bse50

Great bike Paul, too bad it wasn't delivered in time... I would have enjoyed testing it :p

mysql101

What did he do with it? From what I've pulled up online, it has about 10 hp more than the standard 600cc sport bike.

paulmasoner

iTrader: (1)

You sound like someone who drives a Rustang talking to a ricer lol. I guess it's fair and expected though considering you ride a 1300cc drag strip machine :P

dunno, I have no interest in keeping up. IMO most who ride sport bikes, anywhere but the track, are just statistics waiting to happen Anyway, I can't even keep up(lack of interest?) with what he does with the current GTR either

but I did take a look real quick and here are some things I found, stock bike #'s as comparison using the Busa since you're familiar with it.

'11 848 EVO: 435lbs wet
05 Busa: 560lbs wet

'11 848 EVO: 3.2lbs/hp
05 Busa: 3.6lbs/hp

so it may boast only 10hp more than a fart from a cats ***, but stock for stock it's likely faster than your bike in a line and undoubtedly faster in the curves
not the same class of bike, 850/1300cc. but anywho i guess the point is the Duc isnt a street bike. It very much has track bike roots....

I've never seen an opposing opinion from anyone with legitimate track/supersport experience.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Uj0jQTbTIE

bse50

The fact that its engine is a 2cyl and has desmodromic valves says it all.
Most sport bike enthusiasts dislike Ducati because it generally lacks power vs the competition. However, track enthusiasts praise them because of the definitely superior chassis, suspension and power curve.

bse50

Yout bike has an exhaust and other mods.
Btw add braking, stability and cornering speeds to the mix.

mysql101

Assuming your weights are accurate, my bike just dynoed 163. I have a Ti exhaust among other stuff, so I'm going to be 15 lbs or more under the stock numbers (which wikipedia says is 551 - 560 lbs btw).

So your weight to power ratio isn't as far off as you seem to think, and we aren't even looking at torque yet. My bike at 2000 rpm makes more torque than the EVO at peak



Here's my problem with your logic, you're racing just the bike weights and not including the rider.

So Lets say the evo is 435 lbs with 120 hp. That's 3.6 lbs/hp
Lets say my busa is 540 lbs with 163 hp, that's 3.3 lbs/hp.


Now add 200 lbs for the rider in both.

Evo is now 5.29 lbs/hp, busa is 4.54 lbs/hp. The evo's initial starting weight is now at a severe disadvantage.

So much for your theory of the EVO blasting away my bike :P

mysql101

It's basically a stock bike. I don't think the Ti exhaust does all that much, honestly. It's a lot lighter though. My dyno numbers aren't far off stock bikes. Of course dyno calibration means it's not that useful to compare dyno results since 1 hp isn't always 1 hp.

For 2k or so I can slap on a turbo kit and go all day long at 250 hp. Just don't need it.

paulmasoner

iTrader: (1)

I'm not stupid enough to be suckered into the dyno debate. I've seen 20hp variance on the same stock bike from dyno to dyno. The weights I used for each bike has multiple references agreeing within 3-5 pounds. I'm sure you do have the TQ, as I said I was comparing stock to stock. On top of that you have an extra 450cc's, and the associated 120+ pounds.

None of this means anything as I dont know what he's done with the bike. All I know is:
btw, congratulations on the numbers. Now you have even more powa and speed that cant be safely used on the road anyway

anyhow I dunno what the point is here. Two entirely different classes. One is a pure track toy by design, the other is a boat designed to win top speed arm chair and street racing

bse50

So the dynojet stickers etc are like those found on the ricer civics?
That 'busa fits the definition of poseur.

With that said, you don't need 250rwhp on a bike. Even track oriented bikes don't go over 200rwhp and they have a far better chassis than yours, better suspension and exponentially sharper handling. They also weigh less than 200kg.

The 848 fits the latter category with a smaller engine. Take the 1198 into account, do you think you would even see it passing you?

paulmasoner

iTrader: (1)

I used what I saw of 130-135hp to get the hp-wt which makes it 3.2 as stated, and 4.7 with 200# rider, and I used the 560# that is referenced in a dozen places for the Busa. Again this is a dyno debate that has no winners, so its whatever. Your welcome to think your bike is faster in a straight and top speed(which may well be true) but I'll call you ignorant if you think it's even comparable on the track - which coincidentally is the ONLY place you can safely use that kind of power/speed*. Congratulations for having the ultimate big block boat of the motorcycle world

* case/point, my bike makes a whopping 38 ponies and it runs toe to toe in a line with the RX-8 I sold, and if I put street tires on it it'd smoke it in the curves had I ***** bigger than brains. There's no need for more speed than that on the street, and no place for what any of those bikes will do on the street

edit: to be fair, i feel similar towards his bike, being entirely a status symbol as it isnt used as intended

mysql101

The only thing going on here is you took it personally when I asked what mods his bike had, because it barely makes more power then a standard 600cc. You took it as an insult apparently, but that wasn't the case.

HP isn't the end all be all of anything. But 100 lbs on a bike also doesn't make it a boat.

If I wanted bragging rights, I wouldn't have bought a first gen hayabusa. It isn't the king of horsepower or top speed. I bought it because I wanted a nice bike to cruise on.

paulmasoner

iTrader: (1)

personally? not remotely, why would I give a **** about what you feel about someone elses bike? Honestly I think you're all crazy, certainly not personal.

That was also one of my factors in choosing bikes. For less than $5K I got a brand new bike that goes as fast as I would ever ride, as fast as I feel is sane for the street, is comfortable for 3+ hours at a time, gets 55+mpg, is designed stupidly simple to work on.. et al

bazooki

Wow, Busa envy on the RX-8 forum? I have to say I never thought I would find this debate here....feels like home now! LOL. The 848 is a really nice bike but it races against 600's so lets keep things in perspective here....now the hot debate over on Hayabusa.org is the BMW S1000RR and the maybe soon to be released Kawi 15.

mysql101

lol. Soon as someone starting bragging how fast their bike is against a 180 hp car, you know something is up.

The BMW with bolt ons has dynoed around 25 hp more than my busa on the same dyno machine. Personally, Kawi isn't even in the same ballpark as long as they insist on making their bikes look like something out of the Vanilla ice 80's period. Resell value on them (vs busa) tells you all you need to know.

paulmasoner

iTrader: (1)

lol, not remotely. I will not get on any sport bike period. You couldnt pay me to own or ride something as monstrously pointless on the street as a Busa, 1000RR or even the smaller MotoGP style bikes mentioned. Riding bikes like those on the street is akin to buying a GT3 and calling it a nice ride to cruise around in.

The things have their place on the tracks and dragstrips and I mean to take nothing away from how amazing they are. I simply don't buy the line or the mentality. Bikes like those used on the streets fall into 1 of 2 categories...
1) You're riding it safely and within reason, in which case you could have a much "lesser" bike providing the same experience, meaning you chose what you did for reasons not related to what the machine does(ie stereotypical Corvette little dick syndrome) <- there, I said it.
2)you're actually making use of what the bike is capable of, on the street. In which case your a prime example of why anyone who isnt on a Harley(as seen by non moto'ers) is a dangerous *******, and you're simply a timer waiting to expire.

Get geared up and take those things to the track and abuse them, ABSOLUTELY!! Its not for me personally, but F*CK yeah! I love moto racing as a spectator. But on the street bikes like that carry either a clock-ticking douchebag, or someone who needs the attention. Theres simply no other functional use for such speed machines on the street.

bazooki

I have to disagree on this point. I suppose it depends on what environment you ride in but for me I spend most of my time out on winding country roads and straight stretches of secondary highway. Believe me, until you have cracked the throttle on a Busa on a wide open stretch of road (where you know there isn't a police presence and no danger to others) you really haven't experienced speed or acceleration. It gives an adrenaline rush like no other vehicle because that is YOU accelerating at that rate, not the car you are sitting in. Plus, it happens sooo bloody fast that you can reach incredible speeds in a very short distance. THAT is what the mighty Hayabusa is all about.

paulmasoner

iTrader: (1)

guess we agree to disagree.

bazooki

I guess, more simply put, what I am saying is that there is a time and place for everything. Believe it or not but there are safe times to go WOT on a sportbike assuming you have the riding experience to do so. I have been riding motorcycles for around 35 years and sportbikes for most of that time. I have never gotten a speeding ticket on a motorcycle and I have only been down two times. I never drag knee on the streets as I am a single dad of two boys and they need me too much for me to take that risk. I am a hardcore ATGATT supporter and I have also spent time at racing schools learning and improving and pushing sportbikes to their intended limits. I don't think I am a timer waiting to expire nor do I think I am an azzhole. We all have our own opinions though and thats what makes us special.

bse50

You can't go really go WOT... I pulled a wheelie on my friend's s1000rr in 5th gear at 280km\h.
The 'busa is the equivalent of a muscle car on two wheels, it can only go fast on a straight line, for everyday fun any 600 or a supermoto.

bazooki

Haha. Sorry but anyone who claims to have pulled a wheelie on a S1000RR at 280 km/h is full of sheot. You might be able to fool some of the non-riders on this forum but please don't take us all for fools. You also clearly know nothing about the Hayabusa. Educate yourself or keep your comments to yourself. Many Busas spend many days at the track and while they don't corner like a 600 they can more than take care of themselves with an experienced rider aboard.

mysql101

I like to think of my SV650S like the RX-8. Both are agile, fairly lightweight, neither have much raw horse power. I had my SV modded out with all the suspension work you can throw at it. In the end, it's a 72 whp bike. Just like the RX-8, it's nice, but it needs a little more umph. Amazing suspension can only get you so far.

Anyone who says you can't turn on a busa is a hater. You can turn on one. It doesn't take much effort either. Try it before you bash it. You have to look hard to see my chicken strips, and I'm living in Florida.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTioF1UV1VA



A big engine means power anytime, all the time. The aerodynamics means I can cruise on the highway without the wind tossing me around. This makes it hands down a better bike for every day riding than any 600cc bike.


PS: Busa without any muffer sounds amazing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fS5hl3ElcbU

mysql101

D00d! That's only 174 mph!

But seriously. You know he's lying simply because the S1000RR's max speed is 167.8 mph in 5th.

Even if you assume there's a 10% speedo difference, I just don't see there being enough power to flip it up when you're already near redline.





BTW, I did a 180 mile trip north on my Hayabusa a few weeks ago -- 45 mpg for the trip. So if you lay off the throttle, it can delivery solid numbers. My SV650S would have returned around 50 mpg in the same riding conditions. The mpg drops rapidly with any throttle use on the Hayabusa though. Got to pay to play.

alnielsen

iTrader: (4)

That may be true for a US spec bike. However, he's in Italy. It may be different for a Euro spec. I don't know. Just sayin your a little quick on the BS call.

bazooki

I'm not a little quick...it's BS. I know 285 km/h and I know about the S1000RR and he is blowing smoke out his ****. Now maybe on a Busa with an RCC Stage 1 turbo kit.....

bse50

He's right on the gearing, i just didn't double check the numpad. 250, not 280.
It's still crazy and too dangerous.

I rode on busas, zx10r, r1, 1198, s1000r, rsv1000 factory and all the likes since most of my supermoto friends moved to supersports for track duty while I made the switch to cars.
The busa is just a whale on wheels like any other 240kg bike out there. Whoever says the contrary is just a fool and lacks the comparison tools of real supersports. The 1300cc bike is a very fast cruiser.

Any 1000cc bike is faster and more agile around a track and living just 10 miles away from Vallelunga really helped me make up my mind on what works and what doesn't