vipeRX7

Looks like Ford managed to use Mazda's engineering once again:

http://www.autoweek.com/cat_content...._code=06876524

First the probe and the escort, now this. Let's just hope Mazda gets its share of the profits. As long as Ford stays away from the Renesis ...

babylou

Damn, Ford seems to be the slowest reacting company in existence. For commuter cars platform sharing is great. However, by the time Ford begins to use the Mazda chassis it will be four years old. Why the hell didn't they make the decision to use this platform much sooner and have the cars available by the end of this year. Look at Nissan. They have four vehicles off of the FM chassis and 3.5 L V-6. All delivered within one year. Plus they use the V-6 in other vehicles and share some FM chassis components with their FWD Altima platform.

m477

Well, at least Ford manages to recognize decent engineering when the see it, even if they can't do it themselves...

SpreeGuy

right... like mazda has never used any of ford's engineering before.

babylou

This is simply a dumba**, ignorant comment. Ford can engineer as good as Mazda. The Mondeo was/is a much better car than the 626 turd Mazda sold. What has Mazda done over the last decade worth a damn? They had only one winner; the Miata. Maybe we should look at the stellar reliability so well engineered into the FD3 RX-7 by Mazda. Finally, why don't you compare the profitability of the two companies over the last decade. Ford NA operations just posted a $1.2B quarterly profit. Mazda barely posted a profit during their last reporting period. Hmm? Thankfully, Mazda seems be having a rennaisance with the acclaimed Attenza 6 and RX-8, a new 3 and not soon enough a new RX-7.

Don't think I am a Mazda basher or a pro Ford or American car guy. I ain't. In fact, I have never owned a Ford street car and have owned several Miatas that I love. I judge all vehicles and companies based on their product. The only bias I have when purchasing cars is if there are two cars I like equally, one American and one foreign, I will purchase the American car to keep my money at home. I do this because my experiences from travelling to every continent on earth (except Antarctica) is that non-Americans and their governments almost universally favor domestic manufactured products.

Lensman

Obviously never been to Britain then...

babylou

I have spent many months in the UK. Some in Manchester & London England but mostly in Aberdeen Scotland. While Britons seem to be less so like I stated they are still more "keep the money at home" than Americans.

m477

If a car company's profits determine how good the car company is, then by that logic Ferrari and McLarens suck.

And yes, ford sucks. What other company has had anywhere as near as many major reacalls as Ford in the past few years? But the main reason I think fords are trash is my own *personal experience* with them, I grew up in the Detroit area, many people I knew had fords, I've been in many of them and driven several, and none of them made feel like I would ever want a Ford.

Case in point: My coworker's 1998 Ford Escort ZX2. When he got it, it had only 35k miles on it, but it's completely inferior in every way compared to the 1995 Neon coupe I used to own. The interior is the absolute worst I've ever seen on any car made in the past 5 years - the design is terribly ugly, everything looks cheap, and squeaks and rattles constantly, the interior panels don't even line up properly. The seats have no back support and the fabric feels "loose", like it's slightly too big for the seats. The shifter is the worst I have ever felt, the engine sounds lame, and feels really weak. And again, this is comparing it to my 1995 Neon, which was 3 years older with 30k more miles on it.

vipeRX7

So true ... (where'd the Mazda 6 engine come from? ) I'm just worried that Ford might get too involved in Mazda. The last thing I want to see is a renesis mustang Thing is, it seems like *correct me if I'm wrong* Ford gets a lot more from Mazda than Mazda does from Ford. After all, the Probe won domestic car of the year ... Nonetheless, you are right. *thinks up new argument* :p

SpreeGuy

Ford has made many large strides to reduce the amount of recalls they have. Aside from the Firestone AT wilderness tire recall a couple years ago, there have been far and few between.

I am currently driving a 96 Mercury Mystique, and so far the only recall i've had to bring my car in for, was a faulty heater blower switch.

To tell the truth, I'd much prefer a company tell me when they find an error in there product, than deny it and make me pay for the repair.

*edit* found an interesting essay on recalls, 19 pages long, but still interesting stuff.
Recall Info

SpreeGuy

Well, if it wasn't for Ford, Mazda could be outta business right now. :D

If you want we can look at the different cars shared between the manufacturers, but really, I can see this whole thing turning into a flame match. It's unfortunate when someone feels as if they must belittle a company like ford with such childish remarks as "Ford sucks"

Also, on the same note. Where do you think Mazda got the "idea" for the 6 *cough*mondeo(ford)*cough*.

babylou

m477,

I too was unimpressed with the last US model Ford Escort. However, that does not make all Ford products crappy for here on. I mentioned the FD3 RX-7 to preempt any such argument. I cannot think of a car made in the last decade that had such a poor reliability record with such a critical system as the engine. Take a look at AutoTrader; every freaking FD3 RX-7 advertised has a fresh engine. On the flip side the Miata is as rock solid reliable as it is fun to drive. Hopefully, the RX-8 will have a record similar to the Miata.

I really don't know why I am arguing this point. I just think it is sad that some people live by the "once scorned, forever scorned" motto. People with a closed mind miss many opportunities in the future.

m477

To be fair, yes Ford did help Mazda's recovery in the 1990's. And they do make some decent pickup trucks (F series). However, any Ford *car* I've been in or driven has just been subpar compared to the competition.

Ford's reliablity ratings for cars in Cosumer Reports is pretty poor across the board, where as almost every Mazda has received excellent reliability ratings. Therefore, it's definitely an improvement for ford to use the m6 platform in their cars. However, I'll make an effort to be less deragatory about it in the future.

MikeW

So is ford's new large car going to be based off of the Volvo S80, and a midsize [neo mondeo/contour] derived from the Mazda 6
Ford said that the cost of acquiring Volvo was well worth it for acquiring the P2 (volvo S80) platform

Everything ford makes is junk
F-150, where is the four wheel drive, only off-road drive
Ranger, joke
explorer, junky old engine, 3speed automatic+overdrive to make a five speed automatic, four wheel drive only on top models, eddie bauer+limited
Focus/taurus/crown vic horrible vehicle lighting obsolete engine and trans
DEW98-lincoln LS Jag Stype, Thunderbird, The big revision for 2003 brings it up to competitive levels, but the competition just got better, new Eclass, 5series,A6

Although Ford is smart to partner up with ZF for parts. Trans 6 speed auto and CVTs, steering racks, etc.

SpreeGuy

F-150, I'm confused, looking on ford.ca, there appears to be a 4x4 option
Ranger, Joke?
Explorer, for such a horrible suv, you'd think no one would buy it. Funny how it was america's 2002 #1 selling suv. Note: all models come standard all-wheel drive.
Focus/Taurus/Crown Vic., Bad lighting, what a shame. obsolete engine(s), which one, the 2.0L Zetec? the 3.0L Duratec (same block as the mazda6), or the 4.6L V8 that also resides within the new maurader?
DEW98. Eclass?5Series?A6? not exactly imediate competition. Often $10,000+ price difference.

it's really sad that some people can be so ignorant, that a company must be either good, or Ford-ish

Note: I'm not trying to convince anyone that Ford is the best. They are far from it. But, I am trying to show that just because you "think" some of their products are sub-par, it doesn't make all of there vehicles "junk"

Spining Ncnratr

Well lets look at the facts

1 Best selling Full size truck F150

2 Best selling SUV Explorer

3 Need to upgrade or replace Taurus, Forever Mustang, and Ranger these 3 are getting left in the dust big time.

4 Bring some of the Euro Fords over diffenitly the Mondeo, Puma
to replace the Taurus, ZX2

But yes Ford has faults but also Mazda can do more R&D with the 2nd largest Auto maker behind them look at the OK to go with the Rotory again case in point.

m477

Again, this silly notion that large sales = better product.

So by the same reasoning, NSYNC and Backstreet Boys are the most talented musicians in the world, Budweiser is the best beer, and Velveeta is tastier than all of the finest imported French cheeses.

SpreeGuy

remember we are not saying ford is the best.

although when talking about the f-150 and explorer. a majority of people will agree that it is the best product *to suit their individual needs*

Like for example the rx-8, although not the best "sports car" it has the sales advantage of appealing to a wider range of people.

Andrew

Have Ford and Nissan ever worked together? I was sitting behind a 1998 (I think, not entirly sure, could be older) Mercury Villager, and right beside it was a Nissan Quest of about the same year. They looked exactly the same, without the badging they are the same vehicle. So I was just wondering whats the deal there?

Spining Ncnratr

Yes built right in Lorain Ohio down the same Assembly line
but now Nissan has come out with a new Quest of they'er own design and the Merc. Villager is done and 6 ft under but Mercury is getting a Windstar called the Monterey SP? But Nissan claimed it was cheaper for Ford to build the Quest for them than to do it themselfs. Like the old addage says Truth is stranger than fiction.