Petscar

Opinions on Seafoam motor treatment for fuel. Before I get into the de carbon thing for my one rotors low compression, I have been red lining a lot and considering trying seafoam in the fuel. Thoughts?

NotAPreppie

It won't restore lost compression to a degree that will matter.
https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-tec...r-pics-241867/

Loki

iTrader: (1)

To get the effect you're looking for, inject it through the LIM ports the way Mazda does for their decarb products. And it may not help.

If you want something more potent, get a few bottles of Techron (toluene). It's already present in most fuels, but inject it into the LIM and let sit for effect. And again this may not help.

NotAPreppie

Annoyingly, there are at least 3 different products called "Techron Concentrate Plus" and they all have different formulations.
https://cglapps.chevron.com/msdspds/...ctSDSLink=true

Some of them contain the similar molecule 1,2,4-trimethylbenzene (where toluene is just methylbenzene). One contains xylene (1,2-dimethylbenzene). Some have other ingredients like naphtha and alkyl dithiothiadazole and a few have "trade secret" ingredients.

Honestly, I doubt that simply adding a methylated benzene in 1-5% concentrations will change the solubility or combustibility of carbon to any significant degree. In fact, aromatic molecules like benzene, naphthalene, and anthracene often give off black, sooty smoke when burned in open air. Smoke is carbon.

Loki

iTrader: (1)

/schooled

Petscar

Ok, seafoam in the fuel tank with redlining will not improve my carbon issue. Will it help the engine in any other way or it a waste of money?

Loki

iTrader: (1)

The types of problems adding any fuel treatment addresses are moot on an engine suffering low compression.

UnknownJinX

Those additives are aimed to clean the fuel injectors, not your engine.

Seafoam can remove some carbon on a piston engine when sucked into the intake/vacuum line, but again, it probably won't make enough of a difference.

Look into a Mazda reman...

Doesn't even matter to us Canadians because we can't even get them locally, LOL.

Petscar

Ok, please understand I'm new at this. So seafoam in the fuel won't help with carbon, but pre mixing the fuel will help with the carbon. They are both igniting with the fuel, so why does one help and the other doesnt. Trying to understand.

Loki

iTrader: (1)

Premixing does not help with carbon. If you premix or inject 2-stroke oil instead of engine oil, then you've removed one source of deposits, but if you use the stock system and premix, there isn't an appreciable benefit. Oil condenses out on the sides of the chamber and ends up in seal grooves and other places that a volatile detergent like SeaFoam won't get to, abd maaaaaaybe helps prevent deposits from forming or detergent existing ones away, but without a lab study the net effect of all this is debatable.

Premix primarily improves lubrication of areas the oil injectors cannot supply.

Petscar

I saw a thread where someone had pictures of an engine pulled apart without pre mix and pictures of an engine using pre mix. While carbon was there on both, the pre mix engine carbon was "softer" ( his term). You saw a difference in the picture.
So am I wasting my money pouring amsoil into my tank?

UnknownJinX

It can prevent carbon buildup to a degree, but it won't get rid of the existing carbon.

Supplements don't cure you.

Petscar

Ok, I understand. So what does the add on oil supplier do for the engine. I believe it's called an OMP. It feeds 2 cycle oil into the engine some place. Does that help with carbon?

200.mph

iTrader: (9)

youur car has an oil metering pump (omp) which "injects" engine oil into the housings to lube the seals. you are thinking of a sohn adapter which blocks standard engine oil from the omp and instead uses a tank you fill with clean 2 stroke oil

UnknownJinX

You are thinking of the SOHN adapter, which injects 2-stroke oil from a separate reservoir.

The idea is that 2-stroke burns cleaner than 4-stroke, and you can also start using synthetic 4-stroke oil in your engine without having to worry about anything.

That said, a lot of carbon actually comes from gasoline itself since rotaries have trouble naturally with complete combustion since the combustion chamber is so long.

The bottom line: it's very hard to get rid of carbon once it's there. All you can do is replacing the engine and slow down the carbon buildup from a clean slate.

Petscar

Someone suggested a reman, but I am not even close to that yet. The engine runs perfect at this point and starts easily everytime. My front rotor fell into the category that says most 8's fall into this group after break in with an expectation of getting another 40 - 60k miles out of it. On the rear rotor, the compression came back in the 1st stage of failing in on a couple of tests and in one test it actually fell into the passing category with some life left. My hope is by reviewing all the de carbon methods, and implementing one of more i may be able to gain a little more life into rear rotor.

UnknownJinX

If you are getting a Mazda reman, then it doesn't really matter what condition your old engine is in.

That said, the water through vacuum line is probably one of the more effective methods of decarbing and even that's pretty slow. Everything else is more or less supplementary.

Petscar

Kris, whom I met on this site is doing my work. He also feels to go with the water de carb method.

Petscar

Jinx, you said.....
The idea is that 2-stroke burns cleaner than 4-stroke, and you can also start using synthetic 4-stroke oil in your engine without having to worry about anything.

Are you saying without the SOHN adapter that I would have something to worry about if I use synthetic oil in my engine?

thebubbadog

I have been wanting to do the water de carb but i was unable to find any info about it or how to do it on an RX8. If anyone has some more details that would be great.

Petscar

Jinx, you also said....
That said, a lot of carbon actually comes from gasoline itself since rotaries have trouble naturally with complete combustion since the combustion chamber is so long.

Do you think adding an octane booster to premium gas would help with combustion?

200.mph

iTrader: (9)

engine oil is engine oil and has been debated since the dawn of the rotary. pick whatever brand you like and weight depending on climate/temp. sohn uses oil that was never in your engine so yes its cleaner and 2 stroke is designed to burn unlike engine oil. get your water decarb done if you want and please do a little searching on your own. literally any possible question you could ever come up with about an rx8 has been asked and answered on this very forum a million times

200.mph

iTrader: (9)

i linked riwwps write up on it in ops other thread that basically asks the same questions here

Petscar

Bubba, if you look at the 2nd post in this thread, there is a link on results from the water method. I believe there is another link I saw. I will look for it.

UnknownJinX

https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-tec...r-pics-241867/

More likely than not, you are fine.

The reasoning is that since some synthetic oils use different base stock, they can react differently and some of them leave behind ashes.

I personally use conventional because it's cheaper and I change it every 3k miles anyway, so synthetic doesn't really have much of an advantage.

Octane boosters in general aren't really worth it. Usually you are only bumping up the octane by tenths of an octane.

Besides, octane doesn't have anything to do with the inability of rotary to burn fuel completely. That's just the problem of the rotary by its design.

Octane just represents the anti-knocking level you get. Higher octane is less prone to knocking and therefore can be ignited earlier(ignition timing) without it creating multiple, unpredictable flame fronts.