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Originally Posted by RIWWP
(Post 4405259)
Lucky,
A Mazda Reman, if you just buy it from them with no warranty or anything, is about $1,800 to $2,500, depending on what kind of price a dealer will give you and if you can get any discounts under Mazda's Motorsports program. If his was under warranty, then he wouldn't have paid anything for the engine. However, Mazda remans are pretty crappy in quality on average. For roughly $3,000 + your old engine you can get a solid, dependable, high quality rebuilt engine from Mazmart, with several Mazmart improvements already upgraded on it. Barring a cooling system failure (which would kill any rotary), I would fully expect Mazmart's engines to last at least 100,000 miles. Mazmart is in Georgia, which isn't absurdly far for you, and can probably do the pull and re-install for you for a very reasonable price if you drive the car up there. For $5,000, you are entering REALLY high quality rebuilds with additional work such as different seals and porting work. Any decent repair shop should be able to do the motor replacement for about $1,000 or less in labor. Many could get it done in far less time than that. One shop I know charges about $250 to pull, $250 to install (MD, your IP says Kansas, not Miami though). Dealer prices are JACKED through the roof on so much stuff, don't take their prices as a baseline for anything. Or yes, sell the RX-8, add that cash to your current cash, and get a mid-level mileage G35 for less than $10k. 5K+ it is, and it's 90% new parts. |
thanks to my friend..i saw him at school today..didnt have his number..he has an rx7 and the only place he takes his car to get it fixed is someone whom he recommended me which he seems to know a lot about rotary engines ..i just took my car over there and he said that he can rebuild my engine for $1100 for everthing..taking it out dropping it back in..new apex seals..etc..of course..you never know until you break it apart..when he took a look at my car he said that it has low compression because the car takes 4-6s to start it up and sometimes white smoke comes out of the exhaust..he said that rebuilding it will fix those problems..if i decide to let him rebuild my engine..what parts of the engine need to be changed other than the apex seal?
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/\ shouldn't your 'expert' know that ?
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Well, you get what you pay for.
Replacing just the seals usually gives you a ~10,000 mile motor before it needs rebuilding again. Housings and irons are still worn. |
Originally Posted by nycgps
(Post 4405851)
5K+ it is, and it's 90% new parts.
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Originally Posted by RIWWP
(Post 4405823)
Im fairly sure thats not accurate 9k, but not 100% sure. Id have to defer to Paul
Originally Posted by nycgps
(Post 4405850)
As far as I remember, the engine he got was using used parts.
That's the reason why Mazmart stop selling them. correct me if I'm wrong. |
say goodbye to your 50/50 weight distribution. Wasnt that the point of owning the 8? -_-
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Originally Posted by Luckyboii69
(Post 4406412)
thanks to my friend..i saw him at school today..didnt have his number..he has an rx7 and the only place he takes his car to get it fixed is someone whom he recommended me which he seems to know a lot about rotary engines ..i just took my car over there and he said that he can rebuild my engine for $1100 for everthing..taking it out dropping it back in..new apex seals..etc..of course..you never know until you break it apart..when he took a look at my car he said that it has low compression because the car takes 4-6s to start it up and sometimes white smoke comes out of the exhaust..he said that rebuilding it will fix those problems..if i decide to let him rebuild my engine..what parts of the engine need to be changed other than the apex seal?
1100 including labor to remove/rebuild/install? good luck man Just to let u know, a new set of stock soft seal, a new set of new OEM apex, new set of side seal, springs, etc cost WAY MORE than 1100 :) Expert my ass. |
Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
(Post 4406552)
All I know is they rebuilt it and it failed prematurely. Not passing blame just pointing out that RWWIP's claim on how long they will last is just his opinion based on his zero knowledge on what a Mazmart reman even consists of.
I rebuild my FC engine with completely new housings and irons, I went Ceramic Apex so might as well go all out and use new housings. Even I use stock OEM Apex I still gonna just new housings. if I have to rebuild for people, I will at least Re-nitrite the Irons and new housings. |
Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 4406413)
/\ shouldn't your 'expert' know that ?
Originally Posted by RIWWP
(Post 4406414)
Well, you get what you pay for.
Replacing just the seals usually gives you a ~10,000 mile motor before it needs rebuilding again. Housings and irons are still worn.
Originally Posted by nycgps
(Post 4406573)
1100 including labor to remove/rebuild/install?
good luck man Just to let u know, a new set of stock soft seal, a new set of new OEM apex, new set of side seal, springs, etc cost WAY MORE than 1100 :) Expert my ass. |
In most cases NEVER reuse Oil Control Rings $300, Springs $80 and O Rings $80 (these fit on/in Rotors)...plus Cut Off Rings and Springs $150...there is another $600....
PLUS Apex, Side and Corner Seals and Springs, and hoping Rotors can be re-used? Full Gasket sets...$500. Rotor Housings (usually needed) $1500 for 2. Machining of Irons,...or new, $1800 for 3 new. All adds up...plus labour. BTW: Just for the record, given that OEM Mazda parts in USA have increase by around 35% over the past 18 months, then it is virtually impossible to do a rebuild for $1100, unless the repairer is sitting on large new parts stocks at the old prices....even at old parts prices I call it impossible. |
Originally Posted by ASH8
(Post 4406598)
In most cases NEVER reuse Oil Control Rings $300, Springs $80 and O Rings $80 (these fit on/in Rotors)...plus Cut Off Rings and Springs $150...there is another $600....
PLUS Apex, Side and Corner Seals and Springs, and hoping Rotors can be re-used? Full Gasket sets...$500. Rotor Housings (usually needed) $1500 for 2. Machining of Irons,...or new, $1800 for 3 new. All adds up...plus labour. BTW: Just for the record, given that OEM Mazda parts in USA have increase by around 35% over the past 18 months, then it is virtually impossible to do a rebuild for $1100, unless the repairer is sitting on large new parts stocks at the old prices....even at old parts prices I call it impossible. |
You could go ahead and put new apex seals in whenever you regularly change your oil, or you could do it right and have an engine that will last you a long time.
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Originally Posted by nycgps
(Post 4406574)
as far as I remember it was just a rebuild with used housings and such. well you get what you paid for.
I rebuild my FC engine with completely new housings and irons, I went Ceramic Apex so might as well go all out and use new housings. Even I use stock OEM Apex I still gonna just new housings. if I have to rebuild for people, I will at least Re-nitrite the Irons and new housings. But depending on what builder you talk too and what day of the week it is you will get totally different answers from each one. The "guru" of porting told me that installing new housings would not be necessary and would not increase the reliability of the engine (I quickly crossed his name off my list of potential builders). So basically unless you really understand what it takes to rebuild a Renesis reliably, you are unfortunately at the mercy of your builder and understandably you would go with whatever they recommend. |
Originally Posted by 9krpmrx8
(Post 4406552)
Your not sure Expo1's engine failed in under 50,000 miles or your not sure Mazmart current remans are Mazda remans?
All I know is they rebuilt it and it failed prematurely. Not passing blame just pointing out that RWWIP's claim on how long they will last is just his opinion based on his zero knowledge on what a Mazmart reman even consists of. I am not contradicting your note on Expo1's engine. I would also expect that Mazmart would correct and improve deficiencies found by a customer, unlike Mazda rebuild facility and other unnamed vendors. I would have to defer to Paul if he wishes to detail what all their builds entailed. I would still buy one of his engines over buying a reman from a dealer. |
No doubt Mazmart/Paul are great (I have purchased plenty from him/them) but without knowing what exactly goes into a rebuild, you really can't assume that their rebuilds are any better than a Mazda reman. I would take a Mazda reman over quite a few builders engines any day of the week ( and I have had two Mazda remans only last 100k between them both). Especially if they are just Mazda remans with RE-medy products installed on them.
Now if they are taking apart Mazda remans and rebuilding them (seems odd that they would do that) then maybe, but with Rick Engman no longer building them then who knows what type of rebuild is being done and who is doing it, and their qualifications. |
Originally Posted by Luckyboii69
(Post 4406656)
what would be the benefits to have the housings and the irons replaced? my engine hasnt overheated..yet..how about $1100 just for the apex seals replaced? just wondering
The 'benefits' are back to factory spec, but more importantly compressions/performance/economy/longevity. Rotor Housings could have chrome peeling off, could have scouring marks (groves) in. And you could possibly have a warped housing even if not overheated. Irons, again provided nothing has come apart internally to mark them, you won't really know until apart. I just can not see where you can get close to $1100, unless you do the job yourself. As others have said, doing it on the cheap in more cases than not will not give you longevity... Ask 'RotaryResurrection' about cheap re-builds. https://www.rx8club.com/tech-garage-...w-pics-178937/ |
Originally Posted by nycgps
(Post 4405851)
Don't think they have those 3K engines anymore
5K+ it is, and it's 90% new parts. Any Mazda OEM Parts are a lot more expensive today than a few years ago. As you know M8, some parts just has to be bought from Mazda...or a seller/agent who has to purchased them from Mazda anyway...ie. Mazdatrix, even Atkins. Parts like, Rotors, Rotor Housings, Irons, E-Shafts, like 90% of engine. :) |
Originally Posted by ASH8
(Post 4406972)
This is true...
Any Mazda OEM Parts are a lot more expensive today than a few years ago. As you know M8, some parts just has to be bought from Mazda...or a seller/agent who has to purchased them from Mazda anyway...ie. Mazdatrix, even Atkins. Parts like, Rotors, Rotor Housings, Irons, E-Shafts, like 90% of engine. :) |
Somewhere between $1,500 and $10,000.
Seriously. Many factors go into it. A) Until you tear it apart you have no idea what of the major pieces need to be replaced B) Once you have it apart, you could replace the bare minimum for a shoddy engine or have it completely built by a top notch builder with porting, seal changes, water passage changes, etc... It's very very very flexible. No, it's not an answer that many people like hearing. |
Originally Posted by Luckyboii69
(Post 4407014)
how much roughly would a rebuild engine cost?
I posted what are the OEM (todays) costs for most of the parts to do the job properly, although 3 Irons would not normally be replaced. BUT as RIWWP said and as I have said before, UNTIL, repeat UNTIL you have the engine removed and disassembled you will not know for certain what the cost would be...contact RotaryResurrection he will do a good deal, tell him your noticed his threads.. You are in Florida?...get Paul from Mazmart to give you a quote to ship you a re-built engine, all you need to do is have it installed. |
Originally Posted by Luckyboii69
(Post 4406592)
never said he was an expert but a new set of oem apex is only $300 bucks..a set of side seal is $180 and the side seal spring set is what? $90 bucks? it could cost more than $1100 if i need to change the housings..irons and whatnot
See guys? this is the exact reason why Rotary has such bad name : - ignorant owners who never bothered to "get to know their car" - and stupid ass "experts" all around, giving bs "advise" and does all kind of shitty ass build. Simple does not mean it's Easy. What part of that people don't understand ? |
Originally Posted by ASH8
(Post 4406972)
This is true...
Any Mazda OEM Parts are a lot more expensive today than a few years ago. As you know M8, some parts just has to be bought from Mazda...or a seller/agent who has to purchased them from Mazda anyway...ie. Mazdatrix, even Atkins. Parts like, Rotors, Rotor Housings, Irons, E-Shafts, like 90% of engine. :) so HOPEFULLY parts from Japan will get cheaper ... *quote*hopefully*quote* |
Originally Posted by nycgps
(Post 4407050)
Japan just start printing money again ... err I mean monetary easing, Dollar to Yen went from Holy mother Fker 76(lowest) to now 88(today)
so HOPEFULLY parts from Japan will get cheaper ... *quote*hopefully*quote* But, I could never understand how the Yen got stronger after Tsunami, and why for 20 years the Japanese Government has allowed their currency to KILL off local manufacturing...look at Sony, most is made in China/Malaysia. But yeah, parts and cars should at least stabilise and Mazda might make some money from the cars they export from Japan...but you can't win, it also makes some imported parts Mazda use in Japan assembly more expensive. |
I don't wanna start a political war here, but we all know how this shit first started. NO one to blame but US :(
Anyway, it will be fuxking cool if YEN can really go back to 100-110, that's same as when I first visit Japan back in 1999! w00t ! Great for travelers ! :lol: |
In the 80's it was 250!!..yeah!
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^^ mmm ... I was just a few years old back then ...
I'm happy with 110-150 ... but people in Japan gonna be like OMG lol |
Lucky if the shop that is willing to do the rebuild for you for $1k is turbo clinic run by some guy called Charlie Maldonado, stay away from there. I've only heard about bad things from that shop, and it's a shame considering it's one of the few rotary shops in Miami.
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Damn it Mike, you ruined a perfect nuclear holocaust flame thread by posting accurate and helpful information politely. :(
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thanks a lot guys for all the help i appreciate it
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I saw this thread and wanted to chime in. I've looked into doing this swap and so far its not possible because the oil sump on the renesis rotary engine is a full length sump that sits towards the back of the engine bay. The oil sump on the VQ35DE sits in the front of the engine. Therefore you won't be able to match it up and thus can not install it. Theres a plate blocking the front of the engine bay that will prevent you from installing this engine.
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Originally Posted by gorilla_cooch
(Post 4466645)
I saw this thread and wanted to chime in. I've looked into doing this swap and so far its not possible because the oil sump on the renesis rotary engine is a full length sump that sits towards the back of the engine bay. The oil sump on the VQ35DE sits in the front of the engine. Therefore you won't be able to match it up and thus can not install it. Theres a plate blocking the front of the engine bay that will prevent you from installing this engine.
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Originally Posted by Slidin8
(Post 4466892)
I hope your first post is your last one
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Originally Posted by gorilla_cooch
(Post 4467500)
Wow you have entirely way too much time on your hands. Put your tampon in.
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mr, this thread is useless without tq curve graphs so i hope it gets locked
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I wanted to know more about this plate blocking the engine bay.
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Originally Posted by Mr_Pieper
(Post 4467540)
I wanted to know more about this plate blocking the engine bay.
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I'm too lazy to make any graphs right now. I prefer to pick engines based on a tremendous amount of transmission choices and then get one that is notoriously bad and needs heavy modification to work.
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^^
Man, this is the most anal retentive, uptight and impolite forum on the net, FFS, the man is modifying his own car with the engine of his choice, it's his fracking car to do with as he pleases, the only unfortunate thing is he was under the impression fellow members here would be supportive. It seems that unless you're a narrow minded rotary purist or a big mouth with 24,000 post's and take more than 12 months to install a turbo system and belittle everyone who disagrees with his opinion, or a stick jockey that hasn't have a clue on engine swaps and have to ask how to do an oil change or plug change and have nothing better to do than rag on a guy for wanting to improve the reliability and performance of his 8 without using the pathetically useless and unreliable Renesis engine, damn, even the big mouth is on his 4th engine, yeah, the Renesis is a great engine :nono: All of you negative knob jockey naysayers need a bunch of fives and a good kick in the arse :piss: on you all. |
You obviously didn't read shit cause this guy wouldn't be doing anything but signing a check, he's asking what mods need to be done so the dealership can put the VQ in the 8.
But thank the lord your here to defend everyone who gets disagreed with. |
Originally Posted by CRO8TIA
(Post 4467810)
^^
Man, this is the most anal retentive, uptight and impolite forum on the net, FFS, the man is modifying his own car with the engine of his choice, it's his fracking car to do with as he pleases, the only unfortunate thing is he was under the impression fellow members here would be supportive. It seems that unless you're a narrow minded rotary purist or a big mouth with 24,000 post's and take more than 12 months to install a turbo system and belittle everyone who disagrees with his opinion, or a stick jockey that hasn't have a clue on engine swaps and have to ask how to do an oil change or plug change and have nothing better to do than rag on a guy for wanting to improve the reliability and performance of his 8 without using the pathetically useless and unreliable Renesis engine, damn, even the big mouth is on his 4th engine, yeah, the Renesis is a great engine :nono: All of you negative knob jockey naysayers need a bunch of fives and a good kick in the arse :piss: on you all. I have personally helped more people on this forum than you could ever dream of. Being supportive is one thing, encouraging bullshit is another. If you want to be supportive then so be it, kiss his ass all day, why do you care what we think? And why are you worried about my build and how long it took? Are you jealous? Could you do any of it faster or better than I? No, because if you could, you would. Instead you just sit in your RX-8 thinking about how your car runs so great and how your rattles are gone now that you are premixing. You are just butt hurt because you have no real experience or knowledge to combat anything I said to you in the premix thread who disagreed with me. Don't take it personal, just admit you may not know as much as you think you do and educate yourself. Being called ignorant is not an insult if you are ignorant on the topis at hand. But if you post ridiculous BS, I will call you out on it, I don't care who you are, mod or no mod. And I expect to be called out when I speak nonsense, and I have been many times. Posting BS or opinions as fact doesn't help anyone. Helping people help themselves does. And if you hate the Renesis so much then why do you drive one? My RX-8 will be ten years old in July, talk to me when you have some actual experience wrenching on one. |
Bose, yes I can read, evidently you cant. My comment was NOT in reference to Luckyboii's question. 9k, you often speak of personal experience,as do I, maybe, just maybe the rattle I had before premix was seal chatter, but, as always, you know best. And I dont drive a Renesis, I drive an RX8 fitted with a Renesis. I bare you no malice, and wish you the best in your endeavor to finally get your car running properly one year. And no way am I jealous, why would I be ? Would I like a reliable FI rotary ,sure, who wouldn't, when they design one that will pass emissions and last 100k miles with no issues,I'm up for one.Fwiw, apart from 6 years in the military, I have been an engine builder all of my working life. I await your pleasant reply with baited breathe .
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How many bags of popcorn ? Just one or is this a two bagger ?
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I need to venture out more from my local forums, this thread is great! Let's get iT ON!!
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Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 4467833)
How many bags of popcorn ? Just one or is this a two bagger ?
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I'm of the opinion that "The swap who's name we shall not speak" feels goofy and like a waste of time. Sorry for expressing that and defaming your hero. I find it ironic that it is so well planned out and being praised as such and it is slowly becoming an episode of throwing everything in the parts bin at it just to maybe make something work.
If you are so down on the Renesis, then why own the only car it comes in? Everyone is so quick to deride this engine and get rid of it without trying to work things out. So many people that seem to hate the car they own and make it something different that already exists elsewhere. Some kind of stubbornness and refusal to get rid of a car they bought by mistake without knowing what it was about. |
Originally Posted by CRO8TIA
(Post 4467829)
Bose, yes I can read, evidently you cant. My comment was NOT in reference to Luckyboii's question. 9k, you often speak of personal experience,as do I, maybe, just maybe the rattle I had before premix was seal chatter, but, as always, you know best. And I dont drive a Renesis, I drive an RX8 fitted with a Renesis. I bare you no malice, and wish you the best in your endeavor to finally get your car running properly one year. And no way am I jealous, why would I be ? Would I like a reliable FI rotary ,sure, who wouldn't, when they design one that will pass emissions and last 100k miles with no issues,I'm up for one.Fwiw, apart from 6 years in the military, I have been an engine builder all of my working life. I await your pleasant reply with baited breathe .
Premix cured apex seal chatter that was audible while the engine was running? :lol: Did you just Google the rotary engine and learn of apex seal chatter? I bet you did. You have been an engine builder all your life? Well then you should invest some time into learning about the rotary because if you knew even a little bit you would not be blabbering about premix eliminating apex seal chatter on a Renesis. Oh wait, I forgot, you think the Renesis is a piece of shit. So then why on earth would you buy one? I seem to recall it's the wife car right? So then why the Fawk are you here? Oh, you like Isuzu swaps, I forgot. And if you are so interested in my build then you should read my build thread. My car is tuned and running like a champ. Stay tuned for the next phase, it's a doozy and it's coming soon to a thread near you. Here is a recent pic of her all buttoned up with new body pieces for you to droll over. http://www.flickr.com/photos/9krpmrx8/8651055602/ |
Originally Posted by Brettus
(Post 4467833)
How many bags of popcorn ? Just one or is this a two bagger ?
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iv thought about those rims and voted to ugly but goddamn it 9k you pull those off well, now im confused about which rims i want again :tear: ill never get a set
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Subbed for the entertainment aspect. 9K I still hate your shine, your just poking the envious.
:scratchhe Owns an Rx8, hates the rotary engine :ftw: |
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