DIY: AxialFlow Shifter Install
04-22-2012, 12:18 PM
#26
On the sticking down: there is only .001 clearance between the two shafts, that doesn't leave alot for tolorance. There will be tight ones once here or there, let it break in. If it doesn't free up just send it back and get it echanged for another one.
There shouldn't be noise that's objectional. That might clear up also, it may even be the same thing.
RTV, we put a really small bead say 1/8 inch max all the way around. You can't hurt the gearbox with it but it's not good practice to use it eccesive. It will form a bead inside sometime and say in an engine when it falls off it can and will go in the oil pump.
For the same reason you shouldn't use teflon tape on fuel systems, use teflon paste.
All purpose grease is fine, we use a wheel bearing grase made for boat trailers.
I need to hear all these little things so we can fix what we can.
No amount of testing will tell all the stuff that will show up with use.
Use a vicegrip to take out the pins by twisting them around.
There shouldn't be noise that's objectional. That might clear up also, it may even be the same thing.
RTV, we put a really small bead say 1/8 inch max all the way around. You can't hurt the gearbox with it but it's not good practice to use it eccesive. It will form a bead inside sometime and say in an engine when it falls off it can and will go in the oil pump.
For the same reason you shouldn't use teflon tape on fuel systems, use teflon paste.
All purpose grease is fine, we use a wheel bearing grase made for boat trailers.
I need to hear all these little things so we can fix what we can.
No amount of testing will tell all the stuff that will show up with use.
Use a vicegrip to take out the pins by twisting them around.
Last edited by Richard Paul; 04-22-2012 at 12:26 PM.
04-22-2012, 03:06 PM
#27
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I went back in, verified that the plastic shifter cutout plate was aligned properly (I don't think it was). I also cleaned up some of the grease in the grooves on the sphere, and verified my high temp RTV seal. All looks good now. I think the up/down movement is better, and I think it needs some time to break in (very short while).
Also, does it really matter where the white block sits on the shifter? I believe it has some play to move, and that may cause dampening or resistance based on position.
I don't know if it is just me, but my car came with that recycled stuff to go around the shifter between the shifter and the boot. Do you guys have this? If so, do you leave it on?
I'll keep you all posted.
Also, does it really matter where the white block sits on the shifter? I believe it has some play to move, and that may cause dampening or resistance based on position.
I don't know if it is just me, but my car came with that recycled stuff to go around the shifter between the shifter and the boot. Do you guys have this? If so, do you leave it on?
I'll keep you all posted.
04-22-2012, 03:17 PM
#28
I don't know if it is just me, but my car came with that recycled stuff to go around the shifter between the shifter and the boot. Do you guys have this? If so, do you leave it on?
.
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04-22-2012, 05:51 PM
#29
Richard;
Day 2 of use and absolutely loving it. So far so good. I was thinking, what are the chances that the noise during shifting is the plastic piece that sits above the pivot sphere? The OEM one clips into the shift gate. I am wondering if there is some play in that plastic and it is maybe moving around during a shift? Purely guessing here.
Again, this is just a "random ideas" and has NO EFFECT on function. And for those wondering about the noises that me and a previous poster are talking about, it really is a small noise that you would only really notice if you are sitting and listening for it. I had my gf in the car and she had no idea what i was talking about until i really made her listen lol.
Day 2 of use and absolutely loving it. So far so good. I was thinking, what are the chances that the noise during shifting is the plastic piece that sits above the pivot sphere? The OEM one clips into the shift gate. I am wondering if there is some play in that plastic and it is maybe moving around during a shift? Purely guessing here.
Again, this is just a "random ideas" and has NO EFFECT on function. And for those wondering about the noises that me and a previous poster are talking about, it really is a small noise that you would only really notice if you are sitting and listening for it. I had my gf in the car and she had no idea what i was talking about until i really made her listen lol.
04-22-2012, 07:33 PM
#30
While it is true that white plastic sleeve is onlt there for something for the boot to seal on moving it up or down could have an effect. I did an Mx-5 here the other day and we fitted the sleeve to the boot and let it float on the stick.
The other thing I forgot was to ask was if you're running the stock shift ****. Aftermarket metal ***** have given problems in the past.
The S2000 has lots of vibration problems and guys tune it out with all sorts of methods. Rotorys shouldn't have that problem.
The other thing I forgot was to ask was if you're running the stock shift ****. Aftermarket metal ***** have given problems in the past.
The S2000 has lots of vibration problems and guys tune it out with all sorts of methods. Rotorys shouldn't have that problem.
04-22-2012, 07:36 PM
#31
While it is true that white plastic sleeve is onlt there for something for the boot to seal on moving it up or down could have an effect. I did an Mx-5 here the other day and we fitted the sleeve to the boot and let it float on the stick.
The other thing I forgot was to ask was if you're running the stock shift ****. Aftermarket metal ***** have given problems in the past.
The S2000 has lots of vibration problems and guys tune it out with all sorts of methods. Rotorys shouldn't have that problem.
The other thing I forgot was to ask was if you're running the stock shift ****. Aftermarket metal ***** have given problems in the past.
The S2000 has lots of vibration problems and guys tune it out with all sorts of methods. Rotorys shouldn't have that problem.
04-22-2012, 11:25 PM
#32
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I do have an aftermarket shift ****, I still have the OEM one so I will put it on just to give you some feedback. I will also mess with the sleeve a bit. Again I want to drill in that this is only a "nitpick" on my part, and that is only to help you field these questions if you get them in the future.
I don't know about nitpicking here, but mine is really loud, especially when RPM's are > 2000. If I were to rest my hand on the shifter, or if I climb the RPM's in gear, it's like I can hear this Whinning and vibration from the tranny resonating through the shifter and into the cabin. It is not normal. It happens a lot more and louder when I am holding or pushing on the shifter. It isn't as bad in 4th/5th/6th. But 1,2,3 are really crazy. I had people in the car, and they think something is really wrong with it. If I put the radio on a bit, it can drown out the noise, but it is still there. I'll see if I can get in on video.
I do have an aftermarket shiftknob, the M1 Abrahms from TWM Motorsports (http://www.twmshiftknobs.com/shiftkn...hiftknobs.html). I'll try the standard shift **** and report back.
Paimon, when you say noise when shifting into gear, is that all you mean? Or is there noise while in gear, or when you rest your hand on the shifter? We have very similar setups, that's why I want to compare.
On a positive note, shifting is AMAZING. I mean the 1st to 2nd and the 2nd to third is really quick. I think there is a major improvement over stock. At least for me, I feel like I do those shifts twice as fast now. The feel is great! Solid shifting and excellent control. The throw seems to be shortened just like Paimon said, I am not sure by how much, but it's way better now. The shifter does sit higher, and I'll post pictures for comparison when I get a chance today or tomorrow.
04-23-2012, 07:01 AM
#33
I don't know about nitpicking here, but mine is really loud, especially when RPM's are > 2000. If I were to rest my hand on the shifter, or if I climb the RPM's in gear, it's like I can hear this Whinning and vibration from the tranny resonating through the shifter and into the cabin. It is not normal. It happens a lot more and louder when I am holding or pushing on the shifter. It isn't as bad in 4th/5th/6th. But 1,2,3 are really crazy. I had people in the car, and they think something is really wrong with it. If I put the radio on a bit, it can drown out the noise, but it is still there. I'll see if I can get in on video.
04-23-2012, 06:51 PM
#36
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Well, during lunch I switched back to the OEM shifter **** to see if it makes any difference, and it didn't. Here is a video of the noise I am talking about (in addition to Paimon's noise)---I know the video is shaky, I don't care lol. I'm trying to capture the sound.
http://youtu.be/SufgXXOkdOY
I did ask around, and it is common to have this noise apparently. A coworker with a GTO said his sounds very similar, and that's a compromise you make for solid shifting and great feel (loosing comfort and noise reduction).
I'll take another video soon of the shifting with the M1 Abrams!
But I have to emphasize, this shifter makes the gear changes so much better, and makes it quick enough to keep the revs high enough to make for a really nice bursty upshift.
04-23-2012, 07:10 PM
#37
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Adambomb, did this sudden loud sound at the upper end of your RPM range only start happening once you changed to the short shifter and now its still there after going back to the OEM shifter? Can you tell me what the rpm range where the loud sound comes in? The video sound is obviously not spectacular but it kind of sounds like something I've been chasing for a long while which almost sounds like your sound at the higher RPM range. Mine comes on at 5500rpm but has a little more of a rattle attached to it. I doubt its the same issue and I have questioned that maybe its my transmission.....but I feel no power obstructions whatsoever and the car revs freely....
04-23-2012, 07:19 PM
#39
surely a different mic, his sound is actually more up close to the shaft than mine. When he puts his hand on the shifter mine makes that sound too. I figure it has to do with the materials used. Like i said, this shifter is made of harder metals than oem.
04-23-2012, 07:38 PM
#40
I have to say a+ to the shipping and a+ to the DIY!!!
I wish I wasnt in the middle of a engine swap to go play with it.
I did notice a little bit of vertical play once installed 1/8" maybe. not sure if this effects performance but over all it feels awesome!
I wish I wasnt in the middle of a engine swap to go play with it.
I did notice a little bit of vertical play once installed 1/8" maybe. not sure if this effects performance but over all it feels awesome!
04-23-2012, 09:34 PM
#41
It's a little to soon to tell on this, we'll get more feedback.
I did a Miata this weekend and he got to me today with the same problem. I had him try the stock **** and it cleared right up.
I think that worked on an Rx8 also.
The vertical play is something I'm working on. I don't think that is related but who knows. (BTW it should be about .050.) The more you guys tell me the better I can build them. Just one more thing, whatever sound is coming from the trans gets better leverage against the shaft. This means it will transfer that much easier. It's just a tuning fork.
I did a Miata this weekend and he got to me today with the same problem. I had him try the stock **** and it cleared right up.
I think that worked on an Rx8 also.
The vertical play is something I'm working on. I don't think that is related but who knows. (BTW it should be about .050.) The more you guys tell me the better I can build them. Just one more thing, whatever sound is coming from the trans gets better leverage against the shaft. This means it will transfer that much easier. It's just a tuning fork.
Last edited by Richard Paul; 04-23-2012 at 09:36 PM.
04-23-2012, 10:16 PM
#42
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Adambomb, did this sudden loud sound at the upper end of your RPM range only start happening once you changed to the short shifter and now its still there after going back to the OEM shifter? Can you tell me what the rpm range where the loud sound comes in? The video sound is obviously not spectacular but it kind of sounds like something I've been chasing for a long while which almost sounds like your sound at the higher RPM range. Mine comes on at 5500rpm but has a little more of a rattle attached to it. I doubt its the same issue and I have questioned that maybe its my transmission.....but I feel no power obstructions whatsoever and the car revs freely....
That whining is extremely profound when I touch the shifter. It is there, but I was trying to show worst case and get it on camera. I was only at about 5~6k rpm I believe, not that high. The noise is there all the time, just more at higher RPM's. I did notice that 1st, 2nd, 3rd, are the worst, where it isn't as bad in 4th, 5th, 6th, but is still there.
The noise was not there before the short shifter install. Changing to the OEM ****, or my M1 Abrams made no difference.
04-23-2012, 10:30 PM
#43
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Hi folks, I'm the mx-5 that was there this weekend, or.... the mx-5 was mine... whatever.
To illustrate what RP said earlier about the bushing, I sorta jammed it into the top of the upper boot to minimize the up and down movement of it on the shifter.
It was a tight fit, but it does fit.
And yes I initially heard a little chatter, and when I replaced the lightweight aftermarket shift **** with a stock one, the noise disappeared.
ps, I'm jealous. Your center console is so much easier to remove than mine is!
To illustrate what RP said earlier about the bushing, I sorta jammed it into the top of the upper boot to minimize the up and down movement of it on the shifter.
It was a tight fit, but it does fit.
And yes I initially heard a little chatter, and when I replaced the lightweight aftermarket shift **** with a stock one, the noise disappeared.
ps, I'm jealous. Your center console is so much easier to remove than mine is!
04-23-2012, 10:36 PM
#44
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The noise can be ignored or muffled if you open your windows, or with the radio on.
I am thinking about going back in and sealing (with some adhesive) that inner boot that seals the console to the frame (exposing the transmission and ground to the shift area). Doubtfully it will do anything, but it won't be hard to do.
04-23-2012, 11:05 PM
#45
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Hi folks, I'm the mx-5 that was there this weekend, or.... the mx-5 was mine... whatever.
To illustrate what RP said earlier about the bushing, I sorta jammed it into the top of the upper boot to minimize the up and down movement of it on the shifter.
It was a tight fit, but it does fit.
And yes I initially heard a little chatter, and when I replaced the lightweight aftermarket shift **** with a stock one, the noise disappeared.
ps, I'm jealous. Your center console is so much easier to remove than mine is!
To illustrate what RP said earlier about the bushing, I sorta jammed it into the top of the upper boot to minimize the up and down movement of it on the shifter.
It was a tight fit, but it does fit.
And yes I initially heard a little chatter, and when I replaced the lightweight aftermarket shift **** with a stock one, the noise disappeared.
ps, I'm jealous. Your center console is so much easier to remove than mine is!
What do you mean you jammed the bushing upwards? With what exactly? Did it help with the chatter, or just the feel?
04-23-2012, 11:27 PM
#46
Voids warranties
- Buyers should understand the difference between short shifter and short throw shifter, correct me if I am wrong but this is a short throw shifter. What I mean by that is that when installed the shifter sits a tad higher than the oem shifter. I know some people will order this and think that their shifter will sit lower, that isn't the case. The purpose of this shifter (as i have come to understand) is a reduction in throw (aka, function over cosmetic)
Yours appears to have a bit of stubbyness to it now. I feel that its may be just my eyes playing tricks on me though due to your shift ****. Will it still work with the oem shift ****?
If you don't mind so much Paimon, could you please post a pic with the stock shift **** on to compare. No hurry. When you get time.
04-24-2012, 10:57 AM
#47
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If you look in the picture in my last post, you can see that the white bushing is in the hole of the top shift boot. It's a very right fit, so I jammed/shoved/pushed/wedged/manhandled the bushing into the hole so it wouldn't slide up or down the shiter shaft. I don't know that it would help with chatter or not, as I didn't drive it before I did that.
04-24-2012, 11:05 AM
#48
That is a main concern of mine. I was considering this shifter but im really not a fan of short stubby shifters. However I want the feel of a short throw.
Yours appears to have a bit of stubbyness to it now. I feel that its may be just my eyes playing tricks on me though due to your shift ****. Will it still work with the oem shift ****?
If you don't mind so much Paimon, could you please post a pic with the stock shift **** on to compare. No hurry. When you get time.
Yours appears to have a bit of stubbyness to it now. I feel that its may be just my eyes playing tricks on me though due to your shift ****. Will it still work with the oem shift ****?
If you don't mind so much Paimon, could you please post a pic with the stock shift **** on to compare. No hurry. When you get time.
If you look in the picture in my last post, you can see that the white bushing is in the hole of the top shift boot. It's a very right fit, so I jammed/shoved/pushed/wedged/manhandled the bushing into the hole so it wouldn't slide up or down the shiter shaft. I don't know that it would help with chatter or not, as I didn't drive it before I did that.
Last edited by paimon.soror; 04-24-2012 at 11:07 AM.
