Bob Lutz speaks (and I hope he's right)
 

I bet it will impress many........I wouldn't mind messing around with one....but get me to reach into my pocket to buy one....never in a million years.....

"I do believe the car made the point we intended for it to make: the product development process at GM is back on track. We understand beauty, excellence, the best-in-class imperative, and value for money, and the organization has the will and the capability to deliver. I felt huge pride in the GM team that created this exceptional car, and optimism knowing it is but an early signal to the public, and a warning to our competitors, of more to come, as GM finally musters its enormous global talent pool and focuses it on winning products."

I was talking more about this part. With the Kappa cars, GM has a chance to prove their ability to make a quality product at a low price point. Now if they can transfer that to the future model lineups, they'd be back in the game.

Practicality in the Solstice/Sky will limit it's customer base, but the Miata has proven that impractical roadsters can sell. I just hope this is the future of GM.

The Chevy Cobalt is a good compact commuter.

"it was declared an overwhelmingly competent and desirable car by all"
Overwhelmingly competent sounds like a backhanded compliment. It's almost like what one of my professors told me a few years ago about writing recommendations for grad school - you can't say anything outright bad about a person, but you can write things like "exceedingly adequate" that, while technically a compliment, tend to prevent people from being granted admission ;)

desirable car means what to you then?

Could mean that the reporters liked it but would never actually buy one. Just to continue to cynicism.

not if you interpret "overwhelmingly competent AND desirable car" as also qualifying desirable as overwhelming

yeah i'm grabbing for straws here, lol

bahh....yet another "revolutionary change" from GM in it's cycle of introducing an "all new" car in an effort to shake the image left from the previous "revolutionary" garbage. It's junk and will always be junk. I will never ever own a domestic label vehicle.....I can find more quality, refinement, attention to detail, and value in a 5 year old toyota than in the "all new" Cobalt......

Yah, uh huh, okay, thanks. :rolleyes:

Also on this anti-american car thing...there is a reason why they are losing market share, resorting to selling them at huge discounts, and just plain falling behind......You got young companies like Hyundai having better customer loyalty....wow.....

Dead wrong.

GM, as a company as a whole, and Ford as a particular nameplate, have the highest customer loyalty in the industry. GM has won the past 5 years, and Ford has won the past 10 years since loyalty was tracked. Out of the 14 categories of vehicles tracked by Polk for loyalty only 4 categories are held by a car not build by one of the Big Three.

I've never seen/heard of it before but the pics on the website look really nice.

http://www.pontiac.com/solstice/gallery.jsp

I wouldn't trade my 8 for one, but it does look really nice. I'm glad to see something like this coming out from GM -- maybe they're not a complete write-off.

Tyler8
2005 6MT Shinka

You are correct. ;) ..it is their huge truck customer base.....

That will end as soon as Toyota and Nissan introduce 3/4 ton work trucks and expand production......but the GM/Ford/Daimler/Chrysler lobbyist in Washington won't let that happen.....

While trucks certainly play a large part in it, it's not all of it.

American manufacturers also lead in Loyalty in the following segments:

Small Car
Large Car
Luxury Car
Sports Car
Minivan
Compact Pickup
Full-Size Pickup
Mid-Size Sport Ute
Full-Size Sport Ute

Japanese automakers only lead in MidSize Car (the Camry, and certainly an important category to win in), Prestige Luxury Car (LS 430) and Compact Sport Ute (Subaru Forester, which is a GM actually).


Actually the reason why American manufactuers dominate in Loyalty, at least my opinion anyhow, is that while many customers are loyal to Japanese manufacturers, they don't care if it's Toyota, Honda, or Nissan. Same goes for many loyal to German cars. However those loyal to Domestics usually adamantly support a particular make and even a model of car. So you get an effect of a lot of buyers buying Ford and only Ford and would no way buy a GM or DCX, but someone buying Toyota is probably just as likely to look at Honda for their next purpose being Japanese loyal but not necessarily brand loyal.

That's my take on it anyhow.

well...in my case for all my practical car needs I will always have a Toyota...I make some exceptions for sporty cars....I'll take an S2000, rotary Mazda, not much else...so I say I am a loyal Toyota customer.

Why never in a million years? I would not buy it because it's a 2 seater but why did you say that?

The last two comments just show an opinion (strongly bias) that honestly, no offense, is not a opinion I would rank as useful. It’s obvious you have a lot of disdain for GM but I just don’ get how you can judge this car as junk without driving it?

Again...say what you will, (not really attacking you for your opinion), but it's just a rash statement to make about a car you know nothing about.

I hope GM got it right and I personally like Bob Lutz (the guy who brought us the Viper).

Personally, there is no car Toyota makes that can even lift one hair on my head. They are so blah blah that while I know they are great cars I fear dying by sleeping at the wheel of such a boring products they sell.

Honda has the S2000 and while a conservative company I think they understand better than Toyota the fun to drive aspect of cars.

It's all about taste and perception but I hope everyone does not blindly follow any car company. It’s your money…spend it wisely, but at least give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

You are using an intelligent argument to influence a closed-minded person's outlook. The problem is that a closed-minded person can't be influenced because they are closed-minded.

Ah...yes, the "close-minded" problem...lol

I don't want him to think I'm attacking him but I think he is being unfair in regards to his statements about the Pontiac. I think it looks real nice (THANK GOD it's RWD) and it's priced nicely.

I still hope they bring back the Firebird and Camaro and while I'm mad at GM for killing those cars I'm also happy they brought out the GTO (while not happy with it's weight).

It would be sad if one day the nation who basically created the car no longer had a "car company"...so I always hope the best for FORD & GM...Dodge too but they are German-American now.

and Compact Sport Ute (Subaru Forester, which is a GM actually).


Actually the reason why American manufactuers dominate in Loyalty, at least my opinion anyhow, is that while many customers are loyal to Japanese manufacturers, they don't care if it's Toyota, Honda, or Nissan. Same goes for many loyal to German cars. However those loyal to Domestics usually adamantly support a particular make and even a model of car. So you get an effect of a lot of buyers buying Ford and only Ford and would no way buy a GM or DCX, but someone buying Toyota is probably just as likely to look at Honda for their next purpose being Japanese loyal but not necessarily brand loyal.

That's my take on it anyhow.[/QUOTE]


I know it's just nit-picking, but the Forester is in no way a GM vehicle. GM owns a large stake in Subaru, but Subaru is treated as an autonomous entity. They don't use one single piece from the GM parts bin, and GM holds no say over what vehicles Subaru builds short of having a right to certain "joint-ventures" as-in the recent Saab colaboration.

American companies dominate domestic sales on the backs of patriotism and having a small contingent of vehicles uniquely suited to our needs. Those are things that foriegn companies had a hard time understanding, since most other markets are driven almost exclusively by good vehicles.

On the subject of the Solstice. I truly hope it's as good as it's been hyped. But I reserve judgement. I know America can build good cars, they just need to get back to the basics (something the Solstice could genuinely do... as long as GM doesn't foul it up like the last few attempts)

The grill on the Solstice is really really ugly...

This is just untrue. If you travel enough you will see that most other countries are much more inclined toward "patriotism" when it comes to durable goods versus being "driven almost exclusively by good vehicles." Korea is rife with Korean vehicles not because they are better for their market but because it is mandated or the population is very "patriotic" in their purchasing. The same is true for China and Japan. Japanese trucks are no better than others but good luck finding a foreign make on the roads. There are way better taxis than the unreliable and expensive to keep running Mercedes C class but good luck finding any of those in Germany. Try exporting an American made towel to Japan. There are so many hoops they make you jump through to purposely dissuade you. I know this last one from personal experience.

In fact the more I think about it the more I am convinced that Americans are the least "patriotic" industrialized nation when measured by choosing home made products over foreign made products.