tcblank

Okay, I have an '04 stock RX8 speed. I've had the car for the past 4 years as the second owner. While it has had hiccups, I've fixed most of them, such as ignition coils going out, spark plugs, and what not.

Anyhow, I recently noticed I was getting major lag, loss of horsepower, and mis fire issues again. I took it into an auto shop my family swears by here in San Antonio being that it is actually A+ BBB certified. Very rare to find that in an auto shop open as long as it has been.

They went over my car and said that my engine was going bad and the cat was bad. They said it's still under warranty so they recommended I take it into a dealer to get it fixed. Didn't charge me a cent to do what they did.

So I take it into the dealership here I haven't had issues with before and have a decent B rating on BB even if they aren't apart of the BBB.

Anyhow, they spend a few days looking over it and come back to tell me the same thing. My cat is turned to slag, and the engine is bad. I asked how it happens and they said that is because if ignition coils or sparks go bad, sometimes to flow rate out the exhaust of the engine is too much for the cat to handle. They told me they would have to order new parts and put me into a rental.

I was in the rental for about a month before everything came in. They fixed it up in a week and said everything is running fine and called me in to pick it up last Thursday evening.

Soon as I get the car and before I get off the lot I notice a bunch of vibration. I was like WTF? While still on the lot I narrow it down to major vibration when the car gets to 2K rpm. Also, I started noticing other things like the stick wasn't sitting where it used to and the whole transmission felt weird. I grab a service guy and he said that since they took out the engine out, they had to take everything out and put it back in including the trans. They said give it a day to settle down and "reseat" itself. What he said sounded plausible but something in the back of my head was telling me this wasn't right.

I called back the next day, Friday, though and said it was still bad even after driving the other night. Also, as I was driving off, it sounded like something literally dropped out of the engine area onto the highway. I was also getting some major loss of horsepower and lag at 4500 to 5500 rpm. They told me to bring it back in to look at it.

So I drove it in that Friday I called, and had them look at it. I revved it to 2K rpm and left it there while the tech had the hood open. He had me take a look as well after he saw it. Basically the engine was shaking BAD. I mean you could barely see the gas cap because it was shaking so fast. He told me the mounts might be broken and they weren't covered under warranty.

I was like wait a second, I already had a shop look at this and they said the mounts were fine. I asked who put the engine in. He looked up the tech and we went over to him. I asked the tech who put the engine in if the mounts looked bad and he said, "Nope, they looked good to me."

The service rep told me they would look into it, but they didn't have a slot until Monday. I drove it off the lot and called up some family. I got someone to loan me their truck for the weekend because the vibrations made me not feel safe driving it. That and I was afraid the vibration may cause extra damage to the vehicle.

So when I started it up on Monday to take it into the dealership, the check engine light came on. I was like "wtf?" again. So I when I got to the dealership, I told the rep that the check engine light was on and that current symptoms had not changed. Maybe even got a bit worse.

So I finally get a call today, 4 days later, and was told they are still looking into the vibration and engine mount issue, but that the check engine light was because of a vacuum leak from the intake manifold. The service rep wants me to come over today so he can show me it.


Now I need to know, because unfortunately I don't know enough, if all this extra damage could have been caused directly or indirectly from the dealership? Is there something I should be looking for? Anyone have any ideas on the symptoms my car is showing? I personally have a gut feeling that they screwed the pouch on installing the new engine, and as such, it has now caused extra damage. This damage is not technically "under warranty" anymore, but I think they may be trying to weasel out of owning up to the extra damage and fixing it. Does this sound plausible?

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

What dealer did you go to? Dealers have been known to botch the installs and one local member got a new engine and took it back soon after to get yet another "new" (rebuilt) put in and they also forgot to tighten his AC compressor bolts and hid oil pressure sending unit.

We are having a local get together this weekend if you wanna stop by and talk to us "experts"

I personally have had three engines but I still lover her.

tcblank

Northpark Mazda did the new engine install. I had Cambridge Auto look over the car initially.

Also, one of the other symptoms I have after the install is this strange "ringing" noise. Sounds like someone is rattling a bell inside.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Are you dealing with Sean Anton? North Park has done both of my engine replacements without issue and many, many others as well. They have always treated me pretty well but they will try and bullshit you if you don't know what you are doing. If you need input and advise you came to the right place. The engine mounts are a common issue and if everything was fine when the car came in and Cambridge can back it up then they should replace them. Do they have your car now?

The vacuum hose issue is plausible and easily fixed.

tcblank

No, working with Sergio Agular. sp?

I used to work with Patrick Walsh in the past, and had no problems with him at all. It had been so long though that I I forgot his name initially when I called in for Service and got Sergio.

The guy seems alright, but there are some things that have me miffed.

First off, after the engine install they obviously did NOT test it or test drive. It was very noticeable the moment I turned the car on that something was wrong. It was hard idling and about nearly ready to stall. It took only a minor bit of gas to bring the engine up to 2K rpm and start nearly the whole car shaking from the vibrations. It didn't take much rpms to get the ringing noise either. I did this the moment I got the car back and before I drove off the lot. I had Patrick listen to it before I drove because Sergio had left for the day when I came to pick it up. He's the one that told me the engine may need to settle better on the mounts.

Also, the tech Ryan was the one who told me that my engine mounts look good initially. I also had him check BEFORE the engine install to make sure, because I had a weird gut feeling something like this might happen.

I haven't written them off yet, but I feel as if they are jerking my chain a bit to see if I will roll over.

The original reason I even noticed the engine problem and brought everything into Cambridge Auto to have a look was because of the misfires, the loss of horsepower, and the bad smell of gas/oil from running to long. This was because the Cat was bad and exhaust wasn't venting correctly.

RyansRx8

I got my tranny and clutch replaced and the second I got it back i got "check engine" light and it did feel like my stick was in a difference place but i haven't drove it in like 2 weeks so i thought i was just getting "used" to it again...everything is fine now i never noticed any vibration though

Do you have your car back? What's the deal as of now?

tcblank

Right now it is at the dealership as they try to figure out of the mounts are now broken or not. I haven't really a clue what is taking them 4 days to do this though. It took them that, and me calling everyday to get them to pull the CEL code and tell me what it was. Which they then said it was the intake manifold.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Okay first off it should run smooth when you pick it up. The whole settling thing is bullshit, it's a new engine so it should run smooth and there is nothing to settle. The ECU may need a few drive cycles but if it was shaking badly that's a whole other story. I have never herd of Sergio so he must be relatively new. Patrick has been there forever but I only deal with Sean.

tcblank

The felt that the settling story was pure BS cover myself. I am serious when I say it shakes BAD.

Here's an analogy. When the car sits at 2K rpm, it feels like you are some Yahtzee dice rattling around in a cup at that very moment when sitting in the car. It is THAT bad.

I am suppose to head over there at 1pm, in an hour, to let them show me this leak on the manifold. I'll take pics with my phone if I can.

Grungepup

iTrader: (2)

Awe man ... dude dont deal with Sergio, that guy is an A-hole. He was trying to tell me in the past that the Mazdaspeed CAI for the rx-8 voided the warranty and that they would not diagnosis any problems with the engine until the factory intake was reinstalled and they the dealership would charge me 300+ to do it. He also said the Mazda does not recommend the MS CAI ... the guy is a tool bag. I would go in and talk straight to the service manager and ask that you only deal with Sean Anton from now on. He is a straight shooter and will help you out in any way possible, you can even tell him that the SA RX8 club guys sent you to him.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Ditto, and once they know, you know, they will stop bullshitting you. All dealers are full of **** for the most part so you have to go in with the idea that they are going to try and screw you in one way or another. I have corrected them on many issues and generally they don't try and bullshit me anymore.

tcblank

Okay, just got back from the dealership and here's the breakdown.

I was told that the runner control for the intake is now carbonized solid. That is the reason for the CEL. The tech said it was most likely caused by the back flow exhaust from the plugged CAT. The problem is that the intake is not covered under warranty even though the damage was caused by the CAT that was under warranty. I was quoted $615 to replace the runner.

As far as the vibrations go, I was told my engine mounts are NOT broken. The tech said, "I think they have just hardened over time and now the new engine isn't sitting exactly right on it like the last one did. Even if it is off 1 millimeter when the mounts are hard like this then it can cause vibrations."

That was his exact quote. I am not sure how true this statement is. Personally I am thinking my mounts are still perfectly fine, just the engine wasn't installed correctly, or that the new remanufactured engine is off balance. Either of which can cause extra vibrations. I was quoted $415 to replace the two engine mounts.

Last but not least is the ringing noise. Turns out that I still have a few pieces of metal from the burned out catalytic converter still in the pipes of my exhaust. The tech told me they would eventually blow out. I am a bit dubious on that though.

I was given the options to right now pay them to start work and keep the rental they have until tomorrow, or drive off now. I was told since the work isn't covered by warranty, that the rental isn't either and they want their car back. I am about to call Mazda USA and try to get them to cover the cost of at least the Intake Runner control. It's pure BS. That part wouldn't have fused solid without the Cat going bad.

I told them I want the parts they are replacing back. I definitely want to have a look at my old engine mounts because I think they are doing un-needed work. However, I'm screwed over a barrel at this point.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Okay by runner do you mean the SSV valve? If so, it can be cleaned. If the Valve is stuck it can definitely affect the way the engine runs and unfortunately it is not covered under the extended warranty.

But, if you were not having problems before then why would it act up now? The symptoms you had before were not these so......


If your mounts are bad, just buy new ones here from a vendor and we can knock it out, it's not too difficult.

tcblank

I guess it's the SSV valve. I saw a picture of it in another thread.

The tech said once it's been fused it's more cost effective to replace than to clean. I asked about that. Not sure about that though.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

More cost effective? Trying to clean it is free. There is a DIY video here somewhere.

tcblank

Yep, just called them and told them to not do the valve replacement. I'll clean it this weekend. I was also reading that the lag on horse power during certain RPM bands is from different valves needing to be cleaned. Again something I can do for free.

The thing is.. I usually drive the **** out of this car on purpose just to prevent this. I typically get it up to 9k rpms at least once a week as a very conservative number I use premium and STP stuff every other refill. I check my oil level every weekend and make sure it's not too full and not low. I was doing very careful maintenance with the car since I've had it. So the only reason the carbon build up would occur is because of the Cat failing.

Still, called Mazda USA to see what they may do.

On a side note, I told them to replace the mounts. I looked online and found some much cheaper than the price the dealership quoted me, of course. By about half. Also, looking at the various pictures of the mounts, I just can't see how it became "hard" as the dealership is telling me. The damn thing is solid metal! Of course it is hard. I did ask them to give me the old mounts though, and they said they would. If they don't I am going to raise hell over it. Still $415 to install mounts is a big chunk of change during the holiday season.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Yeah that is a chunk of change. How many miles are on the car? Also, check the Gulf forum for updates and events.

tcblank

It currently has about 79K miles on it.

Grungepup

iTrader: (2)

ouch....

was this sergio? or did you talk to the service manager? because i would call bs on the valve not being covered by the simple fact that the original engine wasnt doing it.... you have to fight these guys tooth and nail esp that sergio idiot....

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Yeah carbon build up in unavoidable. Are you premixing? If not, do it. I am doing the Mazmart oil pressure upgrade kit soon and we recently did my transformation to a single larger Fluidyne oil cooler recently. I am the "king" of reliability mods, haha. With two engine replacements I think I finally have a grasp on what it takes to make these engines last but we will see

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Oh, and I agree as well. How many miles were on it when you bought the car?

Grungepup

iTrader: (2)

what happened to the black tape? it gave it more pinache

swoope

iTrader: (5)

a broken mount or the ppf was not aligned properly...

often they will pull the motor and replace it without adjusting the ppf..

well the symptoms are the same..

ask me how i know..

beers

tcblank

what's a ppf?

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

The black tape disappeared when I cut that lip off!! PPF = Powerplant Frame.