Getting STI quotes UPDATE!!
 

I may get some flack for this. I have been getting some quotes for an 05 sti, just to see if trading in rx8 is possible. I'd prefer to have both cars, but I can't. I am stunned at the quotes I got. So far I got two and both were 500 below invoice. That's on a just delivered 05 model. I guess these cars are selling about the same as rx8. The invoice is not nearly as far away form rx8 though. When I find the sti I want, I'm gonna email dealer with description of my rx8, and see how close they are willing to come to KBB trade. Odds are, they will go way below it. I doubt I can own an sti by trading in my rx8 and only having to pay out 4-5k. It's fun to test the waters though, because you never know. I haven't made any decisions, but this was the car that came in a close second place when I bought rx8 in February. We'll see if anything comes out of it, but if the price is right, I'll head down to test drive one, then sleep on it to make my decision. It's a tough call, because you lose so much if you go with sti, but you gain so much back in return. I guess it comes down to looks and refinement, or power and performance. We shall see!!

isnt the sti just a tuned up sedan or is this the rally winner but when it all comes down to SEXY 8 with nice styling or mom sedan with a jumbo jet wing ur choice

WRC is the bomb.. I'll take one. :)

WRX STI... I'll pass. It's a family suped up car.

I figured I'd get these responses. Naturally bias rx8 owners abroad. I'm sure if anyone jumps on an sti forum talking about trading in theit sti for an rx8, they'd get identical responses. Both cars are open to big criticism. I think I'm gonna find a wrx forum and post this same thing. 100 bucks says I get nothing but praise and motivation to follow through with it. :) Like I said, I wish I could own both cars. Give me an rx8 that performs like an sti, and there wouldn't even be a discussion, but unfortunately in this price range, you just can't have the best of both worlds. I do love my rx8, and I will miss it greatly if by chance I follow through on this.

I'm 27 years old, work in an environment that requires me to sometimes pick up clients, look respectable. If I drove a blue family sedan, big fat exhaust, high wing, and try to pick up a client, I would look like an imbecile.

RX-8 at least looks sporty, yet is classy. I would also drive my G35 if I wanted to pick up a client. It all depends on what you are going to do with your car... if it's just pure enjoyment and racing around, sure go for STI. For an affordable looking sports car, that will definitely catch people's attention, stay with the 8.

In the end, if I wanted to drive a power performance car, I would still choose something else rather than the STI. Maybe if I was in high school or college, I could understand getting the STI... but now that I'm in the career field, I can't do that to myself.

Subarus rule. :) STis are very fast and fun. The 8 will handle better in dry weather and it looks a lot better. The STi is much faster, has more room, and a full sized trunk. AWD is amazing in bad weather. The DCCD allows you to manually control the power distribution, so you can essentially make it RWD when you want. The wing can be switched to an aftermarket one if you don't like it. Or you could take it off all together if you don't plan on doing more than 80. The STi doesn't require anything to guard against floods and it won't eat nearly as much oil. It doesn't have a rotary engine :( but it has a turbo boxer (so at least it's not a plain inline 4.

How about the appearence of the car Prod? Are you going to suggest spending money on an aftermarket body kit to make it look like something better than a suped up family WRX?

If you wanted Fun, Fast, Better handling, lots of room.. the new 2005 Mustang has all that and is cheaper than the STi. Heck it even looks better than the STi. Perhaps that's another option.

i too have been thinking about trading my rx-8 into a dealer because private sells everyone and their mom wants a deal off you so they can walk off with a big smile on their face like they robbed you. but i've been thinking about still sticking to it and trading it for a FD maybe but i too have also been looking at sti's but i would end up oweing more on my loan instead of going down on it.

Good points. What you recommend if you were looking to buy a power performance sports car in the price range of an rx8? You'd be surprised how toned down the grey 05 sti is. I saw one in person with silver wheels. If you take off that wing, it really isn't too loud of a car looks wise. The blue ones with gold wheels definitely is flashy. I haven't made any decisions, but it's cool to test the waters to see what else is out there. I'm in my early 30s, but I guess I'll never get over that fun, high performance car. The rx8 thus far lacks a lot powerwise, but I guess in time that will change. I never cared what anyone thought, so even if I was a lawyer, hell I'd drive an sti to work, or to pick up clients. :) The rx8 is not for everyone, and I've had it for 6 months, and i'm just not sure I made the right choice. I admit I bought car for one reason only. THE LOOKS. I'm gonna weigh my options speak to my family, then decide what to do, as well as explore other potential cars. For now though, it's fun browsing other cars, and getting a true perspective of what car I want to own for a long time. It may end being the rx8 after all.

The 8 will not handle better in dry weather. I have and 8 and love it. But where I autox, there are tons of STI's. They are faster and can corner just as well if not better than the 8. I just don't care for thier styling. Looks wise the 8 rules, but performance wise the STI rules.

We had a Subaru dealership so I took an STI home for the weekend, it is quick but it rides like crap and is ugly has hell... The interior quality is horrible and I could have purchased it at cost minus holdback and I passed for the eight...

I can't comment on the ride, and I'd imagine it will have a pure sports car feel, which is right on the road. I have to disagree about interior. I think although not as nice as rx8, it's still a nice interior, and I did like it. Performance wise, there is no comparison at all. The STI is a pure performance vehicle. The rx8 is a practical sports car with refinement and luxury. It's apples and oranges. Yes the rx8 is definitely more of a looker, but to a performance minded person it's an all show no go vehicle. I guess it depends just how much one focuses purely on looks. That is the bind I am in. Looks is why I bought rx8 to begin with. As for the MUSTANG. YUCK. Just my opinion, but I absoluteely hate mustangs, and if one was given to me I'd sell it. We all have different tastes, so this is very subjective. I guess I should jump on a Z forum and ask them. NO wait that won't work, they'll say neither and tell me to buy a 350z. :D

My brother has an STI and I've had the opportunity to actually drive both cars. It's definitely a very fast car. 300 HP and 300 lbs. of torque is unquestionnably a powerful piece of machinery. However, Outlaw hit it on the nose when he described who that car appeals to most. While the kids at the school that I pick up my son from may think "Wow, what a nice car," I don't think my friends and colleagues would share that opinion. Plus, the STI is a lot less refined on bumpy roads where only passengers who like going 150 would want to sit in it. Others would prefer the smoother ride of the 8. I don't think the two cars are comparable really. In the long run, I think most will tire of the uncivilized behavior of the STI unless they live in Germany where they can fly on the Autobahn on a regular basis. Here in So Cal, there's hardly a road available to take advantage of the power of the STI. Personally, if you want to go really fast, hop on a motorcycle. My gixxer 600 can do a quarter mile in 10.38 seconds.

You see its funny. When people say " I need to look somewhat respetable and professional...and the spoiler on the STI along with the scoop makes it childish"

I find that funny because I know plenty of people that look at the RX8 and say its a boy racer, with the tezza style tail lights and confusing lines everywhere.


Personally I think both cars look absolutely fine. And in all honesty the STi is probably a little more "normal" or businessllike. And will definitely be more comfortable for your clients or business associates to ride in (back seat space).


Anyway. Ive read alot of your posts on this board DJ and it seems to me like an STi would be a good trade up for you.

Ive driven both the RX8 and STi, and they both put a smile on my face. Both are great cars, but if you are more into performance (like I think you are) the STi is up your alley.

I would keep the $4-5K loss in my wallet and save it for a street-legal turbocharger or supercharger... :-D

Thanks Lawrence. I like your "tell it like it is" objective attitude. I'm just so stuck between the looks and refinement of the rx8, and the performance of the sti, i'm not in any better of a position I was in when I made the initial decision back in February to get the rx8. You are right, I have a slight edge in performance over looks, but it doesn't give me a clear objective of what I truly want. I guess what I really want is that drivetrain and engine in the rx8 body. :) Since that is never happening I think I need to just go to the dealership and drive one for myself, and then sleep on it to get a better view of what I want. it was damn near impossible for to test drive an 04 sti at the local dealership back in february without pretending I was solely interested in the sti. So I took a look at it, sat in it, then headed to mazda. The dealer handed me keys right away, and I just made my decision. I accept the blame for not really thinking it through, but I'm not sure I'd be in any better of a position had i test driven it. The cars are too different, and capture each side of what I want in a sport car. I admit I did think the rx8 was faster then it actually is, and I found this site after I got car, so that was a negative for me. I'm gonna be happy either way because both are simply wonderful cars. Subaru took a few extra steps in trying to make the sti appeal to more of a general public by adding auto climate control, and putting in a factory sound system, with 6 disc changer standard. I realize that I ultimately am giving up a bit more overall if I chose the sti, but you currently cannot have the best of both worlds. I can tell you this much though. One of two things will happen in the next few years. Either I'll be driving an sti, or a mazdaspeed rx8 that has a lot of power. Thanks for responding to my post. I enjoyed reading. :)

I don't know about that more room comment. It might seem like that with 4 doors, but in adjusting the front driver seat to my 5'9" frame, and trying to get in the back seat I felt my knees rammed up against the front seat. Definitely very little leg room in the back seat, much less than the RX8. In the RX8 I can adjust the seat to fit my frame, and I can still sit in the back in relative comfort. The EVo has a far bigger back seat as well.

It's simple, if you want the performance go for it. The interior is actually damn nice on the 05s and the 04s weren't as bad as most people seem to portray, even the mags gave it high marks. As for the exterior looks... it's not as nice looking as the RX-8, but I get compliments on my car all the time and I'm sure STi owners do as well, and the looks really grow on you. The biggest reason you hear people bashing a car like the STi is because when you compare it to the 350Z and the RX-8 the looks are the only thing you can really bash. Bashing other cars is what car forums are all about right, and especially those cars that outperform yours :p The backseat is far more usable on the STi since there is no center console, the trunk is larger, and people in the backseat can get in and out on their own accord.

If you still value looks over performance keep the RX-8, if you want great performance in all aspects of driving and want a car with tons of potential get the STi, after a few days you won't care what it looks like.

In general, I wouldn't drive my clients in an RX-8 or STi. Your better off getting a luxury sedan for that and keeping the RX/STi as a weekend toy. Unless your company is selling performance parts, I find it hard to take anyone seriously coming out of a sports car (RX8) or youngster's car (STi). IMO, they just portray the wrong image.

The RX8 has much more potential than an STI… The STI is a box that Subaru decided to hop-up and rally... I took another STI home last night from our Subaru dealership to refresh my memory and my original position on the car stands...

Now as far as the RX8 projecting the wrong image for a corporate professional; that is absolute BS... I am CIO for a company with over 1.6B in revenue and my “image” has no problems... The RX8 would be a great car for any executive or professional…

heh or so you think your "image" has no problem. Your last little paragraph made you look like an asshole.

The RX8 is a great car and most of the members on this forum are great people... I would like to apologize to everyone for those who feel they need to use personal insults...

Show me one tiny bit of proof that the RX-8 has more potential than the STi. The STi in USDM form has just begun having it's potential unleashed and there are already cars in the 11s, and some that should be in the 10s by years end. The previous generation STi has broken into the 8s in the 1/4 mile and can be made into one hell of a track car no matter what the track surface is. It's also one hell of a autox car and this past weekend one of North Americas top Subaru tuners set fast lap of the day in Montreal by 2 seconds in it's STi, that's a HUGE amount of time on an autox course. Show me what the RX-8 can do because I haven't seen a damn thing, I haven't even seen anyone break out of the 14s, and have yet to see proof of anyone even being able to match the mag times. I also have not seen the RX-8 at the top spot at an autox or any other automotive competition.

Don't get me wrong I like the RX-8 quite a bit, it's a great handling RWD car that has a lot going for it if you're the right kind of buyer. It's a sportscar that doesn't fit the traditional mold of a sportscar that also provides some practicality and has a unique powerplant. Hmmm, that sounds familiar... Who else might have made a car along those lines before the RX-8 was even a drawing on paper... Hmmm could it be Subaru? The difference being that the Impreza/Legacy was designed from the ground up to unseat Audi and Toyota from the top spot in the WRC. If you had any idea what you were talking about Cort you would know this, the STi is not a tarted up econobox, but the Imprezas in all their forms are toned down versions of a purpose built racecar.

The STi has no gimmicks, it has not cute little rotary accents, every part of that car is designed to maximize performance and be a car that only certain types of car freaks and enthusiats appreciate. It doesn't have any frills, but what it lacks in frills it makes up for it in balls out performance and excessive functionality.

When I look at Subaru as a company I see a company that values performance above all else, a company who's engineers don't just look at the bottomline and focus on making a great car, much like Mazda does. Subaru just seems to have figured out that a little extra HP makes that driving experience that much better.
Subaru gets it, Mazda doesn't for god knows why. You would think after years of seeing things like "another brilliant Mazda chassis wanting more horsepower" would make Mazda wake the hell up and put some more ponies in their cars, but other than some horribly reliable rotaries of past they haven't been able to do it.

VikingDJ, read the following excerpt from SPD and if after reading it you don't want to go out and buy an STi then maybe the RX-8 was the right choice all along. Some people fall for the curvy exterior, and with a nice amount of performance that's all they need. Other's such as myself want the no frills car that will give us lots of tuning potential and a no nonsense kind of feeling behind the wheel.

"The Subaru WRX is a sublime piece of automotive engineering. Simple when it can be, sophisticated where it needs to be. It is a car without the flair of say an Audi or a BMW, but when it is 10 o'clock in the evening and you have 20 minutes to inspect and repair your team's rally car, the unbelievably well thought out ease of access to every part on the car makes it possible to do the impossible, such as change out a damaged gearbox in 18 minutes flat or assign a pair of mechanics to change a rear hub assembly in 8-10 minutes.. This is what you pay for. Subaru is a very small company run by very clever engineers._ A kind of clear headed engineering that makes an informed mechanic look forward to working on your car._

Perhaps the most important result of this clear headed engineering approach is the effectiveness of the Subaru as a performance car. Properly setup, it can take you (very quickly) from point A to point B with less stress and more driving satisfaction than all but a small, generally much more expensive handful of cars. Driven smoothly, not softly, it will do it again and again for a long time. An informed driver who will let the car's strengths work into their driving experience is supremely rewarded.

A couple of years ago, Eddie Alterman of Automobile magazine called and asked me why the WRX was such an important car. As a result of our conversation Automobile magazine wound up doing a comparison test, Subaru WRX vs. Porsche 996 for the March 2001 issue. Here is what I had to say at that time, most of which was graciously quoted in that article:

The Subaru is a car made by enthusiast engineers for enthusiast drivers._ It is not an accident that only two car companies in the world have maintained long standing engineering companies separate from their production and marketing organization. One is Porsche/Audi and the other is Subaru. During the 1960's the Japanese government laid plans with the major Koretsu conglomerates to understand the world's manufacturing leaders and become better companies through this study. At that time Nissan took basically Germany, developing an engineering staff that had all its focus on German engineering while Toyota sent engineers to England and Italy. Both generally dismissed American design esthetics, but paid very careful attention to American production technology._

If you put a 1968 Datsun 510 on a hoist it looks exactly like a 2002 BMW, but about 300 pounds lighter. If you take apart its engine it looks just like a period Mercedes engine, except for the kidney shaped 327 fuely' Chevrolet combustion chamber. The optional close ratio 5-speed transmission has Porsche synchos in it. This was the year that Subaru was founded. The kind of engineers that designed the Datsun 510 became the generation that trained the Subaru engineers. This was also the time of Porsche ascendance to greatness. While the great Ferrari-Mercedes-Maserati, Mercedes-Jaguar, Lotus-Ferrari and Ford-Ferrari battles captivated the imagination of this first generation of Japanese engineers, it was the sheer technical mastery and dominance of Porsche that faced the generation that founded the core Subaru engineering staff. They understood Porsche's message quite clearly. An Otto cycle internal combustion engine is a convenient hot gas generator for a turbine powered car. Invent the computer controlled engine management system and the rest is history. The Subaru WRX engine is best thought of as 2/3 of a Porsche 956/962 engine._

The point of fact is every element of the Subaru Legacy/Impreza design (the Legacy and the Impreza are mechanically 90% identical btw) has been reviewed with a view to first function, second simplicity, third effectiveness of purpose. Within this simple ring the mechanical design has evolved into a physical shape. What is remarkable is that everything that can be simple is simple. Only those elements of design that achieve greater effectiveness through added complexity are the transmission and the engine. The differential - the same Hitachi R160 design as was found on the Datsun 510! The Subaru Legacy/Impreza were designed from the start to win the World Rally Championship away from Audi and then Toyota.

As any mechanic will tell you, there is not a bad wrench position on the entire car. It has to rate as one of the all time easiest modern cars to work on. Nothing on or about the car is an accident. It is a totally engineered package. It may have only 56/44 weight distribution, but the engineers figured that they could get away with it. It may only have McPherson strut front and modified Chapman strut rear suspension, but it is a rally car that needs the inherent strength and long wheel travel this design presents. Eight inches of rear suspension travel? You have to be kidding. GM only gave the Camero four inches of rear wheel travel! Kind of frumpy looking overhangs? No, not really, just a 99 inch wheel base that turns on a dime. They shoved the wheels as close together as they could and still have a fair back seat! It is pure sports car. "

I REALLY CAN'T SEE HOW SOMEONE CAN SAY WITH A STRAIGHT FACE THAT THE RX-8 HAS MORE POTENTIAL THAN THE sti. DO YOU THINK IT IS MAXED OUT FROM THE PRODUCTION LINE?

Exactly my plan.

I think the RX8 is fine for a corporate exec. I work in a very upscale environment with many folks making a lot more than me and I think I have the best daily driver there. The people with porsches don't daily drive them.

Look what you've started!!! :p

Interesting reading on this thread. I have to agree with ike here. The sti should be in no way compared to the origin impreza. People tend to look at the appearance and just decide to mock it for not being an original body design like rx8. The fact is that everything around the car is nothing like a regular impreza. If you want to mock the looks of the sti, that's fine. If you don't like feeling every bump on road like a true performance sports car performs that's fine too. Those are subjective views, but purely opinion based on one's particular needs. Someone can come along and do the same thing to the rx8 in the reverse order. I thought I would enjoy the high revving rx8 more then my previous ownership of high torque power. Having to drive the rx8 at high rpm speeds to get it to go anywhere at the moment just doesn't fall into my needs for a sports car. I admit I am so caputred by the appearance of rx8, I do realize that making a trade in like this, I am ultimately sacrificing looks and refinement for power and performance, therefore I need time to think this through.

I do realize that this may be totally out of my hands, because I can almost here the dealership talking to me right now. I predict something along the lines of " WELL THE RX8 DOES NOT HAVE A HIGH DEMAND, AND WE CAN"T GIVE YOU NEAR TRADE IN VALUE BECAUSE WE SIMPLY COULD NOT SELL CAR. " The fact is that the car is selling brand new for same as the private party value KBB suggests. This is where these super below invoice deals can kill you. If placed at a dealership, it would probably only sell for 28k, which is what it's trade in value is. I ultimately think when the subaru dealer gets back to me, they will offer thousands less then trade in value, and that alone will kill any hopes of a trade in. Currently they said they need to look further into it before they can give me any numbers. This probably means they don't want the rx8, but want to make a sale, so they are stalling because they know I am a long shot buyer. Even though the msrp of my rx8 when new is considerably more then a brand new sti, it may do me little good. The car only has 3100 miles on it, has every single option plus nearly $1k worth of dealer installs it will not mean anything. I am sure the market value has dropped considersably, and the dealer will want my car plus about 6-7k, if not more. I wanted to try it anyway, but likely I am stuck with rx8 (not a bad car to be stuck with). We'll see what the dealer has to say. This appears to be a buy it and marry it car, like many cars are. I had hoped that the 3500 I got off msrp would help me in trading it in, but it appears the price I paid from a trade in standpoint, is actually the msrp of the car. It's out of my hands, so if the price is right, I'll be at dealership this weekend to test drive. Very unlikely, but I'll wait and see what they decide. Thanks for reading!!

No way would I say the RX8 has more potential. I would say maybe the RX7 might have a case, but not the RX8.

I'll agree with you there, the FD has it's quirks but it certainly has a ton of potential if you want to deal with those quirks.

Do you ever think about how much time you devote (waste) to every STI or WRX thread on this board>? It used to upset me how aggressively you would attack these comments, and in the tone that you did it in, ultimately alienating new 8 owners on an 8 board from their lovely new investments. I now see it as cute and almost funny when I picture you scouring through old articles to get your quotes and typing away feverishly just to make a point on a board you just happen to frequent, for a car (the 8) you would never own in the first place. I as well test drove an STI before I made my purchase, I however could not get over the pure ugliness of the car. If your stuck on a desert island with a super ugly girl, THAT is a situation where you would have to "let her grow on you" for me a car is not. especially a daily driver. Thus, we all have our own opinions, and if you owned an 8 I am sure yours would differ. :) maybe you could try a different method next time and pride yourself in the knowledge that others are ignorant- don't hang their underwear from the flagpole!!! now back to the festivities!!!! <ewoks bang your drums!!!>

How do you people know whether the RX-8 has any tuning potential or not? Am I subject to blind faith? Of course not. This car hasn't even been out for a year, and yet people are now complaining about the limited tuning options available. I can't believe the impatience. If you want instant gratification, by all means get an STi, EVO VIII, or even an FD3S. Cars like that have already established themselves as tuner cars. The RX-8's tuning potential hasn't even been tapped yet, and its already getting bashed. Engines such as the EJ20 (I know it's not the USDM-spec STi engine), the 4G63, 13B-REW all have its vast share of aftermarket goodies, mostly because it comes turbocharged. Strap on an intake and an exhaust, and you will soon see serious results on the dyno. Small displacement N/A engines will always have a hard time making insane amounts of power. The main issue is displacement. Also, I believe converting N/A motors to FI is not easy. Why do people assume a turbo kit will be churned out within months of a car's release? Ever heard of R&D? If you can design a turbo kit, nitrous setup, etc. in two weeks, give HKS a call. They would love to hire you ;).

Of course the car has tuning potential. Any one can make a car fast. However, if you add up the time, money, and reliability to taking a regular rx8 and modifying it, it's just not the car you buy for pure performance no matter what it's tuning potential is. 300hp worth of potential on the stock engine safely? I don't see it. It can be done, but not without huge consuqences and shortened engine life. The STI is instant potential, with a beefed up forged piston boxer engine that is meant to handle mods and lots of POWER. The renesis engine I do not believe can handle 300hp and last a long time. I may be wrong, but I just cannot see you easily being able to make this a 300hp beast, yet still be a daily driver that will last a very long time. Ultimately Mazda needs to be the one to create this.l Putting your own kit on this is not a good idea for a daily driver that you plan on putting a lot of miles on, and driving for a long time. If it's meant for pure track, then by all means, knock yourself out.

Wow, that was bold of you Kain, yet so so very true. :) I do not know if I will be able to get over the ugliness of the sti. it doesn't look that great to me in pictures, but I'm heading to dealer to look and possible and test drive, and we'll see how I feel. They never let me test drive it in February because the dealership only had one. This time they only have 2, so we'll see. Maybe I could have persuaded them by acting like I was definitely gonna buy one, but I didn't.
Of course the second I showed up at mazda dealership, the guy was already getting the rx8 out of the lot. :)

Who says you cannot have a reliable turbo kit?

I know its juts a matter of preference...but if you finally go for the STi, make sure you don't get the rear wing. I don't really know how old you are, but I could live without it. And I think I could probably be happy...obviously, sitting alongside my 8.

He is talking about turboing an N/A car.

Which IMO (and most other people SHOULD agree) has more risk/time/effort associated with it than modding an already turbo car. (of course this is a different given point on any engine).
Sock turbo>aftermarket turbo (not in all cases)


Well i agree that it wont be done easily (at least not in the near future).
But i think it can be done. As far as reliability we will have to wait and see.
I personally want to see how long the STOCK motors are going to last.

Oh and DJ i was in a situation similar to yours.

I owned a brand new cadillac Catera. Never gave me any problems had every option...then i decided i wanted something sporty. So I had to take a nice big hit on the catera (shouldnt be as bad with an RX8) after only 8 months and about 7000 miles.

The car I get consequently ended up being a POS. And i got another car shortly after.
And TWO new car purchases after that one. Then I vowed nover to buy new again unless...
a) I can pay with cash (no finance)
b) Its a new RX7 (then i'll suffer the 7%)

I fully intended to ignore this post since it's just the same crap that's been gone over before. However I was PMed and asked to post some thoughts, so I did so.


P.S. It took me 5 seconds to find that quote because it was in the last thread about the STi...

Well said Lawrence. My concern is not with the inability to make the rx8 a true performance car. It's what you said "risk/time/effort" being the key factor/ along with the big bucks that will come along with it. For a daily driver every day car a custom modded 04 rx8 is not the best idea. The risk is too great. As of now, there is no risk because it's not really possible. Reliability by adding a turbo to rx8 is hit or miss, but you can't agrue that the risk is not greater then buying a brand new sti. Plus, there goes your warranty. Ultimately I am looking at the sti being a good car for three years, and if and when mazda makes a car with similiar power, I will then trade it back and get what I really want. No one really knows how the renesis motor would handle having 300hp, but odds are it won't be as good as a forged piston beefed up boxer engine like the sti has. There are only three things I see as making this a bad idea. #1 is the financial hit I would take. #2, losing amenities. I can deal with no leather. I really don't use the navigation, but could always go aftermarket if I end up missing it. The bose system in rx8 is decent, but not enough to factor in. Then you have other things like the hid lights, heated seats and power driver's seat, the homelink system. I would miss the sunroof, but I'd get over it fast. Whatever I missed feature wise doesn't factor in. #3 is the looks. I admit I am downgrading with an sti, and that is holding me back. There are some plus sides of course to getting th sti. The pure power and performance, and the awd, which by putting a set of all season radials on would make the car drivable in winter. I'm not sure how the car as it sells would be in snow, but it would def be better then the rx8. I'm currently playing email tag with dealer, cutting through all the BS so they will finally give me a number. I want to make my decision by end of week, so hopefully they will get back to me. I am impressed with this dealership, because even in this long shot sale, they are still taking the time to meet my request, and come up with their best possible deal they can give me. I can't ask for any better. I can't even make a decision until I have my total loss, so for now this is still just an inquiry. Needless to say if I did by some chance end up with the sti, it will be utterly bittersweet. There's a part of me that hopes the dealer will give me an out of reach quote, so I can just accept the rx8 and it's flaws, and wait patiently for a better rx8.

As for IKE. I asked him to post on this thread, because in beginning there was nothing but bashing going on about the sti, which is not fair. He may be opinionated and naturally bias when it somes to the wrx and sti, and can be overcritical about rx8 to obvious sensitive and defensive owners, but he doesn't rip the rx8, and he understands and respects the car for all it's attributes even though he'd probably never buy one. This site needs people like him to neutralize the bias owners, and offer information, so people who come here thinking about rx8 can here more then just GET IT MAN GET IT. :) He's not any more bias about the wrx then most people here are about the rx8, so keep that in mind. I guess the fact that he does it on an rx8 forum is what gets to people. It shouldn't because there are just as many non owning rx8 people on here as there are owners. I am middle road, and I see the flaws in cars I own as well as cars I don't own. I wouldn't encourage/discourage anyone from buying an sti instead of an rx8, or the reverse for that matter. Thanks for posting IKE. You may piss off some rx8 owners here with your tell it like it is attitude, but in my book you give people ability to look at both sides of stories. :)

As is the STi will be scary in the snow, the tires that come with it are close to being an R compound. So certainly plan on getting some either snow tires or all seasons should you decide to go with the STi. I went through one winter with ultra high performance all seasons and I wouldn't suggest it I couldn't believe how safe it felt regardless. I procrastinated and then drove them through the first early snow and just decided to go with it unless it started to feel unsafe and it never did. However, getting some good snow tires makes the car a blast to drive in the winter, if it snowed it was time to go find a parking lot or some back roads to go out and play on. Lakes can be pretty fun as well depending on how well the lake freezes and how insane you are ;)

Honestly I'm pretty unbiased when it comes to the STi and WRX, I love my car but I know it's shortcomings as well as the STi's. Though if the EVO didn't exist I wouldn't have much bad to say about the STi, with the EVO considered it falls short in a few areas. Mainly the STi's steering isn't as good as the EVO, the EVO is about as good as it gets for a non supercar on the track, it's so fast and responsive and has an amazing feel. However I can see how that would be a bit scary at times in day to day driving. The seats in the EVO get the nod over the STi's as well, unless you're a bit of a widebody :p You want ultimate performance in the 30k range you buy the EVO. You want something really damn close to the EVO with more low end grunt and a bit faster stock for stock that's better for daily driving then the STi is your choice. Potential wise the EVO gets the nod as well, but that's more to do with how old the powerplant is and the amount of tuning knowledge. Give it some time and the USDM STi should be able to show more potential based on the extra displacement. But that's really only something to worry about if you have to have a car that you can make run 10s now (because 11s just won't do) rather than in a year or two.

ohh yeah, if u buy a STI, which is a nice car. make sure you know and research about the detonation problem at a sti forum. detonating makes your engine go bye bye :eek:, its a lot worse than flooding your rx8

Many of the people having problems are from Cali where 91 octane is the best they can get. The STi does NOT like lower octane fuels, but in Pa. that shouldn't be a problem.

its true, but ive also heard of it detonating on 93 octane. :( I too dont think its that big of a threat since chance of it happening isn't really that high... I just know there is such a problem. But i dont really know too much about it, so its best you read up on their forums and get a feel for your self. its your money :p

Besides, WRX and Evo are like the step child AWD performance cars in Japan, if you want the big boy, you gotta go with the Skyline GT-R. And the next GT-R is coming to US in 07 (will cost more than an a STI though). Trading in a relatively new car is a huge hit on the pocketbook!

I am not trading in rx8 for sti afterall. I thought it over, and I can't lose that kind of money just to have a better performance car. The numbers subaru gave me were pretty good, but only on the 04 model they have leftover. The 05 was just too big of a hit. So, now comes plan B. I have a 95 golf I use as my work car. It's old and only worth like $1k on trade in. I'm laying an offer on table for the 04 sti they have. $3k down, plus the golf trade in instead of rx8, and I am gonna finance. The rx8 is paid off so no worries there. I may bail becuase I'm not sure if I want a 5 year loan or not, but I'm gonna see what the dealer can come up with interest rate wise. I figured this will solve my problem all together because I love both the sti and rx8 so much. I'm gonna go to dealer tomorrow and negotiate. I may or may not walk out with sti, but I'm gonna see what they can do. They'll need to give me a low interest rate, and $500 a month is absolute most I will pay monthly. It's still a long shot, but man, slapping a set of all season radials on sti and having and for winter, and rx8 for summer. CAN IT GET ANY BETTER THEN THAT?

Having both is better than having to choose. :-D Get an EVO and a 350Z while you're at it! :-D