RX-ed

Hi all,

I'm having a heck of a time getting Mazda to honour their engine replacement warranty - in fact they denied my claim today. I do all of my maintenance myself and basically their argument is that providing receipts from oil and filters I purchased is not enough to prove to them the oil was put in the car!

Now I am sure I am not the only one in this community who chose to do this: it's much cheaper and frankly, I don't trust most service centres with my rotary. I am fighting Mazda's decision and would like to hear from others who do their maintenance and have successfully gotten a new engine under the warranty.

What have you provided to prove to Mazda that the maintenance was done?

For those interested, you can find the entire story here: https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...=1#post4087383

Thanks in advance for the replies!!

RX8Soldier

iTrader: (24)

Have you thought about taking legal action? If you have proof, they must obey your claim

RX-ed

RX8 member Bladecutter also suggested going that route in my other thread... I will definitely consider it as a last resort.

bose

iTrader: (5)

That's balogna, go to another dealer if possible. I was never asked for any proof of oil changes, I do my own maintenance as well.

RX-ed

Well the problem is, it's not the dealer asking for this, it's Mazda Canada. Going to another dealer would likely lead to the same result since MazCan are the ones approving the request.

ShinkaEvo

iTrader: (3)

What's their reason for denying your claim?

RX8Soldier

iTrader: (24)

^Check the other thread in the OP. Not enough maintenance history...

RX-ed

The reason for denial is essentially that they don't believe I did the maintenance even though I provided receipts that show when I purchased the oil, filters, etc.

The point of this thread is to find other members who have successfully gotten a replacement engine and do their own maintenance. I would like to know what they had to provide to Mazda in order to be approved.

WhiteDealershipRice

Have a lawyer write them a letter citing the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act as precedent.

Even though it is US and not Canada law, It can be used to set legal precedent for a lawsuit for failing to honor a warranty.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuso...s_Warranty_Act

Bassically, a dealer/ manufacturer cannot force you to use their chosen parts/services holding your warranty as "hostage" for it if equivalent aftermarket parts are availble.

Sometimes the credible threat of a lawsuit is enough to bring wayward buisnesses back in line. (as the hassle, negative publicity & expense of a lawsuit eats more into their profit margin than getting the repair done)

RX-ed

^^This is great info - thank you for sharing. This is aligned with and supports the angle I am taking with my "defense". My argument is that Mazda can't force an owner to go to a service center to do their maintenance, whether it is a Mazda dealership or any other service center.

This is an excerpt from the rotary "engine core limited warranty" document:

4. Your responsibilities:
Maintenance:
You are responsible for properly operating and maintaining your Mazda vehicle in accordance with the instructions described in your Owner's Manual. If your vehicle is used under severe driving conditions, you should follow Schedule 2 of the maintenance requirements described in your Owner's Manual.
Maintenance Records:
You must maintain records to show that required maintenance has been performed.
The "Scheduled Maintenance Record" in your Warranty Information booklet should be filled in when scheduled maintenance is performed. Keep all receipts and make them available in case questions about maintenance arise.

Based on this, I don't see how MazCan can justify the denial by saying my receipts do not demonstrate maintenance was done since I own the vehicle.

ken-x8

Did you fill in the booklet like they say? If not, and they have not yet seen the blank one, this would be a good time to fill it in.

Ken

oltmann

Some quick googling tells me that the relevant law is section 77 of the Canadian Competition Act.
Perhaps it would be worthwhile to make a complaint to the Competition Bureau.
http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/e...g/h_03167.html

An inquiry from a govmt beauracrat might push things up the chain of command at Mazda Canada.

RX-ed

I have not, but I can easily do that. I track all of my maintenance info on Fuelly. I can't check right now because I am at work, but I imagine the booklet would have been in the car (glove box maybe?) when I bought it... unless it's in the Owner's Manual? I will check tonight.

RX-ed

Another excellent find / suggestion, thank you.

I have called Mazda again this morning and requested a review. They asked me to fax all of the information again, which I did. This review will be done by a different person/department, and it seems it would be easier for them to obtain the info again directly from me vs. getting it from the other dept. The rep said it could take up to two weeks for their review.

Am I in uncharted territory here or has someone else gone through this before?

WhiteDealershipRice

If both US law & the Canadian Competition act has laws "in the books" for this kind of stuff, it is fair to say that this kind of tomfoolery has happened in the past (and unfortunately is more common than one would hope)

Nop, not in uncharted territory, just "getting the standard runarround" from the dealership, in the hopes that you run out of patience and give up and pay for the new engine yourself.

Once they have you frustrated enough at the car, don't be surprised if they offer to take it off your hands "for a very fair trade... condidering the condition the engine is in" LOL

ken-x8

I've never visited Fuelly, but if what you log there has miles and dates that could be useful support. The only time I ever saw anyone write something in an owner's manual was when a VW dealer noted the mileage difference when they replaced a speedometer. But lots of us keep maintenance logs in notebooks, spreadsheets and on-line sites.

Ken

zoom44

print the log from fuelly. if that doesnrt make then rethink it then you need a lawyer. all you need is proof of purchase and a record show dates of maintenance. more than likely you dont need proof of purchase. if you owned your own service center and did the maintenance there without "purchasing" the items from you business you wouldnt have receipts. the record with dates etc should be enough.

if they want to be really strict how can they "prove" they ever do the required maintenance on their customers cars? if all they have is a written record of the date and what they say they did. where's their proof the old oil was taken out and new oil put in?

RX-ed

^^All very good points and suggestion guys, much appreciated. This is really helping me build my argument, hopefully I don't need to end up having to go to court over this, but I will if I have to.

Now, I have to admit I am a bit surprised no one has chimed in yet that were in a similar situation in the past and who have successfully gotten Mazda to honor the warranty... maybe I need to give this thread some time for more members to see it.

wrightcomputing

iTrader: (5)

I think going to a different dealership is a good idea, or maybe trying to speak to the guys manager who told you no

RX-ed

Not sure if you had a chance to read the entire thread, but the dealership has been cooperating, it's Mazda Canada who are not approving the claim. I think going to a different dealer would likely lead to the same outcome since it's not the dealer's call ultimately. That's my current understanding based on all of the communications I have had with the different parties.

RX-ed

I don't have much time to post so I"ll keep my update short...

After weeks of calls and escalations, I finally had enough last Friday and filed a complaint against Mazda with the Ontario Better Business Bureau.

Surprise surprise, two business days later (today) I get a call from the dealership: they are replacing my engine under the warranty, no questions asked. Mazda suddenly gave their approval.

So for those out there who are being given a hard time - DON'T give up and stick to your guns. I said earlier I was going pitbull on them and I was ready to go the distance... Well they eventually relented.

Thanks to all who made useful suggestions!

...and did I mention I was getting a new engine??

WOOT!

Bladecutter

Well that's fantastic news to hear from you.
I was wondering if Canadians just keep getting anally violated by Mazda, but you finally turned the tables on them!

Congrats!

BC.

RX-ed

Thanks, I'm glad I didn't need to take it to court to finally get resolution!

My engine was ordered today, but apparently it will be coming all the way from Japan so it will likely be a few more weeks. I'm crossing my fingers for a completely new one, since they are currently backordered. One can dream, right?

1.3_LittersOfFurry

iTrader: (4)

Congratulations!!

Karack

without hearing Mazda's side of the story we can only assume certain things. was enough proof of maintenance provided and logged correctly?

even though the 8 has a bad reputation for their motors and warranty you still have to look at it from a business perspective. you certainly don't just hand out a motor because there is a warranty, there is plenty of outlined conditions that have to be met for the warranty to HAVE to be honored.

i would have to assume myself that the proof of maintenance here wasn't quite sufficient but close enough that a court case wasn't worth the hassle. this is a lesson to the OP(and everyone reading who still has warranty coverage) to log everything, be sure the maintenance is done on time(not 3 months/2k miles overdue), and all reciepts kept and organized.

not that this is the case here but as an example.. many years ago we had a customer bring her van in with a failed engine, it still had oil in it but wouldn't run. only took a minute to find the original oil filter still attached to the engine with the "factory installed" stamp on it. this particular car had ~45k miles. we did not honor their warranty and both we(the dealership) and manufacturer did not cave in to the "warranty" as the stipulations of the warranty had obviously not been met. they had to pay out of pocket for a new engine and none of us had any sympathy. the oil in this particular car also appeared to be the original oil that the car was shipped with, well from what we could gather anyways as it was more like thick fudge compared to actual oil by this point.

sometimes the dealership can be helpful in getting coverage passed, sometimes they can also do the opposite and discredit coverage that usually would be covered by the manufacturer(usually because they don't like you or do not think they will make any money off of the job, which is not right and partly why i don't work for dealers anymore).