Buying an 04/05 RX-8
 

Ok ppl,

I've been visiting this forum a lot, though this is gonna be my first post. I've been holding out on buying an RX-8 till this period during the year when dealers expect to roll out 06 models.

I've got a question though. When would be the best time to buy an RX-8, ? In Nov, Dec, or Jan (I can only hold out till Jan). I drive a 240SX right now and live in Seattle(Kirkland).

Apparently Mazda have not announced any new rebates for Nov. so I'm thinking when they make the 06 announcement would probably be the best time.

Ques 2. Would it make more sense with going for a used 05 or a new 04 (that dealers still have in stock?)

3. How much would I expect to pay for a new 04 with Sat Nav? and a new 05 with Sat Nav? Would the price diff. be significant? esp when dealers try to offload 05's once the 06's are out?

Anything else I should be looking out for / keeping my eyes open for? Lemme know ur RX-8 buying experiences and things I too should def. be checking out.


Thanks y'all ........................................

Wow, I can't believe the dealers still have a new '04 in stock. I bought the last new '04 off of my dealer's lot in March. Mine has pretty much every option, GT package, Nav, etc. At the time Mazda was having rebates of $2000 (maybe $2500, I can't remember) on remaining '04s and the dealer lowered the price before rebate down to exactly invoice. Later (from this forum) I found out that I probably could have done a little better than that price, but I was tired of negotiating and was ready to take the car home. :)

If I was you I would probably go with a new '04 over a used '05. The cars are essentially the same (other than the ignition key/keyless entry module) but you should be able to negotiate an amazing price on the '04 because it has depreciated quite a lot just sitting on the dealer's lot for that long (get an Edmunds or Blue Book value on a used 04 with super low mileage, the selling price should be close to that). You could probably get a price similar to the used '05, and you'd be the one to get to break the car in and make sure it's treated properly.

As for the buying experience, it sounds like you've probably already done it if you've been hanging out on this forum, but just make sure you've researched the car so you don't believe the disinformation a lot of salesmen have. My sales guy told me that the spare tire taking up the whole trunk could be stored under the car if I wanted, that the back seat folded down for extra room, and that checking oil often was only for old rotaries. All of this is wrong, and there's stories here on this forum of far worse dealer lies, so just know your stuff.

Out of curiosity, what dealer are you looking at? I bought a Miata in August of '03 from Eric Demeter at University Mazda. It was an awesome transaction, and he knows his cars (he races restored classics on weekends). My sister bought a Protege5 at about the same time from him, and also had a very easy time. I wish I could have bought my RX-8 from him but I moved away.

Can't Beat Prices on a 2004 RX-8 in 2005
 

Okay, since you asked I pulled out the Vehicle Invoice Detail which Schaefer & Strohminger Mazda in Baltimore, MD faxed to me:

.................................................I nvoice Amt....Retail Amt
RX8 6P......................................$24,659... ......$26,680
In-Dash 6-CD Changer.............$400..............$500
Cargo Tray................................$40........... .....$50
Carpet Floor Mats.....................$0..................$0
Portfolio....................................$0... ...............$0
Moonroof Wind Deflector...........$36...............$45
Navigation System....................$1721............$2000
Rear Wing Spoiler.....................$285..............$355
Alarm Shock Sensor Upgrade....$48................$60
Spare Tire Kit.............................$320.............$ 395
Wheel Locks..............................$0............. ....$0
Touring Package M/T.................$2409...........$2800
Appearance Package.................$775.............$970

Transportation $520 $520
Baltimore Assessment $100

Total: $31,313 $34,375

Then the magic words written in the margin:
$31,313
-$4,000 Dealer Cash
- $534 Holdback
Sale for $26,779
NY Sale - $25,995

S&S agreed to give me $500 for my worthless trade-in so I drove down and signed papers to pay $25,595 for this car with an original sticker-price of $34,375 - a whopping $8,380 off the full sticker-price! The $25,995 is what they offered me straight out over the phone when I contacted their internet sales division. Kudos to S&S for being straight shooters.

Now, if Mazda really gives a full 3% dealer holdback on these 2004s then the dealership must have given it all to me because 3% of $31,313 is $939.39 and they went $1318 lower than "Invoice - Dealer-Cash". I assume the "Dealer-Cash" is a special incentive given to this dealership to help them move the 2004s. They must have also cancelled out the transportation charge and/or Baltimore assessment also (which is fine - I consider those charges overhead which shouldn't show up as line items on my invoice anyway).

Now, get this - I talked to dozens of dealers and private parties looking for my perfect blue RX-8 all through August and September - Schaefer & Strohminger were the last. Before I found them another sales guy from another dealership found *this* car at S&S and tried to sell it to me for the full invoice price of $31,313 so - watch out for crooks. :mad:

If you can find a new, never-titled 2004 at an honest dealer you should be able to get an amazing deal. :Eyecrazy:

If you have a dealer with a 2004 on the lot who is not giving you this good of a deal I will fax you my fax and my sales invoice. Mazda must be giving all of the dealerships $4,000 dealer cash to move the 2004s so don't take any b.s. :mdrmed:

@sweetcar. .......... I'm yet to actually go shopping. I'll be vising the one in U district in fact I'll try and check out all Mazda dealers in the area and see if they have any left over 04's.

@Cool-Blue-Dad ............ pmed u....

Thnks Cool-Blue-Dad,

I got the fax. I'll be taking that with me when i go shopping.

Glad to help. Any honest dealer should be in that ballpark for a 2004, but you never what you're walking into when you approach a new dealership so I'm glad to provide some data for you. I was lucky to just walk right into an honest, straight-forward dealership after blowing off a few that were greedy or crooked.

Paperwork still took me over 3 hours (there was extra paperwork since they were taking my trade), but that's just the standard cost-of-doing-business when you're buying a car. :) I felt lucky it didn't take all day.

Cant believe you gave ure car for $500

Let me help you believe - My car wasn't used, it was used up.
1) It was a 5-speed and the shifting fork was gone so you had to 'use-the-force' to find 3rd gear and 4th wasn't easy to find either. That would be a red-flag on any test drive. Cost to repair - unknown.
2) The rear struts were completely destroyed. Not only did the back bounce and clunk on every bump, the back end would skip and skid around in any aggressive cornering. Estimate from shop - $700.
3) The rear main seal on the engine was leaking - bad. About 1 qt/week. Estimate from shop - $800 (odd add 1qt per week which I did for 1 year).
4) The summer tires were bald.
5) The winter tires were bald.
6) I'd done some brake work, but there was still a leak somewhere - might have had a caliper or piston going bad. Brake light would come on from time to time - sometimes it went out when I added brake fluid. Cost to repair - hundreds.
7) The check engine light kept coming on. In NY you cannot get your annual safety/smog inspection sticker if your check engine light is on. Cost to repair - unknown.
8) No CD - only cassette tapes and the driver's front speaker was blown so you had to balance/fade everything to the passenger/rear to prevent the drivers/front from buzzing - oh, and the volume knob busted off the stereo.
9) My inspection sticker ran out at the end of September. I figured I either had to spent $3,000 to get my current car through the inspection and winter or ditch it and get a new car.
(probably due for a tune-up too)
:banghead:

Also - it was a station wagon and, like many folks, I'm way to sexy for a station wagon.

I showed it to some of the local dealerships and they didn't want to touch it at all. If I'd tried to sell it on my lawn I doubt I could have gotten much more than $500 from anyone who drove it. For sure I'd have to argue price with 500 idiots to find one person willing to pony up $500.

Finally, to buy a car at a dealership 300 miles away I needed to either -
1) Drive a trade-in one-way.
2) Rent a car one-way for $100, then return it at the airport and take a $50 cab-ride to the dealership.
3) Find a friend to drive me and pay their round-trip gas, plus buy their lunch and dinner for the day - also about $150.

I figure I was getting $650 value by the dealer giving me $500 sight-unseen for a busted out grey station wagon. His quote was, "You're coming from NY, right? I'll give you $500 for any car you can drive in from NY to MD. Now, if you tow it in that's a different story, but driving it in we can make a deal."

Maybe I could have gotten more than $650 if a buddy used his dealer license to take my car and sell it at auction, but then I would have had to give that buddy a cut and I don't have such a buddy anyway.

Believe my friend, believe. I *almost* felt bad taking their $500, except I'm sure they can/did get ~$500 or more at auction and let it trouble them no more.

EDIT - I forgot to mention the busted out station wagon had 147,000 miles on it. Hence, used-up.

haha ok..............

Good Luck!
 

Are you trading a car with some value? Let us know how your shopping works out.

One more bit of advice for looking at 2004s - they've all been stored somewhere for ~1 year. I found one incidental defect that appeared to be rodent damage. Looked like something had chewed on a coolant hose at the top of the engine compartment. I went over my car carefully in broad daylight when I arrived at the dealership - it was otherwise perfect, not a single rock chip, but knowing what I know now I should have looked around under the hood more carefully.

Fortunately, my local dealer replaced the hose - no questions asked (that was one of they ways I selected him among the 5 closest dealers).

Also, be mindful of your cat. The 2004s have been shuffled around dealer lots for ~1 year so that's a lot of chances for idiots to flood them, at least enough to cause the cat to fail after a couple-thousand miles. Ask for the full service report on that car - the dealership that has it should be able to show the car receiving it's recall work and that report may show replaced plugs indicating the flooded it. No harm done that won't be covered by warrenty (I got my free cat after 5 weeks of ownership), but it's all easier to handle if your informed (thanks rx8club.com).

I wont be trading. I'm looking to sell my 240SX though.

Thanks for the tip. I'll keep it in mind. So far I can't seem to find any 04's. I'm sure they are out there, I'm maybe not looking hard enough. Im getting decent deals though on the 05's too, so I'm kinda waiting for next month to see wht kind of deals Mazda has to move out their 05 inventory once the 06's are in.

I'll be posting details here. Apparently in Seattle University Mazda are considered the best, so I'm probably gonna give them a visit soon........

Cool-Blue-Dad
 

I purchased a black 04 from S&S, they didn't haggle that much on the car, and when I got it home, I discovered some pretty serious body damage, and broken clips and frayed insulation under the hood. I'll admit, they were in a hurry to get me out of the dealership after I signed the paperwork. I took it back and, they gave me a bit of a hassle, mostly trying to save a sale. Those cars should not have been sold as new. It seems like they were "factory seconds" or rollbacks. I remember a red one that had custom rims on it. When have you ever seen a new car with aftermarket rims put on it, especially an RX-8. I took me a long time to get all of my trade stuff back. I was a good thing I didn't transfer the title to them yet. Mazda customer service was WORTHLESS with this, too. Its like they don't care what the dealer does, as long as they move cars.

That's awful. To me major body damage means big dents and possibly a twisted frame. How did you miss that one your test drive or pre-test-drive walk-around? Maybe I misunderstood your sentance. Was the serious body damage under the hood? Do you mean the car appeared to have been in an accident, then shoddily repaired?

The frayed insulation sounds more like what I found - evidence of possible rodent damage which is not surprising when a car is stored for ~ a year.

I remember S&S had 4 2004s which they claimed were brand new (to me that means never titled and less than 500 miles and not a demo/program car). I didn't notice if the red one had custom rims. I did notice that my Winning Blue was loaded with options (only lacked the leather seats) and I think the red had everything including leather seats. I guessed that these cars hadn't sold because their options priced them above the budget of too many shoppers. So, the custom rims could mean some dealer (possibly a dealer who had the car and failed to sell it before it went to S&S) tried to dress up the car and attract more attention/buyers or it could mean the OEM rims were damaged and some dealer used non-OEM replacements.

Sorry to hear you had so much trouble at S&S. I was skeptical and suspicious when I drove down there. The deal they offered over the phone seemed too good to be true. At the least I figured they'd try to cut me down further on my trade. However, they did everything they said they would do and I found the RX-8 practically pristine when I arrived so I had no complaints at all.

The dealer hustled me out of there after the paperwork, no walkaround. There wasn't huge dings, just a ton of small dents, all on the right rear of the car. One was an 8" crease in the right rear door. The car was black, so polished up, you couldn't see any shadows. I caught it when one of my friends closed to door and I saw the reflection that wasn't right. You had to look at it at the right angle. I then went over the car with a fine tooth comb and found lots of dings, and a few paint chips in wierd places. The hardware on the spoiler wasn't the same, either. The right side was different than the left, and the hardware in the wheel-wells was not corroded evenly. Even the engine cover was scratched to hell. The red one was at the Perry Hall store, I think the blue one (I saw) was at the Towson store. When I took the car back, I heard the salesman say to the manager "Look whats back!", so I figured this wasn't the first time they had a poblem getting rid of this car. At least I had a free week with it!

Hmmm, I must say you should have done those in reverse order.

I had talked with the S&S sales manager by phone. When I drove down we shook hands, then he referred me to a sales associate, Dennis.

First thing Dennis and I did was walk around the car, then we went for a test drive. Paperwork was last. Now, I didn't white-glove the body, but I did practially run finger-tips over every surface of the car. No sells guaranteed 'perfect cars' they sell the car before your eyes as-is so the burden of assessing the car falls on the buyer. At least, that's how I see it.

If I would have found rock chips and dents which had not been mentioned when we discussed price over the phone I would have howled foul and either asked for a signed document saying they would fix the damage or asked for additional price concessions.

All that said, I am sorry to hear you were disappointed. I hope you can lay hands on an RX-8 you like at a price you like. Mine has been the best car I ever owned. Driving an AT Celica while my RX-8 is in the body shop this past week has been a real eye-opener as to just how vastly superior the RX-8 is with other sporty cars on the market

Did they take the car back and simply cancel/refund the sale?

Be aware of the build date on the car. get the latest date possible. the later the build, the more up-to-date the car will be.

I purchased a new 2004 in March 2005. The car sat in the dealer's lot for at least a year - it was built in July 2003.
Sept 2003 to March 2005 the car was shuffled around the dealer's lot waiting for a buyer, and doing various recall repairs.
After I bought the car I discovered a bad paint job on the rear bumper. Mazda painted it again for free - but I know the car went through 'something"

I saved over $4000 buying a 2004 vs 2005, however, so i'm glad i did.

Staten Island Mazda has 4 new 2005 models on the floor. They are giving a lease deal as follows:

retail $34,400, discounted to $30,000. If you lease the car, Mazda has a rebate of $3000, net $27,000= cap cost. lease it and pay it off in a month or two - no penalty. or finance the payoff amount, and you are into the car for $27,000 plus tax and a financing.

they have white and silver.

Call Anthony 718-727-7000. Good luck.

Yeah i got a quote of 23,540+TTL (including ALL rebates , MAC etc.)from a dealer in Chicago for an 05 GT+spoiler+mats+locks (those are all the options).

Its probably gonna cost another 1.5K on taxes and 1K on shipping to Seattle so I dunno if it is a good deal or not.

I am supposed to get another quote from a dealer in Portland today. He said he's make my head spin! We'll see :)

Maybe the guy in Portland has a 2004. ~$8,000 of MSRP does make your head spin - believe me. ;)

I considered paying $1k to ship a 2004 with 12,000 miles on it from Arizona if I won the e-bay auction at $17,000. However, the reserve was not met so they relisted the car. How much below MSRP is the $23,540? If it is not *huge* savings you might not want to take the risk of buying sight-unseen. I would say either get a ride out to see it or fly out one-way. Even with a one-way flight you have a few 'outs' (like getting a one-way rental) in case you need to say no to the deal.

It's hard to believe that some dealers will be so dishonest and waste people's time by failing to mention damage or defects in the car, but folks here on the forum have had it happen to them.

I was blunt with my dealer. I asked clear questions like, "has the car ever been titled/owned?" or, "does the car have any damage which was repaired?" or, "is there anything else I should know about the car before I drive down?" I say keep it polite, being a jerk on the phone won't get you anywhere, but you can politely throw out enough warnings that you're an informed buyer and you won't tolerate any monkey business.

I love having the RXClub.COM sticker on my rear windows. Whenever I talk to a new service guy I nicely say, "have your heard of that forum? 21,000 members on the internet. Yeah, we all compare notes about our service experiences." Is it blackmail or just a polite warning - you be the judge ;) I mentioned the forum to a couple of the dealers when I was shopping too. Can't hurt.

The $23,540 is actually a quote from Chicago. So I'll have to pay shipping on that.

The guy from Portland (Royal Moore) said he'd get me a quote that'll make my head spin. So I'm still waiting on it. I can go to Portland and pick it up. Even trade my 240sx if he gives me a fair price. I was actually thinking of flying to Chicago and driving back to Seattle in the RX-8 but it'll be snowing then and wont be much fun.

I just did that trip 6 weeks ago on my 240 from St. Louis to Seattle, took me 3 days! :)

Oh the $23,540 quote is for an MSRP of $32,040 and an invoice of $29,807.

I got a quote for 25,227+taxes from a dealer here in Seattle for Touring+Sat Nav+appearance+ some other small options).

So while the quote from Chicago is better, it does get offsetted by the shipping. Plus the one in Seattle has Sat Nav.

Brother, believe me, as a current owner of an RX-8 with the factory NAV, I tell you - you *want* the factory NAV. It's a whole different relationship with your car when she *talks* to you. ;)

I know, thats why I so want one!!! I have a cheap aftermarket one on my 240SX right now, but it looks so goddamn tacky. I'd pay more to have it fold up and down rather than look like an afterthought, even though the aftermarket ones are MUCH better and cheaper!

Hemanrulez, you might want to check out Russ Dunmire down in Tacoma, they gave me a really good deal, also they're the oldest Mazda Dealer in the state.

I did, they gave me a quote of

"Red touring 6 speed no nav...Blow out deal....$26999 after Mazda Credit
$1000 Rebate
Pearl GT 6 speed no nav...Blow out deal....$27999 after Mazda Credit $1000
Rebate"


With no nav, they arent even in the ballpark of the other quotes. I can get it shipped from Chicago and still save a couple of grand! :)

Of course all this has been done online. I still havent visited a single dealer personally yet. Maybe when they know you are serious they drop prices down a bit.

Any Washington/Oregon dealers here hit me up a PM with a quote!