330 by close to a second once broken in. The car is said by many, including my tech at the Mazda dealer, to release full power between 2600-3000 km ( 1600-1800 mi). I am right in this range and have noticed a difference in the upper rpm's. Maybe that would make the difference for you. Bottom line is that I simply loved everything about this car from the first drive with 8 km on it and am still lovin' it. My 2 cents.

zerobanger -thanks for the feedback . . .I can't really say the RX8 isn't for me since I loved *almost* everything about it . . . I remember test driving the bimmer the first few times and not liking it since I was so used to Japanese cars, the German car felt 'different'.

I have learned from the past to never judge a car fully from a couple of test drives.



skagen - thanks for the feedback as well . .. it really helps hearing what others who own the car have to say ... happy New Year to you as well !!

thanks for the feedback . . . btw the 0-60 for a 5 speed 330i is 6.1 seconds which is about the same as the RX8 - they are BOTH very quick cars . . .

Carguy: first of all you have one hell of a car, I love the 330 and M series BMWs, they are sedans for the serious driving enthusiast! I agree the RX8 ( let me emphasise), feels flat at that RPM, but it is decieving because it really is going good. there is a bit of a difference when the car has some miles on it, I believe it runs rich during break-in and leans out thereafter. I am having a lot of fun with my 8 and that factor was enough for me to buy it. I test drove a lot of cars and sport sedans before I purchased and came to the conclusion that the 8 is a sports car and offers the performance that the sedans didn't quite have. If you want more mid and high end power read canzoomers stage mods in the vendors section, 25 to 55 WHP for $500-$750 with and exhaust and free flow cat additionaly. I believe Canzoomer ran a 13.7 1/4 mile with his stage 1 using a G-tech computer for measurement, this will take care of that flat feeling you didn't like:D

Mine has a definite kick when the extra ports open up - almost like the 3800RPM kick in the 2nd gen RX-7 Turbo, except I get two kicks! It really feels to me like I could pull past 10K RPM if the car would let me. You need to wind it up to redline a few times and then see how you feel about it. This car is definitely more fun to drive than my 2nd gen Turbo.

It's hard to imagine the 8 being more fun than your 2nd gen, are you talking about handling? anyway I dont have a 2nd gen so I dont know, I do know they are extreme performing cars from other forums and friends that have them, I guess that speaks well of our cars!

Some of you guys go into defensive at the drop of a hat. I don't think Carguy is saying it has no power. It sounded like he was saying that after ~5500rpm he expected to feel like it would pull really hard up to redline, but it didn't feel like it. Now, i have read some other posters a long time ago say something similar and my friend has said this about his RX8 too. But the actual issue seems more like it is because the engine is tuned to go rich on the upper end which makes it seem like it loses a little 'ooomph' on the top. And even on the reviews of Canzoomer's mod, it was mentioned that there is now a stong 'ooomph' that pulls all the way to the redline now. And some of the people were expecting to feel what should have been there before Mazda tuned it out. So those of you who think it pulls hard now, wait until you feel what it should pull like when the ECU is returned to 'normal' tune.

This totally reminds me of how in the beginning on the Evo forum, some said that the topend was a letdown on the Evo. And some people would flame them and call 'Troll!' But it turned out that the Evo was tuned to drop from full 19psi boost to 16spi at the top. So what some people felt was real. But later of course people got their ECU reflashed and carried full boost all the way up to redline, and then it really pulled hard up to redline.

Carguy . . . I got 6.8 seconds for a manual from BMW Canada's website. I was looking very seriously at your ride and love it btw! I find the 8 so hard to compare to anything else from looks to engine. I don't think that anyone here is calling Carguy a troll whatsoever, rather I think that there are a majority of RX8 drivers that feel that the car does build through redline with a lot of sensation. Then again, sensation is so subjective! I thought skagen's post was excellent. Cheers.

I find that the tach moves up to 9k so quick, I have to pay fairly close attention, and can't just go by the sounds of the engine.

It is a smooth ride up to 9k, and you may not feel pulled back in your seat, but hitting 68 mph in second and 90 in third, and you will find most cars behind you before you know it.

Elapsed time to xxx will not be as fast as some cars, and there are plenty of folks here who will cram that info down your throat, but it is quick enough and fun to drive.

Many of us are eagerly anticipating the Stage 1 and the extra pull it is expected to give.

The prime consideration when buying my 8 was value-for-money. Where I'm from, the import duty on the RX-8 is 95%. On the 330i, it would be 185%, which would make the BM more than twice the price of the 8. So it was an easy decision.

Having previously owned a BM, I agree with Carguy that I was expecting more oomph in the higher revs from what I had read in the forums, and that I sometimes miss the torque of the BM. The other day I was doing 180 kmh and my passenger thought that I was only doing 140 kmh. I guess it's because the 8 accelerates so gradually without strain and is so stable that one does not sense the true speed. All things said, the 8 is definitely the more sporty and fun to drive car, albeit a very smooth one.

BTW khoney, at what rev does the second port open? I personally have not noticed a kick in the higher revs. The engine just accelerates as smoothly as in the lower revs. I have a Japan specs car with full 250HP (apparently).

Well, I just test drove an 8 for the first time yesterday. Loved it!

I had a similar experience to Carguy and figured this was a characteristic of rotary engines (not that familiar with them but had heard something about really smooth torque lines). So skagen, I think.

nk_Rx8's explanation about tuning is also interesting.

The other possibility was that the salesman in the passenger seat had access to some kind of safety valve. Who knows, maybe he didn't have the same appreciation for 95 mph?

I would get so many speeding tickets in an 8, that I'm not sure I would bother with a retuning.

It may not be the fastest car in the world, but it may be the best handling stock car that I have ever driven. And you have to love the price!

Maybe I'm missing something, but I have a definite "bump" in power, first at around 4.5K RPMs and again around 7K RPMs.

As others have said, the power delivery is so smooth and so strong througout the rev range, you may not notice.

I had two BMWs previous to the RX8....one 325i and one 330i. Both were fun cars. Both are quite different in drive feel than my current RX8. In short, there's nothing quite like driving an RX8.

Wow that stage 1 sounds impressive, I just got finished reading on it and for under $800 it sounds like a great mod !!!

I spoke to my stepfather who has an RX8 and he said I can borrow it for a few days to see what it's like to live with it.

I'm going to pick it up Sunday night ... I'll keep you guys posted if you want to hear about it.

The only downside is he only has around 700 miles so the engine hasn't loosened up at all though he told me not to hold back while using it :cool:

The RX8 is not like any other car I've ever owned or driven. It's deceptively quick; the smooth revving rotary doesn't give you the same type of feedback as a piston engine does. It IS going fast though but it's so smooth it almost feels "flat" at first. You don't get the noise and vibration that a piston engine gives you when you climb the revs.

If you're used to driving by sound and feel, it doesn't give you the "standard" feedback. If that's mostly what you want then you might be disappointed. However if you live with it a few weeks you get readjusted and start to truly appreciate what a refined car this is. It doesn't achieve performance through brute strength but through refined agility.

This is a true "driver's" sports car; one where you're not primarily interesting in impressing others, but are totally focused on the experience of driving for yourself. That's not to say that others don't notice you...hehehe.

I have just over 8,600 miles on mine and I absolutely love this car. It has such class, and is so confidence-inspiring that I almost feel weird to be in anything else now; like driving without a seat belt on. Other cars now feel mushy, uncoordinated, clunky... the RX8 has completely changed my views of what performance is/should be. All that being said, I do have Canzoomer's stage 1 mod on order however and I look forward to a bit of the 'old fashioned' style of feedback being added to my refinement. ;D

Looking forward to having my cake and eating it too. :)

I must agree with khoney and graphicguy. When floored, I get noticable power increases at 4500 and again at 7000 RPM. I believe this matches when extra ports open up. Once 7000 RPM comes, you best be looking to shift, otherwise you'll swing right through the buzzer and into the red. It's most frustrating when the fuel cuts out on you up there (Nice saftey though). At least in the lowest gears (where you might be going the legal limits), the quickness requires split second timing.

I think the difference in feeling has to do more with the engine design. Standard 4 stroke piston engines, like the BMW's, feel like they have incredible power when "on cam". The more radical the cam, the stronger the "punch" at the penality of a narrower RPM band width to deliver it. For production use, the idea is to tune the cam to give you as much torque as possible through the greatest RPM band width. Ironically, this goal of flattening the torque curve is something the Rotary need not worry about. Yet, when you get rid of the "on cam" feeling, the seat of the pants feeling is the car is flat, or there is no punch.

Smoothness is quickness. Obviously, spinning tires, chirping through the gears, 4-wheel drifts, or any other tire scrubbing excercise scrubs valuable time off any test... but "feels" more powerful. The same smoothness rules apply to engines.

Are you sure power dips after 5000 rpm ?

I don't recall power dipping, I just recall the same steady power throughout the rev range . . . are you sure that all RX8's do this or is it possible something is wrong with your car ?

Re: Just test drove the RX8, some thoughts from a BMW driver
 

If your Bimmer has variable valve timing you may be expecting a kick that doesn't exist. These expectations could be tainting your impressions.

Also, 1400 mi is a low mileage engine. My experience with mine at 7k miles, is that it keeps getting better (except for mpgs). Apparently the ecu is waiting for engine parts to get snapped in, and then it releases more power.

However in my driving, I don't really notice any extra kick above 7k rpm, but the acceleration doesn't drop off either. It just keeps on pulling until (and past) the beep.

Either way (BMW or RX) you're driving a fine creation. Happy Motoring!