Many of you took the time to fill out the sport compact car survey I posted a while ago (here: http://www.rx8forum.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=30179#post30179 ) Here is why I asked you to take my survey:
A few guys (including myself) at GM have been discussing how GM has a bit of a gap in its model lineup. Namely, small sporty cars in the $20-low $30's range (Canadian). In fact, I'm in the market for a small sports sedan in that region, and the closest thing that GM offers is the Cavalier Z24 sedan (not interested) and the new Saab 9-3 (just outside of the budget at a start price of $35k.) So instead, I ordered a Mazdaspeed Protege.
Most other automakers have something in this price range for the sport compact crowd, such as the Acura RSX, Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V, Subaru Impreza 2.5RS (and its big brother the WRX), Toyota Celica, BMW Mini, VW Golf GTi (and Jetta 1.8T), Ford Focus SVT, Dodge SRT-4, and so on. Namely all those cars that I asked you to rank on my survey. So maybe The General should foray into this growing market segment (in my humble opinion anyway).
Long story short, in mid-March 17 I made a small presentation to the small car product planners at GM about what a guy like me would like out of sport compact car, and suggested some ways GM could enter this segment.
We discussed importing the Opel/Vauxhall Astra GSi (see here for some pictures: http://www.gsi.top-webservice.de/oliver/oliver.htm )
Specs are 2.0L turbo, 17" wheels with sticky rubber, Recaro seats, sport suspension. Yum. The Opel Astra Turbo Coupe is very nice as well. Unfortunately, with import laws, CAW stickiness, and homologation issues, it is impossible.
The other alternative involved upgrading an existing vehicle. I can't say anything really about the direction GM chose to take, but lets just say keep an eye in your rear-view mirror for a hotted up version of a certain 4-door coupe with plastic body panels in a years time... ;)
Thanks again everyone for taking the time to fill out the survey. I really appreciated your input, and the boys at GM had a look at all your responses, so they actually counted for something!

Originally posted by Grimace
A few guys (including myself) at GM have been discussing how GM has a bit of a gap in its model lineup. Namely, small sporty cars in the $20-low $30's range (Canadian). In fact, I'm in the market for a small sports sedan in that region, and the closest thing that GM offers is the Cavalier Z24 sedan (not interested) and the new Saab 9-3 (just outside of the budget at a start price of $35k.)

do you not have the sunfire (http://www.pontiac.com/sunfire/index.jsp?source=hmlnav) or is that not close enough to the price range? i 've seen a few that were hopped up with power and image mods.


and thanks for letting us in on it :D :cool:

Yeah, we have the Sunfire, but have you seen the 2003 redesign? Serious case of industrial espionage.

http://www.wallsoffame.com/assets/images/2_00_nicholson.jpg

http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars_trucks/2002/2/new_cars_chicago_auto_show/images/tb_lg_sunfire-lg.jpg

:D

I'm (somewhat) kidding. No, the Sunfire has the same problems as the Cavalier: antiqudated chassis, neither a good ride or sporty handling, needs an interior revamp, the driveline isn't exactly spine-tingling, etc. The next Cavalier/Sunfire looks to be a big improvement though. Can't say anything more than that.

a hotted up version of a certain 4-door coupe

That's a nice trick -- 4 door coupe ;)

Ok, call it a quad-coupe, fastback sedan, whatever you like! Same body style as the RX-8. Coupelet? Hmmm I dunno. :p

how bout making a compact version of the SSR? :D wheee modern day mini el camino haha

What about this Pontiac GTO?

Of course, I have heard it isn't coming to Canada in anycase . . .

Originally posted by Grimace
Ok, call it a quad-coupe, fastback sedan, whatever you like! Same body style as the RX-8. Coupelet? Hmmm I dunno. :p The preffered is "SPORTS-QUAD"

Grim, if anything would come from Opel I would love to see the Speedster Turbo. Sorry guy's but if I had this as an option, I would buy it over the RX-8. About 10 years ago when I had turned 15 my dad almost bought me an Opel GT. I would have had a year to get it running again but the parts for it weren’t readily available. So I ended up getting a 79 RX-7.

Originally posted by Andrew
What about this Pontiac GTO?

Of course, I have heard it isn't coming to Canada in anycase . . .

that thing is by no stretch of the imagination compact in any way

Maybe GM will make the Pontiac Solstice.

http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/02images/solstice-intro-1.jpg
http://www.xtremega.com/solsticeside.jpg

Originally posted by lefuton


that thing is by no stretch of the imagination compact in any way

Could someone please explain to me where the limit of sports compact ends? I thought the GTO I saw at the Detroit Auto Show didn't look any bigger than the Saturn SC2 I saw recently at a sport compact portion of an auto show recently in Toronto. Am I just really confused?

A few days ago I was thinking about that survey and almost PM'd you about it. Glad to see it was put toward something useful.:)

Originally posted by Andrew


Could someone please explain to me where the limit of sports compact ends? I thought the GTO I saw at the Detroit Auto Show didn't look any bigger than the Saturn SC2 I saw recently at a sport compact portion of an auto show recently in Toronto. Am I just really confused?

i saw it at the LA auto show, it looks even bigger than the current grand-am's (well, atleast meatier anyhow) not to mention the ls1? in it.

That could be too, I forgot to take into account how close I could get to it (which wasn't very close at all).

It seemed small enough to me, but it could have just been the huge distance factor :)

Originally posted by lefuton


i saw it at the LA auto show, it looks even bigger than the current grand-am's (well, atleast meatier anyhow) not to mention the ls1? in it. Agreed, I saw it there too. It's huge compared to the 8.

Superfan I'd love to see the Speedster here. I saw one on a recent trip overseas, and man! what a beautiful car. Makes the Miata look like a fat pig! The Lotus Elise (same basic car, different body and powertrain and interior) is coming to the U.S., but at $38000 US (last I heard) it was a bit outside of the constraints of the project. We weren't focusing on convertibles because the Solistice is coming out. And it will be a crackerjack of a car, believe you me. I wish I could tell you guys about it, but I'd get fired instantly. :)

In response to the Q's about the GTO: yeah, its too big to be considered compact. Too expensive for our project too. Its also sporting a big honking V8 and is RWD. Its a nice car, but doesn't fit into the genre. (Its not coming to Canada either.)

To bad it couldn't have been more like the "Opel GTC Genève concept" shown at the last 2003 Geneva Auto Show (sigh)

:D

...And doesn't GM own Daewoo? I know the Chevrolet Aveo is based on one of their platforms (the Lanus I believe) ... not that I'd think GM would get a any kind of sports car ot of that!

;)

Sorry, but I''d stick with any Opel over any Ion! But hey, what do I know? .... unless it is reliable (toyota made for GM) hatchback/fastback.

:D

Yeah, GM owns Daewoo now. Strictly commuter appliances though, not much "sport" in those compact cars!

That Opel GTC concept was very nice indeed.

And I'd pick the Opel Astra Coupe Turbo over the ION Coupe too, but alas, ain't going to happen.

http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/240000-240999/240561_2_full.jpg

http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/240000-240999/240561_6_full.jpg

Hopefully we get the hotted-up version of the ION Coupe right!

so grimace, I've been meaning to ask you....what's your job over at GM?

Nothing too exciting (unless I'm causing waves in the company with stuff like this). I'm a "specification analyst" (translation: I make sure the right parts get on the right cars by updating part databases whenever an engineer makes a change.)

So how did the guys respond to your presentation? Are there any definite plans being drawn?

Saturn just announced the Saturn Ion Red Line, with a supercharged 2.0l engine making 200hp. Probably still FWD.

A tuned, 250hp VUE is in the works, as well. Both will be 2004 models.

There's a story at http://www.detnews.com/2003/autosinsider/0304/09/f02-132158.htm.

-s

Originally posted by Grimace
... I'd pick the Opel Astra Coupe Turbo over the ION Coupe too, but alas, ain't going to happen.

Hopefully we get the hotted-up version of the ION Coupe right!

yeah, that would be o.k. ...

:(

Hey, have you heard anything about the"Saturn Sky" concept ever going to production or maybe even as a coupe (an idea more to my likeing)?

I like the overall "looks" of it over the ION hands down!

:D

http://www.edmunds.com/news/autoshows/articles/48983/page009.html

Yep, today the ION Red Line got announced. 200 HP, suspension and brake goodies, tasteful bodykit, etc. Pics can be found over at www.saturnfans.com. Should be a quick little pocket rocket. Its a good step in the right direction for GM, and there will be more vehicles like it too come. Note that a lot of the go-fast and interior goodies weren't mentioned in the above link, but I don't think I should say anything because there might be a reason GM is witholding info.
I have heard things about the Saturn Sky. That's all you get to know. :) Sorry. FYI the Pontiac Solstice is getting built and should be hot.

http://www.saturnfans.com/photos/data/642/332X04ST_IN012.jpg

http://www.saturnfans.com/photos/data/642/332X04ST_IN003.jpg

http://www.saturnfans.com/photos/data/642/332X04ST_IN001.jpg

(There are going to be several spoilers available if you don't care for that one.)

wow people at big companies do actually listen!

way to go grimmy!!

Forgive the digression here, but I need to know --
What the hell is 'Grimace' anyway? I know he is a McDonald's character, but what is he supposed to be,other than a purple blob?

Originally posted by Grimace
http://www.saturnfans.com/photos/data/642/332X04ST_IN012.jpg

http://www.saturnfans.com/photos/data/642/332X04ST_IN003.jpg

http://www.saturnfans.com/photos/data/642/332X04ST_IN001.jpg

(There are going to be several spoilers available if you don't care for that one.)

wow, nice looking Saturn there

so is GM aiming Saturn to be the new 'sporting' division?

and I assume that car will come in manual-only right? :D

I think the front hood could use some kind of treatment ... maybe some kind of air vents like on of the earlier RX-8 pre-production concepts had or some kind of funtional hood scoop ...

Personally, I'm still not to thrilled aout the ION's roof lines ... but maybe I'll change my mind in time. But, I do like the front grill/air intake treatment - for what it counts ...

Yet for some reason, I like the front headlight style, grill and hoodline on the Saturn Sky better - go figure...

I'd love to see what other kinds of rear spoiler treatment are offered ...

That is one of the best looking saturns i have ever seen. The front end needs more of a real grille, though.

Originally posted by rxeightr
Forgive the digression here, but I need to know --
What the hell is 'Grimace' anyway? I know he is a McDonald's character, but what is he supposed to be,other than a purple blob? Grimace had multiple hands/pockets before. Each with a different flavor of Milk Shake. I don't know why Micky D's dropped that aspect of the character.

Now I am all conflicted. I told my brother I would never buy a Saturn because of all the trouble he has had (although it has mostly been because of the dealers, and not the actual car), but that is one nice looking Saturn. And if more sporty Saturns start coming out, what can I do? :)

Originally posted by ZoomZoomH


wow, nice looking Saturn there

so is GM aiming Saturn to be the new 'sporting' division?

and I assume that car will come in manual-only right? :D

You bet your sweet bippy it will be manual only. Beefed-up 5-spped with stronger equal length half shafts and a short shifter. Whoops, did I let that out of the bag? :D Screw it. I'm just trying to build enthusiasm!
Saturn won't be the only "sporting" division. There will be a hot version of the next generation Cavalier too. Now, I know most of you won't expect much out of it because of the Cavalier nameplate, but the next generation will be much improved (about time!)


Originally posted by Andrew


Now I am all conflicted. I told my brother I would never buy a Saturn because of all the trouble he has had (although it has mostly been because of the dealers, and not the actual car), but that is one nice looking Saturn. And if more sporty Saturns start coming out, what can I do? :)

Buy buy buy! Then I get a big bonus! :D Heh heh.
Its definately a nice car. When the details get released, you'll be pleasantly surprised.