Why kill the RX-7? The RX-7 and RX-8 cross into each others market. The people that want the RX-7 want a higher performance RX-8. The people that want the RX-8 want a more practical RX-7. Solution: Add a high powered RX-8 to the line up.

We all agree that the RX-8 is agile and is one of the best when it comes to the twisties. Great weight distribution. A little body roll but hey...it turns a .91g skid pad.

The one thing that we all disagree upon is the power to weight ratio and the torque. So if Mazda were to produce a +200 ft-lbs torque, +300 hp RX-8...why even waste the time, engineering, and money to produce an RX-7 that's just a tad faster and a sliver better in handling in a market that might sell 5000 cars a year and cannibalize the RX-8 sales? with more power Mazda will have the dominant sports car that truly takes advantage of the rotary's lightweight and can seat 4! We would have a car that could compete with the likes of Porsche on the track but then turn around and compete with Lexus is300 and BMW 3 series. I'm not saying that the current RX-8 can't hang with the Porsche but you add 50-100 hp and we have a car that not only hangs but beats for less than half the price.

Then take on the Boxster, S2000, Z4... with the RENESIS Miata.

These are just my opinions of how Mazda should play the chess match. I'd like to hear what you guys all think.

From an money standpoint I think I would agree with you. However, I've always seen the RX-7 as the flagship Mazda car and I think this applies to many others as well. Maybe that's why Mazda is considering bringing back the 7; for company image.

it's more than that: the RX-8, although fast, simply couldn't hold a candle to a next generation RX-7 considering all the consessions and trade-offs it has to make... a balls-out performance machine, sharing as much RX-8 componentry as possible, would be a more befitting flagship as chenpin says.

... in fact, it's a pet theory of mine (knowing that both the next Miata and RX-7 have target masses of none-too-much more than 1000kgs) that the next RX-7 would share its RX-8 derived chassis with the next Miata... a rotary powered, hardtopped, hatchbacked, seriously beefed up, and restyled (possibly dimensionally different...??) Miata as the next RX-7... no, a more powerful RX-8 would be pretty good, but you'd be hard pressed to find a higher performance car in this speculated price range (~40k top out).

Originally posted by chenpin
From an money standpoint I think I would agree with you. However, I've always seen the RX-7 as the flagship Mazda car and I think this applies to many others as well. Maybe that's why Mazda is considering bringing back the 7; for company image.

ignore this post. testing something. :D :D :D :D :D

Originally posted by wakeech
it's more than that: the RX-8, although fast, simply couldn't hold a candle to a next generation RX-7 considering all the consessions and trade-offs it has to make... a balls-out performance machine, sharing as much RX-8 componentry as possible, would be a more befitting flagship as chenpin says.

... in fact, it's a pet theory of mine (knowing that both the next Miata and RX-7 have target masses of none-too-much more than 1000kgs) that the next RX-7 would share its RX-8 derived chassis with the next Miata... a rotary powered, hardtopped, hatchbacked, seriously beefed up, and restyled (possibly dimensionally different...??) Miata as the next RX-7... no, a more powerful RX-8 would be pretty good, but you'd be hard pressed to find a higher performance car in this speculated price range (~40k top out).

But Mazda is gearing this vehicle to a mass market. The RX-7 is an awesome machine but appeals to a smaller market. I think what there trying to do is broaden there market, and I think they are going to do a fine job of it. A larger market of people who can afford this car have families and they want to be able to transport the extra people without having a sports care that only sits 2.
Here's my logic equasion.
I couldn't afford the sports car I wanted as a kid. (RX-7) :(

I can now afford one. :)

But now I have kids. The wife wouldn't allow just a two seater. :(

So what fills this void in the auto market?

That's right Baby! the RX-8. :) They have a hit on an empty void of the Auto market, and they are doing it with style. "Dad's who want a sports car, but can't have one because of the seating." Ka-Ching $$$.

okay, you think that kids nowadays suddenly think that a more practical sports car is cooler than one that blows its doors off?? ;) ahahaha...

...forget not, i'm still a kid (19 until the end of May) and i don't have a steady gf, kids, or anything like that... although no, :p i wouldn't be able to afford a new RX-7... but if a new one WAS to come out, it'd put a serious downward pressure on the very high price of FD's... KA CHING!! ;) ahahahaa!!

Originally posted by wakeech
okay, you think that kids nowadays suddenly think that a more practical sports car is cooler than one that blows its doors off?? ;) ahahaha...


No, I don't think kids think a more practical sports car is cooler. I'm just saying mazda is not aiming this car at teenagers or college students. "Not that they can't buy it or want it" I think they are aiming for a broader more practical market." I hope they do bring the RX-7 back, but I can't have one of those until my kids are on there own." So an RX-8 is a perfect fit for that void.

This is slightly off topic, but can anyone tell me if car makers have ever made money off flagship cars? It's my understanding they are there to bring people into dealerships and not really to make a lot of money. That's the job of the "bread and butter" cars like the Mazda6 or Civic or Accord.

If what that's true, then the RX-7 really needs to an awe-inspiring piece of work.

Originally posted by wakeech
it'd put a serious downward pressure on the very high price of FD's... KA CHING!! ;) ahahahaa!!

Sorry, FD prices are already rock bottom, and even then, as they get cheaper, the quality goes down, you'll just be buying something that someone got rid of because they dont want to deal with problems, but the very mint will keep their value, even if a new RX-7 emerges. IMO.

hmm, I don't think car manufactures make a sport car as a loss leader to get people in the door and then sell them a different car. The problem is that a sports car or flag ship car, is going to appeal to everyone, but their are only a few that can either
1. afford it, or
2. Fits into their lifestyle. <- which is less likely.

That can make the market reach much smaller.
Also something that recent in the last 10 years is that most Flag ship cars, are now part of a higher end dealership. The flag ship car kind of went out the window with those other dealerships, along with the SUV market coming to town.
but I think were starting to see them returning. Nissan 350z, Honda 2000s, Toyota MR2 Spyder, Mazda RX-8

Nissan --> Infinity
Toyota --> Lexus
Honda --> Acura
Mazda --> ?????

I'd like to think that Ford's Mustang has made them a buck or two, and I would definately call it the flagship car. Of course, the Focus (and previously, the Escort) has probably made them a LOT more, simply because of sheer quantities. Now lets think about why the Mustang still makes them so much money... its mostly in the Name, and the heritage... But don't forget, the pony car wouldn't have had near the success it did, if it wasn't for the practicality of the car in its early years. When ford decided to go with the more practical, yet still very performance minded compromise (vice the early Mach I concept, which was strictly a 'sports car'), they pulled in such a large crowd, and sold so many, that it is a name that will probably never die. Sure does sound a lot like the RX-8 to me... hmmm....

finally someone else gets it! i have been saying that same thing for almost 2 years :D

I'll give you a few reasons to keep the RX-7.

First the compromises the RX-8 has that are inherent in design. The weight gain, longer body, doors, etc all compromise performance.

Next, you can't have an RX-8 convertible which will undoubtedly debut at some point when the RX-7 will be released.

And lastly... If you've got something to prove (and Nissan did it this year with the 350Z), then you need to make the best. The RX-8 is good, and with more power would be great.. but not as great as an RX-7 with two seats, two doors and a shorter body length.

The RX-8 will run with the competition and beat a lot of the competition as well.

The RX-7 will be the next plateau for sports cars for the next decade. At least if it does what the FD did when IT came out.... the RX-7 is going to be a seriously bad ass car. And while I would PROBABLY not partake and buy a new RX-7... to know that the car that I own (the RX-8), that Mazda built, also built a car that KICKS EVERYBODYS ASS, and is rotary would give me a warm fuzzy feeling inside :)

Everyone seems to forget that what killed the sports cars before was:
1.) too expensive...35k+
2.) too impractical
3.) too small of a market to justify the cost of R&D

Look at the MkIV Supra (93-98)...It sold a total of 11239 over all 6 years!!!! only a little over 7000 are turbos!!!!

The 300z from 93-96 only sold 13527. Ohhh, to see the drop off of sales...total for the 300z from 90-96 was 80000...that's right 80k but for the last 4 years the total was 13k.

MaRX8 is right. The time in your life when an impractical car doesn't matter (teenager-mid to late twenties) you can't afford it and when you finally can afford the impractical car you need a practical car.

My prediction is that the 350z and if indeed a rx7 comes out, die off again. Personally I don't care if the RX7 is the flag ship car, the design is not going to be that much better than the RX8. Look at what the RX8 offers:

close to 50/50 weight dist.
3046 lbs
0.91 g <=== you want to increase this...put on springs.

What can the RX7 top that the RX8 isn't already proficient at? If it comes in at 2800 lbs...ok it will be slight more nimble. So in C&D's article the emergency lane change might go from 72.4 mph to 74 mph. The acceleration, given equal engines, will go up...but again, just slightly. But what you lose in an RX7 is huge!!! no backseat!!!

I'm sorry but if you give me the choice between an RX7 powered by a +300 hp engine weighing 2800 lbs and a RX8 powered by the same engine weighing 3000 lbs....I take the RX8.

Originally posted by AbusiveWombat
Everyone seems to forget that what killed the sports cars before was:
1.) too expensive...35k+
2.) too impractical
3.) too small of a market to justify the cost of R&D

Look at the MkIV Supra (93-98)...It sold a total of 11239 over all 6 years!!!! only a little over 7000 are turbos!!!!

The 300z from 93-96 only sold 13527. Ohhh, to see the drop off of sales...total for the 300z from 90-96 was 80000...that's right 80k but for the last 4 years the total was 13k.

MaRX8 is right. The time in your life when an impractical car doesn't matter (teenager-mid to late twenties) you can't afford it and when you finally can afford the impractical car you need a practical car.

My prediction is that the 350z and if indeed a rx7 comes out, die off again. Personally I don't care if the RX7 is the flag ship car, the design is not going to be that much better than the RX8. Look at what the RX8 offers:

close to 50/50 weight dist.
3046 lbs
0.91 g <=== you want to increase this...put on springs.

What can the RX7 top that the RX8 isn't already proficient at? If it comes in at 2800 lbs...ok it will be slight more nimble. So in C&D's article the emergency lane change might go from 72.4 mph to 74 mph. The acceleration, given equal engines, will go up...but again, just slightly. But what you lose in an RX7 is huge!!! no backseat!!!

I'm sorry but if you give me the choice between an RX7 powered by a +300 hp engine weighing 2800 lbs and a RX8 powered by the same engine weighing 3000 lbs....I take the RX8.
Yea but to have the 'reputation' you have to build that car, even in small quantities. Even though BMW doesn't sell a lot of M3s/M5s, their reputation stems from making some of the best performance machines out there today.

If Mazda made the RX-7 that will beat the M3, for cheaper... then they've again established themselves in the market and people will buy a Mazda just because it's affiliated with being a high-end performance car. Even if it's the RX-8 and not the 7.

Perception is reality :)

Making a new Rx-7 is obviously a risk. It was precisely this reason that Mazda gave us the Rx-8 to appeal to a broader base.

However, I think there will always be a market for sports cars. What killed the japanese sports cars of the mid 90s is a combination of unfavorable exchange rate, which made them terribly expensive, and the rise of SUVs. For the FD, the lack of reliability also didn't help. With the 350z and Rx-8 starting at <27k, I don't see any reason why the new Rx-7 couldn't be sold starting at 30k if not less than that. Like Hercules mentioned, if it could outperform M3s at a 18k cheaper price, we will have a winner.

Performance wise, I'm willing to bet that the next Rx-7 would be a lot lighter than 2800 lbs. Without the limitation of a 4 seat pillarless design, the Rx-7 body could be made a lot shorter and lower, and uses less reinforcements to achieve the same level of stiffness as the Rx-8. Add the larger 300hp Renesis and we have a 350z smoking, M3 slayer that will do wonders to Mazda's image.

Comparing the M3 to the RX7 is not the best comparison. If you want to compare it to something, compare it to what's in it's class (corvette, 350z,...). The draw of the M3 is it's high level of performance coupled with the practicallity of 4 seats and big trunk. The M3 would be better compared to the RX8.

BMW's reputation is not because of the M3 and M5. It's because all of their cars are amazing performers. Each one has a near 50/50 weight distribution. You don't get a reputation based on one car...you build it though all your cars.

Porsche's rep is not based on the 911. It's that all of Porsche's cars are based around high performance. Even the new SUV is crazy fast.

If Kia were to come out tomorrow with a 350z, Corvette, 911 turbo killer. It would not change my opinion that Kia is a cheap car manufacturer, or that the cars they make are low performance.

A new RX7 will not change the way people look at Mazda. I think the general impression is that Mazda makes good cars at an affordable price. Their cars are usually known for their fun to drive and handling characteristics. I guess we'll see though.

In the past the RX-7 and 300Z et al did not share chassis/engines etc with other vehicles so they had to pay for themselves (which of course they failed to do eventually).

Now several cars share the chassis and engine etc (G35S, G35C, Murano (engine only), FX35, 350Z etc for Z-car and RX-8, new Miata (chassis only), new RX-7 for the RX family) so the risk is spread and the cost to bring the car market is a lot less.

Also the point about "The time in your life when an impractical car doesn't matter (teenager-mid to late twenties) you can't afford it and when you finally can afford the impractical car you need a practical car." is nonsense. Every year who buys Corvettes (32,000 US sales), Mustangs (170,000 US sales), S2000s (9,000 US sales), Z3s (45,000 US sales, replaced by Z4 with higher target), Porsche Boxsters (11,000 US sales), 350Zs (30,000 US sales estimated), Audi TTs (30,000 global sales), and every other two seater or 2+2 or convertible car on the market (all impractical to a certain extent) - a potential market of at least 500,000 units worldwide.

I would like the RX-7 to take 20,000-30,000 of those global sales (perhaps 15,000 just for the USA), which it could easily do. Remember the deceased Camaro/Firebird sold 70,000 per year in the USA and nothing has replaced them yet - what are those potential owners going to buy when they have a little more money (and taste ;)).

Finally Mazda needs a no-compromise image car. The RX-8 is hobbled by being everything to everyone (which is why I can buy it). If I could have a non-practical car (in my case it would have to be a 3rd car) it would be a two seater convertible with stunning looks and performance and a $40k RX-7 would fit the bill perfectly.

Prelucidor: Ok I'll admit it...you're right. You biring up some very good points. I think adding the Mustang, Camaro, and Firebird don't quite fit because the majority of their sales are the base models that are around 18-22k which an RX7 would not fit. But you're right...there are a lot of Covettes, Z3/4, S2000, TT's that are sold each year and an all out sports car would take a lot of that away from those competitors.

Also my perspective is the RX8/RX7 would be a 3rd car. We already have a truck and Mazda 6. So in my case 2 seats or 4 could fit the bill. I guess if the RX7 had a significant gain in performance then it could be pretty tasty. You're also correct that an RX7 would be the only way to have a convertable. I conceed! Ahhhh! I've been smacked down!

Now I don't know....RX7 or RX8!!!!!! a sub 2800 lbs 250-3xx hp car would be pretty sweet. I agree that the rx-7 could probably shed more than 200 pounds losing the extra doors and length.

Ok...produce the RX7...and hurry up!

Originally posted by AbusiveWombat
What can the RX7 top that the RX8 isn't already proficient at? If it comes in at 2800 lbs...ok it will be slight more nimble. So in C&D's article the emergency lane change might go from 72.4 mph to 74 mph. The acceleration, given equal engines, will go up...but again, just slightly.

Ok...produce the RX7...and hurry up!

glad you see the light... :D but the performance gains won't be so small... they're not gonna make a "no-comprimises" sports car in half measures...

I"M NOT KIDDING OR SPECULATING WHEN I SAY THE RX-7 TARGET MASS IS ONLY 1000kgs!!!!!! :cool: ... i mean, they're probably gonna fall short of that, make it 1100kg, but still, i mean COME ON... that's AWESOME!! :D
on top of that, the engine WILL be beefier (somehow, yeah, probably the fat 2 rotor)...

the chassis, now 10" shorter by wheelbase, is stronger again in every dimension by a lot... slightly altered RX-8 suspension for 0.5"-1.5" lower ride height and a stiffer suspension to match, the same binders in a car 500-600lbs lighter... you're looking at one seriously (as Herc put it) bad ass car...

another legend will (must?) be born with the next RX-7, supposing it would come out. these are numbers and ideas which certainly add up to a more-than-worthy sucsessor to the FD...

btw neophreak, :D i wouldn't care if the product is of a lower quality... that just means i get to spend time making it high quality again ;)
ideally, i'd just want an okay rolling chassis, beat up interior (i don't care so much about the interior), scratched up paint (again, i don't care as long as the rust ain't too bad), get the motor rebuilt nice, do work on the car myself (i'm not too un-handy)... it wouldn't be much, but it'd be mine... a small peice of the story, a little rotary history. :)

Originally posted by wakeech


I"M NOT KIDDING OR SPECULATING WHEN I SAY THE RX-7 TARGET MASS IS ONLY 1000kgs

another legend will (must?) be born with the next RX-7, supposing it would come out. these are numbers and ideas which certainly add up to a more-than-worthy sucsessor to the FD...


You know I have to smile everytime I think of that :o

Originally posted by wakeech


I"M NOT KIDDING OR SPECULATING WHEN I SAY THE RX-7 TARGET MASS IS ONLY 1000kgs!!!!!! :cool: ... i mean, they're probably gonna fall short of that, make it 1100kg, but still, i mean COME ON... that's AWESOME!! :D
on top of that, the engine WILL be beefier (somehow, yeah, probably the fat 2 rotor)...

the chassis, now 10" shorter by wheelbase, is stronger again in every dimension by a lot... slightly altered RX-8 suspension for 0.5"-1.5" lower ride height and a stiffer suspension to match, the same binders in a car 500-600lbs lighter... you're looking at one seriously (as Herc put it) bad ass car...

I hope you are correct but highly doubt it. How can Mazda take a shortened RX-8 chassis, add a larger engine and reduce the weight by 500-700 lbs? Slicing 12" out of the chassis, removing the rear seat and rear doors will maybe drop 200 lbs. I can't see Mazda using more aluminum because then there would be little component sharing between the 8 & 7.

Are you getting the 1000 kg target mixed up with the next Miata? I do know, that 1000 kg, or thereabouts, is the target for the Miata.

Ahh, I will still take a new 7 that is 100 lbs lighter than the old one and has more power, more reliability and maybe lower cost.

who's to say that the next RX-7 and Miata will be HIGHLY reliant on one shared design??
i mean, they're both (supposedly) going to be based on the RX-8 chassis, and could both still have radically different body work, engines, but with similar trannies, suspensions, brakes... just think about cost savings, eh?? one's the convertible with the small 4banger, the other's the light weight, very powerful rotary coupe... radically different in appearance, and even some chassis differences (ie, longer front section, a hatched back, and traditional flip up lights for the sexy lines of the 7)... you see what i'm saying??

a 1000kg TARGET is just that, a target...
but i'm sure that Mazda could make it 600lbs lighter than the RX-8 if they really tried.

a few things... the wider rotor'ed engine would add something like 15lbs to the mass of the engine... no big deal.
also, there are no rear doors, less underbody bracing, and fewer (very heavy) crash beams... combine that with the 10-12" chop in the wheelbase, and the elimination of the rear seats built into the chassis, (hopefully) lots less in the way of sound deadening material, with further expensive-but-lighter bits everywhere... it could be done, certainly.

I don't know if they'd make the Miata and the RX7 convertible and coupe versions of the same model. Miatas have always been about affordibility, balance and fun. The RX7 was more of an all-out sports car.

RX7s were usually around 170 inches in length (the RX8 is ~174 in. for comparison) with wheelbases of around 95 inches (the RX8's is about 106 inches). Miatas on the otherhand are aroud 155 inches in length and have a wheelbase of around 89 inches. Dimensionally, the models have been quite different in the past.

Perhaps they will change that since there would be less of an incentive to build a 2X2 model off the RX7 platform (RX8 now exists) as was done in the past? Personally, I'd like to see an RX7 with dimensions similar to past models.

I think a 2600 lb. RX7 (using a Renesis with larger rotors) with these dimensions would be possible.

Originally posted by revhappy
I don't know if they'd make the Miata and the RX7 convertible and coupe versions of the same model. Miatas have always been about affordibility, balance and fun. The RX7 was more of an all-out sports car.

as i said before, they wouldn't be like the SAME same, just extremely similar, with very different body work, sharing only the very basic design elements of the chassis, with the suspension bits, steering, and powertrain components (well, maybe a few wimpier+lighter bits for the Miata).


Originally posted by revhappy
RX7s were usually around 170 inches in length (the RX8 is ~174 in. for comparison) with wheelbases of around 95 inches (the RX8's is about 106 inches). Miatas on the otherhand are aroud 155 inches in length and have a wheelbase of around 89 inches. Dimensionally, the models have been quite different in the past.Perhaps they will change that since there would be less of an incentive to build a 2X2 model off the RX7 platform (RX8 now exists) as was done in the past?

that's true, but given the packaging of the RX-8 (supposing they don't modify the profile of the cabin for the RX-7... which they could do and i'd still love it) they could certainly make a much smaller new RX-7: that difference of 6" in the wheelbase could more than made up in the consessions all past RX-7's had with the 2+2 design (even if we only saw the 2+2 layout in the FC's here in NA)... i think that yeah, that's a really good bet that they wouldn't continue to make that comprimize... so maybe we'll see a shorter RX-7 in the future... it seems very possible.

as long as the package stays the same, with similar proportions (the huuuge front end of the FD needn't be kept... the FC's nose looks fine to me) with a well defined roofline, a raked backside with the traditional wrap-around glass, the hatch, and a nice ass... whoa, i don't think anyone would complain about how it's a bit smaller, as it'd be a LOT faster.

Originally posted by wakeech


as i said before, they wouldn't be like the SAME same, just extremely similar, with very different body work, sharing only the very basic design elements of the chassis, with the suspension bits, steering, and powertrain components (well, maybe a few wimpier+lighter bits for the Miata).




that's true, but given the packaging of the RX-8 (supposing they don't modify the profile of the cabin for the RX-7... which they could do and i'd still love it) they could certainly make a much smaller new RX-7: that difference of 6" in the wheelbase could more than made up in the consessions all past RX-7's had with the 2+2 design (even if we only saw the 2+2 layout in the FC's here in NA)... i think that yeah, that's a really good bet that they wouldn't continue to make that comprimize... so maybe we'll see a shorter RX-7 in the future... it seems very possible.

as long as the package stays the same, with similar proportions (the huuuge front end of the FD needn't be kept... the FC's nose looks fine to me) with a well defined roofline, a raked backside with the traditional wrap-around glass, the hatch, and a nice ass... whoa, i don't think anyone would complain about how it's a bit smaller, as it'd be a LOT faster.

I have no doubt they could build both off the same platform, but I'm not sure if they actually would. Certainly, you would get the most performance out of a miata sized RX7. However, from a marketing point of view, some might consider it a mistake to have an affordable, fun ("girly" - not my words or belief, but a lot of misguided folk have said it) car essentially be the low-powered counterpart of the company's balls to the wall, all out sports car. I guess it would depend on Joe Blow knowing if his RX7 was a more potent version of the miata.

Then you have the bigger is better theory, at least here in the US, where tiny cars aren't considered too manly. Most supercars (at least in the recent past) have not had the tiny roadster dimensions probobly because they required larger engines, but maybe a part is due a bit to the bigger is better mentality. Frankly, I believe this thinking is ridiculous and try to take the smallest car I can live with.

That said, I would think they'd build something dimensionally similar to the 3rd generation. Anyhow, its all wild specualtion so we can only guess. From my perspective, my practicality and performance needs intersect at something dimensionally similar to the FC (with or w/o back seats). Thus, the RX8 is bit too big and roadster sized cars are a bit too small...decisons..decisions...:o Still, any RX7 would be near the top of my shopping list! :D

Have I ever mentioned that I'm planning on putting a RENESIS in a 1500 lb car?:D :D My friends are already calling it the Rotus......

Anyway, I'm in Wakeech and Herc's boat.:)

:D yeah, it is mostly speculation... but the 1000kg and +300hp are really really real... and extremely possible... *shiver down spine*

anyhoo, i think Mazda would probably change the bodies of the car enough, especially the roofline, not to mention the wheel arches, headlights, hood shape/size/contours, side panels, front (nose), back, trunk area, and underside(?) so that only those very very in the know would really be able to tell... and suppose someone said "oh the RX-7 is just a hard top Miata", i'd say "no, the Miata is a dressed down, piston powered, convertible, cheaper version of one of the world's greatest near exotics :p"

hee hee hee... :)

Originally posted by Hercules
Even though BMW doesn't sell a lot of M3s/M5s, their reputation stems from making some of the best performance machines out there today.

Looking at the worldwide picture though, I dunno about that, in Europe for example BMW and Merc's reputation is more in the "executive" end of the market, with plenty of power, sure, but it's luxury and status - whatever that is - that most buyers are after. They're a popular "boss" car, something like a Rolls for small-timers. The M3 is more of a boy-racer car here, rich boy-racers for sure, but boy-racers nonetheless. And the M5 is almost invisible, it doesn't really fit in anywhere.

BTW. doesn't Lexus outsell Merc and BMW put together in the US? They still aren't even close in Europe AFAIK, they haven't got the hang of European styling.

Originally posted by CypherNinja
My friends are already calling it the Rotus......


...they don't happen to be "engrish" speakers, do they?? ;) ahahaha... jk.
but, think about it... blending Japanese and English technology, with Japanese and English pronuciation... an oriental flower, with an engine concept designed in germany... ahahaha... what a blend. :)

I dont think mazda should come out with the RX7 anymore cuz it's only going to effect the sales of RX8 and we RX8 owners might not want to c that happen cuz there isn't going to be much fun with another rotary running around the block:(

I disagree; there is plenty of room for another rotary on the block. The RX-7 and the RX-8 are different enough that they appeal to, two different markets. But the RX-8 has to be successful before you'll ever see another RX-7 in the states.