I remember Mazda NA reps saying that the mzr series is an all mazda design and the v6 was based on a duratec with mazda heads.

Never heard about the porsche influence but I do remember hearing that porsche helped design the k-series v6. So I'm not suprised.

Everyone likes to claim that they've made a particular product or what not...when in turn there is many hands involved.

I'd still call the NA 2.3 a Ford/Mazda motor, with the DFI 2.3 being an almost Mazda motor. Ford's done far more work on the 2.3 platform then mazda has (cosworth), and has utilized in far more vehicles.

Aka the 6i engine has a large # of ford parts in it. The 6s is about a 99.8% ford motor. The only real difference between it and some of the other duratecs is the VVT oil sprocket.

i'm going to have to seriously agree that that is one nasty looking POS of an suv. i like how they are uncreative enough to use the Kansas track "dust in the wind" in the background for that particular advertisment you mentioned too.

-edit-

Dre summed up the idea of what i was gonna say darkmazdaman

and dark, don't ask me, go ask the tons of legacy turbo owners in japan why there is such a large aftermarket and why they like modifying their car.

i can't believe you would even ask that question, do you know what eurotuning is? its when people take performance sedans like the legacy turbo and modify it to thier tastes aesthetically and peformance wise. do you know what VIP tuning is? its a performance/appearance style of modification that people do in japan to their sedans. do you think that just because a performance car is a sedan invalidates it for aftermarket? modifying performance sedans in europe is more common than modifying coupes, and performance sedans make up a large sum of aftermarket in america too, m5, a6/s6/rs6, s4, jetta, c230, etc to name a few.

I ran with a MS6 yesterday on my way home from work. I work a block from Mazda R&D and live a few miles from MNAO.

He seemed to keep up with me pretty good but we really didn't accelerate past 50. It sounded nice but looked too plain for me. I guess it would make a good sleeper for the average joe that doesn't know what it is. Turn up the boost and I'm sure it'll spank our 8's.

O'rly

Yes rly

i don't know if its been said because i dont want to read through it all but..

rotory engine.

...I concur...


...rly

I'm still not sure witch is faster?

Mps ? Rx8
 

Hi

I have both cars. The RX8 and the MPS6. Out of the box the MPS6 is much faster then a standard RX8. The awd is very good and very safe. I find the steering better in the MPS than in the RX8 (maybe I need to get the setup on the RX8 checked, it is all over the place sometimes and needs a lot of concentration when driven hard..) The RX8 (high power version) has a lot less power the Mazda puts on paper. A good RX8 will deliver about 190bhp when tested. A low power version about 170bhp. I got my RX8 tested and it got 193bhp (low torque) . I did the same with the MPS and got 267 bhp (!) (and a high torque). In real life my RX8 is really no match for my MPS6. Even on a track, the MPS with his AWD and higher powered engine is the fastest one. They are both great but very different cars. The MPS is a wolf in sheepsclothes, the RX8 has the looks but lacks the power (my opinion). Turbo charging the RX8 is an option, but voids warranty, has its problems and costs a lot of money, not to speak about fuel consumption. Drive the MPS as hard as you can and it will consume 12liter per 100km. A normal RX8 driven hard will consume 20liters of fuel every 100km. Some people say "the RX8 is RWD and that is much more fun to drive!". They are wrong, because the MPS drives the front wheels and switches power over to the back when grip loss is detected, you can provoke powerslides very easy... I leave it with this .. could go on for ever on those two great cars... So my conclusion : yep the MPS is faster, much faster, a fun drive, the RX8 is a different car and I still love it to pieces. My advise: drive both !

I think the MS6 is faster than the RX8, but I'd go with the MS3 over the MS6.

Depends on what you want in a car... the MS3 vs MS6. The MS6 has more room and full leather interior. The MS3 does not. Also, if you hate FWD and torque steer... then the MS3 won't be your cup of tea. It's really more of a sports compact vs grand tourer kinda comparison. Although with the prices that the MS6 is going for in the US now... it's one hell of a deal.

my friend got a mazdaspeed 6.. his car is badass.. faster than an 8 yes.. looks wise not as nice.. but inside its alot roomier.. also has AWD so u cant go wrong there in bad weather.. it depends on who u are.. if ur a person that has friends and you drive around alot of times and u still want a fast car.. go with the MS6.. but if ur a person w no friends or jsut a person who doesnt like haivng ppl in their car go with the 8

There's not much more power to be had with the MS6 because its turbo is too small (info I received from a tuner who's tried). However, it will be a lot easier to merely upgrade the turbo & tune than to turbo a car that came from the factory NA like the 8.

No denying that the K04 is reaching the end of efficiency with the MS6, but... that tuner must have sucked. The few tests with things like FMIC and downpipe, have shown significant improvements. Just a cat back alone has shown much better gains than N/A cars like the RX-8. The same can also be said for manual and electronic boost controls.

There is still more to be had from this engine for thost that have to run at the front of the pack.

Not sure if this was covered yet (don't feel like reading 7 pages worth of stuff). if power and comfort is your thing, go MS6. I leased an RX-8 for two years then bought a MS6. I chose the MS6 over the Legacy GT for two reasons. The first being looks. The MS6 has a much better looking exterior in my opinion. (Though the limited version LGT in Japan looks awesome). The second would be Subaru dealerships are more sparse.

Anyways between the RX-8 and MS6.

Advantages RX-8: The RX-8 handles better. It's much lighter. Smaller. More responsive. Much better turning radius. High red line. Clutch feels much better (the MS6 clutch is VERY springy which caused me to stall quite a bit at first). Shorter throws. Reverse is near 6th gear (I find it awkward to shift from reverse to first when both are in the same location).

Advantages MS6: Better gas mileage (it was nearly the same the first few tanks, but my last tank I actually got 21 mpg mixed. My best with the RX-8 was almost 20 and that was like 90% freeway). Much more torque. More power. Much less road noise (which makes the stereo sound 10x better than it does in the RX-8). More comfort. Bigger trunk. Seats 5. Better air conditioner.

Basically if you want a sedan but want it sporty, get the MS6. If you want a fun car to drive, the RX-8. I found after driving the MS6 for a while that I like the RX-8 much better. It just feels so much better for me to drive. The people I give rides to all think the MS6 is a better car though. And I can imagine if you're just cruising, the MS6 is nicer.

I just traded my speed 6 for an rx8. The speed 6 has powerloss issues and the reflash screws up the car. I do have to say that the speed 6 was a lot faster though.

Even without the powerloss issues on the MS6, the RX-8 is the better car. Grats!

where is Ike & what have you done with his body ?

I test drove the Speed 6 and the RX8 on the same day and the RX8 got my vote, and a place in my garage !!

MS6 is a decent car... if you swing like that.

But the main thing the RX-8 needs is more POWER. An RX-8 spitting out a true 275 HP+ from a supercharger and this is almost no debate to me.

Mazda committed a crime by not coming out with a Mazdaspeed RX-8.

Hopefully in 2007, all those RX-8 supercharger kits will finally hit the market.

Whether or not the RX8 is a better car really depends on what you are looking for. I enjoy my Speed 6 as a daily commuter/winter car, but I cannot look at that car as an enthusiast like I could with my previous RX8, STI, and current S2000. It's more like a nice daily driver that offers great looks, refinement, and good performance.

As for the Legacy GT comparison. Things have changed, due to the market failure of the Speed 6. I'd prefer the Legacy GT over the Speed 6. However, since the summer, and even more so now, the Speed 6 prices are insane ($21-$22k for the Sport model, and $24-25k for the GT model), so you can get one for considerably cheaper, so there's another reason to choose one over the LGT. For $2000+ less, it's tough to overlook the Speed 6 when you are interested in the GT. Now if your plans are to modify car right away, then the GT is a great choice. I do feel overall it's a better car then the Speed 6, but for daily driving, no plans to modify, and the savings, I didn't feel it was worth it to spend the extra $2-$3000.

To conclude, the only thing I really see in common between the RX8 and Speed 6 is that they are both Mazdas built in Japan, and they both are not selling well. However, the Speed 6 is starting to sell off nicely because of the super incentives. They are just different cars, with different purposes. The Speed 6 is NOT a sports car. :)