Shoto4life

I have the rear up on ramps and the front slightly jacked on the left side. I placed a stacked of boards under the edge of the trannys pan. Now that I'm reinstalling the power plant frame - it’s not lining up! I'm bolting the rear up first - which is pointing downward. Pressure has to be applied to get the front part up to the tranny where it belongs and the front holes aren’t lining up. Seems the front studs are a little too far forward now and I'm having a hard time getting the frame up high enough. Is there a trick to this? What happens if I take the stack of boards out that is supporting the tranny? Any suggestions on how I can get this thing back together again would be much appreciated. I had to swap the gas tank out because it had a hole in it.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

Reinstalling the PPF is not trivial. You can do serious harm if you do not install it correctly. The ovalized holes in the front of the PPF allow for increasing and decreasing the height of the engine and transmission relative to the car. So yes, if your transmission is too high, the bolts will not line up.

There is a very important page in the service manual describing the install process. In particular, there is a measurement from the front tunnel crossmember to the PPF that needs to be correct. As I said, damage to drive line parts, in particular the flywheel and clutch, may result otherwise (ask me how I know.)

Again, the measurement is from the top of the empty bolt bung on the front tunnel crossmember directly up to the PPF. I believe it needs to be 52mm, but I am not sure (I am not on my computer with the service manual on it.) Basically, you jack up the transmission, measure this distance (go a little high,) torque down the bolts in the proper order, remove the jack and remeasure the metric. If you are off, repeat the process.

Good luck

shadycrew31

iTrader: (6)

only way I could see damage done to the clutch/flywheel is if he put the ppf on and didn't check to see if the trans was mated with the engine properly. But what do I know.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

Please see:

https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-aftermarket-performance-modifications-23/help-should-i-resurface-my-racing-beat-flywheel-74593/

And

https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-aftermarket-performance-modifications-23/hey-rb-flywheel-vibration-probs-due-misaligned-ppf-62076/

This conclusion was reached after considerable discussions with Jim Langer.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

I am not arguing. I am not even sure that there is a point here to split into two sides.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

Ok, I take your point and will (somewhat) counterpoint.

I dont have the experience you do, but I am capable of gathering data from my limited personal experience and reaching my own conclusion. From that, I will say that realigning my misaligned PPF definitely corrected a symptom that was centered at the pressure plate/clutch/flywheel. I can not exclude the possibility that the overall issue was related or caused by a bad pressure plate, but the misaligned PPF may have contributed.

I don't see that how we can be reasonably at odds on this, however.

Let me also mention that my method of aligning MY ppf is very similar to yours. I dont measure, I simply make sure that everything is in line. I would argue that this might be somewhat too obtuse to distribute to an initiate. I feel that a measurement, as I described, might be a better way for someone not familiar with replacing the PPF to be instructed. I allow that I could be wrong on this, but I dont think so.

As for the warrenty, I received no recompense from RB for the issues I experienced. I bought a new flywheel friction surface from them, tossed my RB clutch and pressure plate, and bought a centerforce pressure plate and clutch disc. I will say that I expected someone to ask this and thought about mentioning it earlier, but thought that I was being too cynical. I guess not.


ETA: I appreciate and respect your efforts, Charles. Were we physically together working on my car, I would even defer to your methods. But I would certainly be asking why.

Kane

iTrader: (1)

I knew Ray was gonna get in on this.

FWIW, I've seen him do it more than once, and I've done it his way on my car, never measured anything and have never had any problems.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

This is a great list of things to consider whilst reinstalling the tranny. In my initial re-installation, I certainly made mistake 1) and may have made made 2), 3), 5) and 6). I may still make mistake 2), 3) and 6). I dont think so, but I am simply not sure. As for my first re-installation, I just bolted up the PPF while the PPF and transmission were at the lowest point. This could not have been good.

Not sure if I agree with this, but it could be.


Yes, clutch disc, pressure plate (both centerforce; I will be very interested in what you come up with in collaboration with them) friction surface on the flywheel AND "properly" aligned PPF.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

Oh, I see what you are asking. I think what happened is that I talked to RB regarding this issue, they put me onto the idea that the PPF needs alignment, then I I realigned the PPF. After that I posted that It fixed all my issues, but I eventually realized that I was still continuing to have engagement issues. I think at that point I took apart the tranny, saw the issues and bought new parts.

I may have this a little out of sequence, but I think the spirit of what happened is there.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

Perhaps in a full, everyman's description of how to perform the alignment?

I fully support a sticky.

Shoto4life

Thanks guys - little too late though. I got after it right away this morning. Major difference was getting it up in jack stands instead of having the rear on the ramps. This helped level everything and took the pressure off the rear differential making it easy to bolt the rear section in and making it easier to lift the front part up while mating it to the transmission. - I didnt see any room for adjustment in the rear. After bolting the rear part in I jacked the front of the ppf up with the transimission until the holes lined up and popped through. The only room for adjustment I saw, was like you said, the front end of the ppf being slotted. What I tried to do was line up the previous bolt marks which were basically dead at the front of the slot. I was close but not fully there so hopefully its okay. I'm just happy at this point that I got it all slapped back together. It all went together smoothly this time and the only way I could see someone not having it in right is if they dont have things jacked level and tighted the bolts prematurely in the rear part of the slot. Anyway, again, thanks for the help!

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

If I remember correctly, I tightened the bolts slowly in a cross or star pattern to take up the springyness. Once the PP was in physical contact with the flywheel, tightened the bolts in a star pattern, likely to a light torque setting, then in the same pattern to full torque, making sure I made a smooth constant motion to full torque.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

Why thank you! That is quite a complement.

I used locktite on the big flywheel bolt (not sure if it was red or blue; I think red,) but not the pp bolts. I will do that next time.

Shoto4life

So what really does happen if its misaligned? Right now my car is really doggy from 0-3k rpms and runs a 12 sec 0-60. I'm also getting occasional creaking noise at around 5.5 rpm and higher. I'm also getting a p0031 code right now. I don't have a cat on it.

carbonRX8

iTrader: (1)

Right now, from reading from the info in your other threads, I think you have many multiple issues. I doubt the ppf is even on the list of issues, but if it is, it is far down the list. Deal with the codes first.

Shoto4life

When I checked it today my codes are down to just the o2 code. I should also note that i get a fair amount of vibration at idle and around 2k there is a pretty decent rattling.