wankelingoff

Damn. I hope it works out, man.

Shumster

iTrader: (2)

This motor just got declared dead as well, 20KMs. Mazda has no idea what is going on. That's the best they could give me. Heartbroken again.

Shum

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Seriously? How did they determine that?

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

I'd really like to start pointing at the fuel system... The only time I've heard of repeated failed engines like this it's been a fuel system failure.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I don't see how anything related to the fuel system could cause an immediate failure on a NA RX-8.

Shumster

iTrader: (2)

Zero compression on Rotor 1. Same as the last 2 failures.

RIWWP, what exactly in the fuel system failed?

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

It sounds like a reman plant issue, like when they contracted Caterpillar back in the day before they built the reman plant in Virginia.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

IF it's the fuel system (yes, I'm just guessing here), I'd start with looking at the front rotor fuel injectors. If it was something shared between the rotors, i'd think that the odds would have landed on the rear rotor one of the 3 times.

If you have one injector not firing, either clogged or stuck or the harness is damaged, etc... Running stupid lean on that rotor while the front O2 is adding fuel (that only gets to the rear rotor) to balance out the target AFR. Just one guess.

Anything in the fuel system failing and not fueling when it should be fueling is a receipe for disaster.



9k, I've seen it twice before, though both of those were fuel pump failure. Lean spike and boom.

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

I'm not saying it IS the fuel system. But the odds are stacking against it being a reman facility problem imo. Those problems are typically cooling system failures that die 4,000-10,000 miles after installation, or simply DoA. Engines that test out fine on installation but only last a short distance after doesn't really sound like a reman problem to me.

Sounds like something that hasn't been changed is the culprit, and I don't know of anything that would do that other than the fuel system.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I dunno, I don't see an NA engine detonating to the point of causing zero compression. The remans are supposed to be tested before they leave but who knows, that info is from Sleepyz who worked there and that was years ago.

Shumster

iTrader: (2)

Thanks for all your advice and support guys.

The fuel injectors were inspected and tested after the first reman failed. They were determined good.

I'm going to fly back to Calgary. I need to work, and staying out here waiting for her to be fixed is consuming me. Hopefully they will be able to figure it out and I'll be able to come back and drive her home.

Shum

Jastreb

iTrader: (1)

Keep in mind this 3rd engine was supposed to be an original Mazda engine, not a reman.

Shumster, was the compression on Rotor 2 still good?

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

They don't install brand new engines.

Nadrealista

maybe you should try a different dealer, perhaps installation issue..but such abrupt failures are really strange....

Shumster

iTrader: (2)

Problem is i'm on Vancouver Island and this is the only dealer without taking a ferry.

Rotor 2 compression was normal.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

There is not really anything they could do during the install that I can think of that would cause zero compression in the #1 rotor housing. It has to be an assembly issue.

Shumster

iTrader: (2)

Possibly, but remember, my original motor also lost all compression on rotor 1. The dealership had no involvement in that death

RIWWP

iTrader: (2)

I'm not going to belabor where I'd placing my bet ... but keep a wide perspective on it and remember that there is a difference between a faulty component and a functioning component with a faulty electrical supply. If you have harness damage (melting, rodents, whatever) to the injectors or fuel pump, it would simulate a hardware failure, but the components still test out fine, and replacing the components would never solve the issue.

Not saying that's it, just an example of another perspective to think about.

I'll wait to see what they eventually find.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Yeah I know people will generally say the rear rotor fails due to the excess heat at the rear of the engine but here locally I have seen two or three with a loss of compression on the front housing so it is not rare at all to see.

G_ man

iTrader: (2)

WTF is going on sorry to hear of all your troubles, I was really pulling for you to have a good safe trip home and all is good but only 20 km. Like 9k says keep your chin up it will get worked out.

Shumster

iTrader: (2)

Thanks G Man, and everyone. It really means the world to me that you guys will take time out of your day to give advice and support.

I'm only 19 and my 8 has seen me through some of the hardest times in my life. I broke my leg really badly a few years ago requiring 4 reconstructive surgeries, and I can't count the number of times getting into my 8 for a midnight cruise has kept me sane.

It's only fair that I see it through this.

Sorry if I just turned this thread into group therapy, ha

Oh and RIWWP, I just got off the phone with Mazda and mentioned fuel injectors and electrical possibilities, they are still waiting to here back from Regional Ops. Will update when I know more.

poacherinthezoo

Just to recap the course of events to try and wrap my head around what transpired, as per your previous posts (correct me if I mess anything up):

1) Spirited drive with under 1/4 tank of fuel to the gas station
2) Filled up on gas and washed the car
3) Drove for ~20 minutes without issue (km's covered not specified - very easily could have been 20-30 km's just like engine's #2 and #3) before the car misfired, power loss, and then the engine died
4) Intake filter was described as "wet" (7ish days after the engine misfired and died) - no smell noted suggesting it isn't likely fuel but water or another odorless liquid. Also, a litany of codes thrown, almost all related to the intake system (P2109, P0113, P0506, P2004, and P2005).
5) Compression test showed rotor 1 had zero compression (rotor 2 ok ?)
6) Reman engine put in, 300 km's later misfires and dies. Compression test shows rotor 1 with no compression and rotor 2 ok (?)
7) Reman engine #2 is put im, 20 km's later stumbles on start up, followed by power loss and limp mode (no misfires)
8) Compression test shows rotor #1 with zero compression and rotor #2 ok



3 engines all dead due to rotor #1 losing compression without a corresponding compression loss in rotor #2. I don't think it's a coincidence or simply due to DOA remans, the probability is just too low (but not impossible).

I can't help but get caught up on the wet air filter, and list of associated codes being thrown. What possible fluid could have made the filter wet other than water from the car wash? I'm not familiar with the layout of the non-stock intake that was on at the time (but reverted back to stock after engine #1) but coolant would smell, and wash fluid is on the other side of the engine bay.

Regardless, as we all know, water/conductive fluids and electronics don't mix well, and the wet air filter suggests the possibility that water got into some portion of the engine bay. However, I can't think of any specific electrical component failure that would cause such a quick death to rotor #1 (that doesn't belabor RIWWP's aforementioned points). eOMP to rotor #1? They checked the lines for clogs but didn't specify if the electric pumps were both functioning.


Did you monitor fuel trims or lambda values via OBDII by any chance?

Shumster

iTrader: (2)

Poach, you are correct in that timeline.

It's an AEM intake and I've had it on forever, through tons of rain, car washes, snow ect. And have never had an issue with it. They checked the OMP after the first reman death per Mazda's request and it was fine.

Fairly confident in saying it was water

Each compression test rotor 2 was apparently good. However I never saw any actual numbers.

Fuel trim? Do you mean AFR? I was monitoring it and it was between 14.5:1 and 15:1

Coolant temps were around 205F-190F

Nadrealista

and all of this happened on the same tank of gas?

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Guys, DOA remans were fairly common back in the day, I can think of three longtime members here who went thru a similar situation (PDXhak, Alneilson, and Hoss-05). The are hand built engines when new and hand built when re manufactured.