FX-RX8

Well this is really disturbing to me since I'm a car nut and always have bought new cars for the simple reason that I dont trust who or how the used car was dirven and what was done to it....accidents....engine damage.....etc.....
This past saturday I took my 2004 RX8 to Carmax to get it appraised so i can get an idea on how the car's value was and if It had enough value to end my lease early by trading it in (maybe for a ms6). The appraisal came back at 16000$ for 2004 RX8 GT apperance pkg 6 spd with 20k miles but thats not the bad news the appraisal had some notes in the bottom saying that the rear end of the car was totaly painted (maybe involved in a lite accident or scratches) from the suicide doors to the back including the deck lid. This was news to me since I bought this car at Gunther mazda BRAND NEW!! and this was never dissclosed to me by any documentation at the time of signing the lease agreement. I went straight to Gunther after I left Carmax and spoke to my sales man who told me that he would ask his manager and distric manager for Mazda and get more info but that him or the dealer had no idea about this.
I did some research of my own and pulled the CarFax report on the car and nothing is on it, clean car.
I dont know if I am gonna get any further into the matter but it really bothers me and now more defintly want to get rid of the car, it just doesnt feel good to know that the car was repainted some time.

Ike

If the car were to fall off the truck, get backed into on the lot, something along those lines, I wouldn't put it past a dealer to fix it and sell it as new. In some states there is probably nothing illegal about doing so, even if it isn't illegal it sure is shady.

RX26b

Here in Illinois, dealers aren't required to notify new car buyers unless the damage to the vehicle exceeds X percent . I believe it's 7 but don't quote me on it. Your state is probably similar or same.

Now, who knows the different ways they can fudge the numbers so as not to disclose anything and sell these repaired cars as new. Dealers have a very powerful lobby in most states and they cover their a$$es pretty well.

If it was me, I'd get multiple body shop quotes and ascertain whether the damage exceeded the state's allowance for damage. Then I'd hire a lawyer or wait and see what the stealer that sold you the car offers.

tiggerlee

Just because the car was partially painted doesn't necessarily mean it was involved in an accident. Could very well be just some minor body work or scratches. If this is the case the dealer may not be required to disclose that.
If this wasn't the case and it was an accident repair then yes the dealer should have disclosed that before you purchased it. But in reality they'll do whatever it takes to make the sale. So it's not suprising at all. I'd get a second opinion from a body shop.

RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

If your car was involved in an accident, you have an absolute legal basis to get a full refund of your purchase price from the dealer.

Pay a competent shop or individual an inspection fee to verify if this is the case, especially focusing on replacement parts, overspray, and frame issues.

BoilerX8

Or maybe carmax was just talking $hit to reduce the apprisal...

Roto, FX never said anything about the car being in a lawsuit...

RotoRocket

iTrader: (1)

I meant "accident."

Fixed it.

StewC625

Having worked in the biz 20 years ago, there's dozens of things that can cause a car to have had paint repair being sold as new:

- Key scratches - common as hell on lots ...
- Minor transport damage
- Major transport damage
- "rail dust" - ferrous metal shavings that are generated during rail transport of a car that settle on the finish and rust - light colored cars can get ruined finishes from this. That's why so many new cars now come in coated in plastic film on the trucks
- hail

etc.

Chances are it wasn't in an accident, but it's quite possible it had paint repairs.

Ike

Illinois is about the worst place in teh country to buy a used car. In fact many WI dealers send their less than desirable cars to IL because IL choses to protect the dealers rather than the consumers.

http://news.findlaw.com/prnewswire/2...r20061607.html

snap-on

If this was port damage the "stealer" may have no clue there was paintwork done.

EyeBall Fixer...(o)(x)

First off its a LEASE car which means it isn't your car, you're just paying to use it.
Why get your panties in a wind over this?
Your lease is up soon and you'll be able to put this all behind you.

Have a Coke and a

PS:
My 8 had hail damage that I knew nothing about until I took it in to the
"Dent Doctor" for door ding repair. The service guy told me that he'd
worked on my car before while it was at the dealership....

Was I mad?
Yup.
I just won't give my local dealership my business again.

CelticFan

Hate to tell you guys but this happens all the time. In most states if not all of them if a car is damaged and it's not over a certain % of the car value they don't have to tell you anything and can sell it as new. That's why I look cars over VERY carefully when I buy one. I've been told by car sellers that I'm the most **** person they have ever seen but I'm going to know what has or has not been done to my future car before I buy it. If I can't see anything then it A: never been hit or B: they did such a good job that I can't tell.

StewC625

Interesting because my last three Acuras were wholesaled by the leasing company and wound up in Wisconsin ... whodathunkit?

Actually, your comment is very true: Back in 1987, my wife's Acura Integra wound up in a flood, and was totalled - and turned up in a used lot in Wisconsin. It had a Wisconsin title somehow - and the IL salvage title disappeared in some way. I found out about it when the person who bought the car called about six months after the car had been replaced. He called because he found my wife's business card up behind the dash when he was replacing the radio - apparently it floated there in the flood. He kept finding evidence of water damage. Needless to say he was pissed off that he bought a totaled car. He called me about 2 weeks later and said he'd managed to put together the trace-back on it - after my insurance company totalled it out to us, they sold it at auction in the Chicago area to an independent used dealer near Rockford, IL. That dealer most likely cleansed the title somehow, and apparently rolled back the odo (as the guy said it only had 18,000 miles on it - and my signed odo statement when the ins. co. bought it from us said 36,000), then it went back to the auction, presumably sold for a much higher sum, and that's when it went to Wisconsin to a used dealer in Whitewater, where this guy bought it. Needless to say, he was even more mad when he found out the car had been clocked as well as having a false title. I faxed him the total report from my ins. co., and my odo statement and never heard from him again. Hope I helped him.

Stew

Ike

Wow, that's quite the story... I don't know how they do it, but I do know that they have ways of "cleansing" a title in Illinois, some loophole in the law, or perhaps it's illegal but they can still manage a way of doing so.

DaGnome

Gunther Mazda... doesn't surprise me.

Take a look at my post and issues with thier service dept, specifically thier 'painting' of my car..

https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...6&page=7&pp=15

(My Post is on 3/7/2006 in that thread).

The only good news is that after almost a year I still cannot tell anything was done (once it was done right).

BunnyGirl

Since I special ordered mine, the dealer told me if my car was damaged I had the option of getting the damage repaired or they would order a new one for me to replace it. Of course, that would be about another four months to wait for a car if this happened.

FX-RX8

This is what the "stealer" told me.....if there was some damage done at Jacksonville Port for less than 700$ they dont disclose that to the dealer, he said that the dealer never did any repairs to it.
I pulled the Carfax report and its clean.
I am gonna get a couple of body shops to inspect the car for actual parts replacement and any damage that could be considered accident.

I'm waiting on the response from the "stealer" on my problem since the manager wasnt there on Sat.

Ill keep you guys posted.

Thnx for your opinions and more of them will be taken.

Microdot

It is against the law in most states that I am aware of to represent something for sale as new which is not. Most states carry a rather harsh financial penalty for doing so (something along the lines of $50K per instance). I don't know if your car was ever actually damaged. Or if it was damaged, I don't know if the damage exceeded the % of value as specified by the laws in your state to qualify as new. I do know, that once a consumer has taken possesion, it can no longer legally be called new.

The bottom line is, I don't know if your car qualified as "new" in your state when you bought it. ...but in light of what you've told us, it is certainly worth investigating. I know I wouldn't be comfortable taking delivery of a "new" car which previously had a known repair record. Perhaps you should consult an attorney.

Dookie_Rx-8

car dealers are such husslers.....

mkaresh

I don't remember the details, but if memory serves someone won a fairly high profile lawsuit against a BMW dealer a few years back when they found out their 7-Series had been repainted along one side because of minor damage. For some reason this case made the news, perhaps because it highlighted an issue few people are aware of.

Microdot

Actually, the law still states you can't represent something as new when it's not.
If you read my whole post in context, I stated that the laws governing "new" may vary from state to state.
I'm pretty sure it's still the case that once a customer has taken possesion it is no longer new (regardless of how many miles are on the car). In most states, dealers have the flexibility to use cars as demo's (for test drives) and still sell them as "new" Hence your 1-2K limit.

[edited for spelling]

zoom44

yep theri was abig hail storm at the Midlothian Port that damaged abunch of cars. there were/are pics of that on here some where

zoom44

couldnt fidn the hail pics- but just for kicks here's a pic of the very first batch of cars sitting at Midlothian



from this thread

https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...3678#post73678

EyeBall Fixer...(o)(x)

Hey! I think I see my Sunlight Silver there! Duh!

Protherius

DAMN!! That always pisses me off! I hate it when my new car comes painted!!! (haha jk i understood what you meant, just thought it was funny)