SilverEIGHT

I have not been posting in the general forums in a while and I am ashamed to say that when I peruse the new threads now, it seems that what was once a very informative and helpful brotherly like atmosphere has now become a battle ground for those that are new to the car/forum and those that have been around for a while or at least think they are knowledgeable. I'd like to see this forum get back to a more helpful atmosphere like I remember everyone being when I first joined. Everyone was really great and made me feel welcome. Now, it seems that if you are a newbie and ask a simple question there are some that think it funny to blast the new guy just because he/she is not knowledgeable and has not done a search.

It's not everyone and in a lot of cases, it's not those that have been around for a long time. Seems like a lot of recently joined members that want to be in the experienced category and look big. Most of the older members I think know where I'm coming from.

I'm not sure what it would take to rectify this but I know if I was a new member and got the responses I see, I'd leave and would not check back. This forum was one of the main reasons I purchased my 8 and have kept it. I do search and I am careful where and what I say but I do speak from the heart and with thought to what my comments are actually saying and what impact they may have on someone, especially a newbie.

My skin is pretty thick and I really don't take any crap from anyone anymore. Some of you just ignore my comments and that's fine. A new person may not have developed the skills needed to weather such comments. They may be new to posting in threads period and that's just not a good way to help people.

I'd like to think this is a positive atmosphere where we guide people to the right places and help them get comfortable with the community. I have a lot of friends on the GA forum that don't come here anymore because of this type of attitude. Anyway, those are just some of my thoughts as to the atmosphere here. Let's help not hurt.

NgoRX8

iTrader: (1)

I do agree that this forum has changed for the worse. That's why I have been stuck at under 8000 posts for so long. lol......... A lot of these new threads make me wish I hadn't clicked on the link. About 80% of the threads seem to have new members thinking they're all big and start thread jacking.

ZoomZoomH

iTrader: (1)

you should check out NASIOC if you think the n00b bashing here is bad, lol

8 Maniac

iTrader: (1)

Wrong section. I kind of see what you mean, but it seems like some people dont even want to try... to them this forum is a place where they can have everything handed to them and then never contribute anything to the forum themselves. This is honestly the first forum I joined and actively monitored and posted in. I have asked some questions that have already been addressed but I have found most of my answers through searching... most searches are quick but, believe it or not, I've actually read through some of those 100+ page threads to find my answers. When I post for someone to search or something, it's because they ask a question that could be answered quicker if they actually tried than the time it takes to start the new thread and then check back later. I'm not trying to be mean when I respond in a manner like that... but we dont need the forum bogged down with 3000 threads saying "what exhausts are there for the rx-8?". Now if they narrow it down to 2, explain some certain qualifications etc, it then becomes a more specific question with a more specific answer that is actually worth answering.

btw, this topic has been discussed many times before, it results in the 2 sides supporting their position and then nothing actually changes. This type of thread pops up just as often as those "my rx-8 is not broken, is something wrong?" threads. The truth is, if these guys want their answers, they almost have to stay around. I'm guessing if they want it that bad, they'll take that "search noob" advice.

Jedi54

iTrader: (7)

I agree Silver. It's always easy to yell at the n00bs and tell them to SEARCH, but we were all new at one time, we need to remember that.

I'll continue to try and help out the newer members whenever I can.

Revvittupp

I know when I joined the forum, I read for two full weeks, and that was after having worked at Mazda Dealerships for several years, having read the vast majority of articles abotu the car in the last 5 years, and being in general fairly knowledgeable about cars. I learned how to search before I posted, and furthermore made my VERY FIRST post a gift to the forum, a roughly 1000 word "essay" looking into the anatomy of a car deal. I had received some advice reading, and tha led me to my first couple of "mods", so I made a gift back.

I, personally, think that it is IMPERATIVE that a new user read first, search second, and post THIRD, when they are unable to find the answer. I'm not sure if the board allows such programing, btu a good idea would be to have a "start new thread" button show up ONLY after 100 thread views or something to that nature.

Razz1

^ yep you got it right.
Read the stickies, do a couple of searches and then you will know what to ask for.

By the way shud I buy an RX 8 or Civic?

Schimmle

I will admit myself that I read the forum for months before I joined. I was pretty sure that after all the bashing on the noobs I was ready to jump in. I feel I did pretty well myself. I still have slip ups from time to time, but I truely believe that the months I wasn't a member and just brushing up on the site really helped. It also helped me learn different personalities of some of the members.

You also have to remember that when a lot of you joined a lot of the information was new and there were always new and interesting posts being made. There isn't much new to discover.

Now being years since the 8 first came out, finding older ones cheap is getting easier and easier. This means that younger and younger can now afford. The younger you get the less you want to wait and the more you want to be spoon fed. We live in a society that we basically have all kinds of information at our finger tips. We're just getting more greedy as time goes on.

Anyways I could rant on forever about this and I'm sure you don't care to read any more, but I do tend to agree with what is being said. Most of the good topics were all started years ago.

User24

iTrader: (1)

If the kind of nonsense going on today, was the same kind of nonsense going on in Nov 2004 when you joined, the responses in 2004 would have been the same.

"This has been discussed many times:

-link, link, link, link, link"

The truth is, people who tell people to search, or link to previous exact same topics, are preserving the value of 4 years worth of discussion.

If you really expected us to write up the full deal every time someone asks a question, then there'd be no use for a search feature or archive at all. Why save any discussion topics that are older than 12 hours?

Sometimes the politeness runs out and somebody is just going to get mowed down like the grass.

This has been and always will be the greatest 8 club on the internet. The fact that people, including myself, need to get hit hard in order to learn lessons and develop further is nothing new. You are probably more of a "mentorship" role model, but there are other applicable models of leadership that are equally valid.

lilturbododge

i have to say, i have been on forums for about 6-8 years now...wow!!! and each one is new and the counter starts off at...0...its like with every new place you go, you dont know where to look and everything is different. I agree with the search first, but some people have searched, but not for the right word...but instead of blasting them to search, either dont leave a comment, or leave a link to goto...but if i say my car is making a weird noise, you may have already looked and could not find the same lil noise.....but also while typing you dont know that persons on the other side and know if they are joking, being serious or whatever....i guess just dont post crap if you dont have anything to say

mysql

I read about a month before purchasing my Rx-8. Even back in early 2004, there was a ton of information here, so much info that I didn't have to ask any noob questions. It was already here for the taking.

SilverEIGHT

A lot of valid points on both sides. I understand the need to keep 4 years of information in tact and also the need for new members to use the search feature. I just think that the problem is an attitude issue. For example look at these two responses:

Search noob!

or

Welcome to the club and congratulations on your new RX-8! You may want to check out the thread (xxx) for the info you are requesting. Please make sure you read the stickie post as they are VERY important and that you do a search as most every question has already been answered.

I know this subject has been discussed before and I hate to bring it up again but this forum has been very important to me over the past 4 years and it makes me hurt when I see people having a door slammed in their face and treated like crap.

I read this forum for about 6 months and I finally joined because I wrecked my car. I got a LOT of support and I got some that said I got what was coming. It was those that cared that helped me through one of the worst times in my life. Mine was a lot more serious than oil viscosity but to some that are really excited and don't know where to go to share their excitement, this should be a welcoming experience.

EDIT:
I hope this thread will stay in the RX-8 Discussion forum and not be moved to the Lounge as it is intended for those posting in this forum to read.

ken-x8

IMHO, that's the best way to answer newbies. There are, of course, some first posters who have an obnoxious style and deserve a smack, but they're in the minority. And you'd think people here could tell the difference.

I've been active here for just a couple of years, and I think my post count greatly exceeds my significance here. I also subscribe to the general pricipal that forum members should not attempt to moderate other members - that's for the moderators.

But...just voicing my own tastes...I find the knee-jerk "Search, noob," or "Here's what you need" with a link to the search page, or repeated posting of the link to albino black sheep, to be more tiresome than most of the "What oil should I use" posts.

FWIW, I've found answers to almost all of my questions by browsing or searching. I think I've just started two posts asking for info. Got a great answer to the first. No answer to the second, which tells me it was unanswerable. Joined in a lot of great conversations. Hope the forum stays as friendly to all as it's been to me.

Ken

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

I can pretty much tell if the dude did his homework b4 posting.

then I will decide what to do, if "i think" he did not do his/her homework, the answer will be either "search, you n00b" or "not doing anything"

I might be a bit harsh(a lot of times), but seriously speaking, they gave people a chance to yell at them(by not doing their research, just want answers), dont ya think ?

Sushi

Excellent point Silvereight. Nothing more annoying than an internet forum kid who thinks he is so awsome that they are rude to those that dont know. I guess it makes them feel good about them selves to blast noobs, but in the end it only makes them look pathetic, if you cant respond in a mature manner, then dont, nothing makes a forum look more lame then forum tough guys that bully around noobs.

Flashwing

One thing I learned both here on RX8 club and also within the rotary community locally to me is that those with experience all got it the same way. They aquired it on their own either by wrenching on their own vehicle or by reading the wealth of information that is offered here.

I wouldn't be surprised to see everyone contributing and helping each other back in 2004. Everyone was still learning the quirks of the engine and the car in general. We've now had 4 years of information built up in this website so nearly every novice question has been answered several times.

Doing research into topics and upgrades shows dedication and seriousness. Doing your homework shows others you're really interested in learning and understanding the car which is the key to success with the RX8 in my opinion.

When someone comes online asking "so, how much boost can the rotary handle?" or "is it safe to redline this car?" I know right away they have been here 5 minutes and gave up on reading.

I spent the better part of a year lurking around this website for everything I could get my hands on. Turbos, Nitrous, porting, the long threads about testing and teardowns. I had maybe 200 posts when 2008 came around and I've owned by car since December of 05.

People help those who help themselves. If you can't demonstrate at least that much then SEARCH NOOB!

alz0rz

iTrader: (41)

Give it a rest.. these aren't the Civic forums.

Flashwing

No, that's true. Compared to many other forums people are given easy treatment here.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

no offense but people who said "those elites suppose to help the n00bs" are the ones that never actually helped anybody, at least not much.

SilverEIGHT

On our local forum we have a policy of making sure every new member is treated like they just walked into our house and we greet them like a friend. No matter what the question and how little searching they did. You get the same questions a lot of times but we have found that most new members (that bother to post) do want to communicate intelligently, they just need to get acclimated, learn the personalities of the people they are communicating with and then they settle in and are great active members that come to events or just have fun online.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying be nice to everyone no matter what they say. I have on occasion been very vocal about something someone has said on this forum. I have a couple classics (in my on mind ) that I'm very proud of. As some of you have said, you can tell if someone has done their homework. You also can make the choice of responding with a nudge or a hammer. If nudging doesn't do the trick then I'm all for the hammer. I guess I'd just like to see the subtle approach at first then turn the dobermans loose if you smell blood.

nycgps

iTrader: (1)

that dog looks mean .... puppy puppy puppy :P

Rotr8

iTrader: (2)

Both side s are correct in the issue. For the four years that Ive been a member (you can see that my count is only mid 200s extremely low) I ve used this forum as a tool to diagnose and understand what exactly is going on with my car. I would have no problem thinking about exactly what I wanted to know and search for it. I aggree with that now I have flamed a couple of newbs only recently, but this was out of frustration and a prescence of laziness on the newbs behalf. There are plenty of newbs that construct well thought out concerns or questions as well and the dont get bashed. This pattern of posting generalized questions(some of which you can even do a two second google search for) has flooded the forum with to much useless garbage to the point at which when I go to search for something I have to filter thru 90% complete crap to find what I wanted to know. And to the newbs credit this maybe what they have to deal with as well, so it seems to be a spiraling problem... not quit sure what to do about it, but personally I will try control myself when over generalized and repetitive questions are asked as new post....

SilverEIGHT

Yea, I think someone mentioned that the cars are cheeper now and that brings in a new crop of drivers that before couldn't afford them. Our car was at one time a selective group of enthusiast. Now it's appealing to those that are comparing prices of used cars. I was told yesterday that you can get a NEW 2008 for $20K as advertised in the newspaper. I've not seen that myself but that is unbelievable. With the cost of the used 8's getting down so low now, this forum is going to keep getting new members with the same questions.

I wonder if maybe there should be a New Member forum? Maybe a section for newcomers that are required to spend a given amount of time in that section before moving on? They could post all they wanted in that forum. They could read all the forums but just not post outside of the New Member one. I don't have an answer, just trying to see if there is a possibility of something that might start them off gradually? A moderator could be the one to guide them and give them a pass to the next level of posting?

mysql

There's a sticky FAQ somewhere around here. Any noob questions should be going there and people just link to that.

To be named later

Speaking as one of the newbies..............

I can say that I have always been treated respectfully and cordially by the more experienced veterans of this fourm, and that goes for the "new, yet think they are experienced" crowd as well.

And believe me, I have had a billion questions, and probably each and every one was a no brainer, softball pitch type question they have heard again and again. And I have never been treated rudely.

Why even yesterday, I had a question about oil and after perusing all the stickies and searching I did not find a related topic, so I started a thread. Apparently, it was a repeat of a couple day old thread that I missed and I was politely informed where I could go to find that answer.

Personally, I consider it very discourteous to expect you guys to do my research for me. I consider it discouteous to expect you guys to regurgitate the same information over and over when somewhere on a sticky, the same question has been asked and has been answered in-depth. And often it has been answered by folks experienced with RX8's, rotary engines, specific components, etc. In the case of newbies, it is to their advantage to go to a thread chock full 'o' information on the topic they are seeking, rather than to get a limited and cursory overview in some new thread that they start.

The stickies, and some older threads, contain the accumulated wisdom and knowledge of RX8 and rotary-heads........I see no problem with referring new members to these threads.

Can the new members be asked to search for stickies and the subject they are interested in before asking questions, in a nicer manner? I guess so, in some instances, maybe.

But in the same sense, some members, when asked nicely to do a simple search, react as if they have been insulted and smeared and as if their dog was kicked. They take offense to being asked to do a search.

But bottom line, my point is I have asked a thousand questions and have never been treated unfairly or rudely.

And respectfully, as a newbie I have not observed any sort of negative atmosphere. I still see the veteran RX8 owners and veteran rx8club.com members going out of their way to help new guys like me, and for that I am appreciative.