cbmdj13b

Hi guys.

This is my first post.
After getting my first Rx-8 and having problems with the hot start I tried everything. New plugs, leads, coil packs, trying the AT fluid trick and nothing working. I almost gave up. I went on the look out for a fast starter motor.

As the a bit expensive I thought I'd have a look at mine and see if I can liven it up a bit with some WD-40

It's easy to take apart. Disconnect the battery, 3 bolts to get it off ( easy to get to) then there are 2 screws at the top and 2 bolts. The top will come off with the bushes, pull out the middle coil part but be carefull there is a ballbering on the bottom. Clean it all up with a bit of grease in the gears and the top. Once back together WD-40 in all the holes on the outside.

Test it before you put it back on as it did not work well the first time for me, just needed a bit more WD-40.

When your happy with it. Put it back on and you should be able to start it, even on low compression engines like mine.

I think the problem with them is there position on the car. There are holes on the starter that I think are there to lube it up but they let water and grit inside.

Hay, maybe I was lucky, but if this helps some one get there Rx back on the road let me know.

Thanks.

ShinkaEvo

iTrader: (3)

bse50

Our cars only need a faster starter because our engines have lower compression when warm, failing engines may have it so low to make hot starts a problem.
I hope you only had a very worn starter... otherwise a rebuild is next on the list given what you say about having "low compression".

Starters don't fix hot start problems, they only band-aids to cover huge bullet holes.

cbmdj13b

My car starts now when warm! It means I can use it.

Like I said if it helps people use there car instead of just looking at them in the drive it helps rite?

If it means I can use it for another 6 months or so I'm happy.

Benedunn

Not always true! i see a lot of cars with hot start problems that are can be completly atributed to a slow starter! if cranking speed drops below 220 rpm (and ive seen older cars cranking as low as 150 ) even a fairly healthy engine will struggle to start warm! ... the fix that this post is about is always what i try first before having a customer spend £300+ on a new starter and i can confirm it will, more often than not get you by at least a little while!

another trick i find helps is if you remove the earth bracket on the near side of the engine (earth for the starter loom next to the coolant drain plug) and give it a good clean up with a wire wheel or similar (they get a bit crappy) the better earth will help speed up your old starter

word of caution when dismantling your starter, the 2 long thin bolts sometimes dont wanna be moved BE VERY CAREFULL, if they feel iffy they probably are and if you try force them they WILL snap, so worth hitting them with the wd and winding them in and out till your happy before you go diving into the starter

oh and the early starters never ever crank faster than 250 rpm so dont expect to get a cheep R3 starter with abit of wd40 ... if your engine is that ill you need 300 rpm to start it just get a rebuild before you do more damage

cbmdj13b

Thanks for that info. I also put a big earth cable going strate from the battery to the starter. My next idia was to put a second battery in the boot but I don't think these things would help a grate deal.

I'm also not staying this will solve every ones hot start problems as I know coil packs are also a big problem along with engine compression.

Please can some one having problems try this and let me know how you get on?

Thanks benedunn !!

Benedunn

no problem ... im a noob on this site 2

anyway, IMO coils dont generally cause hot start problems ... tho they do cause start problems, running problems, fuel wash problems and inturn low compression problems ... so i guess indirectly they can cause hot start problems haha

hot start problems are normaly caused by dying batterys (which cause cold start problems too obviously), slow starters or general low compression, refurbing an early S1 starter wont really help a low comp engine a great deal, not in the same way putting an uprated starter on would anyway but it will/ could help a healthy engine struggling with an unhealthy starter if you look at mazdas comp graph it becomes a little more clear the relation between starting and cranking speed: note mazda state that the minimum the renisis needs to start it 6.9 kgf/cm2 - this is a little harsh and they do start a lot lower than that but the further below that line on the graph the worse hot start problems will become


all this has probably been gone over 1000000000 times already but since im new here i dont mind writing it out


edit: forgot graph haha

Benedunn

ok whos removed my 'add photos' thingy

cbmdj13b

I don't think so. I spent ages looking on the net for a solution. If it was any other engine I would have said crank sensor. To be honest I was looking forward to re building my 13b.

I also spent ages pushing the rotor tips in and out threw the spark plug hole because people said the drop in compression could be due to the apex seals getting stuck in.

It's nice to speak to a guy who knows there stuff for a change.

I'm just over the moon I can use my car over the summer. .. I hope.

Benedunn

Get it done! its not a hard or ex[ensive as some would have you believe, i have a mate over here (James Hadlow) who got bumbed with a dead rex (his first car!) he pulled the engine and built it himself aged just 17 ... we live a way a way from each other but constantly bouncing ideas off each other! i ported my first 3 engines before getting to do a 'normal 1', just make sur eyou do loads of research before takling the job, all the info you need is on the net but a factory service manual (or the online 1s) are good to have

you took a screw driver to your apex seals????? please do not do that again!!!! your gonna at the very least create a recess or worse (if 1 was stuck) snap 1- stick to the none invasive options like seafoam or cataclean


this has been known to be true! more so with older rotarys but still not unheard of with the renisis ... its often worth trying to decarb a rotary if low compression results are gottne on a suspect engine (like mid 4s on 20k mile engine is likely to be carbon build up

shhhh! i dont know it all! and there are a lot on here that have probably forgotten more than ill ever know, there also a few keyboard warriors that wouldnt like you suggesting the new guy might have an inclin of what hes talking about

cbmdj13b

No not a screwdriver 'twas a small socket on an extension. snap-on ones are quite smooth on the edge. WD-40 (again) and thick oil.

I'm going to get a knackerd 13b off eBay and do it. Iv been a mechanic most of my life but it done one yet but always wanted to. There is a rather "cool" guy on YouTube restoring an old Cosmo that has done some good videos I know the rx8 engine is different but I have learnt a lot from that.

Oh btw, my gearbox is a bit crap. Wines in first and 6th. Will new oil sort it or is it gorn?

Benedunn

Your talking about Arron Cake pal

ye try redline or i use millers race stuff - you need 75w-90, 5l will be enough to do the diff too less if you have a 231

you have a PM by the way

cbmdj13b

Arron cake rules! and has the best website.

TeamRX8

iTrader: (25)

I can appreciate your enthusiasm, but this doesn't really qualify as a DIY thread IMHO. So it has been moved to the Tech Garage forum area instead.

05rx8mazda

iTrader: (4)

Nice job man! mine was cranking really slow as of lately, and i checked the batter, alternator, and starter. They all checked out good, but when i hooked up my Cobb to check the starter Voltage its only cranking at 160-172, and manages to fire the car up once it reaches 198-203 rpms, but it stays at 160 rpms for a good 4 seconds.

Ronan

hey am pretty new to this website and verry new to my RX8,
i bought it about 2 monts ago now and it is really starting to strugle to hot start now (even had to bump it the other day) have been reading so much on the web which tbh is a little confuzing with every one saying something a bit differnt but it really seems like you know what your talking about and I could do with some advise.

my car is a 2004 231BHP 72,500miles RX8 and I love it but im 19 and still in collage and can barly aford the petrol let alown an engine rebuild (which it seems i might need? ) i have not done a compression test yet as there is no mazda garage within a 100 miles of me it seems. (live in cornwall, england).

basically i have two people looking to buy it but do not want to sell them a broken car as i was. so would cleaning / replacing my stating motor with an uprated one, and mayby a new battery and coil packs mask the problem enough for me to sell it? (with a good enough consience but a slightly lighter wallet)

Or my other option would be to rebuild the engin my self! i am not a qualified mechanic (but know quite a few) and i do know a think or to about car engines and am a good reasercher (not speller tho haha) how hard is it acctually to do and do i need to?

sorry for massive message just really need some answers
cheers

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

Another broke college student?

Sell the car and take public transportation, its for your own good

Slidin8

You still should do a compression test to see what is really going on. Gonna be cheaper than replacing heaps of **** which isnt your problem

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

It may well fix your hard starting but the better thing to do would be to establish whether your starter is slow or not . Make a sound recording of it and compare with these .

https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-tro...ck-out-207244/

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

just sell your car man ... I mean it.

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

that's what he wants to do . Read the post noob !

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

damn, u're right, ok, sell it ASAP PLZ !

edd1317

hi people, im having some problems starting my car when its hot. iv herd the 2kw starter is the best way to go but I cant get my hands on 1 is there any1 on here that can help me out please

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

https://www.rx8club.com/new-member-f...causes-249529/

Starting Trouble

• cranks but doesn't fire
  • flooded
  • ignition failure
  • fuel pump failure
  • e-shaft sensor fouled
  • fuel pump failure
  • engine compression loss
  • starter failure
  • fuel system leak
• difficulty starting hot or cold
  • battery failure
  • starter failure
  • ignition failure
  • fuel system leak
  • e-shaft sensor fouled
• difficulty starting only when cold
  • weak battery
  • coolant seal failure
• difficulty starting only when hot
  • engine compression failure
  • failing fuel pump
• doesn't turn over when starting
  • battery failure
  • battery grounds corroded
  • starter failure
  • engine seized
  • in gear with e-brake engaged
• won't start when hot
  • engine compression failure
  • failing fuel pump

Norri171

Okay i really need help. Can someone please text me 12627480304. Serious only. My rx8 i just bought. Well it has to cool or else it wont start? I need it to start hot? I heard something about new ignition coils. Please just someone text me when they can im in the dark on rotary motors. -.-