I really don't understand this, why is Mazda just avoiding the subject of fixing the problem with a $500 check?

A recall that would fix the problem would result in:

- Customers getting what they paid for - Remember the vast majority of us put money down before the car was even produced based on part on Mazda's production numbers. We kept on reading about the car with quotes from the head of Mazda "this car will put down 200-204 rwhp" and will get 20-30mpg... well simple fact is it doesn't.

- Would result in the car still being as desirable - lets face it, resale value is based on how desirable a car is... for a "sports car" a reputation of being underpowered will kill resale value

- No longer be a sudden flood of cheaper used RX8's on the market - comes back to resale value again. MAzda is basically going to set the standard in a month for how much our cars just depreciated because of it being underpowered!

- I bought the car thinking of screaming to the 9000 rpm redline. Instead I got a car that lays down after hitting 6000 rpm's - it truely makes no sense to even go to 9000 rpms since it doesn't even pull hard up there!! Its worth more then $500 to me personally.

- I would personally have a much better opinion of Mazda admitting the problem and fixing it, rather then admitting it and taking the easy way out :( .


They made a great car without a doubt, but they sure aren't trying very hard to keep its reputation.

I would assume there is no recall, because there is no design, manufacture or assembly problem.

The engine is making what it's supposed to, from a design view-point. It's not just making what was claimed.

No recall, because there's nothing to fix.

However, I agree that resale values will be hurt a bit by this.

Hopefully the insurance premiums will drop to compensate.

How about MPG? For a 3000 lb. car with 238bhp it should get into the low 20's at least.

Originally posted by RomanoM
I would assume there is no recall, because there is no design, manufacture or assembly problem.

The engine is making what it's supposed to, from a design view-point. It's not just making what was claimed.

No recall, because there's nothing to fix.




I would not just ASSUME anything anymore.

There is a problem when suddenly the engine looses efficiency and therefore has 20 less rwhp (at least according to Mazda's 200-204rwhp claim *weeks* before the first cars went on sale) and gets worse gas milage. The 247hp number wasn't just made up by engineers/marketing, somewhere along the line the US-spec cars actually DID make that amount and the IS a reason its not making that now OR it was always a blatant lie.

When this happened on the 99 Cobra, it was a last minute change to the intake/exhaust manifolds. It was admitted to, recalled and fixed. SVT learned from their mistake.

Judging by the dyno curves posted before there are some issues above 6200rpm. I think Mazda is aware and hopefully they are trying their best to figure it out behind the scenes and maybe one day the Renesis will make the claimed 247 hp.. or ~200whp.

Perhaps some of your cars DO have a problem- mine just keeps hauling ass after 6krpms, AND I'm getting the gas mileage stated on the window sticker. Maybe those of you who aren't happy need to take them back to the dealership for a checkup....

Thank you, Elara. My mileage is where it should be so far, and the car seems fine to me. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one around here. Glad to know I'm not.

I just wonder if some of the first cars really do have an issue. Clearly, the cars that have been dyno'd so far are from the first batch. I'd be very interested to know how those built from June on do after they get around 5000 miles on them.

By the way, my car was built 06/03 according to the sticker on the door. When were the very first U.S. RX-8's built?

Yeah my car keeps pulling, should I feel it slow down? It certainly doesn't!

Originally posted by Elara
Perhaps some of your cars DO have a problem- mine just keeps hauling ass after 6krpms, AND I'm getting the gas mileage stated on the window sticker. Maybe those of you who aren't happy need to take them back to the dealership for a checkup....

Elara, does your car have the "port campain" sticker... I know it's really not my concearn since our cars get the lower horsepower and we were informed by Mazda some time ago... but perhaps a few were missed and don't have the remapped ECU at all?

What would a recall resolve anyways? A new ECU(requiring testing/EPA certification)? A new freer-flowing exhaust or intake?
What would you like to see if there was a "recall"?

NHTSA-ordered recalls are ordered to fix a safety-related mechanical defect, of which obviously this is not. The 2002 Miata missing rwhp/buy-back/discount card debacle came about when the long-lead print media reports(from Japan testing) recorded dyno figures BEFORE US emission gear installation/testing on our shores. They sucked it up and bought back over 250 Miatas from people with "buyer's remorse" when the weather got cooler. Should Mazda have learned from it the first time around? Absolutely! If a US marketing/advertising guru upon discovery fudged the published numbers for advertising, he/she should be strung up and hung out to dry. But if these dyno figures came from Japan pre-USA emissions, then there's a communications disconnect somewhere and someone didn't do their homework before publishing initial figures from Japan, and it's a helluva way to piss off FoMoCo, who gave the rotary a second chance to begin with. Think of how they feel relying on Mazda for this vehicle introduction. Someone's head is going to roll for messing up the flagship launch performance figures. Remember Mazda North American Operations is solely the USA-only sales, marketing, distribution, and parts/service/support arm of MC(Mazda Corporation).

Originally posted by BlueAdept


Elara, does your car have the "port campain" sticker... I know it's really not my concearn since our cars get the lower horsepower and we were informed by Mazda some time ago... but perhaps a few were missed and don't have the remapped ECU at all?

I've actually got two of them- checked this afternoon, so I can't imagine anything got missed on my car. My guess here is 1)something really is wrong with some of the earlier cars or 2) some people just *think* their car has a problem because they keep reading what others are writing here-kind of the suggestive-placing effect. No offense guys, but it happens.

And on the gas- it's not hard to get hideous mileage with it. I spend a lot of time in 5th and 6th gear, which has helped considerably. First tank was 16 mpg, 2nd &3rd was 20, and my 4th is looking even better.

But again, this is just my opinion. Until someone takes their car in to get it checked, we won't know for sure.

Elara and Loco -- Could you please elaborate on your gas mileage and driving habits? There are numerous threads about bad gas mileage many of us are getting; lowest is 13 mpg; average seems to be around 16, a few are getting 19.

For me, I'm now shifting at 3000 rpm (except for the rare occasions I jam it.) Freeway cruise about 80 mph. About half and half freeway vs city driving. I'm getting at best 17 mpg.

Can you post your similar stats and driving habits. I'd like to see what, if anything, I'm doing wrong and how to get better mileage. sounds to me like the two of you have figured it out.

ive been getting very good mileage also

think im usually around 20, maybe slightly more

ive got a really light foot on the gas, shift and 3k, accelerate lightly

in all honesty, i dont really know how people can be getting the mileage they say they are getting without laying on the gas all the time and doing nothing but revving to 9 grand
________
EXTREME VAPORIZER (http://extremevaporizer.net/)

Maybe the RX-8 likes girls. :D

OK, I've only filled up twice. My car has 630 miles on it, so I only redlined it for the first time this current tank. Prior to 600 miles, I kept the car under 6000 rpm.

First tank:
227.6 miles/12.0 gallons = 18.97 mpg

Second tank:
290.0 miles/12.5 gallons = 23.2 mpg

Typically, I shift anywhere from 3500-5000. I do not usually skip gears when upshifting. I stay in 6th gear as much as possible, downshifting to 5th or 4th to pass or for a burst of speed.

My commute to work is about 80/20 highway/city. I've been using Exxon 93 octane fuel.

Perhaps folks who feel like post 6K is lacking are doing most of their redlining in 1st gear only. Seriously, post 6K in 1st gear is not terribly dramatic, but in 2nd it is fine. Thing is, redline in 2nd gear majorly blows the speed limit on most public roads (not highways). I find myself a little reluctant to do a 0-67 in a 35 mph zone, while driving a red sportscar. Bottom line, try it out in 2nd a bit, and see if you notice a difference.

Same here with the good mileage and the car keeps going over 6K RPM. My worst tank was my first at about 14MPG. Ever since it has been going up and I am getting now about 300 miles to the tank, but this is wehen I have fun and redline it often or shift on the 7K RPM range and running the AC. If I use less AC and dont drive so hard I can get 385 miles to a tank. And that is darn good I think :) about 25MPG.

Originally posted by Genom
Same here with the good mileage and the car keeps going over 6K RPM. My worst tank was my first at about 14MPG. Ever since it has been going up and I am getting now about 300 miles to the tank, but this is wehen I have fun and redline it often or shift on the 7K RPM range and running the AC. If I use less AC and dont drive so hard I can get 385 miles to a tank. And that is darn good I think :) about 25MPG.

This is unreal. If I make a concerted effort to drive like a grandma I might get 17 mpg. And what you describe is hardly grandma (I'm talking about keeping it below 3000 except freeway cruising at 4000.) There is too great a disparity between your results and mine to be attributed to driving habits. Q: I get that black soot around my pipes; it accumulates very quickly after I clean it off. Are you getting it too?

Originally posted by Quick_lude
Judging by the dyno curves posted before there are some issues above 6200rpm. I think Mazda is aware and hopefully they are trying their best to figure it out behind the scenes and maybe one day the Renesis will make the claimed 247 hp.. or ~200whp. I'll second that!:D :D :D

Originally posted by pr0ber
I really don't understand this, why is Mazda just avoiding the subject of fixing the problem with a $500 check?

A recall that would fix the problem would result in:

- Customers getting what they paid for - Remember the vast majority of us put money down before the car was even produced based on part on Mazda's production numbers. We kept on reading about the car with quotes from the head of Mazda "this car will put down 200-204 rwhp" and will get 20-30mpg... well simple fact is it doesn't.

- Would result in the car still being as desirable - lets face it, resale value is based on how desirable a car is... for a "sports car" a reputation of being underpowered will kill resale value

- No longer be a sudden flood of cheaper used RX8's on the market - comes back to resale value again. MAzda is basically going to set the standard in a month for how much our cars just depreciated because of it being underpowered!

- I bought the car thinking of screaming to the 9000 rpm redline. Instead I got a car that lays down after hitting 6000 rpm's - it truely makes no sense to even go to 9000 rpms since it doesn't even pull hard up there!! Its worth more then $500 to me personally.

- I would personally have a much better opinion of Mazda admitting the problem and fixing it, rather then admitting it and taking the easy way out :( .


They made a great car without a doubt, but they sure aren't trying very hard to keep its reputation. Pr0ber - it sounds like you know how to fix this problem - it sounds so straightforward. You should give Mazda a call to help them out as I would love Mazda to correct the issue rather than give me some freebies. Or perhaps you have no clue how to fix this, and neither does Mazda... yet. Give them time - this buyback/incentive offer is there to prevent lawsuits and hopefully in 3-6 months Mazda (or somone else) MAY have a real solution.

I am slightly more concerned about the fuel economy than power although I am just within the expected limits. On my 4th tank I averaged 18mpg (mostly city driving, redlined about 10 times a day and exceeded 6000rpm in 1st gear every single time, AC always on, use 5th/6th a lot too). This is still a lot better than my first tankful where I never exceeded 6000rpm, and mostly stayed below 4000rpm and still only got 15.5mpg.

I would have assumed that this poll would be a no-brainer but looking at the results, proved otherwise.

I think most owners would prefer a recall, or a fix, if there was a problem that can be easily remedied. I would, since I didn't have free scheduled maintenance and was going to pay for it anyway. But I don't blame some people that want the money and the scheduled maintenance, since they feel comfortable with the car's performance already.

In regards to a fix or recall. Maybe Mazda didn't offer it because their hands are tied. We still don't know yet, so this may be speculation. If it happened to be a emissions limiting decision, maybe there is no way legally that they can push out the original HP's & violate that emissions limit.

That's not to say that a third-party won't put out a fix or mod to recover those missing horses. Which is legal to do.

Originally posted by pelucidor
Give them time - this buyback/incentive offer is there to prevent lawsuits and hopefully in 3-6 months Mazda (or somone else) MAY have a real solution.





Looks like theres going to be this offer and thats it from the wording unless we can suddenly get them to fix the problem by putting more pressure on them.

Very disappointing.... VERY


On the other hand, I'm glad I'm not the only one that feels we deserve a recall.

no problems with power or gas mileage
this car was never meant to haul ass and it was never expected to get stellar gas mileage

everyone just shut up and drive the damned cars

Originally posted by XUrotaryrocket
no problems with power or gas mileage
this car was never meant to haul ass and it was never expected to get stellar gas mileage

everyone just shut up and drive the damned cars

XU, I would agree except with careful driving I'm getting barely 16 mpg. If I drive sportier, then mileage is worse. I'd like to be able to get 21 mpg with careful driving, then I wouldn't sweat it otherwise. The reduced hp makes no difference to me at all, but the mileage is unconscienable. It's starting to look to me like there are two variants of this car: One that can get 21 mpg or better depending on driving habits, and another that can't get 17 no matter what you do. Unfortunately, I'm in the latter group. If I return the car, that'll be the reason why.