dyno problem
06-28-2010, 03:00 AM
#1
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dyno problem
hi guys, I have microtech lt10s ecu with e-manage ultimate harness (aka haltech interceptor x). I went to a dyno today (dyno dynamics), and air fuel ratio turned out to be leaning up to 14.6-15.1 at 6500rpm (didnt pull higher rpm). It made a 133whp at that rpm which seems "normal", however the air fuel ratio is with stock ecu.
so my mechanic tried installing the lt10s, and tried richening it up a bit, but
it made no difference whatsoever even after adding 70% more fuel.. air fuel ratio stayed the same..
I believe the problem is not in the ecu, but perhaps in the engine/settings. there is no check engine light though, and in normal driving seems to be running a little bit rich (instead of lean on dyno), proven by a bit black carbon in the exhaust.
my mods are k&n panel filter, 100cpsi hi flow cat and hymee exhaust. we even tried pulling out the abs fuse, and still it did no change.. could it be in limp mode? but there is no CEL.. any explanations or suggestions from the seniors?
spark plugs are new, the main problem is with the ecu not picking up any signal from the microtech, and funny AFR.
oh and also, the microtech was used in another rx8, so it worked well.
thanks
so my mechanic tried installing the lt10s, and tried richening it up a bit, but
it made no difference whatsoever even after adding 70% more fuel.. air fuel ratio stayed the same..I believe the problem is not in the ecu, but perhaps in the engine/settings. there is no check engine light though, and in normal driving seems to be running a little bit rich (instead of lean on dyno), proven by a bit black carbon in the exhaust.
my mods are k&n panel filter, 100cpsi hi flow cat and hymee exhaust. we even tried pulling out the abs fuse, and still it did no change.. could it be in limp mode? but there is no CEL.. any explanations or suggestions from the seniors?
spark plugs are new, the main problem is with the ecu not picking up any signal from the microtech, and funny AFR.
oh and also, the microtech was used in another rx8, so it worked well.
thanks
06-28-2010, 04:07 AM
#3
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basically it is a microtech lt10s which was paired with BOLT ON emanage ultimate harness.. so hooking it up takes only a few seconds...
very first run it was not installed, and found out the AFR was crazyly leaning up then we turned off the car n fitted the microtech (hoping to be able to send down more fuel), but it made no difference.. seems like the stock ecu/the engine is not picking up the signal from the microtech..
any ideas?
very first run it was not installed, and found out the AFR was crazyly leaning up then we turned off the car n fitted the microtech (hoping to be able to send down more fuel), but it made no difference.. seems like the stock ecu/the engine is not picking up the signal from the microtech..
any ideas?
06-28-2010, 10:17 AM
#4
the E-manage Ultimate harness is a little questionable in terms of the way it wires things. I don't have your car in front of me, but check out this thread: https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-engine-tuning-forum-63/emanage-ultimate-turbo-upgrade-kit-findings-96973/
Now a lot of that may not apply to your setup, but I do think you need to go through the wiring.
The wire connections that come with the Upgrade Kit are:
Ultimate Connector A (12 Pin)
Pin #3 - Ignition Input Signal CH-4 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2Z - Rear Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #10 - Ignition Input Signal CH-3 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2AA - Front Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #4 - Ignition Input Signal CH-2 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2AC - Rear Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #5 - Ignition Input Signal CH-1 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2AD - Front Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #8 - Ignition Output Signal CH-4 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2Z - Rear Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #9 - Ignition Output Signal CH-3 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2AD - Front Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #11 - Ignition Output Signal CH-2 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2AC - Rear Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #12 - Ignition Output Signal CH-1 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2AA - Front Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Ultimate Connector B (18 pin)
Pin #15 – Airflow (voltage) Input (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #5N – MAF (C)
Pin #16 - Throttle Pos. Sensor Input (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #5F - Accelerator (E)
Pin #17 – Injector Input Signal CH-1 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2M – Front Primary Injector
Pin #18 – Injector Input Signal CH-2 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2J – Rear Primary Injector
Pin #19 – Injector Input Signal CH-3 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #3A – Front Primary 2 Injector
Pin #20 – Injector Input Signal CH-4 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #3D – Rear Primary 2 Injector
Pin #22 – Airflow (voltage) Output (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #5N – MAF (C)
Pin #24 – ECU Ground (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4J – Fuse Box Ground?
Pin #25 – ECU (Ignition) Power (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Q – Fuse Box Power?
- This wire also (piggybacks) connects to the Dongle Red Wire
- This wire also (piggybacks) goes to PCM Pin #1L – Secondary Shutter Valve
Pin #26 – Injector Input Signal CH-7/A (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2G – Front Secondary Injector
Pin #27 – Injector Input Signal CH-8/A (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2D – Rear Secondary Injector
Pin # 30 – Injector Ground (Sensor) (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4A – Fuse Box Ground?
Ultimate Connector C (14 pin)
Pin #33 – Crank Angle Signal Input (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2U – Eccentric Shaft Position
Pin #43 – Injector Output Signal CH-5 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4O – Secondary Air Injection Pump
- This wire also (piggybacks) connects to the Dongle Green Wire
Pin #44 – Injector Output Signal CH-6 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #1L – Secondary Shutter Valve
Ultimate Dongle
Bluegreen Wire #1 – (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Y – Accelerator (D)
Bluegreen Wire #2 = (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Z – Refrig. Pressure Switch
Green Wire – (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4O – Secondary Air Injection Pump
Red Wire – (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Q – Fuse Box Power?
From this information I noticed a couple of things.
1. In order to use the Upgrade Kit for N/A changes are needed to the Jumper settings in order to be able to trim fuel because all the jumper settings are set to Addition Only.
2. In order to use the Upgrade Kit for N/A changes are needed to the wiring harness in order to be able to pull fuel from the Secondary Injectors because they are wired to the sub injector map.
3. Possibly the wierdest thing I found is that the input and output ignition channels don't match yet they are wired to the same PCM Pins???
CH-1 - Input = Front Trailing - Output = Front Leading
CH-2 - Input = Rear Trailing - Output = Rear Trailing
CH-3 - Input = Front Leading - Output = Front Trailing
CH-4 - Input = Rear Leading - Output = Rear Leading
Ultimate Connector A (12 Pin)
Pin #3 - Ignition Input Signal CH-4 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2Z - Rear Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #10 - Ignition Input Signal CH-3 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2AA - Front Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #4 - Ignition Input Signal CH-2 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2AC - Rear Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #5 - Ignition Input Signal CH-1 (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #2AD - Front Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #8 - Ignition Output Signal CH-4 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2Z - Rear Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #9 - Ignition Output Signal CH-3 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2AD - Front Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #11 - Ignition Output Signal CH-2 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2AC - Rear Trailing Ignition Coil (A)
Pin #12 - Ignition Output Signal CH-1 (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #2AA - Front Leading Ignition Coil (A)
Ultimate Connector B (18 pin)
Pin #15 – Airflow (voltage) Input (intercepts) comes from PCM Pin #5N – MAF (C)
Pin #16 - Throttle Pos. Sensor Input (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #5F - Accelerator (E)
Pin #17 – Injector Input Signal CH-1 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2M – Front Primary Injector
Pin #18 – Injector Input Signal CH-2 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2J – Rear Primary Injector
Pin #19 – Injector Input Signal CH-3 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #3A – Front Primary 2 Injector
Pin #20 – Injector Input Signal CH-4 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #3D – Rear Primary 2 Injector
Pin #22 – Airflow (voltage) Output (intercepts) goes to PCM Pin #5N – MAF (C)
Pin #24 – ECU Ground (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4J – Fuse Box Ground?
Pin #25 – ECU (Ignition) Power (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Q – Fuse Box Power?
- This wire also (piggybacks) connects to the Dongle Red Wire
- This wire also (piggybacks) goes to PCM Pin #1L – Secondary Shutter Valve
Pin #26 – Injector Input Signal CH-7/A (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2G – Front Secondary Injector
Pin #27 – Injector Input Signal CH-8/A (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2D – Rear Secondary Injector
Pin # 30 – Injector Ground (Sensor) (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4A – Fuse Box Ground?
Ultimate Connector C (14 pin)
Pin #33 – Crank Angle Signal Input (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #2U – Eccentric Shaft Position
Pin #43 – Injector Output Signal CH-5 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4O – Secondary Air Injection Pump
- This wire also (piggybacks) connects to the Dongle Green Wire
Pin #44 – Injector Output Signal CH-6 (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #1L – Secondary Shutter Valve
Ultimate Dongle
Bluegreen Wire #1 – (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Y – Accelerator (D)
Bluegreen Wire #2 = (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Z – Refrig. Pressure Switch
Green Wire – (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4O – Secondary Air Injection Pump
Red Wire – (piggybacks) comes from/goes to PCM Pin #4Q – Fuse Box Power?
From this information I noticed a couple of things.
1. In order to use the Upgrade Kit for N/A changes are needed to the Jumper settings in order to be able to trim fuel because all the jumper settings are set to Addition Only.
2. In order to use the Upgrade Kit for N/A changes are needed to the wiring harness in order to be able to pull fuel from the Secondary Injectors because they are wired to the sub injector map.
3. Possibly the wierdest thing I found is that the input and output ignition channels don't match yet they are wired to the same PCM Pins???
CH-1 - Input = Front Trailing - Output = Front Leading
CH-2 - Input = Rear Trailing - Output = Rear Trailing
CH-3 - Input = Front Leading - Output = Front Trailing
CH-4 - Input = Rear Leading - Output = Rear Leading
06-29-2010, 03:07 AM
#6
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Hi guys, thanks for the advices.. My mechanic thinks that it is fuel pump getting clogged due to premixing, which sort of makes sense.. I am putting the walbro 255lph but having trouble removing the top plastic fuel pump cover.. Any suggestions? Thx
07-06-2010, 08:53 AM
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use a fuel pressure gauge to verify pressure on the rail, check injector flow to make sure they are operating in spec. Check that your MAF is clean. Stuff like that. And I'd double check the harness wiring, can you make other changes and see a result? Is the 02 sensor still reading right? If your seeing soot from the exhaust and it's reading lean there could be an error in the readings. Do some data logging while driving and record as many sensors as your logger will allow and if you can record the sensor voltage readings as well. This data can tell you quite a bit about the car and how all the components are working.
As for the plastic ring, it just takes time, patients and elbow grease.
As for the plastic ring, it just takes time, patients and elbow grease.
07-06-2010, 09:51 AM
#9
He means exactly what he said.
Every single point of this "conversion" is completely screwed up, equally so with the advice you are being given by your mechanic and your assumptions about what the problem could be.
Right off the bat - the idea that, since the PCM is not delivering optimal fuel values, you will install a questionable and hacked-up PCM as a piggy-back to fix it?
Huge failure there and no real point in moving forward.
Then, your Microtech cannot be wired up as a piggy-back on fuel, which is exactly what you did.
Every single point of this "conversion" is completely screwed up, equally so with the advice you are being given by your mechanic and your assumptions about what the problem could be.
Right off the bat - the idea that, since the PCM is not delivering optimal fuel values, you will install a questionable and hacked-up PCM as a piggy-back to fix it?
Huge failure there and no real point in moving forward.
Then, your Microtech cannot be wired up as a piggy-back on fuel, which is exactly what you did.
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