I would prefer to have my headlights on during the day as is the case with many new cars of late. Mazda does this with other cars they make but not the RX8. Why?

I would love to make that happen for my yet to be RX8 BUT would also like to make the lights turn off when I turn off the car. In the past, I have forgotten to do this and paid the price in the way of a dead battery.

Anyone else have any ideas (other than to turnn them on manually and NOT FORGET TO TURN THEM OFF MANUALLY :(

Thanks,

Claude H.

Sun up. Lights off. Thank you.

They are fugly.....keep em away

Daytime running lights are lame. I know when to turn my lights on and off, thanks.

But if you want your lights on in the daytime so bad, just turn them on. Mazda isn't taking away the choice, and I applaud them for that.

Turning them on is easy, remembering to turn them off is the problem.

And by the way, lame to some of you perhaps but having them on not only makes you more visible to others on the road but has been proven statistically to lessen the risks of getting involved in an accident.

And I thought we all wanted to be more visible driving our machines.

Anyone with some useful information? It would be appreciated.

Claude H.

Originally posted by claude4
Turning them on is easy, remembering to turn them off is the problem.


I think letting people make their own choice is the correct decision. But here's the "useful information" you were asking for:

The car chimes if you take the keys out and the lights are left on. It's pretty hard to forget.

Actually unless the cdn car is different the chime doesn't chime until you open your door.

Oh but in Canada we have daytime lights they aren't the same as the headlights and they look rather cool actually!

Makes the car look MEAN

Originally posted by Wing
Actually unless the cdn car is different the chime doesn't chime until you open your door.



I guess you're right, Wing. I usually open the door about the same time I remove the key. Either way, it serves the purpose. It's pretty hard to forget the lights are on when the car is singing to you. ;)

Daytime running lights only useful when visibility isn't permit due to weather (such as location where isn't getting much sun). In the sunny Southern California where I live, we need no dam light in the day time :D. Though daytime running lights are/should be little dimmer when it's on compared to regular night driving light, in which isn't available as an option for our RX8 for sure.

Pro-choice wrt the headlamps here - thx Mazda.

Your best defense against accidents is proactive, defensive -style driving. This technique will far outweigh any benefits of daytime running lights.

However, if you really wanted, you could wire up the headlights to always be on when the ignigtion key is in and turned on. You could do it yourself, if you're so inclined, or get someone else to do it for you. In either case, make sure to get the schematics from the service manual, to minimize the experimentation factor ;)

Also, one of the major drawbacks to DRLs is the fact that as dusk approaches, most people do NOT physically turn on the lights since the headlights are already on. This is bad, however, because the tail lights do not illuminate with DTRs. The result is folks driving around at night with no tail lights. Not good.

One thing I hate about DTRs is that when approaching the gate of a military base at night, I can't turn off the damned lights and the guard gets very annoyed.

I'm not sure about the 8 but my hyundai had DTRL and the tail lights were on as well!

The DTRL are A LOT less bright than headlights, it's a different system.

In clear conditions, in full daylight, if you cant see a car without its lights on you should get off the roads.

This whole DTRL stuff started with volco's etc because in their home country it was made law, as their weather usualy gives poor visibility.

I'm glad mazda havnt installed them on the RX-8 - people need to grow a brain.

Originally posted by B-Nez
Also, one of the major drawbacks to DRLs is the fact that as dusk approaches, most people do NOT physically turn on the lights since the headlights are already on. This is bad, however, because the tail lights do not illuminate with DTRs. The result is folks driving around at night with no tail lights. Not good.That's why cars should have auto on/off headlights as well as DRLs ;) - I had my IS300 configured to have the HIDS come on within 10secs of entering a tunnel or covered carpark (and off again 10secs after entering sunlight, with DRLs remaining on). I am not sure why the RX-8 doesn't at least come with auto-off headlights like most other Mazdas instead of the silly chime.

I am normally a big proponent of DRLs just because of the safety stats from Europe. But in my particular case in sunny Texas if someone doesn't see my bright red car from a mile away they won't see it with DRLs either.

I love that feature (auto-on/off) My parents have a 1997 pontiac transport and it has that!

And that was the base model with manual windows and manual everything, but the lights are auto.

Only thing is they don't seem to come on when it's rainy and cloudy. But if you enter underground parking they do, basically you NEVER have to touch the light switch.

My 2k Celica had DRLs and the 'auto on' feature. The DRL were the high beams at low power.

As I started to drive other cars (after my accident), I found it very, very odd that I had to manually turn on the headlights - guess I got soft. lol

What's wrong with everyone here? If someone wants to put a mohawk on their car and glue pennies to the doors, it's their money and their car. Being excitied about cars period is great - who cares if it's not to your taste?

Aside from whether or not everyone likes or dislikes DRLs, there are kits you can purchase to refit a car that doesn't have them standard. It's law in Canada, so I'm sure a refit kit isn't very hard to find - you should do some google-ing and see what you find.

Originally posted by pelucidor
I am normally a big proponent of DRLs just because of the safety stats from Europe. But in my particular case in sunny Texas if someone doesn't see my bright red car from a mile away they won't see it with DRLs either.

What Safety Stats from Europe??

The UK has the safest roads in Europe, and the ONLY cars to have headlights on in day time are the sweedish lot (volvo's etc).

Our roads are safe because we :
[list=1]
Use seatbelts
Dont drive drunk
Generaly have a decent driving standard
[/list=1]

Its nothing to do with Headlights on in daytime.

Sure - its a lot of effort (both physicaly and mentaly) to switch them on if visibility is poor, but rewarding!

Honestly, if you cant see a car in reasonable conditions without its headlights on, in daylight stay off the roads. No ammount of lights or electronic gagetry should replace your brain.

now, motorbikes, thats a different story.

Day-time running lights are a definite safety feature especially if you have a Titanium Gray or Silver cars. Those colors blend in much better with the backgrounds and are harder to see than other colors.

In the Navy, if something is made out of steel they paint it "battleship gray". And if something is aluminum often they don't paint it at all.

In the urban jungle most of live in the gray cars blend in the most. Day-time running lights (which are only 20 Watts or so not full bright headlights.) help you remain visible in all lighting conditions.

It won't matter to me with my Yellow car on order, but for those with the more tame colors be extra careful when you are passing cars in the fast lane. They just might not see you.

-Mr. Wigggles

from my own experiences, i HATE DRL's...you can't just park somewhere without the lights being on...

for instance, say you're picking someone up from their house and they're still getting ready...well, you'd have to turn the car to the 1st on position to turn the lights off which is basically killing the engine...of course, now in hot weather you can't have the air conditioner on because it'll just blow hot air...because the rotary isn't made to be able to turn on and off at your leisure, DRL wouldn't be a prudent "feature" or lack thereof however you want to look at it..

like somesaid before, it's not a choice but the lack of a choice...i think the best approach Mazda could have taken is an automatic shut-off for the lights when the key is out of the ignition and the doors are opened...that's what i had in my Mitsu and it worked great...i never turned them off but when i needed to turn them off, ie. parked somewhere and needed the engine running, i could...

btw, i do not believe DRL are any different from regular lights...when purchasing my RAV-4, it was a $50 relay switch that was automatically added on...i would, however, gladly pay $50 more to get it off....

Originally posted by RobDickinson


What Safety Stats from Europe??

The UK has the safest roads in Europe, and the ONLY cars to have headlights on in day time are the sweedish lot (volvo's etc).

Our roads are safe because we :
[list=1]
Use seatbelts
Dont drive drunk
Generaly have a decent driving standard
[/list=1]

Its nothing to do with Headlights on in daytime.

Sure - its a lot of effort (both physicaly and mentaly) to switch them on if visibility is poor, but rewarding!

Honestly, if you cant see a car in reasonable conditions without its headlights on, in daylight stay off the roads. No ammount of lights or electronic gagetry should replace your brain.

now, motorbikes, thats a different story.

The UK is not that much better in terms of safety versus the US. They are almost identical.

In 2001, The casualty rate in the UK was 656 causulties (any type of reported injury) per billion Kilometers traveled. (vast majority were injuries due to car accidents)

http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_transstats/documents/graphic/dft_transstats_507488-3.jpg

http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_transstats/documents/graphic/dft_transstats_507488-4.jpg

In 2001, The injury rate in the US was 681 injuries per billion Kilometer traveled.

http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/pdf/nrd-30/NCSA/Rpts/2003/Assess02.pdf

So the U.K. is safer and that is probably because the pubs have to close at 11PM correct? Also, there are certain demographics of people in the US that don't wear their seatbelts. They just don't do it for some reason.

The Swedes are the ones who pioneered the concept of having driving lights on at all times. Does anyone have any Sweedish accident data?

-Mr. Wigggles

Ps. I wanted to compare death rates but the UK data lumps deaths and "serious injuries" into one category thus inflating their figure. Also, deaths are about 1% of all injuries.

BRx8,

Did you try and pull up the parking brake to see if that turns off the DRL's? On most (if not all) GM vehicles, this works.

-Mr. Wigggles

Now this is getting interesting.

I will be getting a Titanium RX8 and I do want to have some way of having my lights on during the day AND equalily important, have the car turn them off if I forget to do so myself when I leave.

I had left the car lights on in the dealer showroom, with the hand brake on while I talked with the salesman. The lights remained on the whole time.

If there is an aftermarket solution or a google search to be made, what am I looking for?

Your assistance is appreciated.

Claude H.

Auto sensing headlights = cool, gadget-like

Daytime running lights = not cool, more safety crap shoved down my throat til I puke.

Originally posted by norats
Auto sensing headlights = cool, gadget-like

Daytime running lights = not cool, more safety crap shoved down my throat til I puke.

Seatbelts really cramp your style to don't they?

-Mr. Wigggles

I did a search or two (not really all that comprehensive or extensive) and what I found was a few miata guys that wanted the same thing, and they bought the DRL module from a Canadian Mazda dealership and installed it in a rediculously short amount of time. I think the procedure involved finding the point to plug in said module, removing rubber "delete" plugs, plugging in module, and making sure everything looked good put back together.

I have no idea if this idea translates to the RX-8, but it'd be worth a shot to maybe email some canadian mazda dealerships... The other thing that was mentioned was the fact that if you bought the miata module in the states, it was ~$80 but if you bought it up North, it was considerably less expensive (no idea why, can't confirm, just reporting what I read). The other thing to do is to work with your current dealership and see if they can't help.

Good luck, and let us know what you find.

Originally posted by MrWigggles
BRx8,

Did you try and pull up the parking brake to see if that turns off the DRL's? On most (if not all) GM vehicles, this works.

-Mr. Wigggles

i never even thought of trying that considering the RAV4 is automatic...i'll try that tonight when i get home and tell you how it goes but if you're wrong then THANKS FOR GETTING MY HOPES UP!!! :mad: :eek:

j/k - :D

I don't remember any of the specifics, but in the Celica, people did something to one of the fuses which disabled the DRLs.

In the US 8's, is it simply a matter of installing a fuse to make them work?

Originally posted by OmegaBob
I don't remember any of the specifics, but in the Celica, people did something to one of the fuses which disabled the DRLs.

In the US 8's, is it simply a matter of installing a fuse to make them work?

naw, i don't think so...in the RAV4, it was an actual $50 part, a relay i believe to make the daytime running lights turn on whenever the car was in ACC...i'm sure the fuse that is being taken out on the Celica's are for that relay

Originally posted by BRx8
i never even thought of trying that considering the RAV4 is automatic.I was about to ask why the type of transmission would have any bearing on the use of the handbrake, but then remembered that Americans just slam the thing into Park and leave it rocking on the transmission without applying the handbrake. Do they teach that in Driver's Ed?

I once borrowed a friends automatic Saturn, and he though I'd broken something because it wouldn't move when he shifted into Drive and hit the gas!

Originally posted by eccles
I was about to ask why the type of transmission would have any bearing on the use of the handbrake, but then remembered that Americans just slam the thing into Park and leave it rocking on the transmission without applying the handbrake. Do they teach that in Driver's Ed?

I once borrowed a friends automatic Saturn, and he though I'd broken something because it wouldn't move when he shifted into Drive and hit the gas!

you're right, we don't use the parking brake on automatics...at least every single person i've ever been in the car with always just puts it into park...and no, i don't ever remember learning that in driver's ed except when driving manual which is obvious...

Awfully cheap of me I realize, but I didn't afford an RX-8 by wasting money...

Anyway, My insurance company gives me a 10% discount for them. Seems to me to be well worth the money. Might just have to contact a Canadian dealer. I do have the Titanium gray so it is either DRL or green neon strips under the car... lol

I dont need daytime running light because my car is yellow

Anybody ever thought about making the fogs run during the day, I think it would look mean

I think Mazda didn't put the DRL on so the car wouldn't look like a GM product. Is GM the only car maker with those stupid lights?

Originally posted by MrWigggles


Seatbelts really cramp your style to don't they?

-Mr. Wigggles

Background...
I drive a motorcycle in southern california & my life is on the line every time I go out. I have no seatbelt nor would it do any good. Helmets are pretty useless at 65mph. I can see the potential accident three lanes away, again, my life is on the line, I have to. I simply carry this driving awareness over to my cars (another 20-23k miles/year).
So rather than worry about driving around with big inflatable tires around the outside of everyone's car & making the speed limit say, 20, why don't we legislate a better, more accurate, driver's exam or require defensive driving school or something along those lines. You can't manufacture out or legislate out poor drivers with "nanny" laws...that group will always be there.
Bottom line: Why should I have to drive around during the day with my lights on because others aren't paying attention or have eyesight that's too poor to be driving anyway?
BTW, I believe seat belts save lives & are a very good thing, I just believe personal safety should be the driver's choice. Same thing with the running lights, don't force this crap on people, give them the option.

Also, in your post "to" is spelled "too"

Norats - I agree, seat belts are great. They save lives. But your right about another thing, sometimes those DRL's are a waste of electricity anyways. Most people don't see them or don't care. They have become almost like a car alarm going off in a mall parking lot. Everyone hears it going off, but does anyone care?

A waste of electricity? Damn... you must be putting a mighty strain on your alternator to need that extra charge the battery gets. And the last time I checked, the alternator's pulley doesn't engage on extra load, so don't start talking about lost power or wasted gas...

Originally posted by RotorGeek
Anybody ever thought about making the fogs run during the day, I think it would look mean

they are meant for use during FOG
not driving, not DRL

DRL uses low Wattage

it's a personal choice, i don't like it, but i am sure the cops/other drivers see you better

there are DRL moduals you can buy, in our case you are tapping the high beam for DRL running 15-25% Wattage

go for it, it's a cool mod if you like DRL

I agree - DRL's help you stand out with the cops

Originally posted by norats


Bottom line: Why should I have to drive around during the day with my lights on because others aren't paying attention or have eyesight that's too poor to be driving anyway?


Bingo, because others aren't paying attention and you need all the help you can get. If you want to be the one who convinces the world that there are a bunch of mindless ignorant drivers out there by getting into accidents with them, be my guest. I, for one, am going to be trying to avoid accidents as much as possible and not become a statistic just to prove a point.

For some reason, I'm not surprised you are a bike rider. Sing it with me:

"You can fly so high, never going to die!"

-Mr. Wigggles

i recent the implication on motorcycle riders...

every driver's responsibility is to drive.
driving should be neither offensive nor defensive, but to drive, on public road that is.

reason we take defensive driving courses is because we know there are poor drivers out there, we see them everyday on the road. I accepted the burden because bottom line is my life, but it doesn't mean a poor driver can neglate my safty because i've 'tried' to avoid his thoughtless act on public road. The law and insurance put the burden on the better drivers to cover the poorer drivers. most people who care enough to surf these boards are probably on the better side already, simply because they care.

most auto driver view motorcycle drivers as unsafe and reckless and they put their lives on the line. well it correct only in the sense the rider accepted the danger limit, not that the poor driver can 'take' their lives because it's on the line.

most bike riders' behaviors seems reckless to drivers are because of what's preceived. they come up behind a car and 'because they are so small, they can't be seen'
NO, they can't be seen because poor driver didn't look!!!

let's get back to DRL should we?

back to DRL

DRL is run off a simple module in your engine bay

if you like it, go get one

if you don't like it, unplug it

sweden pioneer them as mr wiggles pointed out, i believed the reason is their weather? and the fact that part of the year, they get little sun light.

we have mix feeling about DRL apparetly, personally, living in so cal, i don't need it, when needed, i'll turn on my head lights because i believe it as a courtasey for me as a driver towards another, not to warn him or her per say, but to announce my presence.

now if insurance company come out and say it'll save me 10%, sure, i'll probably go get the module for the 8 to save me some cash.

Terence T,

I was refering to DRL's.

I was responding to the attitude: "Hey I don't need DRL's because if the other drivers can't see me, that's their problem."

Sure it might be the other driver's fault that they don't see you, but it is everyone's problem. It's everyone's auto insurance rates, it everyone's health insurance rates, and its everyone's highway that gets congested when an unnessary accident happens which better visibility may have prevented.

And, for those out there who don't want to "waste" what amounts to less than 40 Watts to power your DRL's (<1/20th of one HP!), then I won't "waste" power from my cell phone's battery to call 911 when I see your RX-8 and the idiot who didn't see you in a ditch bleeding to death.

-Mr. Wigggles

Well, I am still not clear on how to proceed.

I would love to be able to tell my dealer or my mechanic to install the correct module so that I have DRLs in my RX8 when I get it this fall. But without specifics, I am certain the dealer would be cluless at what to get.

My Volvo T5 seems to just have the headlights running at full intensity, not at reduced power as some here suggest. Basically my headlights are on when the car is on, off when the car is off. (BTW: There is a simple overide setting for those who do not wish to have DRLs).

I take it there is no cause for concern in having the Zenon HID on all the time?

Anyway, it would be nice to find a simple solution and a simple installation that my dealer could provide. (Does not the RX8 come with DRLs elsewhere in the world? Can I not request they get that "mazda" part and install it?

I don't know, this s/not be complicated.

Claude H.

Claude,

Good points. You wouldn't want to power up the HID's everytime you got in the car. The ignition sequence for the lights involves a high voltage spike to get the Xenon to ignite.

I think DRL could be implemented either with the fog lights or driving the high beams at a reduced power output. It doesn't have to be precise.

BTW, Sweden is the only country that I know of where you have to have some form of headlight on when you drive during the day. There might be others.

-Mr. Wigggles

Originally posted by claude4

I take it there is no cause for concern in having the Zenon HID on all the time?

it might, because xenon is whiter, close to sun light in color, during the day it will be less visible it seems. than halogen light


Anyway, it would be nice to find a simple solution and a simple installation that my dealer could provide. (Does not the RX8 come with DRLs elsewhere in the world? Can I not request they get that "mazda" part and install it?


not in the US because it's not require by law

Originally posted by MrWigggles


Bingo, because others aren't paying attention and you need all the help you can get. If you want to be the one who convinces the world that there are a bunch of mindless ignorant drivers out there by getting into accidents with them, be my guest. I, for one, am going to be trying to avoid accidents as much as possible and not become a statistic just to prove a point.

For some reason, I'm not surprised you are a bike rider. Sing it with me:

"You can fly so high, never going to die!"

-Mr. Wigggles

The point is about choice & that's it. If you want drl then turn on your lights during the day.
If you want to wear a helmet, wear one. If you want to wear seatbelts wear them. Just don't forcefully impose choices on the rest of us, (like auto drl) I can make my own choices. BTW, your stereotyping is all wrong..I do wear a helmet on my R1.
OK, so we agree to disagree.

Norats,

First off all I didn't insult you. I simply don't understand your arguments. Please re-read the post. I said I am not surprised you are a bike rider. I am also not surprised that you don't wear some form of a helmet. Your personality type is pretty clear.

Let me tell you a quick story, I have never been in any accident other than a couple low speed fender benders. But about 8 years ago, before DRL's even existed, I almost got into an accident with a motorcycle. It was dusk and I had the sun in my eyes about to make a left turn. At first glance forward, I was all clear to make the turn. So I looked left to start my turn, then I looked straightforward again and there he was a biker on his chopper. He came out of nowhere and luckilly I saw him the second time I looked. I was quickly able to stop and I didn't even get into his lane. I'm sure he saw me lurch forward but there was nothing he could do. If I had proceeded with the left turn his skull (without helmet) would have been through my windshield. The accident would have been my fault, but his head through my windshield would have been both of our problems. However, I guarantee if he had his light on or some other marker illuminated on his bike I would have seen him in the first place. This biker didn't have the ESP that you possess; he gave me a justified dirty look after I lurched forward because he knew he would have been a grill capture if I had not stopped my turn.

Yes, I can turn my fog lights on when I turn on the car and that would probably suffice, but it isn't automatic and I can't make it automatic. I like things such as automatic doorlocks, keyless entry, and other luxury/safety features. For instance, it would be a pain in the ass to turn on ABS everytime I started my car because a few racing purist didn't like the feel of anti-lock brakes. It should be the other way around. For those who don't want DRL's, the should be given a switch to turn them off. The default position should be "on".

I would like the option of some form of DRL's. It is a cheap safety feature and it is unubtrusive unlike many of the more exotic safety features being proposed. If I was a safety freak, I wouldn't be getting an RX-8 in the first place. I like to get from point A to point B as quickly as possible and I want any half asleep drivers to know where I am at.

I never want my next of kin to hear the words: "I am so sorry, I didn't see him."

-Mr. Wigggles

To give the thread a jolt back in the right direction...

Canuks have had DRLs for more than ten years, and I don't care either way, BUT - they became required on new cars in (I think) 1991, so it is now obvious to everyone that the oncoming vehicle is probably an '88 Dodge Aries or similar....it has become the cutoff point between 'normal' cars and P.O.S.

The '8' uses high beam bulbs, on low power, making a very yellow beam. I personally enjoy twilight now, it is time for those Xenons to take over! LOVE those lights! Don't get too close in traffic, you could fade the paint on the car ahead!:D :D
.
.
.
doc

Ok,

So is there a simple solution to this?

In the way of finding out what part needs to be added to the U.S. RX8 and where to get it, How much it costs and if the dealer could get it/install it?

Or do I have to find it as an aftermarket item? In which case I wouldn't know where to begin.

BTW: I appreciate the help.

Claude H.

miata's
www.miata.net/products/lights/mazda_drl_module.html

or buy the canadian version from a canadian forum user

So I just sent mazdausa an e-mail asking for the part number (s)they use on the RX8 to give it DRLs.

They do make the part(s), perhaps the wiring harness in the U.S. model lends itself to being readily modyfied?


Question is: Will I get a satisfactory answer or any answer, for that matter, from Mazda?

Claude H.

it'll be eaiser to find a forum user to go to the dealership for you

or you'll have to call mazda of CANADA instead, if mazda operates like say Honda
the CS dept only have US specs info

OK,

I may have to just remember to turn my headlights off when done using the car as I suspect that it would be almost impossible to get accurate info on the wiring diferences, if any, btwn US and Canada models. Let alone what would need to be done, correctly, to retrofit DRLs to a US RX8.

I tinker with computer networks, not cars.

Claude H.

I agree with you except your helmet statement. Helmets do a great job at 65 mph, I know from personal experience and am able to type this to you today because I chose to wear one.

Originally posted by norats


Background...
I drive a motorcycle in southern california & my life is on the line every time I go out. I have no seatbelt nor would it do any good. Helmets are pretty useless at 65mph. I can see the potential accident three lanes away, again, my life is on the line, I have to. I simply carry this driving awareness over to my cars (another 20-23k miles/year).
So rather than worry about driving around with big inflatable tires

Whenever someone with DRL is coming towards me on the road, I just pull on my flash-to-pass bright lights until I pass them and blind them just like they are doing to me, especially those saturns and SUV's. Maybe they'll get the picture that I don't want their lights blaring at me during the daytime. If you can't pay attention enough to see all the cars on the road then you need to start taking the bus.

One of these days I am going to buy a POS pinto or something and go around just running into people with DRL on purpose. I would love to get out of the car and say "Hey next time get your !&$&#@ lights out of my face during the daytime!"

You know we could also go around honking our horns every two seconds to make people hear us on the road too, but we don't... because it would be annoying as hell. Guess what, DRL are too.

Originally posted by spasso
Whenever someone with DRL is coming towards me on the road, I just pull on my flash-to-pass bright lights until I pass them and blind them just like they are doing to me, especially those saturns and SUV's.

WTF? DRL are NOT bright! They help especially when the sun is in your eyes you can see the car coming from farther away.

If you are staring at the oncoming cars so much that they are BLINDING you, you have a problem, more deep than I can imagine.

DRL are not really any brighter than a flashlight and they point pretty much at the ground. Heck even headlights shouldn't blind you during the DAY!

I'll find out how much the DRL kit is here in Canada for you guys.

Actually 75% of the ARE BRIGHT at least as bright as that car's BRIGHT Lights! Maybe they are not so in Canada, but I can tell you that especially saturns, toyotas, and most GM products have EXTREMELY BRIGHT DRLS.

I am not staring at cars but I do check every car on the road around me and know what they are doing or plan to do, that is part of driving.

If I came up to you and shined a flashlight in your eyes while you were driving would you find it a bit distracting?

Originally posted by Wing


WTF? DRL are NOT bright! They help especially when the sun is in your eyes you can see the car coming from farther away.

If you are staring at the oncoming cars so much that they are BLINDING you, you have a problem, more deep than I can imagine.

DRL are not really any brighter than a flashlight and they point pretty much at the ground. Heck even headlights shouldn't blind you during the DAY!

I'll find out how much the DRL kit is here in Canada for you guys.

Originally posted by spasso
Whenever someone with DRL is coming towards me on the road, I just pull on my flash-to-pass bright lights until I pass them and blind them just like they are doing to me, especially those saturns and SUV's. Maybe they'll get the picture that I don't want their lights blaring at me during the daytime. If you can't pay attention enough to see all the cars on the road then you need to start taking the bus.

One of these days I am going to buy a POS pinto or something and go around just running into people with DRL on purpose. I would love to get out of the car and say "Hey next time get your !&$&#@ lights out of my face during the daytime!"

You know we could also go around honking our horns every two seconds to make people hear us on the road too, but we don't... because it would be annoying as hell. Guess what, DRL are too.

OMG

You need to go see a shrink. You wanna buy a POS pinto and start rammimg people off the road because of DRL's. Guess what ? You are losing it

I never said anything about ramming them off the road, they can stay on the road for all I care.

Originally posted by RotorGeek


OMG

You need to go see a shrink. You wanna buy a POS pinto and start rammimg people off the road because of DRL's. Guess what ? You are losing it

My God,

Who would have thought this question would have drawn out such emotion.

Let there be DRL's for those who want them. And for those who don't, let there be a switch to disable them.

Wing: I, for one, appreciate your looking into this in Canada. I live in New York and would love to have a way of retrofiting DRLs on the U.S. version, if possible.

Can it be that the wiring is the same in both US and Canada cars? Could it be as simple as adding the DRL module? I wish it to be so BUT fear it may not be so simple.

If there is a solution, I would be interested in what woud be required to either do it myself (If simple) or pass on the required instructions and parts to my dealer for them to do. Bear in mind that dealers are not the most flexible here in doing other than what the Mazda specs call for, if you know what I mean.

Thanks in advnce for your help.

Claude H.

I think DRL makes m/cycles less visible. They have a hard enough time in congested areas and anything that makes it harder for them without any real gain for anyone else shouldn't be imposed. Until DRLs came along when I saw headlights I knew it was either a m/c or some elderly doofus who still has 'em on from last night. Either way it meant to be more alert. Now it's becoming a false alarm.

Originally posted by spasso
Actually 75% of the ARE BRIGHT at least as bright as that car's BRIGHT Lights! Maybe they are not so in Canada, but I can tell you that especially saturns, toyotas, and most GM products have EXTREMELY BRIGHT DRLS... Dude, GM DRLs are 40% of the lowbeams. Get over it.

---jps

Originally posted by Sputnik
Dude, GM DRLs are 40% of the lowbeams. Get over it.

---jps

NEW ones are yes, NEW MODELS. What about all those who went and had the dealers change their cars so they would also have DRL. Tell me under oath that all GM DRLs are 40% power and you can go to jail for perjury.

Besides, 40% light is still 40% too much during the day.

Next somebody will decide it will be safer if we all drive around with big ass flashing strobe lights like school busses, hey "IT HELPS VISIBILITY" right???????????????

Well guess what, I don't want to see your flashing strobe either, I mean, shit, if you can't see a big yellow school bus on the road you seriously need to have your license revoked.

Originally posted by spasso
NEW ones are yes, NEW MODELS... They've always been.

You might want to check the facts before you embarass yourself, again.

---jps

:eek: ok, check the facts...

NHTSA regulations take precedence over any and all state laws, so now DRLs are legal in all states, when two-thirds of the states had previously banned DRLs altogether. Even worse, NHTSA permitted DRLs to be implemented on high beam headlamps at up to 7000 candela. This is well above the threshold for discomfort glare. Why? So that GM could make DRLs on the cheap.

GM began installing DRLs immediately on some models in 1993. By 1997, all GM vehicles had installed. GM has kindly offered to SELL you a kit to convert your current vehicle to DRLs. How thoughtful -- and how very profitable. Unfortunately, many of these kits simply turned on the lights with no reduction in wattage!

Finally, in 1998, after receiving several hundred complaints about the excessive glare and the overall effectiveness of DRLs, NHTSA proposed reductions in DRL intensities. The proposed reductions were overly generous to the auto manufacturers by permitting high beam DRLs to be used for another three years. In the end, after 4 years low beam DRLs would be allowed if they were no stronger than 1500cd above the horizontal. Due to vehicles operating at a higher voltage in the real world than in the lab, this figure would approach 2000cd when the car hit the road. In addition, there was no limit placed on the intensity below the horizontal. With such extreme vehicle height differences that we have today, from the Corvette to the 3500 Silverado, glare would continue to be a problem. Why the lax rule? Because NHTSA doesn't want to upset GM and its bottom line.

General Motors (required like all carmakers to install DRLs on vehicles sold in Canada) repeatedly lobbied the Federal Government to allow GM to install Canadian-style DRLs on its US cars in order to save the costs of producing separate wiring for Canadian and American cars. The Department of Transportation finally bowed to GM pressure in 1995, and overrode numerous state laws that prohibited the use of these lights.

Saturn automobiles use the "high beam" or "bright" element of the headlights for daytime running lights. Even though the DRLs are operated with lower voltages, the light is reflected directly into the eyes and the rear view mirrors of other motorists.

DRLs are insulting to our intelligence. DRL proponents assume that drivers are not intelligent enough to know when to turn on their lights. By implication, then, DRL proponents are saying, in effect, that the states are licensing unqualified drivers! Driving is a skill. Observation is a skill. With proper experience and training, these skills are integrated in the person of a safe driver. Both of these skills can be nurtured or improved in every driver. But, neither skill will be enhanced in today's environment if it believes safety lies in the gadgets and misinterpreted data. Safety, in reality, is nothing more than the collective responsibility of each individual to be the best driver -- the most observant, the most cautious, the most defensive, the most skilled -- that he or she can be.

Interesting.... although I still don't understand the glare factor.

I drive in CANADA, every freakin car has DRL on it, it does NOT bother me. NOBODY I have ever talked to said it bothered them.
Maybe the beams are brighter in the US, but they are no visible in the daytime here, if you stand in front of the DRL it will BARELY show up on your leg during the day.

Now people that drive around with their fogs on, THOSE people should be rammed with your pinto! That is the most annoying thing in the world.

foglights during the day are bad

Originally posted by Wing
Maybe the beams are brighter in the US, but they are no visible in the daytime here, if you stand in front of the DRL it will BARELY show up on your leg during the day.



So what's the point?


:) j/k

I called 2 dealers.

Both said the SAME thing.

FORGET ABOUT IT!

Sorry guys, they looked up the part and said it's not just a module. It's the entire wireing harness and cpu module. Quoted me $1000+

One dealer told me, you can probably buy some universal type thing at pep boys or something to "add" it but thats about it.

Thanks so much Wing,

That is what I feared. Never heard of a generic add on kit that pepboys or the likes might have, but for the sake of following through, I will check this out.

Claude H.

Spasso,

If you're reading DRL regulations, you should check them more closely. There are several permitted ways to implement them - GM just chose the worst possible method. Not the fault of DRLs in general, just GM's fault. DRLs can use reduced intensity low beams, reduced intensity high beams, fog lights, or bright park lights. For examples, Subaru uses the reduced intensity low beam, Audi uses the fog lights for cars equipped with HID low beam headlights, and Mazda and Chrysler have used the brighter amber park lights for DRLs. Ford and GM are the idiots who used reduced intensity high beams, and, I am extremely sad to say, Mazda has gone that way with the RX-8 as well (although they are more reduced intensity than most).

As for 'if you can't see the cars on the road then don't drive' - what a presumptuous statement! Canadians have been living with mandatory DRLs for 13 years now, and their benefits are recognized by almost everyone.

Here's a scenario - you're driving on a two lane road through a forest, and you catch up to a moving roadblock (aka RV). You want to pass, but there's a double-solid line. You see a passing stripe ahead, so you prepare to pass by moving towards the centre line and looking down the road. Half a mile down the road, in the shadow and light patches of the forest, you see a vehicle in the oncoming lane. Quick - is it someone travelling in the same direction as you who is passing another moving roadblock further ahead, or is it a car traveling in the opposite direction towards you? Too late - while you had to study the scenario and figure out which way that car was going, you've missed the opportunity to pass. Now if that car had DRLs - you'd be able to instantly tell if it was coming or going. It's a very real scenario, and I can attest that the difference between driving on 2 lane roads in Canada and the US is significant because of this - I just did a 4000 mile road trip to California and back in the RX-8, and we avoided the interstates whenever possible.

There's actually a very real difference in visibility and safety on 2 lane roads when 98% of the vehicles on the road have DRLs.

If you never get off the freeways or out of the cities, then I suppose you'd never notice this. Just because you aren't aware of the benefits doesn't mean they don't exist. Open you mind and try to learn something, instead of condemning things that you know so little about!

Regards,
Gordon

Originally posted by claude4

Let there be DRL's for those who want them. And for those who don't, let there be a switch to disable them.
Claude H.

They have this, it's called the light switch. How hard can it be to turn on the lights when you go for a drive? Is it that hard to remember to start the car? Put on a seatbelt? Put the car in gear? Just add in the action of switching on the lights. And you know what? If you forget to do it I will be very suprised if it causes you to die.

Originally posted by Gord96BRG
Spasso,



Here's a scenario - you're driving on a two lane road through a forest, and you catch up to a moving roadblock (aka RV). You want to pass, but there's a double-solid line. You see a passing stripe ahead, so you prepare to pass by moving towards the centre line and looking down the road. Half a mile down the road, in the shadow and light patches of the forest, you see a vehicle in the oncoming lane. Quick - is it someone travelling in the same direction as you who is passing another moving roadblock further ahead, or is it a car traveling in the opposite direction towards you? Too late - while you had to study the scenario and figure out which way that car was going, you've missed the opportunity to pass. Now if that car had DRLs - you'd be able to instantly tell if it was coming or going. It's a very real scenario, and I can attest that the difference between driving on 2 lane roads in Canada and the US is significant because of this - I just did a 4000 mile road trip to California and back in the RX-8, and we avoided the interstates whenever possible.




As a resident of a state that is 80% forest, I would just like to laugh at your bullshit "scenario."

Hahahahahaha....ha..."snicker"....ahem.

Thank you.

I have to say,

Some of you are trying to be helpful while others need some manners or a spanking.

I think you know who you are.

Claude H.

Personally, I don't have a problem turning on my headlights everytime I get in the car. I did it with my MX-6 for 10 years. However, (I'm not sure if this has been mentioned) when you turn the lights on in the RX-8, the insturment cluster becomes next to invisible during the day.
If anyone does find out about a DRL module, please post the info.

Gordon,
I wholeheartedly agree with you. Yes, you read that right, I agree. The fact is that driving conditions in Canada and Scandinavian countries (i.e. Volvo's home) differ greatly from driving conditions in the US. Not only are our roads different in geometric design and landscape, but importantly, we are closer to the equator and have vastly different ambient lighting conditions. Obviously, we share a border with Canada so one mile north or south of the border isn't going to make much difference. But on average, we are different. I agree that in many cases in many countries, DRL make driving more safe. However, I disagree that we need them in the US. It is insulting to me that US auto makers believe shining a dimmed light through a high beam reflector directly into my eyes and my rear view mirrors actually makes driving conditions safer for me.

I agree that in some driving conditions, even in the US, DRL would be a safety feature. So give us a way to turn them on. Then again, this is called low beam headlights. We as drivers should be smart enough to recognize these situations and use our lights accordingly.

One point: You state that I know so little about this subject. I must disagree with you here.

Even some heads within the automotive industry have been reluctant to embrace DRLs. "It's not that we are against them, but we haven't seen any real evidence of the safety benefits," said Chrysler spokesman Jason Vines. (Automotive News, 1999.) "We are not convinced yet that they're going to be beneficial," said Ford's manager of advance safety, Sherman Henson. And even GM's executives have their doubts: "The research on whether or not daytime running lights are effective is mixed," said the company's director of legal and safety issues.

Originally posted by Gord96BRG
Spasso,

If you're reading DRL regulations, you should check them more closely. There are several permitted ways to implement them - GM just chose the worst possible method. Not the fault of DRLs in general, just GM's fault. DRLs can use reduced intensity low beams, reduced intensity high beams, fog lights, or bright park lights. For examples, Subaru uses the reduced intensity low beam, Audi uses the fog lights for cars equipped with HID low beam headlights, and Mazda and Chrysler have used the brighter amber park lights for DRLs. Ford and GM are the idiots who used reduced intensity high beams, and, I am extremely sad to say, Mazda has gone that way with the RX-8 as well (although they are more reduced intensity than most).

As for 'if you can't see the cars on the road then don't drive' - what a presumptuous statement! Canadians have been living with mandatory DRLs for 13 years now, and their benefits are recognized by almost everyone.

Here's a scenario - you're driving on a two lane road through a forest, and you catch up to a moving roadblock (aka RV). You want to pass, but there's a double-solid line. You see a passing stripe ahead, so you prepare to pass by moving towards the centre line and looking down the road. Half a mile down the road, in the shadow and light patches of the forest, you see a vehicle in the oncoming lane. Quick - is it someone travelling in the same direction as you who is passing another moving roadblock further ahead, or is it a car traveling in the opposite direction towards you? Too late - while you had to study the scenario and figure out which way that car was going, you've missed the opportunity to pass. Now if that car had DRLs - you'd be able to instantly tell if it was coming or going. It's a very real scenario, and I can attest that the difference between driving on 2 lane roads in Canada and the US is significant because of this - I just did a 4000 mile road trip to California and back in the RX-8, and we avoided the interstates whenever possible.

There's actually a very real difference in visibility and safety on 2 lane roads when 98% of the vehicles on the road have DRLs.

If you never get off the freeways or out of the cities, then I suppose you'd never notice this. Just because you aren't aware of the benefits doesn't mean they don't exist. Open you mind and try to learn something, instead of condemning things that you know so little about!

Regards,
Gordon

Originally posted by Thanatos
However, (I'm not sure if this has been mentioned) when you turn the lights on in the RX-8, the insturment cluster becomes next to invisible during the day.Rotate the dashlight dimmer switch all the way up until it clicks. Presto! Daytime gauge illumination with the headlights on.

As I have said in other threads, "can't we all just get along". DRL a matter of opinion.

Good job bingo.

Well done!

I just took delivery of my 8 before T'giving. I have rewired my fog lights so that I am able to turn them on without the low-beams on (which renders them useless as fogs). I can also use them as DRL's, but they are mounted rather low for that purpose. I am wondering about the small lamps toward the center of the front (nearest the Mazda logo) - What are those for? What are they called? Why are they there? Could these be rewired to come on with the ignition? I don't know what wire or relay they might run off of - does anyone have any thoughts on these little units as full-time DRL's? Or know what they are for or are called?

Those are the parking lights. They come on when any of the lights are on.

The only problem is that they are only 5 Watts so they don't show up very well for any situation.

I want to replace them with a 5 Watt or higher LCD cluster and use those lights as my DRL's.

-Mr. Wigggles

Wiggles: That sounds good - have you located a brighter replacement and do you have a plan for wiring them to come on at all times? I is my understanding that studies (10 years or so ago) determined that while it is beneficial to have front DRL's on in the daytime, it is less safe to have your tail lamps lit in daytime because it reduces the effective difference between them and the brake lights. You want as much eye-catching effect for the brake lights as possible. If you increase your front visibility and reduce your rear braking visibility, you have not really made any overall progress. I don't have any stats to cite, but it seems to make sense to me. I will look under my hood for a label on "parking lights" in the fuse/relay box. Thanks for your reply.

Originally posted by claude4
I would prefer to have my headlights on during the day as is the case with many new cars of late. Mazda does this with other cars they make but not the RX8. Why?

I would love to make that happen for my yet to be RX8 BUT would also like to make the lights turn off when I turn off the car. In the past, I have forgotten to do this and paid the price in the way of a dead battery.

Anyone else have any ideas (other than to turnn them on manually and NOT FORGET TO TURN THEM OFF MANUALLY :(

Thanks,

Claude H.

I bought a little gizmo (at K-mart, I think) that wires into the fuse box and buzzes if you turn off the ignition without turning off the lights. "Lite-Minder", or something like that. It was just a couple of bucks. This was about 12 years ago so don't know if they still make them, but probably something out there simple like that.

Aside from the other issues, DRLs have caused us to lose the time-honored custom of putting on one's lights to warn about patrol cars parked ahead.

Do this mod and you can have "daytime-like", well not exactly, but it's better than nothing if you really want lights that you will not have to worry about turning on or off.

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11737&perpage=15&pagenumber=1

I took another look at the fuse box and noticed that there is an empty socket which is labeled on the underside of the cover as "DRL". Is the fuse box something from the parts bin that is used on different models? Are there RX-8's shipped to some countries that do have DRL's? If so, which light to they use: high-beam on low power? Parking lights with brighter bulb? Maybe it is for use on future models?

I didn't find a relay labelled "Parking", so for now I have my fogs branched off of the "ACC" relay and I keep the fog-switch in the "on" position, so they are always on when I am driving. Not ideal, but I think it is better than nothing. I would prefer to have something in the upper light-housing lit.

In your underhood fuse box there is an unused fuse marked DRL (15amp) in the second row from the left just up and to the right of the large relay marked TAIL.

I wonder if installing a fuse in this socket will enable the DRLs for those that wish to run them. Not that I will as I think they are or were a source of premature HID failures on VWs and Audis. alot of guys were disabling them in an effort to increase the longevity of their HID headlights.

:cool:

Damn beaten to the post again! Ratzafratz!

'Fraid not. There is no wire connected to that socket. The bus is "hot" for that fuse socket, but there is nothing wired into it. I wonder if a schematic shows DRL's? If not for USA, for another market? It my understanding that most (if not all) factory DRL's bring the lamps on to only a fraction of full brightness (40% or 70%), and thus should not put much of a strain on them. If Mazda did design for DRL's, I wonder which bulbs are designed to come on when wired for DRL?

Originally posted by loco4rx8
Daytime running lights are lame. I know when to turn my lights on and off, thanks.

But if you want your lights on in the daytime so bad, just turn them on. Mazda isn't taking away the choice, and I applaud them for that.

Word

Originally posted by BoomerBurt
If Mazda did design for DRL's, I wonder which bulbs are designed to come on when wired for DRL?


The DRL control module is wired into the high beams.

Originally posted by BoomerBurt
Are there RX-8's shipped to some countries that do have DRL's? If so, which light to they use: high-beam on low power? Parking lights with brighter bulb? Maybe it is for use on future models?

Yes, Canada has had mandatory DRLs since 1990. RX-8 uses the reduced power high beam :mad: (IMHO, the worst of the three options to implement DRLs. I much prefer the brighter amber turn signal filament (a la 90-97 Miata), or the fog lights (a la Audi) ).

Regards,
Gordon

Originally posted by Rotary Nut
I wonder if installing a fuse in this socket will enable the DRLs for those that wish to run them. Not that I will as I think they are or were a source of premature HID failures on VWs and Audis. alot of guys were disabling them in an effort to increase the longevity of their HID headlights.

:confused: I don't know what VWs or Audis had HID failures from DRLs... my 2002 Audi with HIDs uses the fog lights for DRLs, as do all the other HID Audis I know of. The HID low beams aren't even powered up unless you turn on the regular headlights.

Regards,
Gordon

Boy, I had no idea there was so much disagreement over the value of DRL's. A Ford dealer told me almost ten years ago that Ford was going to incorporate DRL's (a la GM) soon, but it hasn't happened. Most major insurers give a substantial discount for them and we know that insurance co's don't give money away, so they must have pursuasive evidence that DRL's prevent accidents (and thus claims). Anyway, I am going to be satisfied with the mod to my fogs - I have them wired to the ACC relay so that they come on separately from the head & tail lights, and I leave the fog switch in the "on" position. I have advised my insurance co that I have DRL's by virtue of this mod and they have given me the 10% discount. Thanks for all the input.

Originally posted by Gord96BRG
:confused: I don't know what VWs or Audis had HID failures from DRLs... my 2002 Audi with HIDs uses the fog lights for DRLs, as do all the other HID Audis I know of. The HID low beams aren't even powered up unless you turn on the regular headlights.

Regards,
Gordon

My '02 Passat W8 had Bi-xenons and the DRL used the low beam HID at 70% power.

You can set up your RX8 to have daytime running lights (lights that are dimmer than the regular low beams (especially Xenon ones) which will automatically go out when you remove the key. All you have to do is look up the thread about rewiring fog lights so they are on the accessories feed, then turn the fog light switch on and leave it there.

When I purchased my black 98 Passat, it had DRLs. I soon joined a Passat forum. There were post in disabling DRL. I wanted to disable them ASAP becuase I did not want to stand out to police when speeding. However, after several months of procrastination, I never disabled them.
I began to feel comfortable with the DRL. I also never received a speeding ticket in that duration. I also felt secure (maybe in my head) with them, especialy when my wife and kids are in the car.
Two years ago, I installed aftermarket HIDs (98 Passat did not come with HIDs and the OE headlights were horrible). Installation required the removal of the DRLs. So needless to say they finally came off. Removed a relay behind the dash. Yes my headlights were brighter and clearer, but I felt less safe during the day.
BTW, the DRL on the Passat turned the high beams on at 1/3 the power (ie brightness). Never had oncomming traffic flash me thinking I had my high beams on (although I actually did). In addition, with the engine running, the DRL turned off when the hand brake was engaged.
As far as the 8 (silver). I will be looking into the foglight rewire mod soon.
Al

Mitch - That is exactly what I have done. It works fine, unless you are of the opinion that DRL's would be more effective at a higher level from the ground. I figure it is good enough.