Motorcycles? basics
10-09-2007, 01:34 AM
#1
Motorcycles? basics
Some reason I'm interested in/have been interested in having a motorcycle and was just kinda looking around a bit more seriously considering it. I know in the past I've seen a few threads discussing this but just figured I'd ask about the basics. I've personally never driven a motorcycle so I really dont know that much about it. I know people recommend getting a beater to learn on, but are there good bikes out there that are nice but also good to learn on? I'd prefer a sport bike instead of a cruising bike (like the look and such... performance wouldnt be the top qualification seeing as I'd be learning and dont intend on killing myself). Just any tips or push in the right direction to learn more is appreciated. Thanks
10-09-2007, 02:24 AM
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10-09-2007, 02:26 AM
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The best advice I can give you is to take a course from the Motorcycle Safety Foundation. They teach you skills that are absolutely vital for riding, and I can't believe its not a requirement to do so in order to get a license.
The next thing I would say is, yes, get a slightly older bike at first to beat up on and save your money for good gear. A good helmet and gloves are the most important thing.
As for first-timer bikes, I started out on a Honda CB400 (a japan only model, though it is equivalent to the 500cc bikes we get in america) and that was just fine for me. The general consensus is that a smaller displacement bike like the Kawasaki Ninja 250 is a good starter, but I would say save your money and go ahead and get a slightly larger bike like the Suzuki GS500 or Kawasaki Ninja 500. If you take the MSF course you should be fine. In any event the absolute largest I'd go is something like the Suzuki SV650. I wouldn't go for one of the four cylinder 600s for a first timer, but the 650 is a V-Twin so its more manageable. Again, you can go cheap on your first bike, but spend good money on your gear!
Hope that helps
The next thing I would say is, yes, get a slightly older bike at first to beat up on and save your money for good gear. A good helmet and gloves are the most important thing.
As for first-timer bikes, I started out on a Honda CB400 (a japan only model, though it is equivalent to the 500cc bikes we get in america) and that was just fine for me. The general consensus is that a smaller displacement bike like the Kawasaki Ninja 250 is a good starter, but I would say save your money and go ahead and get a slightly larger bike like the Suzuki GS500 or Kawasaki Ninja 500. If you take the MSF course you should be fine. In any event the absolute largest I'd go is something like the Suzuki SV650. I wouldn't go for one of the four cylinder 600s for a first timer, but the 650 is a V-Twin so its more manageable. Again, you can go cheap on your first bike, but spend good money on your gear!
Hope that helps
Last edited by Catspaw; 10-09-2007 at 02:32 AM.
10-09-2007, 02:42 AM
#5
thanks for replies. From what I've found, it looks like MSF course should be $190-ish? I've looked at helmets and such but not sure exactly what I should be looking for.. price range is rather large. Any recommendations towards gear? thanks again
10-09-2007, 02:50 AM
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10-09-2007, 04:55 AM
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A safety course is a good idea, but I 've always thought that a 250cc to 400cc dual purpose bike is probably the best to start out on. Undoubtly, you will drop the bike a few times and these type of bikes will survive most falls with little to no damage.
Also, insurance rates for dual purpose bikes are low, as compared to anything called a "Ninja".
Oh, my first bike was a '86 Honda VF 500 Interceptor, so I didn't really heed my own advice. I'm a LOT smarter now though....
Also, insurance rates for dual purpose bikes are low, as compared to anything called a "Ninja".
Oh, my first bike was a '86 Honda VF 500 Interceptor, so I didn't really heed my own advice. I'm a LOT smarter now though....
10-10-2007, 03:20 AM
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The safety course will cover this too but when you ride you definitely want good sturdy gloves too. I recommend Alpinestars or Power Trip.
10-10-2007, 09:02 AM
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+1 on the MSF course. It is free in IL if you just walk in. I went in the spring and got my license through it.
Make sure you check out the actual Motorcycle Safety Foundation website posted above to see if they have locations near you. Outside places will charge you more.
I have a HJC AC-12 helmet and a joe rocket jacket. Start on an older ninja 250 as others have said so you can get your money back on it when you want a bigger bike. If you save for 500cc but then decide you want to go to a 600 or higher you will lose more on the 500cc then you would on the 250cc.
Good luck!
Make sure you check out the actual Motorcycle Safety Foundation website posted above to see if they have locations near you. Outside places will charge you more.
I have a HJC AC-12 helmet and a joe rocket jacket. Start on an older ninja 250 as others have said so you can get your money back on it when you want a bigger bike. If you save for 500cc but then decide you want to go to a 600 or higher you will lose more on the 500cc then you would on the 250cc.
Good luck!
10-10-2007, 02:14 PM
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Get Good Gear
As far as helmets go i would recommend the scorpion exo700 series. they are cheaper than most othe composite helmets and have pretty good venting.
However the most important part of buying a helmet is to get one that fits your head. Everyone's head is not the same shape. so a helmet that is really great for me might be horribly uncomfortable for you. You need to try a bunch on and find one that is very snug but doesnt have any pressure points. REmember you might be wearing that thing for hours on end. it needs to be comfortable. AT the same time the whole reason you bought it is to protect your head in a crash so it needs to be snug enough to stay in place if you ever hit the ground. I would not recommend buying a first helmet online. Find a good bike shop that carries more than 3 brands and try them all on. Be prepared to pay what you think your head is worth but more expensive doesnt mean better protection. they are normally just lighter and more comfortable.
I have an HJC CL-12. its an ok helmet but is very noisy at highway speeds. I would not recommend it. I'm waiting for the new scorpion exo 1000's to finally hit the stores. If it fits well thats going to be my next helmet.
For the rest of the gear. Imagine yourself sliding down the road. Any part of your body that you dont mind sliding accross 50 feet of asfault doesnt need gear to protect it. If you like me, I like all my skin where it is so i bought the whole deal, Helmet, jacket, gloves, pants, and boots. Joe rocket makes pretty affordable stuff with CE-rated armor in thier jackets. I would go for textile jackets if you live in a hot climate. I went with a mesh jacket since i tend to ride when its over 110 out.
Over pants are probably the most overlooked peice of equipment but you should get them. Jeans are no better than shorts if you go down over 20 mph. If you dont believe me go to any motorcycle forum and look at there crash section. You can read the stories of people who went down and there jeans were shredded and they lost a lot of skin off there legs. Riding pants arent as expensive as skin grafts. (there not that expensive at all really).
Like everyone else has said take the MSF course before you buy or ride a bike. Not only will it help you with insurance but it will also teach you some very valuable things that may save your life.
For the bike i agree with most of the people above that a ninja 250 is a really good starter bike. If you really want to go bigger a ninja 500 is also good.
If you like paying out the *** for insurance and want to die, get a 600cc or larger inline 4. Those bikes have very peaky power band and generally don't have any room for newbie mistakes.
the Ninja 500 is faster to 60 than almost any production car, gets 50 mpg and looks like a sportsbike. ITs what i started out on an i have to recommend it. Also the kawisaki "Positive neutral finder" is helpful.
wow i wrote alot. Whatever you do, be safe out there. and have fun
However the most important part of buying a helmet is to get one that fits your head. Everyone's head is not the same shape. so a helmet that is really great for me might be horribly uncomfortable for you. You need to try a bunch on and find one that is very snug but doesnt have any pressure points. REmember you might be wearing that thing for hours on end. it needs to be comfortable. AT the same time the whole reason you bought it is to protect your head in a crash so it needs to be snug enough to stay in place if you ever hit the ground. I would not recommend buying a first helmet online. Find a good bike shop that carries more than 3 brands and try them all on. Be prepared to pay what you think your head is worth but more expensive doesnt mean better protection. they are normally just lighter and more comfortable.
I have an HJC CL-12. its an ok helmet but is very noisy at highway speeds. I would not recommend it. I'm waiting for the new scorpion exo 1000's to finally hit the stores. If it fits well thats going to be my next helmet.
For the rest of the gear. Imagine yourself sliding down the road. Any part of your body that you dont mind sliding accross 50 feet of asfault doesnt need gear to protect it. If you like me, I like all my skin where it is so i bought the whole deal, Helmet, jacket, gloves, pants, and boots. Joe rocket makes pretty affordable stuff with CE-rated armor in thier jackets. I would go for textile jackets if you live in a hot climate. I went with a mesh jacket since i tend to ride when its over 110 out.
Over pants are probably the most overlooked peice of equipment but you should get them. Jeans are no better than shorts if you go down over 20 mph. If you dont believe me go to any motorcycle forum and look at there crash section. You can read the stories of people who went down and there jeans were shredded and they lost a lot of skin off there legs. Riding pants arent as expensive as skin grafts. (there not that expensive at all really).
Like everyone else has said take the MSF course before you buy or ride a bike. Not only will it help you with insurance but it will also teach you some very valuable things that may save your life.
For the bike i agree with most of the people above that a ninja 250 is a really good starter bike. If you really want to go bigger a ninja 500 is also good.
If you like paying out the *** for insurance and want to die, get a 600cc or larger inline 4. Those bikes have very peaky power band and generally don't have any room for newbie mistakes.
the Ninja 500 is faster to 60 than almost any production car, gets 50 mpg and looks like a sportsbike. ITs what i started out on an i have to recommend it. Also the kawisaki "Positive neutral finder" is helpful.
wow i wrote alot. Whatever you do, be safe out there. and have fun
10-10-2007, 02:32 PM
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you lucked out cuz the new 250 ninjas actually look like sport bikes, but learning on a 250 is always a good idea, and most 250s dont lose value because of the constant demand for them
as far as your helmet and gear goes. the MOST important is that it fits. I have an Arai helmet that costs 500 bux but the expense is mostly jsut for creature comforts. Cheaper helmets like scorpion or icon will protect your head just as well, the only difference is mostly just lining and comfort level.
I'd recommend an armored leather jacket. Make sure its nice and tight, so that it doesnt ride up and expose your skin IF you are ever to skid on the asphalt. I'd recommend leather pants and boots too. Or at least some armored over pants.
The only way to get better at riding is seat time. But to start off TAKE THE MSF COURSE.
and remember, always ride like no body sees you, and always respect the machine.
as far as your helmet and gear goes. the MOST important is that it fits. I have an Arai helmet that costs 500 bux but the expense is mostly jsut for creature comforts. Cheaper helmets like scorpion or icon will protect your head just as well, the only difference is mostly just lining and comfort level.
I'd recommend an armored leather jacket. Make sure its nice and tight, so that it doesnt ride up and expose your skin IF you are ever to skid on the asphalt. I'd recommend leather pants and boots too. Or at least some armored over pants.
The only way to get better at riding is seat time. But to start off TAKE THE MSF COURSE.
and remember, always ride like no body sees you, and always respect the machine.
10-11-2007, 10:30 AM
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Do a motorcycle safety course. You learn and test on their bike. After that likeothers have said get an older bike so if you lay it down you won't be to mad/sad. And get proper protection, jacket, boots, helmet, gloves. I can't believe the prople who ride in shorts and a t-shirt, morons. They won't save you in a bad crash but they will when you dump it and slide across the road.
10-11-2007, 11:04 AM
#13
Do a motorcycle safety course. You learn and test on their bike. After that likeothers have said get an older bike so if you lay it down you won't be to mad/sad. And get proper protection, jacket, boots, helmet, gloves. I can't believe the prople who ride in shorts and a t-shirt, morons. They won't save you in a bad crash but they will when you dump it and slide across the road.
10-11-2007, 02:49 PM
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10-11-2007, 03:08 PM
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there's a lot of things to consider when riding a motorcycle.
Like others have mentioned, the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course is a good idea. Depending on where you live it may be free and required to get your motorcycle endorsement.
Get good gear. A high qualitly, name brand, DOT and Snell approved helmet, good jacket, gloves, and boots. But don't fall into what most do and get a false sense of security by wearing these, it will still hurt like a mother when you spill. I say when because you will, and you just need to accept that fact. It may not be do to an error of your own, but rather a cell-phone jockey SUV driver who runs you off the road. Just be prepared to go down.
The beater bike isn't always a great starting point. When things mechanically fail on a bike they have a nasty way of causing you to lay your bike down and hurt yourself and others. If you do buy a used motorcycle, make sure it is in good enough riding condition. Tires, tires, tires. Always check your tires before you go out. If your front tire goes down, you are almost garranteed to go down and seriously hurt yourself. Make sure all the hoses, esepcially the brake and clutch lines, are in good order before each and every ride. If you bike is chain-driven, make sure to lube the chain frequently.
I would advise against getting a Ninja 250. It's a great starter bike for sure, but you'll want to sell it in 2 months at least, and I can almost garrantee you won't get what you paid for it. People know these are starting bikes and that they can be had for very cheap. No one will pay you a brand-new price for a used bike when they can goto the showroom and get their own brand new one.
I started out on a Suzuki SV650S and I loved it. It has plenty of power, but is still controlable. I like to say it "grows with you". Plus, it handles fantastically, and there are some good aftermarket parts out there for it, and a good owners forum as well. The bike is more of a naked crotch rocket, but it's low matience 90-degree V-Twin is a pleasure to ride with, and it's fuel injected and liquid cooled.
Most people will tell you not to get some super sonic crotch rocket right off the bat (like a Suzuki GSX-R, Honda CBR, Kawa Ninja, Yamaha R series, etc) because you will kill yourself. Well, the truth is the people that get hurt on those bikes do so because they don't the will power to control the throttle. The bike will only go as fast as your right hand tells it to.
Another thing to keep in mind; learn about motorcycle handling dymanics. Learn why you lean into a corner, what countersteering is, what trail braking is, what a low-side and high-side are and what causes them, and the gryoscope effect that allows all motorcycles to drive. The more you know about proper riding techniques, the better you will be when riding. And always ride within your limits. Always brake before you enter a turn (or trail brake lightly).
It sounds like a lot to learn, and to be honest, it is, but once you learn it, it will be like second nature, just like driving a car. Don't try to race anybody or be cool until your comfortably within your riding skills. Try hooking up with a local owner club of the bike you choose and go on rides and hone your skills.
Also you can Google some riding tips arcticles that are also pretty helpful.
Like others have mentioned, the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course is a good idea. Depending on where you live it may be free and required to get your motorcycle endorsement.
Get good gear. A high qualitly, name brand, DOT and Snell approved helmet, good jacket, gloves, and boots. But don't fall into what most do and get a false sense of security by wearing these, it will still hurt like a mother when you spill. I say when because you will, and you just need to accept that fact. It may not be do to an error of your own, but rather a cell-phone jockey SUV driver who runs you off the road. Just be prepared to go down.
The beater bike isn't always a great starting point. When things mechanically fail on a bike they have a nasty way of causing you to lay your bike down and hurt yourself and others. If you do buy a used motorcycle, make sure it is in good enough riding condition. Tires, tires, tires. Always check your tires before you go out. If your front tire goes down, you are almost garranteed to go down and seriously hurt yourself. Make sure all the hoses, esepcially the brake and clutch lines, are in good order before each and every ride. If you bike is chain-driven, make sure to lube the chain frequently.
I would advise against getting a Ninja 250. It's a great starter bike for sure, but you'll want to sell it in 2 months at least, and I can almost garrantee you won't get what you paid for it. People know these are starting bikes and that they can be had for very cheap. No one will pay you a brand-new price for a used bike when they can goto the showroom and get their own brand new one.
I started out on a Suzuki SV650S and I loved it. It has plenty of power, but is still controlable. I like to say it "grows with you". Plus, it handles fantastically, and there are some good aftermarket parts out there for it, and a good owners forum as well. The bike is more of a naked crotch rocket, but it's low matience 90-degree V-Twin is a pleasure to ride with, and it's fuel injected and liquid cooled.
Most people will tell you not to get some super sonic crotch rocket right off the bat (like a Suzuki GSX-R, Honda CBR, Kawa Ninja, Yamaha R series, etc) because you will kill yourself. Well, the truth is the people that get hurt on those bikes do so because they don't the will power to control the throttle. The bike will only go as fast as your right hand tells it to.
Another thing to keep in mind; learn about motorcycle handling dymanics. Learn why you lean into a corner, what countersteering is, what trail braking is, what a low-side and high-side are and what causes them, and the gryoscope effect that allows all motorcycles to drive. The more you know about proper riding techniques, the better you will be when riding. And always ride within your limits. Always brake before you enter a turn (or trail brake lightly).
It sounds like a lot to learn, and to be honest, it is, but once you learn it, it will be like second nature, just like driving a car. Don't try to race anybody or be cool until your comfortably within your riding skills. Try hooking up with a local owner club of the bike you choose and go on rides and hone your skills.
Also you can Google some riding tips arcticles that are also pretty helpful.
10-11-2007, 03:41 PM
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Good advice here.
I'd add the fact that confidence comes with seat time, so don't get discouraged (as many do) if you take a rider course, fail on your exam and conclude it's not for you. Atleast in Canada, I know that the majority of people who try to take their license never end up buying a bike.
Also, early on try a dual sport or trail/dirt bike ride, you should be able to find places that rent 'em. With full gear, you can play with the limits of traction, esp. throttle control, while going at a speed and in an environment that won't kill you WHEN you fall off. Also, early on, consider trying the first phase of a race school. Nothing better to learn the real cornering and braking capabilities of a motorcycle. I'm still amazed by how many seasoned riders don't use more than 40% of either.
I feel safer (more maneuverable) on my bike than in my car, for me there's nothing better.
I'd add the fact that confidence comes with seat time, so don't get discouraged (as many do) if you take a rider course, fail on your exam and conclude it's not for you. Atleast in Canada, I know that the majority of people who try to take their license never end up buying a bike.
Also, early on try a dual sport or trail/dirt bike ride, you should be able to find places that rent 'em. With full gear, you can play with the limits of traction, esp. throttle control, while going at a speed and in an environment that won't kill you WHEN you fall off. Also, early on, consider trying the first phase of a race school. Nothing better to learn the real cornering and braking capabilities of a motorcycle. I'm still amazed by how many seasoned riders don't use more than 40% of either.
I feel safer (more maneuverable) on my bike than in my car, for me there's nothing better.
10-11-2007, 03:44 PM
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You can definatly find a good bike that is used. My opinion is that while a ninja 250 is a good starter bike, you will most likely want to move up to a bigger bike in a hurry. The big question to be answered is are you a resonsible person that will respect the power of a sportbike. If the answer is no, then get a ninja 250 or 500. If the answer is yes, go with a little bigger bike that you won't grow out of so quickly. Another good rule of thumb is to stay away from any bike with an "R" in the name as a first bike.
I started out on a Suzuki SV650S. It is a great starter bike. I rode with friends that had Gixxers and busas. I was easily able to keep up. This is my recomendation for a starter bike.
I started out on a Suzuki SV650S. It is a great starter bike. I rode with friends that had Gixxers and busas. I was easily able to keep up. This is my recomendation for a starter bike.
10-11-2007, 05:52 PM
#18
thanks for advice everyone, helps out a lot. I'd say I'm responsible now. Definitely done some stupid stuff in my 8 a couple times but never race or anything like that. I honestly cant remember how long it's been since I redlined any gear past 2nd 
Anyways, I think now I would be able to handle a 500cc safely. I dont wanna go for anything too fast to start on, just as a precaution, but I dont really wanna start too slow either. I havnt really made up my mind yet, and thinking once I take a course I'll have a better idea of what I'm looking for.
question: what does the R mean? lol. I can only assume they're faster and not good for a start cause of that, but what exactly does it represent/do?
Anyways, I think now I would be able to handle a 500cc safely. I dont wanna go for anything too fast to start on, just as a precaution, but I dont really wanna start too slow either. I havnt really made up my mind yet, and thinking once I take a course I'll have a better idea of what I'm looking for.question: what does the R mean? lol. I can only assume they're faster and not good for a start cause of that, but what exactly does it represent/do?
10-11-2007, 10:10 PM
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If it really stands for anything, it stands for race. I know that the Ninja 500R has the R designation but don't consider that bike to be a racing bike. The 600 - 1000R's are the bikes that you can get in trouble fast on if you are a beginner. These bikes are engineered for one thing, racing. Every year there is one thing that is consistant with these bikes. They keep gaining power and loosing weight.
A good forum for learning about sport bikes is gixxer.com. They have a FAQ section with sticky's that will answer in detail everything that has been discussed in this thread and then some. They are a great bunch of people. The forum really helped me out when I got the itch to start riding. Hope this helps.
A good forum for learning about sport bikes is gixxer.com. They have a FAQ section with sticky's that will answer in detail everything that has been discussed in this thread and then some. They are a great bunch of people. The forum really helped me out when I got the itch to start riding. Hope this helps.
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