I have just read the um-tenth tread about an RX-8 failing under warranty through apparently no fault of the owner and Mazda refusing to fix it under warranty because of "abuse".

Am I the only one who finds this very disturbing? I realize that there will be times where abuse can be confirmed but it seems in most the threads the problems are not due to abuse. Also the frequency of this response from the dealers would indicate a coordinated effort by Mazda to avoid pay legitimate warranty work. Often a Mechanic will look at a part and label abused with out any proof.

It’s things like this that leave Mazda in a very poor light and will prevent me from buy another Mazda in the future. It is such a shame that such a fine car is tied to such a poor company. Maybe I’m wrong what do you think?

Personally, I have not had any problems with my dealer; but then, I have not had any problems with my RX8, at least not this one. I had an 04 that had the usual teeth cutting issues well documented in this forum and my dealer handled them well. The only thing they couldn't to work to my satisfaction was the air conditioning, it never cooled well enough for me but they did try a lot of things to get it working better. No complaints from me.

I haven't had any problems either, but my friend Abbid has been getting it in the rear end by mazda, and I know a local guy who also had clutch issues mazda refused to fix (Clutch pressed all the way in and still engaged, extremely hard to press down). His car didn't even have 10k miles on it.

TEETH CUTTING ISSUES??
Never heard of it. lol
i am fairly satisifed with my Mazda dealer. They do a good job and covers my stuff under warranty.
one of my wheel was cracked (like a 4 cm long crack, very small). they replaced that wheel immediately.
well, many car companies do what you mentioned. sometimes, they refuse to cover your car under warranty. but that is just a very small portion.
besides, car compaines are not GODs. sometimes they do make unrecoverable mistakes in their production lines. so if you got a car like that, you are very unluky. if the company can help you, that is great. but if they can't, you just have to bit the dust. it does happen.

This is my fourth Mazda with no major problems. (Well, one—which they addressed promptly.) Sucks that you're having unresolved problems.

You're not gonna have this car much longer, are you? I give you three months.

Get used to it, this is starting to be commonplace with a lot of car manufacturers.

As profits fall, Businesses tighten whichever belt they can. :(

Thank, in part, Autoworkers unions. :(

Unions = the devil.

"Get used to it, this is starting to be commonplace with a lot of car manufacturers"


ill second that.



and when an rx8 comes intot he dealer with "rx8club" stickers and soem weird body kit and an intake or what have u, think they wont deem it abuse? its called stereotyping. they put u in the pile of loser kids with mufflers on their civics and deem any work abuse bc u must be street racing with it. on the verge of anything as serious as engine/transmission overhauls, u bet ur nuts they r gonna come hard on u. its business, it sux, im sorry, we all get the short stick sometimes. me included.


dont blame mazda,im in it for the long haul, better or for worse. go mazda!

You think Mazda is bad, there are 100 times more evo's running around with the same claims by mitsubishi

You think Mazda is bad, there are 100 times more evo's running around with the same claims by mitsubishi

In most cases those Evos probably are abused.

In most cases those Evos probably are abused.

I never understood how a car company can make, market, and sell cars that the owners are buying and using it for what it was actually designed for.

Dang, I thought this thread was about abusing goats.

Seriously though, I've not had any issues with my dealer in GA or TX. I don't baby the car by any stretch either. I hit the beeper at least once in every trip.

28,000 or so miles and no major problems. My favorite Mazda dealer/shop (Rosenthal Arlington Mazda) has done a fine job every time they've had it.

Just out of idle curiousity, I wonder how many people actually have abused their cars, then bitched when Mazda balked at them? Maybe some of them are actually using Mazda as a scapegoat for their own irresponsibility.

It's all kind of analogous to crying wolf. The one's that truly abuse their car and whine and complain and put up a fight are the ones that ruin it for the rest of us.

As profits fall, Businesses tighten whichever belt they can. :(

Thank, in part, Autoworkers unions. :(

Unions = the devil.


Yeah, we'll all get much higher quality workmanship from uneducated Mexicans making 32 cents an hour in an unregulated factory south of the border :uhh:

there is no coordinated effort, this isnt' a conspiracy and mazda is not out to get you....some dealers probably are to quick to use the abuse tag due to the looks and condition a car is in, but how many of those cars are actually abused....the owner isn't going to come on here or to the dealership and say.....yeah, i abused my car...mazda caught me...my fault...it just isn't gonna happen. Nobody wants to pay for things they damaged if they don't have to. i'ld say only about half of my customers will own up to something they did...even if it is a clear cut case they still argue.

It's all kind of analogous to crying wolf. The one's that truly abuse their car (http:///#) and whine and complain and put up a fight are the ones that ruin it for the rest of us.well put......What was that famous phrase.... "Me thinks thou does protest too much." esp. when a car company calls their bluff and they see the bill.

This isn't the case 100% of the time surely, but car manufacturers, not being born yesterday, have seen most every abuse, know what's right and wrong with any car model, statistically and paractically from repair frequency.

It does make business sense to cover a lot of this doubtful stuff as any publicity gets filtered down to "XXXX didn't cover my warranty work" regardless of the merits. And people depend on that. But I don't think any well run business should just lay back and swallow it for every obviously abused car either.

If you look at the repair records of essentially similar cars built in the same plant like the MX-6/Probe the Mazda version tended to have fewer repairs than the Probe. Do you think that they would have similar repair records? One likely culprit, more Probe owners were the younger buyers who may have been more abusive to the car. Unfortunately, there could be some stereotyping going on when the dealership sees a younger 8 owner come in with clutch issues, etc.

Yeah, we'll all get much higher quality workmanship from uneducated Mexicans making 32 cents an hour in an unregulated factory south of the border :uhh:

You will be surprise what is manufactured South of the Border or East of California and the level of quality they can achieve. Quality is NOT proportional to wage of the workers (especially since Purchasing Price Parity isn't accounted for.) Quality is CONTROLLED by a quality system (i.e. Toyota Production Systems or Lean Mfg.) These systems are inherent in the company's culture and infrastructure not the worker. Mexican (or any worker around the world) workers can do very high quality work regardless of wage.

Toyota's are mostly made with non unionized workers, how's thier quality? Hyundai's have a higher quality rating then all american companies. I'd say that unions don't add or take away from the quality of any car, thats what quality control and precedures are suppose to do, but unions do have an effect on the profits or lack of profits a company makes...

Ahhh, magic beat me by 1 minute... :kiss:

You will be surprise what is manufactured South of the Border or East of California and the level of quality they can achieve. Quality is NOT proportional to wage of the workers (especially since Purchasing Price Parity isn't accounted for.) Quality is CONTROLLED by a quality system (i.e. Toyota Production Systems or Lean Mfg.) These systems are inherent in the company's culture and infrastructure not the worker. Mexican (or any worker around the world) workers can do very high quality work regardless of wage.

Well hell, let's just chain'em all up and put the little buggers to work then! I mean, who REALLY needs a living wage? As long as the company owners can pocket a few mil per year and sell their product cheap enough for Americans to buy, it's all good! :Eyecrazy:

"i'ld say only about half of my customers will own up to something they did...even if it is a clear cut case they still argue."


so true man. about a month ago we had a guy in a mazda3 come in for an oil change and the lower engine cover was completely torn up. there was obviously an impact because the bolts to the ac compressor were bent and its housing was cracked. when we informed the customer of the obvious damage and gave him a price for a new shield (175 bucks) a new compressor (480) and the new clutch assembly (525) he nearly lost it. he wanted us to warranty it and he asked "how do i kno u guys didnt just do that?!"

i was like yeah man i whipped out my hammer and started bashing the crap outta ur compressor and nobody else in the shop dared ask why.

he clearly nailed somethin during driving and he wanted us to warranty it? thats not how it works. in the end, we did put it thru the warranty and he didnt pay a dime. I was so annoyed, the service writers could care less bc they still get paid great,wether its warranty or
cash.


just YESTERDAY we had a guy come in with a mazda6, it had 99 miles on it and two tires were popped and three rims were bent. when we asked him what happened he ADMITTED to letting his 16 yr old son drive it and he jumped a median and ruined the tires and wheels.

no he didnt have the optional tire warranty.

out of goodwill we warrantied it. dont ask me, i wanted to bend him over backwards for being a dumbass but once again, the service writer warrantied it. 2 tires (200 a piece) and three rims (dont even ask) later, he was on the road and carefree of his mistake.

all the techs were taking bets as to when hed be back and want it warrantied again. poeple are messed up and they ruin it for the rest of us. bc when any rx8 with an aftermarket strut bar comes in to a shop and has a shifting issue, ur screwed, but assholes like that 6 and 3 owner can get away with anything. business is awesome, i love it.

it sucks to think that owners pay for their warranties, yet are nearly afraid to bring their cars in for fear of the "abuse" flag. customer service, from target to mazda, should never be scary.

Car companies should offer a warranty opt out option. I'd rather save a few bucks when I buy my car and then just pay cash when something breaks.

Car companies should offer a warranty opt out option. I'd rather save a few bucks when I buy my car and then just pay cash when something breaks.

thats a bold statement! when it comes to a large investment like a car, i want that thing protected.

Well hell, let's just chain'em all up and put the little buggers to work then! I mean, who REALLY needs a living wage? As long as the company owners can pocket a few mil per year and sell their product cheap enough for Americans to buy, it's all good! :Eyecrazy:

You realize in Beijing you can have a full Chinese breakfast for 4RMB or $0.50. A 20oz Bud cost $0.50 to $0.75 a bottle. And no there are no price control especially on these type of consumer goods. When I went to Mexico I found the same thing, expect they are a bit more expensive than Beijing. I can't speak for Mexico, but in China a factory paying $1.00 an hour is a lot better than most alternatives. And without higher education, the alternative can be much worst than being chained to factory line.

I apologize to the original poster for going off-topic.

OK Mazda Personel...

"05whiterx8"
"RoXanneBlack8"

Here's one for you:

I took my previous RX-8 (2004 AT) in for poor MPG issues multiple times.
Well... not poor... terrible MPG = 9 MPG on a bad day and 12 MPG on a "good" day...

Of coarse, it was always "my" fault because I wasn't driving the car correctly...
I was accused of driving the car too hard and then on the next visit I was told to rev it
to the beep.
Then I was told I was using incorrect fuel or I was letting it idle too long or to short...
The list goes on and on and on...
To me, what Mazda is really saying is they don't know how to fix this issue so lets blame the customer.

Always my fault. Hell, I'm just a customer, what value do I have? It's not just Mazda either.
Most all Dealerships / Manufactures are in it for themselves...

None the less, I'm an RX-8 fan, corporate Mazda Sucks Butt.

Kind of like me saying "I love my job. It's too bad I have all these frickin' patients..."

ok, but you can't say that corporate mazda sucks butt...because its the indivudal dealership that is telling you all of that....the questions i would ask....did they hook it up to the computer and monitor all the sensors to make sure they are working properly? did they contact technical assistance to see if there were any known fixes for this problem?? how many miles does your car have on it?? it's hard to say what i would do different without actually having seen the car....but its a case by case basis...but your dealer shouldn't be dismissing your complaint even if they've heard it before....sounds like the problem is the dealer....not corporate mazda...they only get involved when there is a problem the dealership can't handle.

its not mazda its the dealer

You realize in Beijing you can have a full Chinese breakfast for 4RMB or $0.50. A 20oz Bud cost $0.50 to $0.75 a bottle. And no there are no price control especially on these type of consumer goods. When I went to Mexico I found the same thing, expect they are a bit more expensive than Beijing. I can't speak for Mexico, but in China a factory paying $1.00 an hour is a lot better than most alternatives. And without higher education, the alternative can be much worst than being chained to factory line.

I apologize to the original poster for going off-topic.

Actually, I apologize for getting on my political soapbox. I really am not a big pro-union liberal or anything, but I believe in shades of gray, and this "it's all the unions fault" stuff got me irritated.

So, sorry.

i had a customer come in with an 04 rx-8...she had pretty much torn off the under panel on the car two months back...then a rock flipped up and took out her condenser. i told her what happened and she blamed mazda for it. she fought me for two weeks trying to get that warrantied, complained to everyone of my bosses, even the owner. still got her no where. she ended up paying for it and i never saw her car again

Get used to it, this is starting to be commonplace with a lot of car manufacturers.

Um....not Audi. I've dealt with two dealerships on the both parts of the country and been treated like James Bond at both. I sincerely doubt that will change anytime soon.

Um....not Audi. I've dealt with two dealerships on the both parts of the country and been treated like James Bond at both. I sincerely doubt that will change anytime soon.

Clearly since you've dealt with two dealerships it's true, and of course all Audi dealerships are the same :rolleyes: I was also unaware that there are only two parts of the country...

Don't forget to mention that you sold that car and your new Mazda RX-8 is getting 17 to 18 miles per gallon driving the exact same roads.

His RX-8 was broke but it was easier/cheaper to blame it on him then fix a malfunction car. I am presently going through the exact same thing and getting the same run around. MAZDA SUPPORT YOUR DAMN CARS WHEN THEY ARE MALFUCTING, DON"T BLAME IT ON THE USERS!!!!

OK Mazda Personel...

"05whiterx8"
"RoXanneBlack8"

Here's one for you:

I took my previous RX-8 (2004 AT) in for poor MPG issues multiple times.
Well... not poor... terrible MPG = 9 MPG on a bad day and 12 MPG on a "good" day...

Of coarse, it was always "my" fault because I wasn't driving the car correctly...
I was accused of driving the car too hard and then on the next visit I was told to rev it
to the beep.
Then I was told I was using incorrect fuel or I was letting it idle too long or to short...
The list goes on and on and on...
To me, what Mazda is really saying is they don't know how to fix this issue so lets blame the customer.

Always my fault. Hell, I'm just a customer, what value do I have? It's not just Mazda either.
Most all Dealerships / Manufactures are in it for themselves...

None the less, I'm an RX-8 fan, corporate Mazda Sucks Butt.

Kind of like me saying "I love my job. It's too bad I have all these frickin' patients..."

This is a copout; the dealers are Mazda's representatives. If they are not up to company's standards they need to get dumped. Try bypassing the dealers and go straight to Mazda Corp. See how far you get before they send you to the dealer. Part of Mazda's job is to know what their dealers are up to and how they are supporting the clients. The fact that poor dealers exist is because Mazda allows them to.

The dealer is Mazda, don't be fooled otherwise.


ok, but you can't say that corporate mazda sucks butt...because its the indivudal dealership that is telling you all of that....the questions i would ask....did they hook it up to the computer and monitor all the sensors to make sure they are working properly? did they contact technical assistance to see if there were any known fixes for this problem?? how many miles does your car have on it?? it's hard to say what i would do different without actually having seen the car....but its a case by case basis...but your dealer shouldn't be dismissing your complaint even if they've heard it before....sounds like the problem is the dealer....not corporate mazda...they only get involved when there is a problem the dealership can't handle.

NO comment.

NO comment.

Stop abusing your car!

ok, but you can't say that corporate mazda sucks butt...because its the individual dealership that is telling you all of that....the questions i would ask....did they hook it up to the computer and monitor all the sensors to make sure they are working properly? did they contact technical assistance to see if there were any known fixes for this problem?? how many miles does your car have on it?? it's hard to say what i would do different without actually having seen the car....but its a case by case basis...but your dealer shouldn't be dismissing your complaint even if they've heard it before....sounds like the problem is the dealer....not corporate mazda...they only get involved when there is a problem the dealership can't handle.Sure I can say Corporate Mazda Sucks Butt...
Who's responsible for providing their technicians with the information and training to maintain their products?
Could it be Corporate Mazda?
If my service rep and/or repair tech would have said, "Al, we don't know how to fix this issue
and offered me some sort of compensation (free oil changes would have been enough)".
I could have "lived" with my sucky mileage issues. Instead they point their finger at me (us) as being at fault.
Granted, some people DO abuse their cars. Most of us don't.
The abusers are much fewer in numbers then Mazda is blaming.
It's just an easy way out for you guys...
If our mileage issues were just an isolated incident I'd also be more understanding.
As everyone knows on this forum, there are a multitude of MPG threads/posts.
I read a new one about every time I log on.
I also know that shit runs down hill and as much as dealerships hate dealing with
complaints, we the customers hate dealing with people who lie to us.
Please understand 05whiterx8, I'm not angry at YOU personally, I'm angry at Mazda (your employer) for thinking we are all a bunch of idiots.

As for testing done by my individual service guy...
I'd like to think they did all they said was done...
One never knows for sure....

For me, it's all water under the bridge.
My 04 is still on the lot waiting for its next victim.
I feel for who ever buys it.
My 06 mileage is tolerable so far.
I still love the RX-8.
I'm just not "feeling the love" for it's parents...

I have just read the um-tenth tread about an RX-8 failing under warranty through apparently no fault of the owner and Mazda refusing to fix it under warranty because of "abuse".

Am I the only one who finds this very disturbing? I realize that there will be times where abuse can be confirmed but it seems in most the threads the problems are not due to abuse. Also the frequency of this response from the dealers would indicate a coordinated effort by Mazda to avoid pay legitimate warranty work. Often a Mechanic will look at a part and label abused with out any proof.

It’s things like this that leave Mazda in a very poor light and will prevent me from buy another Mazda in the future. It is such a shame that such a fine car is tied to such a poor company. Maybe I’m wrong what do you think?

Hummmm... Lets see what the Dictionary definitions is for Abuse;

1.To use wrongly or improperly; misuse: abuse alcohol; abuse a privilege.
2.To hurt or injure by maltreatment; ill-use.
3.To force sexual activity on; rape or molest.
4.To assail with contemptuous, coarse, or insulting words; revile.
Obsolete. To deceive or trick.

n. (-bys)

1.Improper use or handling; misuse: abuse of authority; drug abuse.
2.Physical maltreatment: spousal abuse.
Sexual abuse.
3.An unjust or wrongful practice: a government that commits abuses against its citizens.
4.Insulting or coarse language: verbal abuse.

I dont think you "Wrongfull used your Mazda RX-8 in any wrong manor"...

Clearly since you've dealt with two dealerships it's true, and of course all Audi dealerships are the same :rolleyes: I was also unaware that there are only two parts of the country...

the South and the North.

Where you been IKE?

:mdrmed:

Hummmm... Lets see what the Dictionary definitions is for Abuse;



I dont think you "Wrongfull used your Mazda RX-8 in any wrong manor"...

If there's any abuse around here it's DOMINON!

He abuses my eyeballs every time he posts. :bootyshak

That dam signature drives me crazy! :bootyshak

If there's any abuse around here it's DOMINON!

He abuses my eyeballs every time he posts. :bootyshak

That dam signature drives me crazy! :bootyshak
The pix on the right reminds me of my plumber...
Now where's that spackling compound?

As profits fall, Businesses tighten whichever belt they can. :(

Thank, in part, Autoworkers unions. :(

Unions = the devil.
My father worked in a factory before he was drafted in 1942. One day a woman next to him severed her finger while on a machine. She wrapped a rag around the stump and kept working - she'd have been docked a day's pay if she stopped. Unions stopped that kind of abuse.

Now... you were saying?

If there's any abuse around here it's DOMINON!

He abuses my eyeballs every time he posts. :bootyshak

That dam signature drives me crazy! :bootyshak
LOL you know you like it ;)

The pix on the right reminds me of my plumber...
Now where's that spackling compound?
If my Plumber had an ass like that she would not leave me home alive lol :ky:

My father worked in a factory before he was drafted in 1942. One day a woman next to him severed her finger while on a machine. She wrapped a rag around the stump and kept working - she'd have been docked a day's pay if she stopped. Unions stopped that kind of abuse.

Now... you were saying?Was this a Mazda Factory? :Eyecrazy:
Probably not... :)
If it had been a Mazda Plant, they probably would have blamed the woman worker
instead of poor employee education...
And point their finger(less) at someone else for the problem...

Quote: He abuses my eyeballs every time he posts.

That dam signature drives me crazy!

I'm with you, I guess he can't afford clothes for his daughter

well...i can't argue with alot of the posts...unfortunately. There are some bad dealers out there, hell maybe even alot of them. But they aren't all bad. I apologize to you all, i took the attack on mazda personal because i work for them. I just get so tired of people not taking responsibility for their actions. And i'm not saying that anyone abused their cars. i'm just saying that i'm sure there is a percentage of people that did abuse their cars and want someone else to pay to fix it

Quote: He abuses my eyeballs every time he posts.

That dam signature drives me crazy!

I'm with you, I guess he can't afford clothes for his daughter

:jerkit:

well...i can't argue with alot of the posts...unfortunately. There are some bad dealers out there, hell maybe even alot of them. But they aren't all bad. I apologize to you all, i took the attack on mazda personal because i work for them. I just get so tired of people not taking responsibility for their actions. And i'm not saying that anyone abused their cars. i'm just saying that i'm sure there is a percentage of people that did abuse their cars and want someone else to pay to fix it

Understandable. I am sure Mazda dose get it's share of scum trying to get free repairs for their own abuse but, when there is a questionable call that Mazda can not prove was abuse they need to take care of there customer base. This is a liability all manufactures take into account and budget for. The problem occurs when the parent company decides to cut expanses by cutting claims; it appears this is what Mazda is up to.

What adds fuel to the fire is when they have an obvious problem and just ignore it and blame the users for their problems. The biggest in my eyes being the inconstant gas mileage across various 8s. This inconstancy is now proven with one member getting 10mpg in an 8 then moving to a new 8 and suddenly getting 17 to 18 mpg, same driving route and style with both cars. Mazda told him the 1st car was working fine and normal getting 10mpg how do you explain this expect that Mazda dose not what to invest the money to fix this problem. It is cheaper for them to blame it on the owner then fix the problem. This is why I view Mazda as a real scum company regarding support of their product. If I wrong please correct me, I would love to hear the explanation.

how can 10mpg be normal if mazda's posted mpg numbers are 7, 8 or 9 miles higher?
it doesnt seem like there's any way around the fact that mazda is full of shit here. all of us can expect numbers slightly lower than what 'they' tell us, (and only because as consumers we're used to being lied to) but to be THIS MUCH lower is completely absurd and shouldnt be ignored.

05whiterx8,

Just read over want I wrote and just wanted to let you know that we all appreciate when a Mazda Service manager responds to this list like you are. I realize you are getting blasted for actions of your company that you may have little to no control over. I also realize that Mazda corp. dictates what it will reimburse you for with regard to warranty work. This mpg issue really has me pissed off and I am beginning to see the only way to get Mazda to fix it is sue them which I hate.

I really wish they would stand behind their cars and not have their service people insult my intelligence when I take it to the dealer.

Thanks again for your personal interest and support of this board, it is appreciated.
prechated.

If I had a car that got 8mpg, I'd ask the service manager to drive with me. I'd drive it down until the light came on after getting about 30 miles away from the dealership. Stop at a gas station, put in one or two gallons of gas then ask him to drive us back to the dealership using the "proper" method.

Yeah, we'll all get much higher quality workmanship from uneducated Mexicans making 32 cents an hour in an unregulated factory south of the border :uhh:


What does education have to do with working on an assembly line?

Only in a union can you have a guy make $35 per hour driving a fork lift.

Raptor75, what I don't think you get, is that Mazda built the car, and then sold the car to the dealer who sells it to you.

I have never heard of a Mazda dealer loosing its sales franchise because of pissed off customers. It may have happened, but normally they only loose their sales franchise because they can't pay the bills. Piss off enough customers and you can't pay your bills. So Mazda corp doesn't need to care. They care about being paid for the car from the dealer and making their 30%. The dealer is their customer, not you.

So when you take the car into the dealer, the dealer needs to expend time and money to fix it. He then either submits a claim to Mazda or the Insurance company or the customer to pay for the fix. Either way the dealer did the work... not Mazda.

So as a dealer, wouldn't you want to stop any hemorging of money. The customer must pay to get his or her car back, so you get paid right then and now. Wheras if they must submit a warranty claim, you might not get paid for 30 or 60 or 90 days. So as a dealer it is in your best intrest to get the money the easiest way you can.

Because you didn't buy your car from Mazda. You bought it from a dealer. You are not MNA's customer, the dealer is.

Sort of like if you have phone line DSL at your house, and you pay for service through AOL, yet your local phone company is who provides the actual wiring to your house. You could call the local phone company and bitch about a poor connection, but they wouldn't care. You are not thier customer. AOL is. So you have to call AOL to get the DSL line serviced (of course why anyone would buy DSL through AOL is beyond me, but that was just an example).

Dealerships have the bulk of the responsibility to the customer. But, Mazda should be paying closer attention +/- actually acting on the things they are paying attention to and they are not. My dealership has a high rated service dept. which I have yet to need. Overall, nothing about my experience has been anything to shout about. They never bothered to get my insurance switched. They ran into a problem at the DMV (town tax issue - not their fault), but they neglected to notify me. I called at day 24 b/c my registration had not arrived - they called me back 6 days later to tell me about the problem. Mind you, it was Friday at 4.30, and getting to the town hall, then DMV was not an option. My 30 days from purchase to get my reg. was over, making my car illegal. Thanks for the heads up, jackass. Attention to details usually runs through the entire organization. So I won't be expecting anything but hassles when I need the service dept. I'll be sure to have my mechanic look at anything first, and hopefully never go to the dealership again. Mazda will no doubt be upset with that. An entire company losing sleep, I'm sure.

If I had a car that got 8mpg, I'd ask the service manager to drive with me. I'd drive it down until the light came on after getting about 30 miles away from the dealership. Stop at a gas station, put in one or two gallons of gas then ask him to drive us back to the dealership using the "proper" method.


This isn't even the problem; I can recreate the 11mpg with out a problem. It is the fact that Mazda says this is normal because their computer did not report any problems. They would have to start servicing the car and stop depending completely on the computer. They would have to do investigative work to find the cause and the simple fact is this would cost Mazda money and they find it cheaper just to say the car is normal it is your fault. Zoom44 recommended dropping the CAT to check it, since no cell were issued for this the dealer wouldn't even consider it despite reports of bad CATs with out any Cel warnings.

Actually I have heard of a dealer losing his franchise for what boiled down to poorly representing the parent company. Many of car company's including Mazda can feel a lot of heat from the parent company. The Autobarn, where I bought my car was under just such heat. The sales guys bent over backwards to help me and I was quit impressed with them, it was a very pleasant car buying experience. The whole time they talked about a survey from Mazda that they needed a positive feed back on. They even offered to bribe me for a positive response or to just drop the card off with them.

Dealerships are privately owned but under the rules set by the parent company. Do you think the Lexus dealer gives you great service because they are a bunch of great guys.....No, it is because the parent company mandates their behavior and what is expected. Step out of line and your out.

Mazda authorizes dealers and they are Mazda’s representatives to the client. Again don't fool yourself, Mazda has the ultimate say in how your car is serviced and supported. They can over ride the dealer’s decision and can dictate what they will support or not.

The dealer is Mazda and Mazda's corporate paradigm will dictate how they treat you!


Raptor75, what I don't think you get, is that Mazda built the car, and then sold the car to the dealer who sells it to you.

I have never heard of a Mazda dealer loosing its sales franchise because of pissed off customers. It may have happened, but normally they only loose their sales franchise because they can't pay the bills. Piss off enough customers and you can't pay your bills. So Mazda corp doesn't need to care. They care about being paid for the car from the dealer and making their 30%. The dealer is their customer, not you.

So when you take the car into the dealer, the dealer needs to expend time and money to fix it. He then either submits a claim to Mazda or the Insurance company or the customer to pay for the fix. Either way the dealer did the work... not Mazda.

So as a dealer, wouldn't you want to stop any hemorging of money. The customer must pay to get his or her car back, so you get paid right then and now. Wheras if they must submit a warranty claim, you might not get paid for 30 or 60 or 90 days. So as a dealer it is in your best intrest to get the money the easiest way you can.

Because you didn't buy your car from Mazda. You bought it from a dealer. You are not MNA's customer, the dealer is.

Sort of like if you have phone line DSL at your house, and you pay for service through AOL, yet your local phone company is who provides the actual wiring to your house. You could call the local phone company and bitch about a poor connection, but they wouldn't care. You are not thier customer. AOL is. So you have to call AOL to get the DSL line serviced (of course why anyone would buy DSL through AOL is beyond me, but that was just an example).

Actually I have heard of a dealer losing his franchise for what boiled down to poorly representing the parent company.

But was it a Mazda franchise?

Don't get me wrong. I am convinced without any doubts that the majority of the dealers are Mazda's biggest issue. The service techs dealing with Mazda are among the worst of any brand, simply because the majorty of them are really service techs for the GM brand also being sold there and they only know how to replace parts, instead of troubleshooting an issue.

But with Mazda North America worried about sales and keeping out of the red ink, I think they turn a blind eye to everything except the very very worst cases. They'd rather just sell the cars to the dealers.

But toss in a lot of owners (and dealers) have never dealt with rotary power cars, and their querks (like flooding or high gas consumption) and I can see the dealers just not wanting to do anything.

BTW on a side note, for your high gas consumption, have you checked the injectors for leaking/dirty injectors??? A leaking 2ndary injector often increases gas consumption without flooding on 13B engines. Does your oil have any gas smell??? If so it is probably just a leaking injector.

That's what the sales manager at the Autobarn told me and I know of a local Mazda dealer that went away, it adds up but I can't confirm.

I do agree with you on your summary of the situation. Mazda rolled out a car that they (dealers) were ill prepared to service. Put on top of that Mazda's priority of saving a buck over servicing the client and you have a recipe for very poor service and a "we don't care" attitude.

Thanks for the info on the injector, the car only has 2500 miles on it and was getting poor mileage from the start so I didn't think dirty injector. It could be leaking but again the dealer won't look at anything unless the computer tells him to. They want me to pay for the diagnostics of their malfunctioning car. I'll check out the oil for the small of gas. I can tell you that the car is throwing a ton of gas in at start up I can smell it in the exhaust.


But was it a Mazda franchise?

Don't get me wrong. I am convinced without any doubts that the majority of the dealers are Mazda's biggest issue. The service techs dealing with Mazda are among the worst of any brand, simply because the majorty of them are really service techs for the GM brand also being sold there and they only know how to replace parts, instead of troubleshooting an issue.

But with Mazda North America worried about sales and keeping out of the red ink, I think they turn a blind eye to everything except the very very worst cases. They'd rather just sell the cars to the dealers.

But toss in a lot of owners (and dealers) have never dealt with rotary power cars, and their querks (like flooding or high gas consumption) and I can see the dealers just not wanting to do anything.

BTW on a side note, for your high gas consumption, have you checked the injectors for leaking/dirty injectors??? A leaking 2ndary injector often increases gas consumption without flooding on 13B engines. Does your oil have any gas smell??? If so it is probably just a leaking injector.

Thanks for the info on the injector, the car only has 2500 miles on it and was getting poor mileage from the start so I didn't think dirty injector. It could be leaking but again the dealer won't look at anything unless the computer tells him to. They want me to pay for the diagnostics of their malfunctioning car. I'll check out the oil for the small of gas. I can tell you that the car is throwing a ton of gas in at start up I can smell it in the exhaust.
Screams leaking 2ndary or third injector...(as I recall the reni has three injectors per rotor, but I am not sure, I know none of the other 13B's do).

And of course if it was a hunk of something stuck in the injector nozzle or the injector was dropped and damaged before installation, it would not show up anywhere on a diagnostic computer, but rather just that it was running slightly rich.

And as far as dealing with the dealers not being prepared to service, Mazda sent a tech from each dealer to reni school to service the cars. But again I am convinced that modern techs are just clueless.

Well, techs are knowledgeable to the same degree that people are in any profession. Some know their way backwards and forwards around a rotary engine, some start looking for pistons. It's a fact of life.

The key is, to try and find a dealership/tech combination that is decent, and then reward them with your business.

I know in MN we have a number of solid dealerships, and the guys/gals at Morrie's mazda do an excellent job with almost all the rotary cars that come through there.

Thanks this gives me something to pursue. How can you test for the leaky injector?

the PCM would compensate for a leaky injector by dialing down the amount injected by the primary- or at least you'd think it would. if it couldnt get it down to where it was supposed to be then it would throw a CEL light for the over rich condition detected by the Wide Band O2 sensor.

the 6spd manuals have 3 injectors per rotor and the 04, 05 automatic's have 2 per rotor....i know i get about 17 mpg with fairly aggressive driving.

the only problem is we count on the computer to steer us in the correct direction, and if the computer doesn't think that there is a problem it's hard to find one. I know for gas mileage complaints all we normally due is monitor the sensors to make sure each one is working properly.

Mazda does tend to stay out of the equation unless the dealership can't handle a problem. They would prefer that the dealership resolve the problem if at all possible, if not that is when the district reps step in.

Dealerships have the bulk of the responsibility to the customer. But, Mazda should be paying closer attention +/- actually acting on the things they are paying attention to and they are not.


but they absolutely are paying attention. they know they have a dealer problem and are workign on correcting it- things just dont happen over night


The problem for Mazda is expanding its customer base: Are there enough Americans who really want "zoom zoom"? A number of factors have hampered this goal. For one, its dealer force was one of the weakest in the business. A few years ago, only 20 percent of Mazda dealers were exclusive, which means the other 80 percent shared their show rooms and loyalty with other brands. With Honda, 82 percent of the dealers are exclusive. Mazda is improving on this count; 43 percent of the company's 709 current dealers are exclusive, and the goal is for 50 percent by the end of next year.

http://www.forbesautos.com/news/headlines/2006/may/fdc050206-mazda.html

Badly treated buyers

Dan Lawlor, senior analyst for quality and customer satisfaction research at J.D. Power and Associates, says customers complained about poor treatment by Mazda sales and service employees, as well as poor quality and poor resale value of Mazda vehicles.

As John Mendel, COO of Mazda North American Operations, puts it: "You can't treat people like crap and expect them to keep coming back to you."

Mazda is starting a comprehensive program to bolster customer loyalty. Steve Odell, senior managing executive officer of Mazda Motor Corp., cites three elements of that effort: better product, more exclusive dealerships and better treatment of customers in the back shop.

http://www.cartype.com/page.cfm?id=465&alph=ALL&dec=ALL

"better treatment of customers in the back shop. "
:rollingla
If they go near my 'back shop' I'll never go there again! I think . . .

the 6spd manuals have 3 injectors per rotor and the 04, 05 automatic's have 2 per rotor....i know i get about 17 mpg with fairly aggressive driving.

the only problem is we count on the computer to steer us in the correct direction, and if the computer doesn't think that there is a problem it's hard to find one. I know for gas mileage complaints all we normally due is monitor the sensors to make sure each one is working properly.

Mazda does tend to stay out of the equation unless the dealership can't handle a problem. They would prefer that the dealership resolve the problem if at all possible, if not that is when the district reps step in.

I understand what you are saying, but believe that there will be problems with a car that the computer will miss. It seems that today’s attitude is if the computer can’t spot it there is no problem yet we see many posts here that tell of problems being discovered that the computer never picked up on. What about these?

Let me ask you a simple question. I have a RX-8 05 8/05 build date, GT model, MT. I presently have 2500 miles on the car. I drive almost 100% of the time city driving in Chicago. My average drive to work is 9 miles one way with city stop light driving. It takes me about 25 minutes to make this drive and while the car is moving I average about 30mph. In the Winter I get around 11mpg and in summer about 12mpg. When I have taken it on long drives(100 miles plus) I average 20 to 22 mpg Highway. My driving style is moderately aggressive. Most the time I'm following traffic shifting between 3K and 5K but if traffic opens up so will I. I will redline it at least once a trip.

Should my car be getting 11 to 12 mpg in the city?

PS Thanks Zoom44, what you said makes perfect sense, even if it is leaking the CO2 sensor will pick up the excess gas and trim it back.

but they absolutely are paying attention. they know they have a dealer problem and are workign on correcting it- things just dont happen over night

It has been an issue since the 80's. They have said the same thing since then.

I could tell horror stories about taking my first FC (2nd Gen RX-7) into service (at the biggest best highest rated dealer in the San Diego area) for something as simple as a reverse light switch that failed.

I buy Mazda products for the product, and do the service myself.

I or a member of my direct family have owned or still own, a 79 RX-7, 86 323, 87 RX-7 Sport, 88 RX-7 Convertible, 88 10th Anniversary RX-7, 88 RX-7 GTU, 94 RX-7 pep, 96 626 Sport, and have been seriously looking at a 8. I still own the 88 RX-7 Convertible and 88 10th Anniversary RX-7.

Mazda makes great product. When you buy one, you just have to figure that you'll never ever ever take it into the dealer for anything but a recall or to buy parts at the parts counter.

My experience with Mazda has been exactly the opposite. They have treated me unbelievably every time I have been in. They did a warranty replacement of the sun visor and are going to buff the entire car, because of a small scratch on the rear drivers side fender that was there when I purchased it. Some dealerships are willing go out of the way to do the right thing and keep the customers happy.

the PCM would compensate for a leaky injector by dialing down the amount injected by the primary- or at least you'd think it would. if it couldnt get it down to where it was supposed to be then it would throw a CEL light for the over rich condition detected by the Wide Band O2 sensor.But that doesn't help if it is a leaking injector.

See if the injector is leaking, it leaks when the car is off (remember the fuel rail stays pressureized for faster starting). With the Reni design, it would only flood one rotor face when that happend. Of course that would lead to a serious smell of gas when starting (because the cat would not be warm enough to burn off the extra gas).

So, say you loose half a gallon (per a tank full) through leakage while off. An then when starting another 1/2 gallon. Start up probably ignores O2 and cats until warm so if you suddenly are getting 13MPG (figuring agressive drivers probably only get 15 MPG anyway).

So, when the O2 and engine comes up to temp, and the ECU cranks back the primary because it is seeing a rich condition, it would not throw and error until it couldn't crank back the primary far enough to compinsate. But it would only compensate at warm engine temps anyway.

Now I am simply speculating on that. I have not looked at the RX-8 PCM code to see what it really does. Maybe it does monitor the O2 cold (but I doubt it since normally O2 sensors needs to be around at least 500-600F to send correctly).

Mazda authorizes dealers and they are Mazda’s representatives to the client. Again don't fool yourself, Mazda has the ultimate say in how your car is serviced and supported. They can over ride the dealer’s decision and can dictate what they will support or not.

Maybe in theory, but I've seen too many threads where the customer is basically told "we have to go by what the dealer says". "Your clutch was abused because it's blue", when they're blue out of the box... not to meantion strong-arm tactics to get perfect scores on questionnaires. Seems to me their dealers have too much power. There is a lack of checks and balances, or at least unwillingness on Corporate's part to establish a uniform standard of service. I haven't had a major problem yet, but the things I have read do make me worry what would happen should I need some major warranty work. One hand just doesn't seem to know what the other is doing. For an example you need go no further than the synthetic oil issue, a debate which predates the RX-8 by a generation, and will probably continue forever -- something Mazda could put an end to at once by simply making a definitive statement. Everything is iffy with them. And the fact that Ford is involved, frankly gives me the heebie jeebies.

Raptor,
Based on your driving time and miles (posted above), you average 21.6 mph. It is apparent that you are idling quite a bit at lights. Based on myself and deduced from what other owners are seeing, it appears your milage is about the same as all RX-8's. Mine does the same. What is really amazing is if you go out on a back road and keep the revs between 5-7K, your milage will be about the same as your highway milage.

Mike

My father worked in a factory before he was drafted in 1942. One day a woman next to him severed her finger while on a machine. She wrapped a rag around the stump and kept working - she'd have been docked a day's pay if she stopped. Unions stopped that kind of abuse.

Now... you were saying?

I hate to go off on this tangent, but I wanted to comment on this.

Yes, unions were useful when companies abused their workers in that way. However, it's a completely different world now. My mom manages an office for a major telecommunications company, that's unionized. Here's a common scenario from day-to-day: An employee frequently comes back late from lunches and breaks. My mom will have a talk with them as verbal warning. The next time she has to address the issue, she will write them up. This employee will then proceed to call his Union Rep in for a meeting to argue that the employee is being treated unfairly. And of course, it turns racial because the employee thinks he or she is being discriminated against. This is the kind of crap that most unions are dealing with now. We no longer have companies prohibiting employees from going home after injuries and such. They're protecting lazy employees who think they have the right to do anything they want and still get paid for it.

Or to a reknowned rotary shop other than the dealer. They are our there.

I avg 17.5 or thereabouts in heavy stop-go (think S. Fl and its badly-timed lights).. I also get my foot in it a lot, shifting usually around 7k 1st and 2nd.

Actually, I do 17.5 no matter how badly I get on it. I haven't tracked it yet, so dunno how she'll respond to that.. but I've not seen 20 yet.

I think there *is* a problem with low-MPG 8s.. and that low-mpg is a symptom of something else amiss in the car, something the car's ECU isn't trapping as a fault. But y'know, the damn thing only tests for what it has been taught for.. it won't catch the "WTF" conditions new <insert thing here> usually come with.

Were I mazda, I'd be very quietly approach low-mpg owners to investigate why. I don't like the sounds of an engine with really sub-par mileage.. it says something else is wrong.

Have you had your car compression-tested? (Ye of low-mpg in this thread?) I'd be curious to see how it stacks up against 'spec' compression. How about oil analyisis (beyond using the nose, that is..) It may show something else.. lots of gasoline (side seal issue?) which would also put out a lot of metals that shouldn't be there..

Probably been mention in this thread but it isn't isolated to any one car maker, have seen mitsu and dodge do the same type of abuse story.

Luckily so far no real issue with the dealership and service expect trying to blame the AC issue on the XM radio, but that only took a minute to disagree and now its getting fixed.

missinmahseven,
Like I said in my message, getting your foot into the gas does NOT kill milage. Sitting at a light and low rpm driving in traffice does. Raptor said his freeway milage is not too far off the mark. I suggested he go on some back roads and see what that milage is like. Gather some more data is all I am suggesting.

Mike

Sometimes you just have to make sacrifices in the name of science, like ripping it up on the twisties. *sigh*

lol, i'ld like to be doing some "research" right about now.

as far as the computer thing goes raptor, maybe dealers do rely on it to much. The only problem is it is nearly impossible for a technician to find a problem when the computer doesn't think there is one. Sure you could spend all day chasing something down only to find out there are no problems, might even get lucky and guess right about replacing a part, but the clear majority of the time your replacing perfectly good parts that don't fix any problems. Then the customer is even more pissed off because you've told him there is a problem by trying to fix it, but you didn't fix anything, so they have to keep coming back in while you guess some more. Its a catch 22 sometimes trying to help people out
on one hand you feel better because they are attempting to fix your problem and on the other you have to keep bringing it back, all the while loosing more confidence in the dealership than before.

So, my question to you is....would you rather a dealership guess and replace wrong parts...or wait until they actually have an idea about what's going on?

To be honest I would accept either, having worked on cars myself I understand what you are saying and how hard it can be to find a problem. I also understand that some people just don't understand sometimes that your doing your best and trying to help them. Instead they start to rip you guys which is wrong.

What I do find completely unacceptable is when the service manger tells me every thing is fine just live with it. That is what really piss's me off, if they make an effort I'll work with them all year if necessary. I just want my car fixed and Mazda to stand behind their product.


lol, i'ld like to be doing some "research" right about now.

as far as the computer thing goes raptor, maybe dealers do rely on it to much. The only problem is it is nearly impossible for a technician to find a problem when the computer doesn't think there is one. Sure you could spend all day chasing something down only to find out there are no problems, might even get lucky and guess right about replacing a part, but the clear majority of the time your replacing perfectly good parts that don't fix any problems. Then the customer is even more pissed off because you've told him there is a problem by trying to fix it, but you didn't fix anything, so they have to keep coming back in while you guess some more. Its a catch 22 sometimes trying to help people out
on one hand you feel better because they are attempting to fix your problem and on the other you have to keep bringing it back, all the while loosing more confidence in the dealership than before.

So, my question to you is....would you rather a dealership guess and replace wrong parts...or wait until they actually have an idea about what's going on?

and i understand where you are coming from too, i've been on that side myself before i was in the business.

what i would be interested to find out is if anyone in your area does the same kind of driving that you do. If they could get some one to run the same route, during the same hours and traffic conditions that you drive with another 8 to see if it comes out the same...same gas stations and all. That may be the only way to test and see if your 8 gas mileage is abnormal or not

See if your dealer w/swap for one on the lot for a day or two. 24 hour test drives are more and more common, so why not? If the mpg is that much different, maybe they'll be more willing to investigate.

never hurts to ask...i'ld try that

This might be a good place to post my Letter to my Local Mazda Dealer.

I sent the following to my Local dealer - and to date have not recieved a reply. I finally sent to mazda, got a reply saying blah -blah-blah complaint noted or whatever.


5 December 2004 I purchased a 2004 Mazda RX8 from your dealership. I don’t recall the name of the salesman, as I’ve had no contact with him since. I do remember the people in your Service Department however, as I’ve had dealings with that part of your dealership on several occasions.
Bottom line up-front:
Your staff in the Service Department has been very cooperative, professional, and courteous when I’ve taken my car in for “little things” such as having rattles fixed, and oil changes. When “big things” happen, I’ve been on an emotional roller-coaster of “We won’t cover your car under warranty” then relenting after putting me through much angst; “Okay, we’ll do you a favor and honor the warranty”…which was included in the $28,500 you spent at Milam. This past week, your Service Department failed me in a most outrageous way.
Details, which will illustrate my frustration, follow. These are in chronological order, oldest to newest events:

Returned Car for service work regarding: Dealer Repair Information #0003559 – Repaint rust on brake rotors. After a second treatment sometime later, a point was made to tell me the re-painting was done out of the goodness of their hearts, as “Mazda doesn’t reimburse them for the labor involved.” Milam Auto is Mazda to customers.
HVAC/Radio display unreadable and garbled: Before any other diagnosis I was told “there was no way that will be covered under warranty” because I had installed some basic aftermarket audio components. Milam did NOT prove or illustrate how the aftermarket parts caused the display to go bad. After some frustrating hours, the part was covered under warranty because Milam/Mazda Tech line found ONE OTHER car, in California, with the same problem – which was a radio unit overly sensitive to heat. Had my car been the first case they could find, the display would NOT have been covered.
Catastrophic failure of the Clutch Disc: After removal of the damaged parts, your Service Department called me, accusing me of abusing the clutch. I was told the clutch disc has been “abused and over-heated”, as the clutch disc had “turned blue, from overheating.” The clutch disc had EXPLODED – the metal rivets holding the clutch disc together simply failed. I suggested employees of your Service Department open a brand-new Mazda RX8 clutch disc if they had one in stock. ALL have a blue hue to the metal pieces. Begrudgingly, the clutch was replaced under warranty with the caveat no future replacements would be done as the clutch is a “part” and “parts” only carry a 12,000 mile warranty. I was told “(Milam is) doing you a favor in honoring the warranty” as my car had just over 13,000 miles when this happened. Your Service Department worked well with me in holding off a few days on the repair, as I had ordered a Mazdaspeed (MS) Flywheel for installation. Had your parts department not told me “No.” when I asked if Milam can order MS parts, the install would have been completed a few days quicker.
Hard Starting Issue: per Mazda TSB 01-019/05. This problem was not fixed; I was denied warranty coverage. I had cut a VERY small notch in the side my battery cover to allow the pass-through of a ½” diameter power wire for an audio amplifier. I was told by a Service Rep “That small hole is causing the battery to overheat. Therefore the hard starting won’t be covered as your modification lead to the problem.” I was not offered data to support the claim. The “diagnosis” was made only by calling the Mazda Tech phone line and concluding the tiny notch in the cover “must” be the cause of the hard-starting. I also asked your Service Department to look into re-fixing a driver’s airbag rattle which was fixed at one point, but has since returned with a vengeance, per Mazda TSB 08-004/04. I have to keep a wadded-up piece of paper in the gap between the airbag cover and the steering wheel to maintain sanity during driving. The car is now “past the warranty period for rattles.”
Gradual, severe power loss: Last week, your Service Department gave me untold amounts of ulcer-inducing stress and grief. My car could barely accelerate. The car bucked and shuddered – the only way I could drive the car is by keeping minimal pressure on the throttle to gradually build up speed. When I dropped the car with your Service Department I said that I’d been researching the symptoms online, and thought the power loss was likely the result of ignition coil failure or a clogged catalytic converter. The reaction I got from your Service Department was disbelief; “if the cat-converter is bad, [my car] would have a Check Engine Light [illuminated].” The next day was told by a service representative that Milam would not diagnose the problem with my car. I was told “…we called Mazda Tech line – they told us we are to not touch the car because of a performance intake and exhaust system which may have caused the power loss.” I was effectively denied warranty coverage based on speculation without any determination of the cause of the problem. I had purchased and installed Racing Beat brand intake and exhaust system last year. Racing Beat has a well-documented, established history with Mazda. Your service representative told me he’d never heard of Racing Beat. When I brought up the quality of the parts I’d chosen I was questioned on the brand of air filter. I was told “the air filter might have caused the car’s Mass Airflow Sensor (MAF) to malfunction.” After two days, I was asked to return to Milam and pick up my car. I was to expect a call within a few days to see if they could convince Mazda to cover the car under warranty. When I expressed my frustration, and asked if he thought Milam was in violation of the Magnusen-Moss Warranty Act, I was patronized with the comment “If it’s not a MAZDA brand part, it will void your warranty!” Also, suggestion was made that if I’d have brought in my car with the Original Equipment re-installed, I would have had no trouble getting diagnosis and repair for the car.

It is a shame that I’d be forced to be dishonest, just to ensure fair treatment.

As of the writing of this letter, I have not received the promised phone call.
Monday of this week, I called a different Mazda dealer and explained the problems with my car, and my frustration – at this point I just want to know what’s wrong with my car. I was honest and upfront to the service representative on the phone, telling him of my Racing Beat products. He told me “We’ll take care of you – bring it in.”
No more than 3 hours later, I got a call from the actual technician who worked on my car. He told me he drove the car and suspected the catalytic converter was at fault. He removed the converter to find “…pieces of the catalyst broken and in chunks – falling out all over.” He told me he’d get a new converter as soon as possible.
I asked him if I’d be charged for the converter and if my use of other-than-Mazda parts may have lead to the failure. He wondered if the car had any history of hard-start issues – which, in his opinion, does lead to such a failure of the catalytic converter at times.
When I told the technician of Milam Auto’s refusal to fix the hard start problem my car had been experiencing, he told me he’d absolutely fix that too.
Denying warranty coverage without cause is a violation of Federal Law to the best of my understanding. Speculation is NOT enough. To invalidate a warranty, aftermarket parts must cause a failure of another part. And IF an aftermarket part is shown to cause a problem, only that area of the warranty is voided – e.g., new wheels causing the ball joints to go bad would not invalidate a warranty on the ignition system. At this point Milam Auto’s Service Department hasn’t actually invalidated my car’s warranty – but the threats of such action, coupled with the unwillingness to even just research the current problem borderline on unethical in my view.
At this point, I’ve been driven away from Milam Auto and found a new dealership. Milam Auto gave me a very fair deal when purchasing my car. Milam’s Service Department has left me jaded, and frustrated, however. If I had not found the other dealership I’d absolutely boycott Milam Auto and Mazda, and do what I could to ensure all those I’m in contact with would stay very very far away from your store. I would have also seriously considered legal action and letters to the FTC, BBB, and anyone else who would listen. I would LOVE to frequent Milam Auto for all of my car’s service and maintenance needs, as it’s less than ten miles from my home.
Milam’s sales staff treated me with respect and showed a real willingness to work with me. In fact, recently I went on a test drive with a salesman in a Mazdaspeed6. I enjoyed the experience to the point I’d discussed the possibility of trading my RX8 on the sedan. However, I would need a lot of convincing to buy a car at a place where I cannot trust their Service Department.
Thursday of this week, I picked up my car, running fantastic and repaired correctly under warranty from a Mazda dealer nearly forty miles away. I’m okay with having to put up with the distance for all my car’s future needs too; warranty-covered work or otherwise.
I can accept the problem may not be the sincerity of the personnel in your Service Department, and may be a systemic problem with how much they are allowed to actually do for a customer. I don’t doubt the integrity of the individuals, but have reservations about the policies under which they operate. Something as simple as a pipe and muffler section or a replacement black plastic box with a filter inside won’t cause engine failure. And if they did, I’d appreciate – I believe the average person would demand - data or evidence to support that conclusion, rather than “we don’t know, so that (insert aftermarket part) MUST have been the cause!”
As when shopping for a car, I don’t expect special treatment. I expect a Service Department to look at problems with a car objectively. I expect a Service Department to give me credit for having at least basic knowledge of how the systems in a car work together. I expect a Service Department to have at least the level of information I can find doing a 20-minute search of the internet. I am only after a fair deal. Thank you for your time, sir.

What kind of oil were you using just before your cat went out - there has been an on going discussion and it would be worth knowing.....

They've never heard of Racing Beat?!
My dealership has RB parts hanging on the walls in their customer lounge/service area.

That letter goes in the "Hall Of Fame"

that was a very well written letter, sorry to hear about your problems at the dealership close to your home...good to see someone else took care of you though

i have the revi/ram air pipe and hymee ss exhaust on mine...so do half of my rx-8 customers.....haven't seen any problems yet..except maybe one with a mass air flow sensor

What I do find completely unacceptable is when the service manger tells me every thing is fine just live with it. That is what really piss's me off, ...And with good reason too! I think many of us would be tempted to wring the guy's neck for saying somethng like that. :mad:

Ok, I don't want to be an ass, but why in the world would you consider buying a car from a dealership where the service department is crap?

Go to the dealership 40 miles away, buy the car from them, then drive to Milan Mazda and ask to talk to the sales manager. Walk them out to your car, explain they lost an easy sale to another Mazda dealership because of their service department and leave it at that.

Buying more cars from dealerships that are low cost up front, and screw you down the line will just perpetuate the problem.

^ I agree. But I think his point was that he wouldn't buy the ms6 from them b/c of the service dept. Bought mine from a dealer 35 miles away, rather than the one 5mins away b/c the closer one was Tasca; with a giant showroom, giant ego, and giant run-around. 40 miles to the service dept. is just a good excuse to cross the Newport Bridge (doing the posted limit, of course). Too bad I don't trust any of them.

Well thanks to all who suggested various solutions to my immediate problem, I see I still have many miles to go before I put this to bed. I also hope Mazda North America reads this thread and takes it to heart. They are doing a lot of harm with there approach to customers and it will cost them in the future. Their poor service has already lost them a sale to me. I was really starting to like that new C7 but after the lack of support I had with the 8 I'm staying with Subaru for my wife’s next car. It is a shame because they make nice cars and there are some good dealers but over all their product support sucks.

Not to mention the SUV w/ Turbo that is STILL not available on the 8. But that's another thread altogether. Good luck Raptor.

I hate to go off on this tangent, but I wanted to comment on this.

Yes, unions were useful when companies abused their workers in that way. However, it's a completely different world now. My mom manages an office for a major telecommunications company, that's unionized. Here's a common scenario from day-to-day: An employee frequently comes back late from lunches and breaks. My mom will have a talk with them as verbal warning. The next time she has to address the issue, she will write them up. This employee will then proceed to call his Union Rep in for a meeting to argue that the employee is being treated unfairly. And of course, it turns racial because the employee thinks he or she is being discriminated against. This is the kind of crap that most unions are dealing with now. We no longer have companies prohibiting employees from going home after injuries and such. They're protecting lazy employees who think they have the right to do anything they want and still get paid for it.


Can I throw an off tangent AMEN to go along with this statement! But also include most of society looking for a way to get a quick buck and not have to work for it. Entitlement programs from the 1940's really started the hole that has led to the cess pool of slacker mentality we are in now.

Tim

Can I throw an off tangent AMEN to go along with this statement! But also include most of society looking for a way to get a quick buck and not have to work for it. Entitlement programs from the 1940's really started the hole that has led to the cess pool of slacker mentality we are in now.

Tim
this thread is 4 weeks old tim :smoker: