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Old 05-09-2013, 05:55 PM
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STX Build Thread

Hello all! A friend of mine just bought a 2004 RX8 Sport wih 165k miles sight unseen. In this thread, we will keep track of expenses, interesting things found in this car, and things we do to prep it for STX. Our goal is to do this on a small budget, and produce good results by spending smartly.

It was listed as a "mechanics special", and was told the engine was bad and would not start. Because of the absurdly low price, he decided to pop on it. He figured worst case, it would not be worth prepping, and would part it out. If it arrived in decent condition, we would install a new engine and get it prepped.

Car as arrived:

Car was delivered for $2725 including the sticker price, taxes, title fees, and shipping 700 miles to his house. When it arrived, it was EXTREMELY dirty...lol. It looked like it sat next to a gravel road for a year.

Edit notes: JP-X has decided to jump into STX. New parts added for that...and better coilovers will probably be added this winter. Probably hit the stx easy button and go with KW.

Total expenses to date:

Car: $2725
Starter: $110

Total: $2835



Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3951.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3952.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3957.jpg  

Last edited by MikeTyson8MyKids; 07-11-2014 at 09:08 AM. Reason: Changes in class
Old 05-09-2013, 06:03 PM
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And, the underhood/interior is not much better:






After a quick wash, it got a little better:
Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3973.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3976.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3977.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3978.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3965.jpg  

Old 05-09-2013, 06:15 PM
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Let's see what surprises this car has :

First, the MAF was zip tied in with no o-ring:


Couple Coil studs snapped off, and coils ziptied in:


Was that a REMAN tag lurking in the background? YES


Looking over the Carfax, he will be the 6th(!) owner of this car. It has a a history of going in for was Carfax calls "Powertrain service", and within a few days, being put up for sale. With this pattern, I'm guessing this car is probably on it's 3rd engine. He is going to call MNAO and see just how many engines this car has had installed...lol...and whatever else interesting they can tell him.

When we received the car, we checked out the critical fluids, and of course tried to start it. We tried a little ATF down access ports, jumping it, etc...just wouldn't even attempt to fire. Original starter barely spun the engine; it was evident that the starter was pretty sued up. So we installed a new one:




Looks like we've got a slight oil leak on the underside or backside of the engine. There was no oil in the flywheel area when we changed the starter, so this appears to be either a pan gasket leak, filter leak, or possibly an oil sensor leak. This requires further CSI'ing. Notice the globs of sealant...looks like a reman! lol
Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3974.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3975.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3985.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3979.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3980.jpg  


Last edited by MikeTyson8MyKids; 05-09-2013 at 08:21 PM.
Old 05-09-2013, 06:29 PM
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We tried once or twice more to get it started with the new starter, and it just didn't sound right. There was no distinct pulsations from the engine. Around back at the tail pipes, no fuel smell, NO AIR MOVEMENT. So, maybe the Cat is plugged up?

Let's see, this is NOT an OEM Cat (i'm not sure who makes this one):


Let's pull that CAT down and have a look:



We were greated with a fuel bath. Ok, this thing was flooded for MANY starting attempts before we ever received it. I think we found a problem! LOL I can say this one is 100% blocked, there was simply no way to pass air through it. Unfortunately, when the CAT went, it took the rear O2 with it. Add that to the list of things needed.

So we cleaned up the fuel drippage, pulled the CAT down further out of the way, did a quick deflood procedure by holding the gas to the floor and cranking it.

And then, this happened:

Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3981.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-img_3982.jpg  

Last edited by MikeTyson8MyKids; 05-09-2013 at 07:23 PM.
Old 05-09-2013, 06:42 PM
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It LIVES! That is probably the loudest street car I've ever been around...

It idles fine, it revs fine. We never had it running for anymore than 30 seconds because it really was obnoxiously loud for 10pm, and, we didn't need to melt anything/catch on fire.

Next steps:

For now, just punch out the cat converter and reinstall, so at least we can stand being around the thing when it is running (we will install a working CAT once we know if this engine is ok or not). Also, need to buy an OE rear O2.

After that, we need to do some minor stuff like brake/clutch fluid flushing, general suspension checking over, etc, just to make sure it is actually is safe to drive.

Next, do a full Seafoam decarb to possibly unstick any seals that may be stuck, then go drive it for a short burst. After that, we'll put it back up on stands and do a home compression test just to see if anything is catastrophically wrong with the compression. If it feels fine, drives fine and idles fine when hot, and nothing seems wrong with the home compression test, we'll call it good for now. Maybe during a time when we're waiting on parts, or have a little downtime, we'll take it to the Mazda dealer and get some real compression numbers on it.

Plans:
Like I said before, he would like to first enter it in CS/RTR. I've got my own car I've run in STX for a while now, and maybe he'll move that direction, but for now, it is CS/RTR. So, first up would be new shocks..lol. The originals are still on it. He'll probably buy some Koni yellows and stick them in there. At the same time, this thing needs tires. The tires that are on it have plenty of tread, but they are Sailun Altrezza??? I have no idea what those are, but something is telling me, probably not going to cut it in RTR...lol. Dunlops, BFG Rivals, Hankook RS3...something like that will be going on.

That is about it for now! I'm sure he'll chime in (I started the thread since he hasn't even registered yet). We'll both update with pictures, results, surprising finds, etc.

Last edited by MikeTyson8MyKids; 05-09-2013 at 06:53 PM.
Old 05-09-2013, 07:32 PM
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wtf, lol
Old 05-09-2013, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by TeamRX8
wtf, lol
That was exactly our thought when it fired right up!

Seriously, a $2700 RX8 that *might* just need a few parts?!
Old 05-09-2013, 07:49 PM
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I love how you can see the exhaust coming out from the side of the car when I snap the throttle.
Old 05-09-2013, 07:58 PM
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I was thinking the oil issue might be from oil filter changes since it runs down near the starter if you don't stuff a bunch of rags around the filter stand, but the pic would seem to indicate something more constant like an actual leak somewhere

I have a coil bracket if you need one


.

Last edited by TeamRX8; 05-09-2013 at 08:01 PM.
Old 05-09-2013, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by TeamRX8
I was thinking the oil issue might be from oil filter changes since it runs down near the starter if you don't stuff a bunch of rags around the filter stand, but the pic would seem to indicate something more constant like an actual leak somewhere

I have a coil bracket if you need one


.
Thanks Mark, I've got an extra one as well.

Yes, that oil leak didn't really bother me at first, because I figured we'd be replacing the engine anyway. But since it fired up for the short bits we ran it, it seems ok for now. There wasn't any oil in the around the flywheel, so it hopefully is something simple like a pan leak, leaking sensor, or simple as messy oil changes. Just from that picture, I'm guessing a pan gasket leak.

I don't think either of us will have a chance to really mess with the car till later next week.
Old 05-10-2013, 08:37 AM
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Sweet. Glad to see you got it.

Hopefully I will catch you at one of the upcoming autocrosses. I haven't been back out since the Autocross school.
Old 05-10-2013, 09:06 AM
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To me, the o-ring-less zip-tied MAF takes the grand prize. Unbelievable.
Old 05-10-2013, 10:44 AM
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cool build!

i've bought 3 cheap/dead Rx8's in the last year, and i've come to a few conclusions.

1. 21st century man does not diagnose anything, they just assume engine is bad.

2. you will find more abysmal workmanship than the MAF, my grey car had a really impressive collection of bailing wire, zipties, and a bungee cord holding the under cover on, i'm on the wrong computer, but i should post pics.

3. everything the ziptied MAF mechanic didn't touch will be perfectly fine

4. there is a birds nest in the cabin air filter

fix #2, and you'll have a really nice car

Last edited by j9fd3s; 05-10-2013 at 10:47 AM.
Old 05-10-2013, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by j9fd3s
cool build!

i've bought 3 cheap/dead Rx8's in the last year, and i've come to a few conclusions.

1. 21st century man does not diagnose anything, they just assume engine is bad.

2. you will find more abysmal workmanship than the MAF, my grey car had a really impressive collection of bailing wire, zipties, and a bungee cord holding the under cover on, i'm on the wrong computer, but i should post pics.

3. everything the ziptied MAF mechanic didn't touch will be perfectly fine

4. there is a birds nest in the cabin air filter

fix #2, and you'll have a really nice car
Hey thanks for sharing. What is funny, and maybe you saw this as well, but you can almost date the 'fixes' by how much dirt is covering them. Whoever owned this car last is responsible for the zip tie mayhem and shoddy battery hookups. Some of the other random broken stuff looks older. Just glad that whoever that last owner was didn't have it for long.

I'm sure we'll find plenty of other surprises.

On a side note, MNAO said they could not tell me how many engines it has had replaced, which is hard to believe..lol. They did confirm though its had all the reflashing done. I guess we'll try calling the dealerships in the Carfax service history.

I say 3 engines, JP-X says 4. 1 can of seafoam goes to the winner...lol.
Old 05-10-2013, 02:05 PM
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pm me the vin, and i'd be happy to check the warranty history.
Old 05-13-2013, 09:43 PM
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Thanks to j9fd3s for the warranty history! I combined a couple car history checks along with the warranty history. Here's the NOVEL for this car.

6-20-2003 - Car rolled the assembly line in Japan
8-6-2003 - Car arrived at Chrystal Mazda (New Jersey)
9-12-2003 - Car was purchased from Chrystal Mazda
9-17-2003 - Car was registered with 10 miles on it in New Jersey
1-28-2004 - Inspection reported after an accident/incident. Damage to right front, glass damage reported.
6/27/2005 - Went in for service with 21,000 miles
8/8/2005 - 21,884 miles, went in for service again. "Engine oil/fluid leak checked"
8/17/2005 - Just 10 miles later, "Engine oil/fluid leak checked" again.
8/22/2005 - Was sold at Pohanka Honda in Maryland
10/1/2005 - At 24k miles, headlights were serviced
10/7/2005 - Car was registered in Maryland
10/28/2005 - At 26,000 miles, ENGINE REPLACED.
9/21/2006 - At 46,853 miles, TRANSMISSION REBUILT.
10/24/2006 ~ 3/2/2007 - Only 500 miles put on the car, and it was in many times for "Servicing and Checking".
6/20/2007 - Vehicle offered for sale at Pohanka of Salisbury
7/7/2007 - 63,750 miles, ENGINE REPLACED.
10/19/2007 - 63,961 miles, car listed online for sale.
11/23/2007 - Vehicle purchased.
12/12/2007 - Car registered in Virginia.
9/9/2008 - Vehicle in for new brakes, air filter, wipers, etc.
9/19/2008 - 68,100 miles, car listed online for sale.
9/23/2008 - Vehicle purchased.
9/30/2008 - 68,149 miles, car listed online for sale.
10/21/2008 - New owner registered car in Virginia.
12/10/2008 - 72,291 miles, car in for service at Hall Mazda Virginia Beach.
5/??/2008 - Both motor mounts replaced.
8/10/2008 - 86,036 miles, in for inspection at Hall Mazda Virginia Beach.
3/30/2010 ~ 3/31/2012 - Lots of registration renewals/loan or lien reported.
3/31/2013 - 153,000 miles, came in for LOW COMPRESSION.
4/1/2013 - 156,000 miles, failed Virginia state inspection.


Whew! So, it appears to be on the 3rd engine. That engine should have a 2007 build date on it with part # K008-99-008R-52.
This history check suggests a couple things.
- Not every dealer knows how to properly diagnose this car. Look at the multiple trips to the dealer right before it is sold/engine replaced.
- Not everyone has the patience to deal with this car...lol...6 previous owners!
- It was driven till it quit, and sold. Right at the end they even tried a cheap-skate aftermarket cat, and got rid of the car when it melted down.

Hopefully this week, we'll be able to check to see if that is the engine that is in the car currently.

Would be cool if any of the previous owners saw this!

Last edited by MikeTyson8MyKids; 05-13-2013 at 09:47 PM.
Old 05-14-2013, 10:56 AM
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wtf, lol ....
Old 05-20-2013, 09:21 PM
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Just a quick update:

Neither of us have had much time this past week to do much. JP-X did get a chance to mess a bit with it today. He knocked the melted core out of the cat and bolted it all back together. He fired it up and let it idle and revved it a bit for 15-20 minutes or so to check for leaks, stalling etc. It did reach operating temp fine, and it idled just fine as well. So, that is good news at least. Looks like it has got a water leak at the front around the radiator somewhere. More to come on that!
Old 05-21-2013, 09:51 PM
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Had some free time tonight to work on it. We spent most of the time on the engine. The engine is the 3rd engine, and was built on the 180th day in 2007, so that means it has approx 90k miles on it.

He'll chime in with home compression test results and some more legendary stupid stuff we found on it. LOL
Old 06-03-2013, 07:47 PM
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So 2 weeks ago this past Sunday I picked up an OEM cat with about 54k miles on it for $225. MikeTyson8MyKids found it for me on craigslist not too far away. I took a couple pictures of it once I got it home.





I wasn't about to put this cat on before knowing the health of the engine. Since I didn't want to have to wear earplugs while working on this thing, that night I took the aftermarket cat and went through the redneck conversion from no-flow to high-flow. There was also the secondary benefit of not pissing off all my neighbors.
Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-oem-cat.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-oem-cat-face.jpg  
Old 06-03-2013, 07:58 PM
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Once I got the aftermarket cat out, I got a better picture of the inside face.



This is what fell on my floor just from turning it upside down. I have my hand next to it so you can get a general idea of how large/small the pile is.



I then took a piece of electrical conduit, and broke up the remainder of the first cat brick. Here is a picture of a pile of the rest of the first brick next to what I previously dumped out onto my floor. Notice how much less burned this pile looks compared to the first one.



Now in order to punch out the back brick of the cat I ended up having to use a little bit more persuasion --> enter the trusty claw hammer. With the help of my trusty hammer, that second brick didn't stand a chance. Here is a picture of the second brick on my floor. My trusty claw hammer didn't want to miss the photo op.



And now a picture of the inside of the cat, now that the work had been completed. It is now officially a "high-flow cat".

Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-cat-before.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-cat-dump.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-cat-knockdown-1st-brick.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-cat-2nd-brick.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-cat-now-high-flow.jpg  

Old 06-03-2013, 08:18 PM
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The following day, I had to do some routine maintenance on my daily driver. So I decided to finally let this thing idle and warm up. It got up to temp, and seemed to be holding a steady idle. I was going to just let it idle there until I got done working on my daily driver. But then, about 15-20 min after start-up, I noticed this:



Before I shut the car down, I took a look around to see where the leak was coming from. I looked through the grille and followed a stream of coolant across the front to the top of the radiator somewhere. More on this to follow. I shut the car down and just finished my maintenance on my daily driver.
Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-coolant-leak.jpg  
Old 06-03-2013, 09:40 PM
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This brings us to Tuesday 2 weeks ago. Paul had a few hours free after work to come over and help work on it. We started by connecting a vacuum gauge to a port on the bottom side of the intake manifold just a few inches or so downstream of the MAF. It was pulling about 16inHg and holding steady ... until it got up to temp. Here is a short video of what we saw once it got up to temp.


As you can hear, based on the results, Paul thought there was a side seal or rotor face issue of some sort. Before we ended up having to go the the parts store to pick up a compression tester, we decided to check out a few more things. We pulled the entire intake upstream of the throttle body off.

We decided to switch out the coils and check the spark plugs, just to make sure there wasn't an issue with the ones that were already on there. Here's a better picture of the coils with one being held on via zip tie.



Also notice how odd the wires look going into the connector on the left side of the picture. Once we got the coil bracket out we got a better look at what the previous owner did with them. I know you may all be shocked, but this didn't improve our impression of the previous owner's competence.



Look at how these are lined up on the bracket ... in particular look at the one third from the left. From our inspection of these items; it looks like all the plugs are pretty new, and the coils also appear to be newer as well. Switching these coils out didn't improve engine behavior. That's not a big surprise though. While we had the coils out we got a better view of the reman tag on the engine.



Build date 07-180 ... This is consistent with the time frame of the second engine replacement. This is as close as we can get to confirming this is the third engine currently in the car. There for the winner of our bet and a can of Seafoam is:



While we were waiting for it to warm back up, and while we had the airbox out, we decided to see if we could trace the source of the coolant leak. What we found was consistent with the quality of work of the previous owner.

Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-zip-tie-coil.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-poorly-installed-coil.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-coolant-leak-source.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-reman-tag.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-winner.jpg  


Last edited by JP-X; 06-07-2013 at 06:35 AM.
Old 06-03-2013, 10:03 PM
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While we were poking around, here are a few more things we noticed:

There is an air dam piece missing here:



Is that an aftermarket clutch cable I spy? ... Yes, it certainly appears to be.



A few more WTF moments:





Surprisingly the back calipers were just fine.

Anyway, we next went to the parts store, and I picked up a compression tester for about $30. Here are the results from our test on rotor 1:


Compression looked pretty constant across all faces, even though it may be on the low side. And now for rotor 2:


Two low bounces indicate a single damaged apex. The compression on the remaining face was lower than the compression on rotor 1. After we finished doing all that we put the intake back together. We then ran some of the Mazda decarb stuff, that Paul had with him, through the engine.

We then decided to check the oh so well know camber cam bolts to see how stuck they were. The passenger side was free, and worked flawlessly. The driver side on the other hand was a bit different. The threads on the bolt were all messed up and rusted. So the nut took some PB Blaster and a lot of Wheaties to free up, but the bolt itself could spin freely inside the bushing.

Our conclusions were that I should plate it, and start driving it to see how everything else behaves.
Attached Thumbnails C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-oil-cooler-air-dam-missing.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-new-clutch-cable.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-brake-caliper-facepalm-driver-side.jpg   C-Stock/RTR Build Thread-brake-caliper-facepalm-passenger-side.jpg  

Last edited by JP-X; 06-07-2013 at 06:37 AM.
Old 06-03-2013, 10:10 PM
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Keep up the good work (and posting up the previous owner's creations/abominations)


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