GB: SakeBomb Garage IGN-1A Ignition Coil Kit
02-08-2016, 09:45 AM
#226
SARX Legend
iTrader: (46)
If I was pushing these on people/trying to drum up sales, or pitching them as a massive power increase (which they aren't, and never have claimed to be) I'd head down the street to the local dyno shop, do some pulls on the stock coils, head back to our shop, swap the new setup in, do some more pulls the next day on the IGN-1A's, and then post up a couple dyno graphs. Then the same skeptics *demanding* hard evidence will then nit pick that it was done on different days, different temps, age of the stock coils, what stock coil version, plug wire age, how old are the plugs, and then scratch their heads wondering how these compare to LS coils ... on and on. I'm not here to *convince* you to buy them and I don't claim it's going to supercharge your car. In the same vein, this isn't snake oil, and yes there is both a performance/drive-ability, and reliability benefit.
We spend our time developing performance parts, not marketing/selling them. I'm not here trying to spur sales, or maximize profit... I came here dumbfounded that no one made this yet, and that there are companies out there selling (of all things) LS coil retrofits for the RX8. We've tested these to death on FD's for years and found bulletproof reliability, power increases, and drive-ability benefits, and ability to support tuning/power expansion later. We slapped a prototype kit on our RX8 with no modifications/dwell time adjustments and low and behold... smother revs, punchier mid and top end. Same as nearly everyone else is reporting here. Believe it or don't...
No offense, but the RX8 is small potatoes... and the customers who buy our parts typically find us, not the other way around. We build systems/components/kits that (I believe) should speak for themselves. Those that are in the know will purchase them, those who are not please sit back, eat some popcorn, and wait to see how it shakes out.
In the mean time (instead of everyone working together to help us make sure these can be made to fit S2/RHD/non TC ABS units) I'd like to pose a few questions myself since there's so much doubt in the air
-Are the stock coils are "sufficient" and if so what's the proof?
-Why do stock coils often fail?
-Why do the LS coil retrofits also seem to fail frequently?
-How did LS coil retrofits even became a thing here, and why is that "accepted"?
-Why did Mazda use 20ga wire as +12v power wire in the ignition system, and do you think that was a good idea and or was "sufficient"?
-Where is the stock block ground vs coil ground flow path, is in relation to sensitive sensors? (as far as I can tell it's all mixed together
)-Why are the stock coils not tied to sensor ground (and if anyone here understands associated implications)?
-Why do you think these coils will fail when they've been tested to not fail under far more extreme conditions?
-Why aren't you sure they'll work on the "Renny" when they're proven to work on the 13b-REW.
You are making claims that you can't prove, that is all I am saying. That doesn't help anyone and only comes off as marketing BS. These coils and your kit should speak for themselves, there should not need to be any fairy tail claims or references (such as to use on NHRA cars, etc) to other uses that have nothing to do with our use.
-Are the stock coils are "sufficient" and if so what's the proof?
It depends on your definition of sufficient, but I would say yes, the current version C coils from mazda are sufficient for most uses and many racing classes require the use of stock coils and people use them without many issues at all
-Why do stock coils often fail?
Heat, mileage, a bad cat converter, etc
-Why do the LS coil retrofits also seem to fail frequently?
Frequently? That is a stretch. Thousands of people here have never had a problem with their D585's failing. The same can be said for uses on other platforms. My kit is 7 years old, several others locally are also at more than 5 years with many miles without issue.
-How did LS coil retrofits even became a thing here, and why is that "accepted"?
It has been a topic of discussion for many, many years, as have the Mercury coils
-Why did Mazda use 20ga wire as +12v power wire in the ignition system, and do you think that was a good idea and or was "sufficient"?
You would have to ask an electrical engineer. I believe it is sufficient for 99% of the RX-8's on the road
-Where is the stock block ground vs coil ground flow path, is in relation to sensitive sensors? (as far as I can tell it's all mixed together
)There is a condenser, and a few grounding points in the system but no stand alone ground for the coils as far as I know
-Why are the stock coils not tied to sensor ground (and if anyone here understands associated implications)?
Again, an electrical engineer with experience in vehicles could probably answer that
-Why do you think these coils will fail when they've been tested to not fail under far more extreme conditions?
I don't think these coils will fail necessarily. I LIKE THESE COILS. But they commonly fail in the boating world so let's not act like they don't have a somewhat normal failure rate
-Why aren't you sure they'll work on the "Renny" when they're proven to work on the 13b-REW
Because most here with a "renny" are running a stock untuned ECU so I don't think an apples to apples comparison is acceptable.
Last edited by 9krpmrx8; 02-08-2016 at 09:50 AM.
02-08-2016, 09:57 AM
#227
SARX Legend
iTrader: (46)
I understand 9K's Skepticism. I welcome it. It's what drives communities. Far too many times I have witnessed the blind leading the blind and communities accepting something to be factual that isn't. In scott's defense, he's been here for the long haul and seen the wrong doings of many vendors. The unsubstantiated claims of what is better and what isn't...
I find his questioning to be refreshing. It forces you to face the facts. The facts are that on the older 13b's these coils are a god send(as well as other platforms). As I see it, I've only heard/read of these coils giving up @ 30+psi of boost on older 13b's. A Realm I just don't see happening anytime soon on a Renesis. Maybe someone should build a hybrid motor to help with the back pressure/heat issue and push the platform...
With that being said, Still loving my kit. Fires up and Helps ignite the fuel while I'm running down local Mustangs, Camaros, and turbo Hondas. Has survived a dwell time that quite frankly is a tad bit high for the coils. Has seen 20+psi of boost with no signs of breakup. The only thing I can say bad is I'm not sure how long these will hold up. My BHR coils that were said to be a lifelong investment have proven otherwise with multiple failures
That's not a big issue as I'm aware that all good things do come to an end. Stay tuned for a long term reliability review.
Long live the SB ignition kit. Shout out to Team for initially getting the wheels turning for me: https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-tec...-coils-221536/
I find his questioning to be refreshing. It forces you to face the facts. The facts are that on the older 13b's these coils are a god send(as well as other platforms). As I see it, I've only heard/read of these coils giving up @ 30+psi of boost on older 13b's. A Realm I just don't see happening anytime soon on a Renesis. Maybe someone should build a hybrid motor to help with the back pressure/heat issue and push the platform...
With that being said, Still loving my kit. Fires up and Helps ignite the fuel while I'm running down local Mustangs, Camaros, and turbo Hondas. Has survived a dwell time that quite frankly is a tad bit high for the coils. Has seen 20+psi of boost with no signs of breakup. The only thing I can say bad is I'm not sure how long these will hold up. My BHR coils that were said to be a lifelong investment have proven otherwise with multiple failures
That's not a big issue as I'm aware that all good things do come to an end. Stay tuned for a long term reliability review. Long live the SB ignition kit. Shout out to Team for initially getting the wheels turning for me: https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-tec...-coils-221536/
That's bad *** that they are working for you and I think your use is perfect for these and if you have positive results then that is all that matters.
But there no way in hell that anyone is going to convince me that installing them on a stock untuned NA RX-8 is going to benefit from them unless they had failing stock coils before.
And I agree on reliability, only time will tell.
02-10-2016, 12:59 AM
#229
you missed me hooking up an EBC incorrectly a few weeks ago. I routed my MAC solenoid incorrectly and overboosted. figured out that I routed it wrong, so I fixed that. Later that week I Lost to a built K-swapped EG hatch. I would blow the motor up before I lost to a honda...routed it back the incorrect way and ran 25psi falling off to 19-20 (just what I could see trying to monitor it all by eye). going to find a MBC as I have yet to be able to make adjustments to this boost controller and it work. smh
02-10-2016, 07:31 PM
#231
#rotangklan
02-10-2016, 07:40 PM
#232
stock motor with 115k miles on it. Low compression and failing coolant seal.
greddy kit with 60-1 upgrade.
greddy kit with 60-1 upgrade.
02-11-2016, 09:45 PM
#233
RX8Club.com Sponsor
Thread Starter
you missed me hooking up an EBC incorrectly a few weeks ago. I routed my MAC solenoid incorrectly and overboosted. figured out that I routed it wrong, so I fixed that. Later that week I Lost to a built K-swapped EG hatch. I would blow the motor up before I lost to a honda...routed it back the incorrect way and ran 25psi falling off to 19-20 (just what I could see trying to monitor it all by eye). going to find a MBC as I have yet to be able to make adjustments to this boost controller and it work. smh
? Don't risk the motor over a Honda! Anyone running E85/flex fuel on the turbo Renesis builds?
In the REW world (I know the side port renesis isn't exactly the same) but we've found essentially the sky's the limit on E85... we found no signs of knock on straight E85 at 585rwhp on a nearly stock motor (very very mild street port) and a reasonably sized single turbo. The coils didn't break a sweat. This particular setup (ignition and all) have been dead-on reliable for 3+ years at this point. This is just one of many data points. We could have kept tuning for higher boost but that was more than enough to get into trouble.
I'd think E85 would be the ticket for a turbo Renesis. Is that commonly done here yet? It's common practice and well accepted over in FD land :D
Last edited by SBGarage; 02-11-2016 at 11:08 PM.
02-11-2016, 09:48 PM
#234
02-11-2016, 11:15 PM
#235
RX8Club.com Sponsor
Thread Starter
02-12-2016, 12:26 AM
#236
EWP me please!! I'm also waiting to hear info on the BBK. I'm going to be in the market in a couple months. I'll also take a heavy introductory discount on both hehe
Thanks for talking me into it yomom!
02-12-2016, 12:48 AM
#238
you took it a step further than me. It's the natural way of things. I'm glad we have people like you and brett. You both have great setups, awesome ability to diagnose and work on issues that arise, and most importantly, the communication skills to help further the platform.
02-12-2016, 01:28 AM
#239
Dark Moderator
iTrader: (18)
My bad
As an OG e85 mix pioneer I resent being left out haha Not really. I'm glad people are opening their eyes to this. E85 FTW
EWP me please!! I'm also waiting to hear info on the BBK. I'm going to be in the market in a couple months. I'll also take a heavy introductory discount on both hehe
EWP me please!! I'm also waiting to hear info on the BBK. I'm going to be in the market in a couple months. I'll also take a heavy introductory discount on both hehe
Yeah, I am trying to make it to 50k on this engine.
03-28-2016, 02:30 PM
#243
RX8Club.com Sponsor
Thread Starter
Since this threads gone off track and we're running a second group buy on the coil kits, please head over here if you're interested in purchasing one at GB pricing -> https://www.rx8club.com/group-buy-ce...system-261865/
***If you guys want to continue general discussion/debates about the coils please continue here in this thread, not in the new GB thread. ***
***If you guys want to continue general discussion/debates about the coils please continue here in this thread, not in the new GB thread. ***
Last edited by SBGarage; 03-28-2016 at 02:35 PM.
12-06-2017, 02:53 PM
#244
Smoking turbo yay
This is an ancient thread, but just want to check with people:
Is it true that with the car stock, it doesn't really matter which coils you use?
Is it true that with the car stock, it doesn't really matter which coils you use?
12-06-2017, 05:54 PM
#245
SARX Legend
iTrader: (46)
Well it matters in terms of reliability. But with upgraded coils you definitely want to account for them in a custom tune. The stock coils have gone thru a few revisions (A, B, C) that are not reflected in the aftermarket stock replacements.
05-10-2019, 06:16 PM
#247
RX8Club.com Sponsor
Thread Starter
We currently have these BACK ON SALE... the next 15 kits will be at $655! Please visit the following link to purchase, first come first serve. https://www.sakebombgarage.com/compl...-kit-se3p-rx8/
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SBGarage (05-23-2019)
06-21-2019, 02:39 PM
#250
You gonna eat that?
iTrader: (1)
Happy to report my SB kit is still going strong after over 3 years.
Idk the exact mileage atm, but I'd guesstimate 35k, I'll have to see if I can find it.
Three 2000 mile road trips in that span.
Idk the exact mileage atm, but I'd guesstimate 35k, I'll have to see if I can find it.
Three 2000 mile road trips in that span.
