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I had my engine rebuilt by JPR imports (Jim is the man btw) and I told jim to use Racing Beat's ported template and use their ported PCM flash. Now I get the car back, break the engine in, and take it to the MazdaManiac dyno day in PA (8/28). I shortly find out that RacingBeat's flash won't allow any data access through the OBD-II port. So I run my car with their tune to see what it will do...well it was very very lean throughout the RPM ranges. Here's the best part, it only made 186whp. I have the RB header, RB midpipe, and the HKS Hi-Power. I also have the BHR ignition kit. All of those parts and this tune puts out the same as a stock rx-8.
I call racing beat about getting my PCM reflashed to stock and getting my money refunded because not only did this tune not perform well at all, it was very lean. I just rebuilt my engine, the last thing i need is for it go because of a crap tune. I was assured that my money was going to be refunded and that RB would pay for shipping 1/2 way. I was happy.
Now JPR calls RB and gets the details worked out about getting the money refunded to him to be sent to me. They said that RB does not guarantee any performance gains or refund the cost to flash it, oh and I have to pay shipping. I will find out early next week if they in fact did completely reflash my PCM.
Buyer beware. To be honest I am absolutely disgusted with RB's customer service and pcm reflash service.
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They don't guarantee any performance gains? Wow, pretty sad since obviously you have been loyal to them.
Like come on, Racing Beat is pretty much one of the top rotary parts providers. They have been in business from the beginning...and this is just so unacceptable and very upsetting.
I feel ya man, when u laid down the story to me that **** was utterly unacceptable, I could never treat my own customers like that, thats why I dont sell hype myth stuff such as octane booster or magical snake oil ... lol
__________________ "A group becomes a team when all members are sure enough of themselves and their contributions to praise the skill of others."
Well to be fair, had they built and tuned the car your argument might be more valid. There could be any number of issues beyond their control that are contributing to the results. On the flip side, I'm not aware of any notable RX-8 person endorsing that product either. To be even more blunt, it's well documented on the forum that a non-tunable flash isn't recommended. The flipside to this is that the tunable alternative has a well documented success rate that you apparently chose to ignore.
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Es gibt keine verzweifelten Lagen, es gibt nur verzweifelte Menschen.
- Heinz Guderian
Racingbeat did revert my PCM completely back to stock today. I was able to load my MM AP maps, car drives so much better. The RB tune is garbage.
@Team, i chose the RB Ported Tune because I wanted the accessport to save it as the "stock" map so that if I needed to uninstall the accessport for any reason...i wouldn't be left with the stock tune on my car. It was supposed to be a failsafe. Even MM said, I've never heard of a RB ecu flash that blocked the AP...well the Ported tune DOES BLOCK any handheld tuner.
@paul, i only have ~2,000 mi on the rebuild. I was going to check it around 5,000 mi. But I plan on continuing the MM service as always to finish my tune. When its all tuned to the final map, i'll get her on the dyno.
The problem wasn't that it was "blocked".
The problem is that the RB flash forces whatever PCM it is installed in to identify itself as a 2004, even if it is not.
When the AP went to install itself, it saw that the RB flash was identifying the PCM as a 2004. As soon as it was done backing up the RB flash, the PCM's header reverted to its true identity - that of a 2005 - and the AP freaked out.
Imagine - You are sitting at dinner with Jessica Alba and you turn around just long enough to grab a salt shaker from an adjoining table and when you face her again she is suddenly Rosie O'Donnell.
Imagine - You are sitting at dinner with Jessica Alba and you turn around just long enough to grab a salt shaker from an adjoining table and when you face her again she is suddenly Rosie O'Donnell.
may you burn in h3ll for planting that image in my head
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Es gibt keine verzweifelten Lagen, es gibt nur verzweifelte Menschen.
- Heinz Guderian
Imagine - You are sitting at dinner with Jessica Alba and you turn around just long enough to grab a salt shaker from an adjoining table and when you face her again she is suddenly Rosie O'Donnell.
Im not a very technical person, i have to read some posts over to understand how stuff. that made it really clear.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atilla
welcome to socal...where you post's don't count...
I recently was helping a friend out and had a chance to look at some of the parameters in the RB stage 1 flash. I didnt like what I saw. His c/o was loss of power. Midrange was fine but after about 6K his power was off?
In looking at everything I saw His a/f's imho were too lean--like a 14.1 up to about 7.5 K with 30 degrees timing and then never getting below 13.8 period--even at 8.8 K still with 30 degrees.
So not knowing what was going on I called RB to see if that was inside the expected range for that flash.
What I was told made sense, but also was a surprise to me. I was told that they dont shoot for a particular a/f.... period. They tune for power only. If the power is off they richen or lean or whatever---ok --then so what else is new? Right? So I asked does that mean a 14.2 a/f at over 7Krpm and 30 degrees of timing is OK. They said "Yes".
Thats when I said to myself----"Wow".
Guess I dont know much at all.
OD
I was told that they dont shoot for a particular a/f.... period. They tune for power only. If the power is off they richen or lean or whatever---ok --......
How is THAT done without the specific vehicle being there on the dyno?
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Do NOT send me a PM here. E-mail me at "Charles@BlackHaloRacing.com".
"I said my piece and I counted to three......."
Well, in their defense, that is how cars were tuned for decades before lambda measuring devices were available. Some cars make more power at AFRs that we would think are too lean or two rich in abstract.
That said, as Charles said, how do you do that without seeing the car?
Well, in their defense, that is how cars were tuned for decades before lambda measuring devices were available. Some cars make more power at AFRs that we would think are too lean or two rich in abstract.
That said, as Charles said, how do you do that without seeing the car?
I remember, and was involved in performance vehicles back then. A vacuum gauge, a couple hand tools, and that was all we needed. LOL
MM, how varied are the airflow curves you have seen in the datalogs received among Renesis engines that are otherwise similar?
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Do NOT send me a PM here. E-mail me at "Charles@BlackHaloRacing.com".
"I said my piece and I counted to three......."
MM, how varied are the airflow curves you have seen in the datalogs received among Renesis engines that are otherwise similar?
There are less than 1/2 dozen basic curves/values that reveal themselves.
Most motors (if the S-DAIS is working properly) fall into one of those profiles, which, in turn, reveal the condition of the motor so some extent (once you normalize for baro and temp).
I have a 2004 ECU with the RB V2 flash, and it is not that lean. I just had it dyno'd (see the dyno thread) plus I watch the AFR. In fact, it wasn't as lean as I wanted. (I had a straight midpipe on for the dyno with no donut at the catback, so it was "free flowing".
I am not blasting or supporting RB. Since I am leaner than 11 and my fans are turning on earlier, I can't complain. I got it cheap and it took a 1/2 hour to install. I can put my stock ECU in for any warranty issue. Just having some fun!
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[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]Please see the For Sale forum for items from my sold: 2005 RX-8 manual with KW3 coilovers, 5Zigen bronze wheels, Racing Beat software.
Perhaps your car was ported a little more and it is making it run leaner.
Plus the BHR coils will make the fuel burn more complete and it also will be leaner.
Their flash is based off stock coils.
They also don't use that crappy HKS power.
you sir are biased the hks hi power has nothing to do with it, and the bhr coils don't do anything to lean the afr they only provide a more complete burn
Well, in their defense, that is how cars were tuned for decades before lambda measuring devices were available. Some cars make more power at AFRs that we would think are too lean or two rich in abstract.
Yep. I miss the "mixture" **** on my car that most piston-engined airplanes have. It's trivial to find the max power a/f ratio. At a constant airspeed (or at a stop before takeoff), move the **** in (rich) or out (lean) to get max rpm. The caveat is that one can only do this within a certain range of other conditions. A max power, sea-level takeoff may result in detonation with some engine types (easy to do with cylinders that are ~4 inches in diameter). A related method is to "tune" the EGT for a point shown to give best power.
Bad Guy: Racing Beat
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