When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
My position is not negative and has been unchanged for many years. I'm not against a particular product, but have many years of experience developing a concept that I only wish to share with the community here. It was detailed earlier in the thread so I won't continue to pound it in, but instead only wish to counter your point about negativity.
If your open to exploring the concept it's fairly easy to prove one way or the other.
You would also best be advised IMO to add several more pounds putting up a heat shield between the header and the trans. I reported many years ago on the forum that angling towards the trans like that is a mistake I won't make again.
Wow, not sure where that came from or even why you felt his innoculus reply deserved that kind of response
As someone who considers himself an objective observer, the "actual third party" can be construed as implying dishonesty on the part of BHR, not exactly innocuous.
While harsh, if he truly believes his results are valid, then the response to what one could perceive as basically being called dishonest is understandable.
Ok, if you want to discuss it then here is the only posted dyno sheet from the manufacturer that I've seen, as per the website. There are so many variables involved that I was surprised that it was ever displayed at all, not to mention the low values overall. It seems questionable on multiple levels and to be honest has the typical marketing spin I expect from *any* manufacturer.
Further, nobody bothered to ask Arca what he really meant and IMO it would have better to put a positive spin on it or said nothing at all as to project that kind of FU response. It was pretty much the dyno result I expected, if only based on my own experience and understanding of the realities of the Renesis exhaust system potential. So for me Arca's reply did not come across as anything other than a sincerely honest assessment
Originally Posted by BHR website 3-21-2015
The attached dyno sheet is from a 6-port/6-speed 2008 RX-8 with about 25K miles on it and using a BHR Ignition System as it's only modification (installed well before the dyno test was performed), including still using the factory cat-back exhaust system. Typical rear-wheel horsepower gains were 20-25 rear-wheel horsepower, with additional engine torque being demonstrated as low as 2,000 RPMs, but actual total gains in power are dependent on the age/condition of each engine and the presence of other modifications.
No discussion needed.
I'm just saying the comments could be taken differently than what someone else may perceive them to be.
If ambiguous comments are made without details, then it's left open to interpretation, that's all.
this is ridiculous. put a stock mid pipe and catback back on Carbon's car and do the run. Put the longtube back on with whatever catback you choose that will fit and the numbers will tell the rest of the story.
I see enough data here to make some pretty impressive leaps from stock.
Alright, I'll chime in with my own experience as far as the install is concerned.
Caveats - I'm an amateur and I spent WAY too much time installing this on my own, in my garage, with not all the right tools. I also did the Sohn OMP mod at the same time. And I didn't take pictures.
By the end of the day I had the Sohn installed and was attempting to mate the header to the engine. Unfortunately, I had underestimated how far to the drivers side the engine had to move in order to fit the header in. So, without a way to shove the engine over, I resigned for the night, defeated. Around 7pm.
In the morning, I went to Princess Auto and got a bar clamp/spreader and returned home to finish up. The spreader was too freakin wide to use... So off again to return it and get another.
A short while later, I returned with a smaller clamp, and continued. Once the engine is moved around 2 inches to the driver side, the header slides in with a little manuevering. Installed the gasket, lined up the header, and began tightening it down. This is where I ran into a few troubles. The header is an awful pain in the *** to get around to the manifold studs/nuts. The bottoms are easy access, and the front two tops as well. The rear top on the other hand, next to impossible. Another trip to get a 14mm ratchet wrench. That one's as close to torque spec as forearm strength and willpower will allow.
On to connecting it to the short midpipe and the midpipe to the stock (for now) exhaust. Another issue. Once this thing is in, it leaves very little room at the top of the 3 bolt connection to get a wrench in there and turn the bolts. I would also like to note that the bolts are too close to the piping in order to allow even a thin walled socket on them, so wrenches only. Very little space, wrenches only. You can picture the frustration, I'm sure. That being said, I did not have any of the same fitment issues Carbon had, just some install know how issues. No grinding.
6:45 Sunday evening, and I'm taking the car off the jackstands, ready to go for a spin. Get everything cleaned up, and start it up. No exhaust leaks, no engine lights... We're good!
Run it around lightly for a bit with no WOT till it warms up, but everything seems to be fine. No drone, no rasp. Now, I had an AP midpipe that was an awful, raspy racket under WOT. From around 3-4.5k it was just terrible. The car is warm, so I'll give it a go. Open it up in second out to 8500, all the way through, no rasp, just rotary goodness.
I make no claims to have a very sensitive butt dyno, so my findings should be taken with a grain of salt. It's got a bit better throttle response (feels less sluggish in low rpms), and definitely feels pretty good going through the windy roads. It feels a bit more powerful, but I don't have any actual dyno numbers to go to. I also didn't have a catalytic converter before this, so the header wouldn't give me a huge gain there.
So, if you were to buy and install this yourself. A few things to consider. Install the thing assembled, if you can manage it. That will come with its own issues as it's pretty heavy and obviously, pretty long. Having a 14mm ratchet wrench and a spreader or some other method to move the engine to the drivers side are pretty much required. A hoist for the car would help a great deal as well. Finally, there is no inlet for the air pump, so you will be deleting that when you install this header. Read up on that here (https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-tec...delete-193675/)
The header is a quality part, sounds great, and adds a bit of power. Charles is a great guy to deal with and is always willing to answer my questions, whether or not there was a sale involved. Now, does anyone have an HKS HiPower they want to sell cheap and ship to Canada?
Some things I forgot. Once I had used the spreader to move the engine, I did NOT have to remove the lower rear manifold stud. It was a tight fit, and there was a little rubbing, but no scratches were left on the header, so it can be done without removing the stud.
Also, I spent about 11hrs total doing this and the Sohn install over the weekend. Just wanted to mention this, as I don't know what access to tools/shop Carbon had, and I probably did it in the least time efficient way possible. That time is including 5 trips to pick up tools (around 30 mins/trip), so 8.5hrs of working time. The OMP took around 1-1.5 hrs, so Carbon's estimate of 2-4 hrs might be a little short if you're in the same boat as me for skills. It was my first time removing an exhaust manifold, ever, so it would probably take me less time now that I have an idea of what I'm in store for. It's certainly doable in a day for an amateur, if you have all the tools you'll need.
I'll have to double-check, but I think it also has ample clearance on the sub-frame now, as it was not touching when I looked at it. That may have been before I completely lowered the engine back on to the mounts, so I'll take a look when I get home from work today. I mention this only because Carbon specifically says he had a pre-market version, and it seems to me that corrections have been made to fix the issues he mentioned.
Is this header suitable for a street ported engine? What I mean is: will it behave about the same as it does for a stock port engine?
Or will it perhaps perform worse, since it was so specifically designed for the timing of the stock port?
BigC,
I don't have one but have heard a lot of good things.(outside of the forum)
In all honesty it seems for those who don't want the hassle of FI, this is perfect.
When it comes to products from Ray, your enthusiasm should be full tilt .
I have never regretted anything purchased from BHR. Just like your many years of the BHR coil solution (which you loved, I'm sure ) I'm also certain you will love the power this setup helps unleash .
5 months on, and I'm still really happy with this header. Feels great, sounds great. Seems to be holding up really well. Just installed an AEM intake on the car, and the combo really sings up at the top end of the RPM range.
A few months ago my welder of several years quit on me. The good news is that my new welder does a FANTASTIC job of welding and I am very happy with his work (anyone whom has purchased a BHR Midpipe in the past couple months has seen his work)[...]
Hopefully this isn't the guy who welded my midpipe, one of the nuts that was welded to the rear flange was so far off center, the bolt almost couldn't be screwed in. Ended up taking the midpipe out from under the car and installed the rear bolts first, using a wrench with a pipe on the end for added torque.
PITA.
5 months on, and I'm still really happy with this header. Feels great, sounds great. Seems to be holding up really well. Just installed an AEM intake on the car, and the combo really sings up at the top end of the RPM range.
A few months ago my welder of several years quit on me. The good news is that my new welder does a FANTASTIC job of welding and I am very happy with his work (anyone whom has purchased a BHR Midpipe in the past couple months has seen his work). However, I have not been promoting the BHR Header as I have been looking for some time to spend with him on the fitment details of the header as it is a bit of a tight fit and requires precision to assemble it. I expect to resume production on the header later this week. In the meantime, here is a recent update I received from a customer;
The car has more surge and torque. When accelerating at 5k and above, I find the car to perform better. It definitely gives more power. It feels more alive and a lot more like a sports car. When stock, I found the performance of the Renesis to be less than adequate. The noise increase is negligible, if any. I will admit, I was a bit worried by the potential sound increase, but it proved to be unfounded. I paired your system with a RB catback, as I knew these were a quiet and sedate system. I think they are a perfect combination. I had my engine rebuilt with a half bridge also, so it sounds great at idle with the increased airflow. I will get you a video in the coming weeks, both of the car idling and when being revved.
Hi Charles.
Once you resume production, do you plan on having some on hand at all times?
Based on the fitment pics I have seen, I think it would work on an S2. But you would want to check to be sure, the S2 oil pan setup is different and has a protrusion that enlarges the sump on the exhaust side of the engine. The pan on the S2 has to be modified to install the Greddy turbo manifold for the S1 but the Greddy manifold drops down a bit.
03-20-2015, 11:41 PM
.
