Footman's review of the Eibach Pro-kit + Bilstein B8 sprint shock combination
 

Having driven the car now for 1 week. I have subjected the car to most conditions:
- Driven in rain (wet driving conditions, low traction when wet)
- Driven at night when the air is cold (low traction when dry, because summer tires are hard like pucks)
- Driven downtown Toronto (test of ability to absorb severe broken roads, i.e. Yonge st/Bloor area)
- Driven on highway (test of stability and feel at high speeds and cruising)
- Driven on/off highway exit ramps (test of cornering ability at high speeds)
- Driven in daily stop and go traffic (reaction of vehicle on acceleration/stopping and emergency maneovers i.e. dodging Corollas)
- Driven over speed bumps and entering malls/plazas where the curb is slightly raised (yes! there is a difference!)
- Aesthetics (wheel gaps)

There is however one area where I have not subjected the car to yet, and that is at the track where I will anticipate is where the car would really shine. I assure you I'm not afraid of the track, it's about the money at the moment.

Note that the car is running on OEM Dunlop SP Sport 8090m 225/45/18 on stock rims. The tires have about 4/32" tread left. The rubber is approximately 3.5 years old. This will be a factor in the amount of grip/response experienced.

When I was running stock setup, I was doing extensive research on lowering springs/shock combo. There were many opinions expressed on the forum. A lot of people said just installing the lowering springs and reusing the stock shock is fine. The general consensus was that this was okay. The shocks will wear out faster because of a mis-matched spring rate to the shock. The more hardcore enthusiasts recommended always changing the shock at the same time as the spring otherwise the ride will suffer.

That last statement was the one that always bothered me. In stock form, the car's handling was precise and accurate. It will let you know exactly when the car will break loose; and when it does break loose, it's very gradual. This gradualness allows you to steer the car back into control, and gives you time to adjust the throttle to correct the car's direction. It was very easy. It didn't break away violently out of control.

In the end, I figured since the car was relatively new I'd try it with just the spring lowering and reusing the stock shock. Once installed, the car had the right look, it was dropped. But the handling on it was a bit off. It was lower. The turn in was sharper and stiffer. But something was just a little bit off. At the limits, the car was twitchy. The point when the car broke loose in the rear was not as defined. When it does break loose, it was NOT gradual. It just slides a lot. Using steering inputs to correct the slide, the car wobbles from left to right a bit.

I can now see the merits of changing the shocks and the springs at the same time. For the real driving enthusiast, I highly recommend changing both the springs and the shocks at the same time. Now that I have the proper Bilstein B8 shocks to go with the Eibach Pro kit. The car handles like a dream. Before with just the Eibachs, it felt like a trade-off versus the stock suspension. Whilst you get improved cornering and grip with the Eibachs alone, you lost the confidence and control slightly at the limits.

With the Pro kit and the Bilstein B8's, you get both. It has completely improved the car's handling with ZERO negativity. All the issues I had before with pro kit and stock shocks are now addressed.

I know some of these factors have to do with the tires, and by doing this review running on relatively old/worn tires, I can only imagine what it'd be like when I put on some new rubber. It can only be better. A few weeks ago I posted a thread about the car sliding out easily on aggressive corners even just a simple one like a left turn at an intersection. That has been resolved now.

Going over potholes and bumps, before it would feel very crashy, now it's just a solid "thud" and the bump is absorbed. You can feel before that the tire contact patch bounced a lot with the ground. The wheels came off the ground a lot more. Now they are solid and planted. Left and right transitions (slaloming), the car exhibits less roll (using stock roll bars). Some minor bumps that I knew used to make the car crash, now I can't even feel it. The difference is worlds apart between the stock shock and the Bilstein B8.

I'm not saying the stock shock is crap. What I am saying is that the stock shock is matched for the stock springs and that the Eibach Pro kit is excellently matched with the Bilstein B8.


For speed bumps and curb entrances, the car rides over them with less bounce which is good. Sometimes, when you go over a curb entrance backing out of a driveway, you don't want the front of the car to bounce down and up once the wheels hit the lower surface. You want it to just come down, and then back up once.

All of these improvements can be summed up scientifically that the B8's are providing more damping force (stiffer shocks) than the stock shocks. The increased damping force is reducing body roll in corners. Take for example the left turn at the intersection. The outside wheel is not compressed down as much as before, thus giving the inner wheel more grip to accelerate the car in a corner.

Aesthetically, the B8's are a shortened shock. They are much like the Koni yellows that you may have read on the forum. Yes, they further drop the car by another 0.5 to 1". If you see me at tonight's meet at Woodbine/16th, you can see for yourself. The wheel gap is now even front and rear. There is no wheel gap. I have gained some extra negative camber at all 4 wheels after the install. This has provided a sharper turn in so far, at the cost of wearing the inside of my tires (that are soon to be replaced anyways) so I don't care.

These were shipped from UK. Bilstein had 0 stock on them, so they had to build new ones. Mine were stamped April 2010.
Cost was $580 British Pounds shipped. At time of purchase, exchange rate was approx 1.55. Comes to about $900.

A lot of people will say "man for that money, you could have just gotten Tein basics coilovers" Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and this is not about what's a better value or not.

Coilovers are far stiffer than comfortable for daily driving. There are a ton of adjustments and corner balancing that most are not familiar with. I personally don't want to fuck around with all those settings. Not to mention, how are the adjustable spring perches going to survive the SALTY winters of Toronto as a daily driven car.

For those that don't want to fuck around with so many settings and have a high quality product that you can use for daily driving and performance driving. These fit the bill quite nicely. You can't go wrong when the Nissan GTR uses Bilstein shocks as well.

Here is a summary of what you should do if you are in the market. Ask yourself what kind of driver you are.

If you are the average RX-8 driver, maybe redlines the car once a day/once a week only... shifts under 3k most of the time, or if you're an auto-driver, only want the lowered look with an 'okay' ride. Just swap your lowering springs and keep your stock shocks on.

If you drive like I do, and you care a lot about performance/handling, definitely invest in shocks/springs at the same time. In the case of this review,

I give 4 thumbs up (hands and big toes) for the Eibach Pro-kit and Bilstein B8 combo


***PICS added Dec 19, 2010*** long overdue, sorry but enjoy!
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Front wheel
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welp... that setup is what I've been wanting to go with for awhile now... but... that's too much text for me to read in one go. Glad you approve though :)

Interesting review. They are pricey, but Tein Basics is not an alternative. I looked at those, they are basically for aesthetics only, and being able to claim, hey, I got coil overs. You can't adjust dampness with them.

Seeing as how I already have the Tein H-Techs, I am probably leaning towards the Tokicos or the Konis, unfortunately the Konis are a pain to adjust the rears. Fronts are easy. Plus the Konis are smaller shocks, resulting in a further drop.

As they say, you get what you pay for.

Great review.

I wonder how different the Miata will handle once the stock shocks wear out. I was thinking of getting the Koni shocks. But I didn't know Bilstein had "nurburgring" edition shocks. I might find some for the Miata! :)

If you truly want an accurate performance review, you would need to take the car to a track and run all the combinations on the same day. Stock shocks with Eibachs, Bilsteins with stock springs etc. Your feel on the road is not an accurate measure there are too many variables like weather, temperature etc. For example if your trying it right after a big rain storm and the roads have dried, all the oil, coolant grease etc would have washed off the road and produced more grip. A hot day after a long period of no rain, the roads would be greasy and not produce near as much grip. For those of you who were at Mosport with me last mothers day, in the morning we were 10 seconds off our normal lap times because of a cold greasy track, nothing in the setup of the car had changed.

Sorry to poop on your test lol

Al, if you want to one up on that, I could also say that a proper performance review would also include a shit load of other numerical data, camber/toe/caster settings, time of the day, humidity level, track surface temperature, and a plethora of other info...

but of course, this write up isn't meant for that target of audience. I see your point though; thanks for shitting on the thread first and then apologizing after writing it.

Maybe I should just keep my mouth shut next time instead of spending time to contribute to the forum and taking the time to write something that could be useful and relate to the average driver. I'm writing this as a favor to the community. I don't get paid for my time doing this. I certainly don't get paid to take it to the track and log all the data including complete circuit lap times BEFORE AND AFTER the shock install. What kind of lateral G's and slalom speeds i am getting. :)

Footman I didnt mean to offend you at all. I have just seen that the "butt" dyno or "butt" gforce calculator can be very misleading. I am sure that the combination you have on your car feels amazing especially when compared to stock. The only point i was getting at was just because it feels better doesnt mean its any faster. When i increased my spring rates and raised my ride height in the race car it "felt" worse, but was 2 seconds a lap faster.

Now now you two.. stop fighting... just think of the child..

PLEASE DEAR GOD THINK OF CHILDERN!

Forget the children!

Thanks for the review. Its a nice write up with no objective data and subjective feelings, which is fine by me hehe :P (Ok that on ramp thing its objective...if you do the same ramp everyday)

I want to see how much lowered it is...since my front clip is lower than your stock front clip Footman.

I have a pending sale on the RB springs...maybe match with the HD Bilstein (cheaper I think) instead of B8 since RB don't lower much - and I don't want to look out for road condition due to lowered cars at old age anymore...

Thanks Footman for the great review, thumbs up x 2.......

Tein FLex coilover is a good choice for both daily driving and track.

Nice write up Footman! Exactly what we could expect from you! Two thumbs up! :bigok:

I am glad you were not testing new brakes ... hey! Was that you testing that volvo with the epic fail???

finally had the time to properly devote to reading your wall of text -- nice review!

makes me think about destockifying my car..................................... hmm....

Well done and thanks,

Pictures would be grand as well...

Thanks.

great review thanks footman.

I am actually interested in Progress Tech springs with Bilstein HD. What do you think of that combo?

No idea man... I have no experience with Bilstein HD's.. those are also known as "Bilstein B6".

Nice review.

I am interested in the shocks as a possible replacement for the Bilstein HD shocks that came stock with the R3, once those are worn out. I had a 05 GT before and I agree with you assessment of the stock shocks. Also since you are paying allot of money for changing the springs there is no point in leaving the stock shocks in there.

I am personally a bit disappointed in the R3's suspension as I often find it too hard for the street of Windsor (the only change I have done - is Racing Beat sway bars). On the track, which is the only area I really care about, the suspension feels 'overwhelmed' by my R compound - 225/45/17 Hoosier Koni Spec.

Would be great if in the future you did a track review. I can even lend you the tires to see how the suspension works with them.

Since you have put allot of thought into the decision, maybe you can help me out with a few questions:

1) Is the B10 a more track oriented shock that the B8?
2) Why did you go with the B8 & Eibach as opposed to B12 BTK Kit?

Chris,

The B10 is not available for the RX8.. it's a twin-tube shock.

The B12 BTK, I didn't consider because I had already purchased the eibach pro-kit. The B12 set is 4 x B8 shocks + springs that were set match together... I somehow have a funny feeling that the "springs" included in that set are the same as the Eibach pro-kit.

On the website, they mention that the B12 set springs are "progressive design". Another hint is that the lowered height is 30mm, which translates to 1.18"..... coincidentally close to the Pro-kit's advertised 1.2" (just rounded up), because no one can tell the difference between 0.02"!!!

For someone that has fully stock setup, it would be wise to consider the B12 BTK kit against the Eibach Pro Kit + B8 combo. If someone has time, perhaps they can call up Bilstein in europe and ask if the spring is produced by Eibach in the B12 kit.

^ Thanks, enjoy your new set up.

So, did you ever do shocks? Care to share pictures, or share where you shared pictures, with the H-Techs? I have almost convinced myself that H is the way to go, but I want to know of much more drop a shock like the D-Spec drops the car.

Thanks for any help possible.

I have no idea all Bilstein shocks on the 40th/R3 rx8 are Bilstein HDs...

Maybe I can just order one from parts to get my Bilstein HD then...but I thought their design are different and won't match!

Kids Kids Kids..................how many times have I told you that street and track require 180 degrees of difference and if you try and combine them the result will be worse on both ends! lol All your shock is doing is controlling compression and rebound of your suspension, one will give you great ride and comfort the other handling and performance. If you try and combine that you usually get exactly what Chris Bangle said........too stiff on the street and too soft for the track! Chris part of the reason your car feels "overwelmed" is that you have increased the roll stiffness with the bigger sway bars and have not compensated with properly valved shocks and higher rate springs that are matched to your sway bars. If you spend the time and money to build the perfect "package" of springs, shocks and bars......................the car will ride worse than crap on the street on street tires, but will be wicked fast on the track.

Al, I know what you said, but we are trying to move the balance a bit towards track friendly. So I think Footman and most people here can tolerate a little bit more "crap" on street...

For Footman goal "For those that don't want to fuck around with so many settings and have a high quality product that you can use for daily driving and performance driving. "

Footman's subjective review states that he thnk this works for him...thats it.

Now...maybe the truth is that it doesn't matter...just add the springs make it look better and change the shcoks when its done since the moment you chage the stock setup you are fcked in terms of perfect balance...(I remembered you said that the spring itself is good enough but will sure fck up the shocks faster which is the case right now for Footman)

Oh well, we still gonna try eh? :P

I don't think the R3's are the same as Bilstein HDs, though I have no factual proof. Just a feeling it's not.

The Bilstein B8 + Eibach prokit works, and works very well to my subjective appreciation.

The car is extremely stable at high speeds when hitting small bumps/riding cracks in the road. Because my current summer tires are on its last legs, every corner that I take aggressively now results in my tail end coming out and DSC engaging, it's very easy to regain control in this car. Right now I'm sure its the tires that are holding me back on corners.