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I wouldn't by the Camaro for the simple reason that I sat in one and it had piss poor visibility out the front, next to nothing out the sides, and good luck looking out the rear... it feels like your sitting in a WWII pillbox
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IMO the only Mustang worth buying is a 2003-2004 SVT Cobra, AKA the Terminators. Ford makes good engines but they're usually thrown to waste into a horrible chasis. The S197 chasis was a big upgrade but the engine is not that impressive. Its capable of creating a lot of power, but what isn't? The Mustang has become bland. The 2010 is a nice upgrade but to me the Mustang has become something of a domestic Civic. At the first sign of defeat the fanboys start bringing up lightweight body, more advanced engine, and the potential to make X amount of horsepower. Not to say every Mustang owner is like that but seriously. When the Inside Line and Motortrend videos went up the Mustang fanboys were in such denial. It was just sad.
BTW .1 of a second at 100 mph in a drag race is about 1 car. Since both the Mustang and Camaro are both going over 100 mph by the end of the quarter, the Camaro is ahead of the Mustang by ~6.5 car lengths. That's not "kinda close", thats not "a driver's race". Thats just a good old fashioned ass kicking. Half a second may not sound like much but keep in mind there's only about 3 seconds seperating a Honda Civic Si and a Corvette C6 Z06.
And I don't hear anyone complaining about how the Mustang got to use the OPTIONAL track package against the Camaro. Better brakes, tires, suspension tweaks, and more aggressive gearing and the Mustang still got trounced against the all standard SS. Imagine what a normal GT would have done. Or lack-there-of I should say. Why on Earth would you compare a GT500 that costs almost $15,000 more than the Camaro? When/if a Z28 model is build and put into that price range, compare all you want. The V6 Camaro outperforms the Challenger and Mustang, and the standard V8 Camaro outperforms the Challenger RT and Mustang GT even with optional performance extras. If you read the write up, price was included in the reason they chose to test the Challenger RT and Mustang GT against the Camaro SS. All the cars price-as-tested were within $1,000 of each other. The Camaro won fair and square. I'm actually glad the Mustang and Challenger got the optional performance features. Otherwise you'd see "Nuh uhhh the Mustang GT with the track package could do 0-60 in 3 seconds flat and a quarter mile of 6.5 seconds!" all over the page.
__________________ I just RX8 my girlfriend
2005 RX8: AEM cold air intake, Veilside Evolution shift knob STOP!!! Pending next project
Why don't you guys compare the v6 version of the Camaro and the V8 version of the previous Mustang GT? They both make nearly the same power.
But not nearly the same price. And the Mustang GT has gobs more torque and is actually built towards performance. While the Camaro has similar power it was intended for mpg and marketing.
__________________ I just RX8 my girlfriend
2005 RX8: AEM cold air intake, Veilside Evolution shift knob STOP!!! Pending next project
they should compare the V6 Camaro with the GT Mustang while the Mustang has more torque the camaro(also comes 6speed) would be lighter would make for a good comparison im sure once its out one of those new car mags will do a test
"The ultimate Mazda in our minds is rotary powered; as a company, we have no intention of abandoning that valuable asset." -- Franz von Holzhausen (Mazda Chief Designer)
That would be a weakpoint in the Camaro. Yeah the IRS CAN lead to better handling, but its not always the case. Ford has done a great job of tuning the live-axle and its performance handling is competitive. The ride quality is sacrificed however, and thats where the IRS comes in and can give the the best of both worlds. Hopefully GM built the IRS in the Camaro strong. I heard it was designed after the C6. But again, the IRS could be a disadvantage at the drag strip, especially when mods come into play. Still have yet to see a new Camaro around here
__________________ I just RX8 my girlfriend
2005 RX8: AEM cold air intake, Veilside Evolution shift knob STOP!!! Pending next project
That would be a weakpoint in the Camaro. Yeah the IRS CAN lead to better handling, but its not always the case. Ford has done a great job of tuning the live-axle and its performance handling is competitive. The ride quality is sacrificed however, and thats where the IRS comes in and can give the the best of both worlds. Hopefully GM built the IRS in the Camaro strong. I heard it was designed after the C6. But again, the IRS could be a disadvantage at the drag strip, especially when mods come into play. Still have yet to see a new Camaro around here
Ah. No. Again, Holden has been able to prove they can design and build a car with a strong IRS that can perform at the drag strip. I can tell you that a GTO made a couple of 9 second passes with a completely stock driveshaft and rear end on slicks. Sure, it blew up, but it's still impressive. There are plenty more in the 10's and 11's that haven't broken.
A G8 GT with a stock 6 speed automatic, no stall, stock driveshaft, stock axles and rear end ran a 11.0 at 130mph on slicks. All it had was twin turbos and a tune, running race gas, no meth. He turns down the boost and uses it as his daily driver. In any case, the stock drivetrain held up and is holding up with no problems whatsover. That's awesome, and the G8 obviously has far, far more in common than a leaf spring rear transaxle C6.
IRS Zeta plaform FTW.
__________________ 2005 Pontiac GTO Torrid Red / Red / M6 / 18" (1 of 71)
Nitrous Outlet 100 shot halo dry kit, xpipe, muff delete, K&N
441 whp / 434 lb-ft
GBNF: 2004 RX-8 GT 6MT Brilliant Black / Red
Ah. No. Again, Holden has been able to prove they can design and build a car with a strong IRS that can perform at the drag strip. I can tell you that a GTO made a couple of 9 second passes with a completely stock driveshaft and rear end on slicks. Sure, it blew up, but it's still impressive. There are plenty more in the 10's and 11's that haven't broken.
A G8 GT with a stock 6 speed automatic, no stall, stock driveshaft, stock axles and rear end ran a 11.0 at 130mph on slicks. All it had was twin turbos and a tune, running race gas, no meth. He turns down the boost and uses it as his daily driver. In any case, the stock drivetrain held up and is holding up with no problems whatsover. That's awesome, and the G8 obviously has far, far more in common than a leaf spring rear transaxle C6.
IRS Zeta plaform FTW.
That m-m-m-makes me happay.
I wouldn't know what to do with a car like a Camaro. I can say right now that I woudln't build it to have more than 500 bhp, but then again I haven't driven it yet so lol CANNOT wait for it to come out. GM already has the car in their commercials so it shouldn't be long now! But GM has around 10,000 Camaro's to build and deliver first to all the pre-order people
My uncle is HOOKED on horsepower. He has a C5 Z06 with a bigger cam, headers, lightweight flywheel, racing clutch, other small bolt ons and such and he had just installed new heads. Him and my dad were going on the annual Corvette run in Texas but my uncle's vette jumped its timing chain and bent a valve or two. So instead of rebuilding and reusing what he can he's considering parting out the engine and getting a 427 long block after he JUST bought the new heads. Me and my dad don't understand why, but his car is wicked fast (2nd fastest in the club they're in, and there are plenty twin turbo and supercharged vettes in the club too) and he's always looking for a way to make it faster. He says he'll have his mind made up this month. Long live the Chevy small-block V8!
__________________ I just RX8 my girlfriend
2005 RX8: AEM cold air intake, Veilside Evolution shift knob STOP!!! Pending next project
I like the idea of the of the Z/28, but I'm not worried about it coming out. The success of the Camaro line is not dependent upon the Z/28 alone.
There will be plenty of modded LS3 based SS's that will easily make far more than 556 bhp. You don't need the LSA to make big numbers.
Ford has shown that if a "big dawg" version like the GT500 comes out a year or two after a successful initial launch, you can still cash in. Maybe the economy will change and the Z/28 will launch a little later.
__________________ 2005 Pontiac GTO Torrid Red / Red / M6 / 18" (1 of 71)
Nitrous Outlet 100 shot halo dry kit, xpipe, muff delete, K&N
441 whp / 434 lb-ft
GBNF: 2004 RX-8 GT 6MT Brilliant Black / Red
GM will probably wait and see how well the Camaro sells before going all in with a Z28 model. It does look sexy though. The wait is driving me insane. The possible mods are endless. I would slam it first. A solid 2'' drop. Should widen the handling performance gap between the Mustang and make the Camaro look a little smaller.
__________________ I just RX8 my girlfriend
2005 RX8: AEM cold air intake, Veilside Evolution shift knob STOP!!! Pending next project
mmmhmm Z28! Didn't the '03 versions only put down like 300whp? That's sad...
The odd thing was, the Z28 was not top tier in the 4th gen. The SS was top dog. The SS/WS6 were also more expensive.
I don't understand why GM wants to change that especially considering their push to improve the SS "brand." I figured they'd bring out the Z28 at launch and the SS would be the super car.
__________________ 2004 Velocity Red AT TR Pkg, Spoiler
The odd thing was, the Z28 was not top tier in the 4th gen. The SS was top dog. The SS/WS6 were also more expensive.
I don't understand why GM wants to change that especially considering their push to improve the SS "brand." I figured they'd bring out the Z28 at launch and the SS would be the super car.
It's actually brilliant... obviously, the new Camaro has the retro styling of the sixties. If you look back to the first gen Camaro as a reference, you would realize the SS was the entry model Camaro with a V8. The Z/28 option was the highest performance model and the one with the lowest production numbers...
GM is using this as a sort of a "retro branding" to differentiate it from the 4th gen Camaro. I think it's smart.
For instance, here are the production numbers for the 1969 Camaro
RS: 37,773
SS: 34,932
Z28: 20,302
__________________ 2005 Pontiac GTO Torrid Red / Red / M6 / 18" (1 of 71)
Nitrous Outlet 100 shot halo dry kit, xpipe, muff delete, K&N
441 whp / 434 lb-ft
GBNF: 2004 RX-8 GT 6MT Brilliant Black / Red
Yeah the new Camaro would make for a nice daily driver. For the price, it's hard to beat the performance numbers. Though I sure wouldn't get the V6 - no point in having a "muscle car" that isn't a V8. The sound just isn't there.
It's actually brilliant... obviously, the new Camaro has the retro styling of the sixties. If you look back to the first gen Camaro as a reference, you would realize the SS was the entry model Camaro with a V8. The Z/28 option was the highest performance model and the one with the lowest production numbers...
GM is using this as a sort of a "retro branding" to differentiate it from the 4th gen Camaro. I think it's smart.
For instance, here are the production numbers for the 1969 Camaro
RS: 37,773
SS: 34,932
Z28: 20,302
Valid point. I didn't' realize the history behind it. Chevy should pick one product hierarchy for the Camaro and stick with it.
__________________ 2004 Velocity Red AT TR Pkg, Spoiler
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