Is engine failure really that common?
09-12-2011, 05:08 AM
#1
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Is engine failure really that common?
Hi there,
Was thinking about buying used 2003 or 2004 RX-8, but friend of mine frightened my, said when car reaches 100 000 miles, engine is going to simply die on me and needs to be replaced and that he had 2 friends who killed engines just like that.
Now, is engine failure really that common? how much truth is in this story? maybe they did not take proper care?
Thanks
Was thinking about buying used 2003 or 2004 RX-8, but friend of mine frightened my, said when car reaches 100 000 miles, engine is going to simply die on me and needs to be replaced and that he had 2 friends who killed engines just like that.
Now, is engine failure really that common? how much truth is in this story? maybe they did not take proper care?
Thanks
09-12-2011, 05:56 AM
#2
I would say engine failure is pretty high on this car. Most problems have been adresses with ecu updates.
Mine is a 04 and is on it's 3rd engine (97k on the odo). Best advice I can give is to research more on the car before you buy it. Also make sure to get a compression test and see if you still have any kind of warranty left on the car before you buy it.
Mine is a 04 and is on it's 3rd engine (97k on the odo). Best advice I can give is to research more on the car before you buy it. Also make sure to get a compression test and see if you still have any kind of warranty left on the car before you buy it.
09-12-2011, 06:11 AM
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I think that some engine failure on this car can be linked to people not knowing how to maintain it. There are loads of salesman that sold this car without really explaining the proper way to take care of it(like checking the oil level). Also older rx8s do seem to have more problems as they were still nailing down the proper flash for the ecu.
I do not know the exact numbers for the failure rate of this engine and i'm sure nobody really does. You have to take into account hardly anyone comes onto a forum to say "the car is great and I have had 0 problems" you will pretty much be reading only complaints.
I do not know the exact numbers for the failure rate of this engine and i'm sure nobody really does. You have to take into account hardly anyone comes onto a forum to say "the car is great and I have had 0 problems" you will pretty much be reading only complaints.
09-12-2011, 04:20 PM
#6
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You really should search all of the stickies related to this topic but there is no right or wrong answer to your question.
IMO, these engines properly maintained and never overheated are good to between 75,000-100,000 miles. There are of course a couple that have gone over 100,000 miles on the original engine but they are sort of the unicorns of the RX-8 world. There is a reason Mazda had to build a plant dedicated to rebuilding the Renesis though and together with the fact that my dealer has done a few hundred RX-8 replacements I would say the failure rate is pretty high.
But, if you bought a rotary and expected Honda Civic like reliability then that was not a smart move.
IMO, these engines properly maintained and never overheated are good to between 75,000-100,000 miles. There are of course a couple that have gone over 100,000 miles on the original engine but they are sort of the unicorns of the RX-8 world. There is a reason Mazda had to build a plant dedicated to rebuilding the Renesis though and together with the fact that my dealer has done a few hundred RX-8 replacements I would say the failure rate is pretty high.
But, if you bought a rotary and expected Honda Civic like reliability then that was not a smart move.
09-12-2011, 04:36 PM
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I've blown the engine on a prior Corolla (62k), and on my Miata (114k)
My 8's engine hasn't as of 84k.
You do the math.
Ok, my personal experience may not be a typical scenario.
But you are correct. There is an ECU timer that watches the odometer for 100,000 miles, and once it's tripped, you are done. Immediately just shuts down all ignition and fuel and retracts the seals into the housing and floods the engine with coolant. New engine time.
This guy in this thread is lying: https://www.rx8club.com/rx-8-discussion-3/200000-mile-club-210536/
And I pulled everything in this thread out of my ***: https://www.rx8club.com/new-member-forum-197/new-potential-owners-start-here-202454/
My 8's engine hasn't as of 84k.
You do the math.
Ok, my personal experience may not be a typical scenario.
But you are correct. There is an ECU timer that watches the odometer for 100,000 miles, and once it's tripped, you are done. Immediately just shuts down all ignition and fuel and retracts the seals into the housing and floods the engine with coolant. New engine time.
This guy in this thread is lying: https://www.rx8club.com/rx-8-discussion-3/200000-mile-club-210536/
And I pulled everything in this thread out of my ***: https://www.rx8club.com/new-member-forum-197/new-potential-owners-start-here-202454/
The engine failure story:
Most of the engine failures were on 2004s with automatic transmissions. The 2004s in general had more issues due to the flash not adding enough oil and a few other things off the boat, and the automatics being 4-port and usually driven much more casually compounded the problem.
Compounding THAT was the original reman facility for the engine replacements did not have very good quality control, and alot of those original reman engines had improper seal clearances and other build issues that caused quite a few people to get to their 3rd or 4th engines.
MSP-16 updated the flash and improved things greatly, and happened early 2005. Mazda North America can tell you if MSP-16 was performed for any 2004 or 2005 if you give them the VIN. they also re-vamped their reman facility, and reman engines 2006+ are now usually far better than the original factory ones. So if you find a 2004, 2005, or 2006 with an engine replacement that occured late 2006 or later, don't take the engine replacement as a negative mark against the vehicle, but a positive one, as it means the engine is likely in fantastic shape, and good for quite a long time.
Plenty of 2004s were still perfectly fine.
2005s have a much reduced failure rate, 2006 further, 2007 and 2008 are relatively rare.
In 2009 they introduced further engine changes correcting several things, the most critical of which was an increase in oil pressure to RX-7 ranges (they dropped it for the 2004-2008 years for some reason), and re-introducing the center oil injector (they deleted it for the 2004-2008 RX-8s for some reason, all prior rotories had it).
I have not heard of a 2009+ engine failing yet. That doesn't mean that they won't though.
A compression test should be standard before anyone buys an 8 though, just to be on the safe side. Most dealers charge $80 to $120 to do a compression test.
Most of the engine failures were on 2004s with automatic transmissions. The 2004s in general had more issues due to the flash not adding enough oil and a few other things off the boat, and the automatics being 4-port and usually driven much more casually compounded the problem.
Compounding THAT was the original reman facility for the engine replacements did not have very good quality control, and alot of those original reman engines had improper seal clearances and other build issues that caused quite a few people to get to their 3rd or 4th engines.
MSP-16 updated the flash and improved things greatly, and happened early 2005. Mazda North America can tell you if MSP-16 was performed for any 2004 or 2005 if you give them the VIN. they also re-vamped their reman facility, and reman engines 2006+ are now usually far better than the original factory ones. So if you find a 2004, 2005, or 2006 with an engine replacement that occured late 2006 or later, don't take the engine replacement as a negative mark against the vehicle, but a positive one, as it means the engine is likely in fantastic shape, and good for quite a long time.
Plenty of 2004s were still perfectly fine.
2005s have a much reduced failure rate, 2006 further, 2007 and 2008 are relatively rare.
In 2009 they introduced further engine changes correcting several things, the most critical of which was an increase in oil pressure to RX-7 ranges (they dropped it for the 2004-2008 years for some reason), and re-introducing the center oil injector (they deleted it for the 2004-2008 RX-8s for some reason, all prior rotories had it).
I have not heard of a 2009+ engine failing yet. That doesn't mean that they won't though.
A compression test should be standard before anyone buys an 8 though, just to be on the safe side. Most dealers charge $80 to $120 to do a compression test.
09-12-2011, 04:58 PM
#8
Hi there,
Was thinking about buying used 2003 or 2004 RX-8, but friend of mine frightened my, said when car reaches 100 000 miles, engine is going to simply die on me and needs to be replaced and that he had 2 friends who killed engines just like that.
Now, is engine failure really that common? how much truth is in this story? maybe they did not take proper care?
Thanks
Was thinking about buying used 2003 or 2004 RX-8, but friend of mine frightened my, said when car reaches 100 000 miles, engine is going to simply die on me and needs to be replaced and that he had 2 friends who killed engines just like that.
Now, is engine failure really that common? how much truth is in this story? maybe they did not take proper care?
Thanks
pfft...mine went out at 65k...
*in ghost voice*
WoooOoo0o0o00oo0o0o goooo buuuuyyyy a Scionnnnnnnnn
09-12-2011, 05:24 PM
#10
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I think what kills our engine is the constant cold starting and stop and go traffic. The rotary engine is in its element at the track, not in traffic.
09-12-2011, 05:32 PM
#11
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Why must people jinx themselves 
Seriously it is hit or miss and there are multiple modes of failure. But honestly I think all will agree that getting to well over 100,000 miles is not likely. In SARX alone we have had an engine replacement in every year model Series I (04-08 for you noobs) except 2008 and mostly everyone takes pretty good care of their RX-8's. Our latest member to the new engine club is SWG in her well maintained 2007 GT manual that only had 49,000 miles or so. She had the typical hard start in hot weather, power loss when hot, and eventual stalling.
But, I also think the hotter weather plays a significant role in the failures as well.
Seriously it is hit or miss and there are multiple modes of failure. But honestly I think all will agree that getting to well over 100,000 miles is not likely. In SARX alone we have had an engine replacement in every year model Series I (04-08 for you noobs) except 2008 and mostly everyone takes pretty good care of their RX-8's. Our latest member to the new engine club is SWG in her well maintained 2007 GT manual that only had 49,000 miles or so. She had the typical hard start in hot weather, power loss when hot, and eventual stalling.
But, I also think the hotter weather plays a significant role in the failures as well.
09-12-2011, 09:15 PM
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Giorgi, do not think of an Rx8 as a good cheap car for a teenager, I went into my purchase of a 2004 (03 build) with the knowledge that I may well be buying a new engine every 50k miles.
I'll just go ahead and say right now I paid 9k flat for my car i could tell the compression was low, but I made sure it as warranty covered, bought the car got the new engine so I could know that further engine failure was on me, and didn't have to hope past owners took care of it.
The up side to this is that I now drive a car that I believe to be better than most 40000 dollar cars on the road, so I saved some money in the short term with expectations of paying more over the years.
PREMIX PREMIX PREMIX, and hey maybe in the future we'll be able to purchase and swap in a 16x
I'll just go ahead and say right now I paid 9k flat for my car i could tell the compression was low, but I made sure it as warranty covered, bought the car got the new engine so I could know that further engine failure was on me, and didn't have to hope past owners took care of it.
The up side to this is that I now drive a car that I believe to be better than most 40000 dollar cars on the road, so I saved some money in the short term with expectations of paying more over the years.
PREMIX PREMIX PREMIX, and hey maybe in the future we'll be able to purchase and swap in a 16x
09-12-2011, 09:56 PM
#16
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...said when car reaches 100 000 miles, engine is going to simply die...
There is a failure percentage that has been posted here (which I won't repeat since from me it would be hearsay), but I believe that includes the early failures that involved ATs in hot climates. I also tend to be intrigued by the number of posts from people whose engines failed despite them using oil that is not what Mazda recommends.
It's a really neat car, lots of fun to drive. But it's not a Honda. Don't buy one of these if you're not willing to accept some risk.
Ken
09-13-2011, 07:56 AM
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One would think some of these engines were built in Detroit on a Monday. Seems some die at 50k others go strong up to 200k. Throw the dice. My 04 is fine at 50k. My car has been extremely reliable so far. I take good care of it too.
09-13-2011, 08:27 AM
#18
From all the reading I have done and my experience it is really hit or miss. However, like others have said before .You only read about the bad ones. Same goes to any car forum you go too. I can't tell you how many, "problems with my car" threads are on the 350z forums (I used own one) and that car is really reliable. I am saving my money just case mine goes but I love my Eight that much that I will keep on trucking with it, if the engine dies.
09-14-2011, 09:05 AM
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Seems like your only reason for being around here is to sing praises for the Evo and talk about how you sold your RX-8 since it didn't meet your expectations. EvolutionM is that way =>
09-14-2011, 09:08 AM
#22
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You are like a broken record, do you work for Mitsubishi or something
Seems like your only reason for being around here is to sing praises for the Evo and talk about how you sold your RX-8 since it didn't meet your expectations. EvolutionM is that way =>
Seems like your only reason for being around here is to sing praises for the Evo and talk about how you sold your RX-8 since it didn't meet your expectations. EvolutionM is that way =>
no ****. Stop with the evo trolling already. OP, i'm at 97800 on my original engine in my late 04 build 05. New Yorker said it best though.
09-14-2011, 09:31 AM
#25
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Yeah it's been an interesting 7 years for me. I have gone from loving this car, to cursing and hating this car, to loving and adoring it again. I am on my fourth engine but only two of the failures were due to crappy engineering, the third failure was no fault of the engine or it's design.
But, just at my dealer alone, the engine replacements done are in the 400 range and our local member who is a tech there says he is seeing more and more 06's and 07's getting replacements so I think if you do the math you can assume the overall failure rate is pretty significant.
But, just at my dealer alone, the engine replacements done are in the 400 range and our local member who is a tech there says he is seeing more and more 06's and 07's getting replacements so I think if you do the math you can assume the overall failure rate is pretty significant.