spork

No, this isn't a "which is better" post nor a "which should i buy" nor a racing post.

I met up with two coworkers today. One drives an STi, the other wanted to drive both my RX-8 and the STi. I also had a try with the STi.

My STi observations:
1) Holy crap does it scoot. It just blasts its way through everything. The power seems to be there at any time (provided you're over 2K rpmish which isn't hard to do). The RX-8 is sorely lacking if this is what you're comparing it to.

2) It's easier to drive. I have a much easier time getting it going from a stop than my 8. My shifts are smoother too. I dunno, I just find this car very easy to drive and it surprised me.

3) The throws are significantly shorter.

4) Even though the throws are shorter, the shifter feels crappy. It feels really cheap... I'm not sure how to explain it. But it also looks cheap compared to the RX-8's shift ****.

5) The handling seems plenty fine on it. I feel like it does but I didn't get a chance to throw the STi in many curves, but even then the STi isn't far behind.

6) It was kind of interesting how used to the digital speedometer I am. I was having a hard time at first figuring out how fast I was going sometimes.

My non STi owning coworker STi drove both the STi and my RX-8. Here's his observations:

1) So I told him not to expect anything close to the STi power when driving my car. After he drove my car for a few seconds, he turned to me and said "you're right. it's not close to the STi. but it's still fast though."

2) He said "You know after driving the STi, I don't think the STi looks that ugly any more."

3) He said he's probably better off not getting an STi because he'd be too tempted to race everyone and probably drive like a maniac if he had one.

4) He said STi's ride wasn't so nice though. Too much noise especially.

5) He really dug how smooth the engine on the RX-8 was. He loved the fact that it never felt like it was trying too hard.

6) He said "man, I really like the sound of the rotary engine."

And so... I've taken my car for an oil change twice to the dealer. Both times they overfilled my oil. You know how the stick has the flat area and then two lines on the flat area? The oil is past the max line and almost hitting the rounded area. I even told them before that they overfilled the oil last time. They kinda reacted like "yeah uh huh, that's nice." And goddamn it, they did it again.

What should I do? Last time I just drove with it over the max line. I'm wondering if I should do it again. Or do I need to bring it in to get some oil drained? I shoudl've checked it after they gave my car back but I was in a rush. And they're closed tomorrow and I don't want to have to skip work. The top line on the flat part is the max line right? How bad is it to drive with a bit too much oil? It seems to drive fine...

Ike

1.) Yep, people that call the STi laggy can't drive worth a damn or have never really driven one.

2.) Did you get the chance to launch it and break all 4 tires loose, that's when you really start to look at it in a whole different light.

3.) Shorter than most production cars.

4.) Doesn't feel cheap to me, it just feels notchy and mechanical. To me it feels very solid, and I think the plastic **** on the RX-8 pales in comparison to the nice leather stitched **** in the STi but to each their own...

5.) It should feel plenty fine, it's one of the best handling cars on the road and on our less than perfect streets it's limits are beyond that of almost all other cars on the available.

Nice writeup and nice to see an RX-8 owner appreciate the STi for what it is.

automaton

Ummm, The RX8 has a nice leather shift ****.....

I like the write-up also. I test drove an STi before I test drove (and bought) the RX-8 and was impressed with it's power, but I was trading in a WRX and it really just felt like more of the same (much, much more, but more of the same, none-the-less). I also thought it lacked a certain "refinement" that the 8 had. I honestly think the 8 is one of the smoothest driving cars on the road.

That said....

I agree with you on the shifts being less smooth in the RX-8. I've chalked it up to the different characteristics of the way it revs from a conventional piston engine. The revs drop quickly and I find that I shift much smoother if I shift more quickly. Every Subaru transmission I've ever shifted has been a fairly "deliberate" affair. It took me awhile to acclimate myself to shifting as slow as I had to for the WRX to be smooth, and then it became second nature, now I'm relearning my old habits of rapidly shifting.

Nice write-up.

DARKMAZ8

Sometimes the smoothness of the rotary makes the car seem slower. At 9000 it sounds like it could go another 9000. I personaly miss the straining sound of a high reving piston engine. Makes the ride more intense.

ÜberJumper

Re: overfilled oil.

I was checking my oil last night, and it was clearly right on the low mark. So, remembering Rupes (I think) thread about overfilling oil, I poured in 600ml (little over half a quart) at first. I checked the oil, and lo and behold, it appeared to be completely over the top fill mark! I was like "there's no way that's right", so I checked again a couple of times, and the first couple of checks showed it about the same. Subsequent checks showed that the oil was actually NOT overfilled, and that it was only about a third of the way up between the low mark and the full mark. I then put in the remaining 400ml of oil, and it seemed to jump up over the halfway mark, still with obvious "globbing" of oil onto the dipstick.

I have a feeling that the dipstick may be positioned at a point where oil being filled into the engine can drip down overtop of it :-/

Booosted

Hi, STi, Bye STi, Haha Thats All I said, Turbo Your 8's and Then Compare Them People, One Is NA n One Is Turbo u cant compare something that isnt alike from the start. Bring an STi to my house Drive his then drive Mine and Then we can Get some Comparisons.

Hatein Them Matchbox Cars
Booosted

dos

The comparo he is doing is two stock cars in the same price range. Many people that are looking for a new car may look at the STI(4cyl turbo), 350(V6), G35(V6), etc... Put the same amount of money that you put into turbo your RX8 into the STI and bye bye RX8.

IZoomZoomI

yea i agree, people are getting a bit overconfident with their "turbo" 8s. It's still far from a powerhouse even with current fi systems.

BlueEyes

This arguement is starting to wear thin with me. FI is a means to an end, the end is what we compare. If they wanted to use coked out hampsters to power their car, and it beat the rx8, guess what, its faster, period. Some of the greatest cars of all time have used forced induction, mazda can do the same if they choose.

V_for_velocity

Spork: Interesting observations. Maybe should have been separate posts though (comparison and oil question).
And BlueEyes: Coked out hamsters -- good one!

BlueFrenzy

I tend to agree with Boosted. I think the comparison in zippiness would be more realistic if spork's friend had a standard WRX. But I think the comparison in ride quality is accurate (I doubt there is much difference btw STI and WRX). Regardless, the Subaru is a nice car and I think if had one, I too would be tempted by the power at the line. And I don't need anymore speeding tickets

Rupes

:p

See...anyway I took mine to the dealership, my oil was at the same spot, right where the dipstick becomes rounded. They told me think nothing of it (but drained it anyway).

-Rupes

Ike

Pretty big difference between the STi and WRX. They also both lack sound deadening compared to the RX-8 which is one of the reasons why you have the RX-8 which is RWD and has a "light weight" rotary weighing about the same as a standard WRX with a much heavier AWD system.

spork

Cool, thanks for the info on the oil thing. I'm going to assume the oil isn't a problem but next time make absolutely sure they don't do this again. Stupid dealership.

Either you drove an STi with an aftermarket shifter, the 2004 and 2005 shifters are different, or you're just crazy. The shifter on the STi I drove was made out of rubber/plastic. It was essentially a rubber/plastic ball engraved (if you can call it that) with the gear pattern attached to a long plastic feeling stick. The RX-8 shifter was MUCH nicer than the one on the STi I drove. I like the shift **** and shifter of the RX-8 a lot better than the STi other than the length of the throws. I really dig the short shifts in the STi.

I don't see what's wrong with comparing a turboed car and a non turboed car. I mean what's next? Saying you can't compare anything to the RX-8 because well, you can't compare a rotary to a piston engine? I mean they're not alike from the start either, right? How about engines that need premium gas to ones that need regular? I'm just pointing the differences between two stock cars that are in the similar price range.

interesting. i tried shifting faster yesterday and to my surprise it is smoother. But i think it'd be easier to learn driving manual on an STi than the RX-8.

Apophis

Why do people always talk about the RX-8 like it's a $33K car to start with? The 6MT starts at $27K. At that point, you pretty much have all of your performance options already built in. You get DSC at $28K so maybe that's the performance cost baseline. If you really want to compare an RX-8 to a $33K car, you might as well be comparing the additional features you get at $33K (e.g. leather interior, Bose audio, Homelink, and maybe even Navigation) because, without them, the 8 is a $27-28K car. We're talking about an 18% price gap to an STi.

Imagine if there were a performance-oriented car priced at $39K... picture something halfway between a 350Z Track ($35K) and a C6 Vette ($44K). Would that be a reasonable comparison to a $33K STi? Well, that's what you'd be looking at if you considered an 18% gap to be "the same price range".

That said, who cares? Didn't we all know that the STi is quantitatively a stronger performer? I bought my 8 because it's perfect for me. I don't really care what an STi owner thinks or a non-STi owner or anything like that. Honestly, I've said all of that before and I'm sure I'll say it again... I only wrote this post because I think it's kind of dumb comparing cars with such a big price gap.

Missile

Re: Oil - my dam* dealersh*t did the exact same thing... filled it well past the F marker to just where the flat portion of the stick ends.

I called and comlained and all they did was refund the charge for the oil. They said their oil gun has a predetermined level it fills. What a crock. Don't they check the level after they fill it up???

Being ultraparanoid, I went to Pepboys, bought some stands, then drained the oil myself.

Solution for next time - I will change the oil myself.

F the dealer!!!

Chrisbert

I love the STi power, just can't deal with the huge wing thing. Call me old fashioned.

Conekiller

The shifter on the STi you drove is not stock. The stock shifter on both the 04 and 05 is very nice and all leather.

I've never driven an RX8 so can't comment on the feel but my 04 STi with a Kartboy short shifter installed feels as good as anything I could imagine.

BlueEyes

18% really is not that much of a difference. The STI has no options so you have no way of judging the "performance base" of that car. I don't understand why people get so upset when comparing sports cars to each other. Though, I am sure nobody would be upset if the 8 blew the doors off a 22-23K car, I doubt you would have posted the same thing either. The reality is that it happens all the time, every car magazine compares car performance, and guess what, the cars don't all cost the same. Some differences are as great as 60-70%.

Some people care a lot about the performance of a car, myself included, and they want to know how cars stack up against each other, and what type of performance value they are getting. It just happens, IMO, the 8 isn't much of a performance value, especially will little aftermarket support. It, however, has value in other areas. I only wrote this post because I think it's kind of dumb how people cant understand a comparison between two cars with such a small price difference yet geared towards car enthusiasts.

Ike

This is what the stock shifter in the STi looks like, sure doesn't look plastic to me

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...RK%3AMESE%3AIT

124Spider

I was at a track school over a weekend a month ago. Record rainfall both days, which kind of dampened thngs a bit (pun intended ).

However, a definite highlight of the weekend was a ride in my instructor's STi, on a soaking wet track. My, can that thing fly, and does it stick to even a very wet track, especially in the hands of a very good driver.

I still don't like its looks much, but it's a very, very fine car.

My son's whispering evil things at me about spending some time (and money) this summer rebuilding my Toyota Celica All-Trac; says we can easily get it well above the 300hp range; the drive in the STi makes that more attractive.

Rxdriftingaction

I will wait for 06 evo..!! according to "road & track" it's the fastest evo ever..!!! 0~60mph 4.4s..!! sti can't match with it .. and it's cheaper.. then sti. anyway..!!!!!

DARKMAZ8

depends, If you want a comfortable daily driver than I say the STI is better but if you want car to take to the track then the evo will be the better choice. Remember, if the 06 is anything like an 05, be prepared for a harsh ride.

Ike

Don't think for second Subaru will sit idle and not try to showup Mitubishi. The reason why the STi and Evo are great cars is because they keep trying to one up eachother.

DARKMAZ8

cheap, reliable and fast. Pick 2. It's only a matter of time when the price of these cars won't be a bargain. plus, the fast and the furious trend is on the down slope.