I went to look at an RX8 for the first time yesterday. and I'm already pissed at the dealer and I didn't even begin negotiations.

On the sticker, they had "dealer installed packages"

"Protection Pakage" $2995
for:
pin stripes
Door guards
wheel locks
Cloth protectant.

this was on all the cars with cloth!!! WTF!!! $2995 for those crappy items that MAYBE add up to $200. Amazing.

I cannot stand it when the dealer insults would-be buyers like this. The Nissan dealer does the same thing with the Z's. I asked 5 sales people how much wheel locks cost and none of them can answer me.

anyway..sorry for the rant. I just hope nobody ever pays for that crap.

P.S. With this new Power information (i.e. 238 hp) do you think new RX-8s will be easier to make deals on?

later
Ciccone

P.S. I edited the title I'm sorry for misleading others with the previous title.

If that was in the UK i'd report them to trading standards.

Originally posted by Edo
If that was in the UK i'd report them to trading standards. And in the US I'd report them to Mazda, since they're trying to double-charge for wheel locks that come standard with the car.

^^GREAT POINT!

I might just do that, since it bothers me so much.

I had a similar experience. There were two dealers to choose from. One had a dealer installed paint sealant for $495. The other had installed the spare tire kit for $395. I could tell that the spare tire was there but I couldn't confirm that the paint was "sealed," so I went for the spare.

In addition to the $1000 plus markup on the RX-8, even a Protoge LX next to the 8 had an ADM of $995. This is an ecomony car that has been out for 4 years and is getting ready to be replaced. I saw the markup on the RX-8 and asked the salesman about the "stupid tax" and he got really hot. I don't care and left the lot without even discussing a test drive. Honda quit this crap (in our city at least) several years ago and I am sure that their sales and satisfaction skyrocketed. The car industry is not strong enough to support this type of dealer behavior. If Mazda NA cannot get a handle on their dealer network it may derail Mazda's comeback. Sorry about the rant!

^^that is what pisses me off! that they ASSUME you want the dealer installed packages. it is just a way for them to make more money.

Paint sealant is a JOKE. trust me, I worked at a dealership and I also owned a car detail business. Paint sealant is nothig more then a standard wax product they apply. It took our 'service guys' 10 minutes to apply, but we would keep the cars in the 'back' for more then an hour to allude to the customer that we were doing something important.

At the acura dealership I worked at we also tried to sell a 'package' that was 'wheel locks, trunk tray, door guards and rubber floor mats' for $895.

We had LEFT over items that we had to get rid of, so management forced us to put this on the sticker price.

I would love to say hello to the person that actually purchases all of this stuff.

I have an email into the dealership to see if they can explain the $2995. I'll share with you when I hear back.

I saw the same thing on a showroom unspoken for RX-8 at the Oakville Ontario dealer. They added:
Tinted windows $ 500 CDN ($350.00 USD)
Protection Package (rust proof/Scotch Guard/? $500 CDN
Plus a $300 CDN admin charge for you doing business with them.

I left, a went elsewhere, found a dealer that does not believe in
charging an admin fee, especially when he can get list price.

I checked around you, can get Tinting done for $145-200 CDN,
so this dealer is really trying to suck your money out of you.

^^ LOL!! here in the states some dealers have an "Advertising fee". Bascially saying that it costs them approx $200-300 a person to advertise, so if you buy the car you have to pay them back for their advertising!

amazing.

I think this kind of crap used to be even more common. It seems some dealers are getting wise, now that the buying public has become more educated. Of course, there are still some who feel obligated to try to soak the consumers simply because they can. I too think Mazda should lean on this type of behavior, but if they are, it apparently isn't hard enough. They (Mazda) need to realize their dealer network already has a crappy rep, and ultimately, they'll fail without dealers.

For those of you who do not have a decent dealer near you, I would suggest trying a different approach. There are a number of services available on the internet or through some banks or credit unions that will go out and search around the country for the car you want at the price you specify. I guess there's a nominal charge for this, but its worth it. A friend of mine got fed up with the BMW dealers here in S. Florida and did this...she paid less than dealer prices and got the car she wanted (which she couldn't find that way at the dealers anyway) delivered to the office.

jds

^interesting.

i do remember a guy at the dealership I worked at, he came in one day, he picked up his car. basically he bought it directly through his credit union, he never dealt with the dealer until he had to pick up the keys.

I know that Costco also has some buying services.

I too wonder if pricing will be affected by the new revelation.

When I checked the inventory for where I live they had 71 RX8's in the four Mazda dealerships in my area. This was before the announcement about the HP issue. To me it sounds like the RX8's aren't exactly "flying off the shelf", at least in my area.

Personally, I think this HP issue will make it easier to deal (perhaps deals as low as 1.5% to 2% over invoice.) This is especially true when the "New-Used" RX8 start popping up.

I guess this is good for people like me who have not bought the RX8, but bad for the rotary development.


Magic8

a freind of my wife decidied that she liked my car so much she was getting one too. after going around to @4 dealers she found one that had a car in port that she is picking up today at msrp no extra fees plus she was at the place on friday when the conference calls happened and heard all about the hp mistake from me, so she is getting the $500 and free maitenaince too :D

Do not pay for that extra crap! especially not pinstripping(who wants that?) and the wheel locks which come standard!!

Originally posted by zoom44
Do not pay for that extra crap! especially not pinstripping(who wants that?) and the wheel locks which come standard!!

That was my question too- who the heck puts PINSTRIPING on an 8? Yuck!

I got the whole "teflon" coating talk, but declined. $500 for something I can take care on my own- no thanks.

those wheel locks are standard, no? i have the GT so maybe they're just standard on mine, i dunno...anyhow, i was charged a $595 fee for processing and handling...it was on the sticker so i didn't bother with questioning but maybe i should have?

oh and i agree with Elara, pinstriping would've completely ruined the car...pinstriping is SO 80's...

Car dealerships are a business just like any other, and they are in business to make money. When you go into a clothing store, or a jewelry store do you ask them what their cost on the items you are purchasing is? Markup on jewelry is often 1100% or higher, and 400% or higher on clothing, yet since everyone charges that everyone accepts that, and you can't go in there and negotiate the price because they will just tell you to get out. Car dealerships have so many laws against them they are required to disclose a lot of information to their customers. Prices on everything are negotiable at a dealership, but just like in other types of retail businesses, if everyone else is charging the same, its going to be hard to negotiate it for much less. Since the RX-8 is a new car dealersherships are charging additional dealer markups because they can, and people will still by them, its a price you might have to pay in your area to be one of the first, because if you dont buy it, someone else probably will in less than a few weeks paying the markup. The high price for paint sealant etc. etc. might be ridiculous, but the price on that is negotiable, as long as they still make some profit on it, they probably wont care to much. You might as well try negotiating the price with them, sicne you can go somewhere else and get the same thing for less at another dealership. At the last dealership I was doing sales and leasing at, we had additional dealer markup on every single new car on the lot, ranging from $2999-$4999. As a salesman, a lot of people would get mad and say I won't pay that, and I say, I wouldn't pay that either. Some of my customers payed the extra markup, or a discount off of it, and some didn't. Everybody thinks dealerships are big scams and are out to steal your money, well most dealerships are just businesses trying to make money, but because of the product they sell, they have to make a lot of profit because most dealerships only sell 100-200 cars a month and they have salesman, salesmanagers, finance managers, and all sorts of other people to pay. Im not going to say these people are poor, but I know just about everybody in the sales department works very hard for the money they make, when I was in sales I was working 50-60hours a week, and 12hour days on Fridays and Saturdays, and now in F&I I work more hours, and now that our other F&I manager is gone for 6 weeks, I have to work 6-7 days a week. Any customer I have I try and make sure they get a fair deal and are happy for what they're getting, and every dealerships I have worked for trys to put their customer first, but there are a lot of other dealerships out there that make the money their only concern.

When will these idiots learn. I bought mine at MSRP and the dealer did'nt even complain when I told them not to put their logo on my car. It is hard to beat a small town dealer (Indian Mound Mazda Heath, Ohio). We should post the names of ehtical, fair dealers and ones to avoid, this is the only way to put an end to this nonsense. Many people hate to "shop" for cars because of the bad experience. I, on the other hand love it especially when I get a jerk salesman. We need to remember THEY DONT EAT IF WE DONT BUY THEIR CAR. The worst I can do is keep my money.

Icemaster^^

i too was a salesguy at a dealership, but this in no way makes me 'like' the way they try and rob a customer.

What the dealership is doing is different then going into a clothing or jewelry store and paying retail for an item. You see, when i go to buy Jeans, I buy JEANS at that price. I don't have to worry about the store pricing the Jeans at $29.99 PLUS adding a "store appearance package" that consists of a Leather belt, ankle flares and beaded back pocket for $10 more!

What the dealer is doing with 'dealer installed' packages is taking a chance that someone will want it. They figure it is easy for them to mark it on the sticker and if ONE, just ONE person takes it, then they make almost 100% profit from it. However, what it does is cause frustration, anger and insult in the majority of the consumers that are smart enough to know these packages are bogus.

Good business sense should never include 'assumptions' that your customer wants an overpriced package of items that are not appealing.

I would rather them put a "popular vehicle' markup on the car rathr then their lame 'dealer packages'. At least they would be honest.

P.S. With this new Power information (i.e. 238 hp) do you think new RX-8s will be easier to make deals on?

The RX-8 just isn't 238hp. If they confessed to the actual HP, the RX-8 would BOMB for sure. It's an RSX type S - Fun, Zippy, Neato, etc. etc. ANY dealer markup is criminal.

Would any of you buy an RSX-S for better than $30k plus dealer markup.

Wow, Icemastr. slow down and find the carriage return (i.e., "enter") key on your keyboard.

Sorry, had to razz ya, but actually I agree with most of what you say. Markups are scuzzy (in my mind) but not inherently dishonest. Hey, the sticker is posted, markup is there in black-and-white. Anyone don't like it, there's the door.

What really rubs me the wrong are dealers who add that junk (sealant, underbody coat, wheel locks, etc) to every car just cuz it's their policy. We all know it's a scam but there are enough stooges out there that don't understand the rules of the game that the dealer gets away with it. What it says to me at a dealership like that -- and there are many, of all auto makes -- is that they believe their customers are suckers. Those who walk out, fine, but enough will buy the car at the inflated markup to proved that the dealer is right. Really jacks me the wrong way.

Originally posted by Elara


That was my question too- who the heck puts PINSTRIPING on an 8? Yuck!

I got the whole "teflon" coating talk, but declined. $500 for something I can take care on my own- no thanks.

I got my RX-8 GT with Ming treatment ( basically a clear coat protectant) and at list price from my dealer, without even haggling.

There are a few dealers out there who are not gouging..

Clear-coat protectant = wax.


sorry to say that.


Paint and clear coat technology is developed by manufacturers and LARGE corporations specializing in this area...NOT the dealership using off the shelf products.

its all worthless...work at a dealership for a few days and you will learn A LOT.

Originally posted by ciccone376
Clear-coat protectant = wax.


sorry to say that.


Paint and clear coat technology is developed by manufacturers and LARGE corporations specializing in this area...NOT the dealership using off the shelf products.

its all worthless...work at a dealership for a few days and you will learn A LOT.

Good to know. I know nothing about Ming treatment.
I DO know about sprayed on clear coat, which is essentially a clear lacquer, and I use Zaino to polish my car.
Heck, I restored a 1946 Dodge truck years ago, and sprayed 6 coats of clearcoat on it, wet sanding between each coat with 1200 grit. It shined like a mirror, and was one tough finish.

So, what exactly IS the Ming treatment stuff? Wax?

It took two weeks of shoping and I have to drive two hours away just to get mine at MSRP.

Silver, GT, Navigation and spare tire out the door for 32,395. I had to get 4 SP A/T so wife could have some fun too.