IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

30k is coming up in about 1k miles! No idea when I'll hit that, but I wanted to plan and I'd love some feedback.

Here's what I'm definitely planning to do:

- Engine air filter
- Transmission fluid
- Differential fluid
- Brake fluid
- Spark plugs
- Ignition coils
- Ignition wires

Engine oil and oil filter change won't be necessary (did those recently enough).

I'm also considering changing coolant, thermostat, and water pump. Leaning against it, but open to arguments either way.

Brake pads are not dead, but they're low enough that I'll probably change them while the system needs bleeding.

I plan to go OE on everything except the transmission fluid (Motorcraft XT-M5-QS) and diff fluid (Motorcraft XY-75W90-QLS). The car is still under warranty so I want to be as far within the lines as possible, especially as I am DIYing.

For parts sources, I'm thinking Mazmart for the ignition stuff, and onlinemazdaparts.com for the rest.

Have I left anything out? Is any of this overkill? Are there other parts sources I should look at?

TIA!

poacherinthezoo

Pretty much covered all the bases there. Coolant change wouldn't be a bad idea.

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

Thanks, poacherinthezoo.

The main reason I hesitate to do the coolant thing is that it'd be at 1/3 the time interval and 1/4 the mileage interval that Mazda specs for FL-22, even with Schedule 2. Changing coolant involves the possibility of air bubbles in the system, so I'm tempted not to try to fix it if it ain't broke.

Similar reasoning with the water pump and thermostat: they are not part of Mazda's regular maintenance schedule ever (as far as I can tell), and I was always taught not to touch a sealing surface unless you absolutely have to.

I'll probably do the cooling system stuff just after the rotary core warranty expires, unless a problem comes up before then.

As for the diff fluid, I've decided on Motorcraft 75w-90: https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubrican...nsaxle%20Fluid

Lord09

My thoughts exactly on the coolant change. It's a long life coolant that's designed to last very very long.

I usually have some type of OBD2 reader hooked up, so I keep a very close eye on my coolant temps. So far, they've been within normal operating parameters.

I did everything you did on a 2010 GT with 28K miles, but used Redline fluids.

Car feels great.

lakersfan1

I've never bled the brakes of any car under 60K miles. It won't make anything better, and it's alot easier to get air into the brakes than into the cooling system.

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

A brake fluid change is required at this mileage, per Mazda.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

Yeah, 60k without a fluid change is ... ill advised. You may get away with it, but it is really not recommended at all.

gwilliams6

Hey if you haven't paid for those coils yet, I suggest you spring for the BHR coils and wires. Better spark, a slight hp and mpg bump and lifetime durability. I have it in mine and it WILL make a noticeable difference in performance (especially at high rpms). Truly you will be thanking yourself every time you drive if you switch to the BHR kit. I realize the Series 2s have the " c" coils which is an improvement, but even Series 2 owners love the difference with the BHR kit. BTW my Mazda dealer, the top Mazda dealer in our common Philly metro area, told me there is no warranty problem with upgrading to the BHR coils.

lakersfan1

I thought I was crazy, but checked the service schedule for a random car (Mazda3) and the RX8. The Mazda 3 service schedule just said to check the level, even at 60K miles. What possible reason could there be to completely flush every 30K miles specifically on the RX8, unless they used a fluid that is highly affected by water? Don't make no sense for a stock vehicle.

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

I’m skeptical of the BHR kit. Maybe I’m missing something, and maybe you can convince me.

I’ve seen the rave reviews and have no reason to doubt that people have had success with the BHR kit. At the same time, I haven’t seen any back-to-back comparisons between the BHR kit and brand new “C” coils. I haven’t even heard HOW exactly BHR’s kit is supposed to beat Mazda coils on a functional level, without incurring any side-effects. All I’ve heard are vague claims of “better” performance, and that doesn’t tell me much.

Long life sounds nice in and of itself. It just leaves me wondering what the catch is. Again, what is BHR doing differently from Mazda, and how can there not be any negative side-effects?

Given all that plus even the slightest possibility of warranty-related headaches, I’m strongly inclined to stick with OE. Open to evidence and arguments (preferably the former).

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

There are several opinions on the matter. GWilliams will give you one I'm sure.

The main difference that is the foundation of the product development and the proven difference is that they last a hell of a lot longer. How much longer? Well, no one is really sure, because to be frank, no one knows how much longer OEM C coils will last over Bs, As, or original OEM coils, and while there have been a few random BHR coil failures, it is still under 1% of all coils BHR has sold so it could easily be noted as defects, not worn out. I don't think a single kit has reach it's lifespan limit yet. For OEM coils, Cs are supposed to last longer, but there is still no evidence / proof that they consistently do. BHR coils though, have been proven to last well over 60,000 miles at least, if not 90,000 miles, and still have zero misfires, zero performance fall off. OEM original coils fall off by 20,000, C coils might be 40,000, but I doubt it.

In my mind, if you go OEM, go with the cheaper original coils and change them regularly. If you don't go with OEM, go with BHR, and never change them again. The C coils where you will change them semi-regularly at an unknown interval for nearly twice the price of original, and 2/3rds the price of BHR...well, I can't see much reason to do that. Except maybe because you want OEM coils on there for warranty reasons, and want the best of those that you can get.

There are other claims of better mileage and better power, but they are all still subjective, and not quantitative. Mainly because I don't think anyone has done any back to back comparisons with PERFECT OEM coils vs BHR coils. Everything is BHR vs whatever they had on before, that was failing. So of course there was a gain. New OEM coils would have had a gain too.

There are a few people that claim to have done that comparison, but they have yet to actually produce the quantitative results clearly. Even BHR refuses to claim or market power or mileage gains. They admit that those slight gains may exist, but proving those gains is difficult and shifts the focus from the intent of the kit, which is reliability.

gwilliams6

RIWWP you said it all for me. Mainly it is the reliability that members here can agree upon with the BHR, though many will also tell you they outperform new stock coils. And they were designed to have a higher voltage spark than oem coils. Since I have bought and run just about every brand of stock and aftermarket coils for rotary engines, stock and race, in over 40 years in these cars, I do know just a little about coil performance and rotary engines. The BHR coils just outperform new oem coils in the RX8, take it or leave it ! And I believe NO one in this club has ever had a warranty problem with Mazda from using BHR coils in their RX8. If you are too timid to switch, then don't switch, but as RIWWP points out you will pay more in the long run by staying with oem coils. Best to you. See you at the next Philly area meet where we can talk this up some more in person.

gwilliams6

Here is actually what BHR says about their coils for the RX8:

It is widely known that the ignition coils on the Mazda RX-8 are weak and suffer from reliability issues, even on unmodified engines, as early as 30,000 miles and weak ignition coils eventually result in failure of the exhaust catalyst and/or long-term engine damage. With forced induction, nitrous oxide use, or any kind of track racing you need to have an ignition system that is more reliable and with higher voltage/current output than the OEM system.

Tech Tip:
The Black Halo Racing Ignition system is designed for purposes of improving the reliability and drivability of the RX8 as well as a modest but noticeable increase in power. This ignition upgrade is NOT designed to resolve problems with your engine/car as a result of mechanical failure, so please be sure your engine is mechanically in proper operating condition before purchasing.
This ignition system is likely the most popular product ever offered for the Mazda RX-8 and it's popularity continues to rise...... probably because this is the ONLY ignition system for the Mazda RX-8 which retains over 80% of it's value in the resale market! Do not be misled by imitation/"copycat" systems other retailers may try to sell you as many of them do not include everything needed for a proper installation.
Typical benefits reported by those whom have purchased this kit are quicker start-ups, better throttle response, more midrange torque, smoother engine sound/operation above 7,000 RPMs, and no more misfires. All this applies to power-adder (nitrous or F/I) applications, as well, and all models of the Mazda RX-8.
The Black Halo Racing Ignition System addresses these concerns in a very simple manner. The coil conversion wiring harness allows a true "plug-and-play" installation that doesn't require you to cut, splice, or otherwise alter any wiring in your RX8. The ignition coils used emit more current and voltage than the RX-8/OEM ignition coils and provide much longer life over the stock and most aftermarket systems. They are used in many racing applications, rival any coil in the aftermarket, and this system renders any additional/external ignition hardware unnecessary. The kit mounts in the exact same location as the OEM coils and fits all models/years of the RX-8. Do not wait until problems arise before making improvements to your ignition system.
The pre-assembled kit contains a baseplate, coil brackets, ignition coils, a plug-and-play conversion harness, and custom-built MSD or Moroso spark plug wires. It also includes a 3-year warranty on all parts, materials, and workmanship.

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, I saw that much. As RIWWP indicated, I don't see anything that wouldn't equally apply to brand new OE coils -- except maybe the promise of longevity. Then again, as RIWWP also pointed out, there's no way to compare the rev. C coils to BHR's kit on longevity, because the data simply don't seem to exist. Again, please correct me if I'm wrong.

If we wanted to guess, then here's what it comes down to for me. If there really were such an easy way to improve the stock ignition system without bad side-effects, and if that really is what BHR's kit does, then what are the odds that the C coils -- which were released years after BHR's kit came to market -- are still so vastly inferior? Are those odds such that it'd be worth giving up the OE safety blanket? Maybe. I just can't imagine taking that bet that from where I'm standing, especially as BHR's kit is so much more expensive.

If/when the data come in, I'll be happy to change course.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

Yup, it's a reasonable way to think about it and a reasonable course of action. BHR vs original is hard to quantify, original vs C isn't quantified at all, and BHR vs C isn't quantified at all. So it's hard to argue against, or for, any one solution as long as you have the facts straight about each solution

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

Thanks again, RIWWP.

BTW, updated the first post. Here's the diff fluid I'm eyeing: https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubrican...nsaxle%20Fluid

Williard

iTrader: (18)

I have used the C coils but have used and am still currently using BHR's ignition system. I myself feel MORE relaxed and at ease knowing i have the BHR solution to Mazda's Ignition problem.

Also, What "safety blanket" do you speak of? A warranty?

The warranty is only as good as the person(s) who write it.

BHR's dedication to the 8 owners is the reason they are so popular aside from Ray's great products. At least IMO.

Anyway, the C coils are most definitly cheaper than BHR's solution. If your on a budget and want whats best for your car on that budget, get the C coils. If you have the extra coin and can "splurge", Get the BHR kit.

As always, that is IMO.

Hope everyone is enjoying their day.

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

Also, to be clear: I am NOT saying that anyone with a BHR kit should ditch it for Mazda C coils or anything. If it's working for you, there's no arguing that. The calculus is different when you're choosing a path vs. when you're already on it.

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

Two things:

1. OE parts are usually tested much more rigorously than aftermarket parts. Some VERY notable exceptions, but they are still exceptions.

2. There may be very few service departments that might deny an engine warranty claim based on the presence of non-OE coils. Whatever that percentage is, using OE coils reduces it to zero. A small step perhaps, but still a step.

That's all I meant. Again, this is in no way a comment on the actual quality of the parts in question. Nor is it a comment on BHR's warranty or service. I'm just saying there's generally a layer of assurance with OE parts that you can't get in the aftermarket, even if that tradeoff is sometimes worth it in the end.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

As a side note, the BHR ignition uses Chevy OEM LS coils with a slight internal modification, direct from the same manufacturer. So the point about rigorous OEM testing applies in both cases

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

True, but they weren't tested on the RX-8. The rev. C coils were.

Legot

iTrader: (1)

How would you know that? There are, in fact, several other cars that the stock RX8 coils are used on. It's even unlikely that any coil was tested on a vehicle for reliability our quality. Because they are an electrical device, their performance will translate identically to any external system (I.e. the engine).

The stock coils were never developed specifically for the RX8, they were designed to fulfill a specific set of requirements, which was slightly modified for each revision. The same goes for any coil that can be found under multiple brands, and the same certainly goes for the commonly used D585 coils. It just so happens that the D585s fulfill, and in some areas surpass, the system requirements of the Renesis.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

I could argue that actually, they were

Over a thousand kits and probably half a million miles or more, with less than a 1% failure rate is a pretty good test.


Not trying to sway you, just enjoying the debate

IamFodi

iTrader: (1)

Fair points.

We're really getting into the weeds here, and I don't want to come across as a BHR basher because that's not how I feel. Anyone else care? I could go on as I think this is an interesting discussion, but it's pretty academic at this point, so I'm happy to leave it here if no one else finds it worthwhile.

Williard

iTrader: (18)

Fodi,

I think everyone is pretty well interested in the discussion as long as it does not become an issue.

After the point RIWWP has made i would like to hear the reply.