Does anyone have recommendations for a good radar detector? I don't want to spend much more than $150 bucks, however I don't want to buy anything that is useless either.

Of course I never plan to exceed the posted speed limits in my new rx-8:p

Typically the only good radar detector that you can buy cheap over the internet is the Bel line.

Passport and of coarse Valentine One are great detectors as well but they are tough to get a really good deal on.

Bel and Passport are owned by the same company and thus benefit from each others reasearch. Mr. Valentine used to work for Passport before creating his own company.

Personally those are the only three brands of radar detection I would buy. Cobra, Uniden, Whistler etc. will all work but not as well.

-Mr. Wigggles

The V1 is by far the best detector out there. I had a Passport in my FC and a V1 in my FD a couple of years ago. The V1 was far more sensitive, with False Alerts coming from automatic doors... But the V1 saved my butt many times on drives from Vegas to Reno, to LA, bay area, etc... So much so that I sold the Passport and got another V1 for my FC. (I sold the FC with the V1)

Expect to pay an assload for the V1, however. They aren't cheap. But you sure get what you pay for. Plus free upgrades for life.

Thanks for the great suggestions. How much does the V1 typically cost?

Originally posted by tank
Does anyone have recommendations for a good radar detector? I don't want to spend much more than $150 bucks, however I don't want to buy anything that is useless either... Unless you can find a good one used, you really aren't going to find a good radar detector for $150 and below. Manufacturers have to skimp on performance to get below that price.

One way of skimping that occurs is that they limit the Ka band. You see, unlike X and K band (which is a single frequency band), Ka covers a wide range of frequencies. A good portion of common Ka radar units use one or two frequencies. So, one way that cheaper radar detectors skimp is that instead of covering the whole Ka band, they only cover one or two frequencies, and are completely incapable of detecting many of the Ka radar units out there (especially the high-end ones like the "Stalker", which you need to detect the most).

But that's just one way, and that's why there aren't any "good" radar detectors for under $150 new.

---jps

Originally posted by rotarynews.com
...Expect to pay an assload for the V1, however. They aren't cheap. But you sure get what you pay for. Plus free upgrades for life. They aren't "free" upgrades. You have to pay a little to get an updated unit. The last time I checked into "trading in" my '97 unit for the latest and greatest, it cost in the ballpark of $150.

---jps

I think the V1 is about $400 new. Correct me if I am wrong.

$400 and worth every penny.

I love mine.

I'm new to this concept (current car too slow to need the warning ;) ) , can anyone tell me where in the RX-8 I would mount the detector and how it is powered? It would be a shame to change the aesthetics of the fine interior by supergluing a non factory device to the dash...

theres only 2 radar detectors that are worth getting. anything else isnt worth getting

the passport 8500(what i have) and the valentine 1

the passport costs 300 and the v1 costs 400

on virtually every car forum, there are neverending debates about which one is better, some say the v1, some say their equal, some say the passport is better. u cant go wrong with either, so just get the passport and save a hundred bucks.

Originally posted by tribal azn
theres only 2 radar detectors that are worth getting. anything else isnt worth getting

the passport 8500(what i have) and the valentine 1I also have a Passport 8500, and I'm very happy with it. The 7500 I had before it, was a POS.

Everyone who has driven with a V1 raves about the directional arrows...I'd love to try one for a while to see just how much they add to the overall experience and usefullness.

Based off your suggestions and after doing a little research on my own, looks like I'm going to need to get the crowbar out and pry my wallet open a little more:(

I think the V1 looks to be about the best in terms of giving maximum information on possible threats. I guess I'll simply justify it to the goverment(my wife) as an insurance policy :p

LOL!
________
YAMAHA SR500 (http://www.yamaha-tech.com/wiki/Yamaha_SR500)

I have a Snooper S5-R that I bought at the birmingham motor show. It is very good especially with laser speed traps. That was about £240. If you really want to get the best the new Snooper S6-R is what you want. It is a GPS detector as well as a standard detector so the non radar emitting system can be deceted also. But a £600 its a bit pricey.

Originally posted by tank
Based off your suggestions and after doing a little research on my own, looks like I'm going to need to get the crowbar out and pry my wallet open a little more:(

I think the V1 looks to be about the best in terms of giving maximum information on possible threats. I guess I'll simply justify it to the goverment(my wife) as an insurance policy :p

You can get the top of the line BEL 985 for a pinch over $200

http://shopping.yahoo.com/shop?d=zerl&id=1990873625&clink=dmks.4.1/bel_985/ctx=mid:6,pid:1990873625,pdid:6,t:3,ht:1,loc:,pos: 0,spc:14489115,date:20030310,srch:kw,x:0&cf=9&__yltc=s:14489115,d:23501379,test:4,src:srch,nc:,w :cat-cp,v:1,did:,stid:yahooelectronicsshopping,mid:6,pi d:1990873625,p:205.00,pf:,pt:,k:bel+985,q:,x:0,pos :0,ppos:0

I think you'll be happy with it. I don't have this model but my current Bel is serving me well.

I think the Bel is the best value on the market and should preform very well against the Passport 8500.

http://www.radartest.com/article.asp?articleid=1064

-Mr. Wigggles

one of the best sites out there for detector comparisons...
radartest.com (http://www.radartest.com)

btw, b/c of the physics of light, the arrows mean jack if the signal is from the left or right other than just letting you know where the signal is coming from since even if your doin 200mph, your lateral radar profile will be 0mph, think about it and it makes sense. Also keep in mind that radar signals are reflected off EVERYTHING; so a stay beam could actually trick the arrows.

I have the passport 8500 and it is the shit. Two reasons I went with the passport over the Valentine1 (V1):

1) $$$$ of course

2) aestetics, the profile of the 8500 looks cooler than the V1 w/o loosing any functionality. Not to mention the V1 is also the biggest detector out there and obstructs more of the road.

Other reasons are listed on the site mentioned above. A summary of these is:

V1 disadvantages: poor Ka band detection distance (23000ft where the passport detects at 40000ft). Since Ka is the hardest to detect and becoming the frequency of choice b/c of its very lower power output and high accuracy, this makes the V1 a poor choice for the 21st century. Passport can also pick up up to 8 simultaneous signals and the strength of each, V1 only shows that there are multiple signals.
V1 advantages: all that I can find is that it did detect the lazer signal more readily than any other detector. However, keep in mind that b/c of the extremely narrow beam from the lazer (about 18 inches at 1000 feet), unless the cop coughs and the beam grazes the detector, NO DETECTOR on the market will pick it up.

Passport 8500 and most of the 900 series Bel are fantastic, only difference for the most part is that the Bel's will talk to you.

Moral of the story. $150 will buy you assurance only, there is no way it will get you a detector that will save your ass. If you cant afford a Passport, Bel, or the V1, don't buy one till you can. All others are crap.

I don't know who runs radartest.com and I don't think it matters.

Car and Driver did a test of all the detectors and the V1 came out number one. I'll take their word for it.

Originally posted by Hercules
I don't know who runs radartest.com and I don't think it matters.

Car and Driver did a test of all the detectors and the V1 came out number one. I'll take their word for it.

that's a somewhat ignorant approach to information.

I am not in the business of cracking on one radar detector over another. i bought one over the other. i don't sell either of them so I have no reason to recommend one over the other except for what i have read on the web. I looked at every piece of info I could get my hands on and picked the one i thought was better IMO.

Car and Driver is a respectable company, as is Consumer Reports, and soooo many others. That said, any one of them can and do suffer certain biases. i never take any one persons opinion to make a blind buying decision, especially not when im throwing down 300 bux. i would never expect anyone to make such an uninformed decision about anything for that matter.

Take to POS kia sephia. Im willing to bet my life that a few, very credible companies rated it an awesome, but it ended up being a shitty lemon. Im not trying to start a flame war hear, just provide the information for other people to choose what's right for them.

Consumersearch.com (http://www.consumersearch.com/www/automotive/radar_detectors/fullstory.html) has some interesting points re the various testing sites.

First-hand comparison at Epinions.com (http://www.epinions.com/content_57994743428)

Review commentary at Epinions (http://www.epinions.com/content_7305399940)

Finally, Mike Valentine's comments (http://www.valentineone.com/lab/V1Hater.asp) on Mike Peterson of radartests.com

Originally posted by Farsyde

2) aestetics, the profile of the 8500 looks cooler than the V1 w/o loosing any functionality.

speaking of ignorance and relevance...
who cares what it looks like.

Eccles- thanks for the links, they are very informative. Now I'm back on the fence betweeen the V1 and the Passport 8500:confused:

Originally posted by Hercules
I don't know who runs radartest.com and I don't think it matters.

Car and Driver did a test of all the detectors and the V1 came out number one. I'll take their word for it.

From what I have read on the Internet, several different sources warn about www.radartest.com not being objective.

Originally posted by tank
Eccles- thanks for the links, they are very informative. Now I'm back on the fence betweeen the V1 and the Passport 8500:confused: Only reason I say to get the V1 is due to upgradability.

If there is a new firmware you can send yours out, and for $30 it's upgraded. If they change it entirely, you send it out and for ~$150 you get a new unit. Repair service is also reasonable after warranty.

That's why I'd suggest getting the V1. It's infinitely upgradeable and if the Passport gets outdated... you're screwed. The V1 you will pay a bit, but not as much as it costs to buy either. That, and the construction quality is really superb. Specially after they switched to magnesium casings.

How frequently have you upgraded yours? If the price difference is $100 up front, I would have to get an upgrade 3 times $30*3 +Shipping) to make up the difference between the 8500 and V1. If they completely redesign the unit and I need to pay for the upgrade it's then a $250 difference, without taking into account any upgrades I had purchased in the interim. At that point wouldn't I be better off buying the latest and greatest radar detector on the market?

Please don't get me wrong, I greatly appreciate your thoughts. I am simply trying to makes sense of the economics of it :)

Originally posted by pmacwill


speaking of ignorance and relevance...
who cares what it looks like.

ignorance, what are you talking about. Didnt pick it for this reason only. Secondly, relevance; your damn right looks matter. Don't tell me you would still buy the RX-8 if it looked like a eurovan.

The passport is upgradeable but i can't find any information on price, specifics. Anyhow the V1 is about 12 years old. In the X, and K band its the top of it's game, but it needs to be upgraded. If they can get my computer to go 30 times faster on the same size chip, they can shrink the V1.

the only 'problem' with V1 is that there is no discount (except maybe Ebay) on them. Anyone ever had theirs reconditioned? Mine seems to have lost some of it's distance ability...

Originally posted by tank
How frequently have you upgraded yours? If the price difference is $100 up front, I would have to get an upgrade 3 times $30*3 +Shipping) to make up the difference between the 8500 and V1. If they completely redesign the unit and I need to pay for the upgrade it's then a $250 difference, without taking into account any upgrades I had purchased in the interim. At that point wouldn't I be better off buying the latest and greatest radar detector on the market?

Please don't get me wrong, I greatly appreciate your thoughts. I am simply trying to makes sense of the economics of it :) Since I bought mine in '97, other than a couple of cosmetic changes and firmware updates (which are tweaks more than anything, so I didn't bother), there has been one signficant upgrade. In the same time, there have been a couple of top-of-the-line Escort models that have come out, so the Escort route would be more expensive.

For those of you looking to get rock-bottom prices on Escort models (or any electronic equipment), make sure that you are buying from an authorized dealer. Most of the time, those Ebay bandits are not authorized dealers, and therefore, Escort will not honor the warranty.

---jps

very informative thread so far...

my question for u guys is do u recommend any of the front/rear bumper mounted radar detectors? if so...which ones? if not...why not?

i've never owned a radar detector but whenever i've considered it i've leaned toward the front/rear installed types simply because i don't want a bulky (albeit nice looking ;)) device stuck to the inside of my windshield all the time.

which leads to a final question i guess...is it neccessary to mount radar detectors like the passort and V1 on your windshield or are there more inconspicuous (read: aesthetically pleasing) installation alternatives?

i have yet to read any positive advantage that external (bumper) mounted detectors have over windshield mounted ones that justifies their price. I know passport makes the K40 which is remote. i know nothing about it though, sorry.

Also, always mount the detector centered on your windshield. The closer you mount it to the dash the more you place the dettector in a possible radar shadow and decrease the RADAR effective detectablility, unless you have a vette or some other very low profile car. The closer you mount toward the roof the larger (and i mean larger) chance you are likely to NOT detect a lazer signal.

Originally posted by Farsyde
Also, always mount the detector centered on your windshield....

thnx for the info farsyde. i'll take your advice into consideration if i decide to go the windshield mounted route. which i'll end up doing if bumper mounted detectors: a) are noticeably less effective and/or b) their prices don't justify my aesthetic goals. (ie...paying $100 more for the same tech. just to keep it off my windshield.)

anybody else have any thoughts on bumper mounted radar detectors?

K40 did horrible at radartest.com. They weren't impressed at all.

-Mr. Wigggles

it might have already been said.. but liek Mike Valentine says "once you live with the arrows, you never go back"

Originally posted by ELX13
...anybody else have any thoughts on bumper mounted radar detectors? Don't forget to give people a chance to reply.

There are remote radar detectors (those that are mounted on the "bumpers") that are pretty effective. An advantage is obviously a stealth install (which is convenient, and keeps it out of the view of both thieves and police).

As far as the "arrows", I've found them to be a very effective tool, which is hard to replace. Depending on the seup, having two antennaes on the remote setup can be close to the Valentine setup, but is not a replacement.

The one thing you have to consider between a windshield mounted radar detector and a grille mounted detector is reception. With an open road in front of you, the higher mounted detector will have a slight advantage in over-the-hill situations. If you have a similarly sized vehicle in front of you, some radar will normally pass through the windshield of the vehicle in front, and a windshield mounted detector has a better chance of detecting it(but things like metallic tint, bodies, etc. will hurt that). If you are in an RX8 behind an SUV, then the windshield mounted detector will be completely blocked by the SUV body, but radar will pass under the vehicle, and a grille mounted detector will have a chance at it.

So basically, it's a "wash" as far as reception. I've had a couple of remote detectors, and I always consider such a setup first. It's worth the extra cost to me, personally.

Without going into it, a windshield mounted laser detector is useless, and a license plate mounted version isn't much better (unless you combine it with a laser jammer, which is illegal in more and more locations).

---jps

i just need the radar detection of an F-18 and the ability to fire something back at the cops!!! :D

Maybe i'll look into an oil slick system so when the cops get nice and close, whaaaam!!!!

Originally posted by Farsyde
i just need the radar detection of an F-18 and the ability to fire something back at the cops!!! :D

Maybe i'll look into an oil slick system so when the cops get nice and close, whaaaam!!!! Reminds me of the nintendo game Spy Hunter :)

Originally posted by Sputnik
Don't forget to give people a chance to reply....
will do and i'm glad u did reply...your insight was definitely helpful.

as long as remote detectors are on par with windshield mounted ones when it comes to reliability/features it looks like i'll be going with one of them.

Originally posted by Hercules
Reminds me of the nintendo game Spy Hunter :) Yeah, but I don't think the RX-8 will turn into a boat when you drive off the end of a pier, nor do I recommend testing that hypothesis!

Originally posted by Hercules
Only reason I say to get the V1 is due to upgradability.

If there is a new firmware you can send yours out, and for $30 it's upgraded. If they change it entirely, you send it out and for ~$150 you get a new unit. Repair service is also reasonable after warranty.

That's why I'd suggest getting the V1. It's infinitely upgradeable and if the Passport gets outdated... you're screwed. The V1 you will pay a bit, but not as much as it costs to buy either. That, and the construction quality is really superb. Specially after they switched to magnesium casings.


Very excellent point :) going to the store to buy a V1

Originally posted by Hercules
Only reason I say to get the V1 is due to upgradability.

If there is a new firmware you can send yours out, and for $30 it's upgraded. If they change it entirely, you send it out and for ~$150 you get a new unit. Repair service is also reasonable after warranty.

That's why I'd suggest getting the V1. It's infinitely upgradeable and if the Passport gets outdated... you're screwed. The V1 you will pay a bit, but not as much as it costs to buy either. That, and the construction quality is really superb. Specially after they switched to magnesium casings.


Very excellent point :) going to the store to buy a V1

Originally posted by pr0xy
going to the store to buy a V1 Hey, wait, you can't buy them in stores!

Oh well, he'll be back in a while.

Originally posted by DrKillJoY
it might have already been said.. but liek Mike Valentine says "once you live with the arrows, you never go back"

This page of marketing from the V1 site is 100% true. . . https://store.valentine1.com/demo/demo3.asp

Once you learn to read the V1, and learn the area you drive in's radar signature, you will be thankful for the V1's Aarows.

Most Walgreen's automatic doors are now K band... which drove me nuts for a while, since there is one on the major cross streets where I live. I figured out it was the pharmacy when I pulled up to park and the V1 pointed straigt to the door... a few weeks after I discovered this, the V1 beeped the normal K warning pointed to Walgreens, then it also pointed ahead to a pair of bike cops.

So, my orig statement about free upgrades was true, if you have them done within a year of purchase... which I did.. I don't think I could get an upgrade free now...

Not at any stores or via any of those discount places by phone or online or mail. Anyway - mine is about 5 years old +/- ; the V1 website says he doesn't recommend upgrading mine - but - for $229 I basically get an 'instant upgrade' which looks like a replacement of my unit. I think the amazing thing is that they still cost exactly $400 ( or is it 399?). At any rate, the bogey counter can make a huge difference when in an area with a lot of misc. activitiy - usually store doors. Or the Cincinnati airport - my laser warning always went off driving past there...

Originally posted by rx8daniel
At any rate, the bogey counter can make a huge difference when in an area with a lot of misc. activitiyJust wanted to point out that the Escort 8500 also has an advanced display mode which shows the number and strength of multiple bogeys on multiple bands. I agree it's a great thing to have - only last week I got an alert as I passed the local Eckerd (which always triggers a K-band alert), but I noticed that the display showed two signals, and sure enough, there was Officer Donut a little further down the street.

Originally posted by rx8daniel
Or the Cincinnati airport - my laser warning always went off driving past there...

in front of the airport???? I can't think of anything that runs on the 904nm wavelength other than police speed detection devices. Either a cop was using lazer on you, you encountered a stray beam, or it's a false alarm. I'll have to check the FCC frequency allocations to see if anything elese sharesd the laser band.

I've had my cheapo Uniden detector set off in lazer mode when I pass the Louisville airport, which is right next to I-65.

This has happened several times there as I travel that route.

New Chevy TrailBlazers's 3rd break lights trigger my V1's Laser Detector. Damn them! I wonder if there is a fix from Val. for this?

Edit: Never mind, says right here on their site http://valentine1.com/lab/Previously7.asp

Red neon is occasionally used for the CHMSL (Center High Mounted Stop Lamp) on new cars. We know of these models: GM Trailblazer and Envoy, the Lincoln Mk VIII and the latest BMW 3-series convertible.

Originally posted by rotarynews.com
CHMSL (Center High Mounted Stop Lamp)

i thought it was HCMD (High Center Mounted Display)? or am i using an old term?

Perhaps someone near Cincy can try it out sometime - On I-70 - near the airport's control tower,I think it was, in the exact same spot every time, it'd go off about every 4 - 8 seconds, but only a 2 - 3 times as I remember it. I have no clue about frequencies and so forth, but it'd go crazy for about 1 second then nothing until the next short blast!

Don't forget, folks, that there are many light sources out there that will emit light in the traffic laser frequency. White light especially covers a wide range of frequencies, including laser, and it will sometimes be just strong enough to set off a laser detector (this is why laser guns have a very difficult time getting a reading on a headlight that is on).

In other words, something doesn't have to specifically emit a certain frequency to set of a laser detector. It could be something that emits a wide range of frequencies.

---jps

Originally posted by rxeightr
I've had my cheapo Uniden detector set off in lazer mode

Happens alot with cheapo detectors



Originally posted by rotarynews.com
New Chevy TrailBlazers's 3rd break lights trigger my V1's Laser Detector


while laser systems DO use a diode to emit the 904nm pulse laser pulse, it is invisible and the diodes used in cars are visual and dont include the spectra of "laser band." Man i'd never buy a V1 if this really is true. Its by far the biggest flaw i've seen in detectors since the late X-band. Any engineers here feel free to get technical or fill me in on the details.

Originally posted by Farsyde

while laser systems DO use a diode to emit the 904nm pulse laser pulse, it is invisible and the diodes used in cars are visual and dont include the spectra of "laser band." Man i'd never buy a V1 if this really is true. Its by far the biggest flaw i've seen in detectors since the late X-band. Any engineers here feel free to get technical or fill me in on the details.

You might be able to get this kind of frequency from a hot source of something, including visible lights (such as the revolving lamps that are on top of the control towers).

I'd not let something like this keep anyone from otherwise buying a V1. I used to use it a lot, and one 400 foot stretch in one part of the country (I've used it everywhere from TX to Iowa to here lately to remember how to use it) does not detract, in my opinion, from it's purpose at all. It has 3 modes too so you can avoid most local store sensors and only get alerted to the stronger signals when in urban areas.

Originally posted by gazita123


You might be able to get this kind of frequency from a hot source of something, including visible lights (such as the revolving lamps that are on top of the control towers).

i don't see it happeneing for a spot light since the visible spectrum only covers ~ 390nm to 780nm. Unless the bulb is specifically designed to create an infrared beam, then it is highly unlikely, especially around an airport where clear communications are needed, that a stray infrared beam would be aloud for no purpose other than to interfere with important communications.

I've also driven behind every type of car (including a bad as lamborgini, although not for long :D ) and my detector has never had a false laser. I would never spend $100+ additional of my hard earned money to have a system that false detects a laser signal, by far the most important signal to read.

This could be it's own thread, but I'll open this one up for comments:
Once you get hit by laser, the detection is very nearly pointless from that moment in time.

Originally posted by Farsyde

... Man i'd never buy a V1 if this really is true. ....

The V1 is simply reporting what it "Sees"

Would you rather it be less sensitive, with the possibility of missing actual lasers, or more sensitive, and just give the bird to the lady in the trailblazer in front of you when she puts on her breakes that sets off the V1 (then she looks back at you, when you're giving her the finger, and she gets a very perplexed look on her face) ?

Originally posted by rx8daniel
This could be it's own thread, but I'll open this one up for comments:
Once you get hit by laser, the detection is very nearly pointless from that moment in time.

This is true. The capture time for laser is three-tenths of a second so instead of the detector displaying "LASER" it should just display "PULL OVER"

Originally posted by rotarynews.com
The V1 is simply reporting what it "Sees"


Also true, but there are dozens of detectors out there that "see" what isnt there. This is just as bad as a detector that misses the occasional laser, police related or not. I would rather have some trust in a working detector than false hope in a paranoid detector that false alarms b/c it isn't sure what it "sees."

Originally posted by Farsyde


i don't see it happeneing for a spot light since the visible spectrum only covers ~ 390nm to 780nm. Unless the bulb is specifically designed to create an infrared beam, then it is highly unlikely, especially around an airport where clear communications are needed, that a stray infrared beam would be aloud for no purpose other than to interfere with important communications.


The sun produces visible light, but it also produces many other frequencies, including UV and IR. IR is a frequency that is unregulated by anyone, since is is produced by anything that produces heat. That spotlight doesn't just produce visible light, it produces heat, as all visible light sources we have currently do.

A good example: I was working tech support for a commercial my company was producing for an IR controlled toy. The spotlights produced enough IR to keep the receivers blind to the control signal. We had to place an IR filter over the spots to keep them from interfering.

It is quite possible that the spotlight (which is much brighter than the ones used for the soundstages) to produce that IR frequency and in sufficient strength to give a false warning.

Finally a thread I can get my teeth into!

I have had a lot of different radars. Most are junk.
Settled on a top-of-the-line Bel. ( Not the one with the voice alert! Lord forbid....) the one just below, there are so many models for different markets, it is in the 900 series.
The #1 reason for this model is that you can selectively turn off bands, one by one. X-band is not used in my area, and 95% of my false alarms are 'x'. A detector is mostly useless if you cannot trust it's alerts. With X off my unit just sits there until it spots the real thing! Sometimes a very weak alert from some old 'Fuzzbuster' in oncoming traffic, but if the display read anything over '1' out of '10' it is definately the real thing.

( Unless I am using the ARC jammer, then all of the above goes out the window!)

Also have Blinder laserjammers between the headlight and the bumper, but have never been 'lasered' for real.

Originally posted by StealthTL
The #1 reason for this model is that you can selectively turn off bands, one by one. X-band is not used in my area, and 95% of my false alarms are 'x'.FWIW, both the Passport 8500 and the Valentine 1 offer this same functionality. I have my 8500 set to reduced X sensitivity, but not off entirely. Just the other night I got hit with X-band from a stationary cruiser, but that's the only time I've seen X-band used around here since I bought the unit over a year ago.

First, as I think it was already stated the V1 does not have "free" upgrades for life, but it isn't what I would consider a small fee either. I believe i gave either 150-250 when I upgraded mine last year. That is still cheaper than buying a new on and I only mention it for the sake of being complete.

Upgrading is definitely worth it versus buying a new one. Plus when you upgrade they don't make you send back your old unit, do something to it and send it back to you, you actually get a brand new one. Fortunately for me I live about a half hour from Valentine HQ, all I did was walk in with my old one (detector only) they took it and gave me a brand new box with the detector and all accessories. This was a very nice surprise.

As for the false lasers. My brother and I were parked head to head [3 feet btw. the cars]. He has an 2002 Acura TL, when he turned on the headlights it set off the laser sensor. And frankly I think the manufacturers who made those vehicles that trip my V1's laser should all be taken and hung by their balls from the rafters of a catholic church. There is nothing like speeding along at 85-90 down I-75 and have your V1 report a false LASER. I can't count on two hands the number of times I have almost wrecked my Miata b/c some shit brick in his crappy Trail Blazer hit his breaks in front of me.

Of course I'm not upset or anything, and I am sure I could remedy this by just not speeding, but then what would be the point in paying 400.00 for a radar detector if you're not going to speed.

Originally posted by Farsyde

The capture time for laser is three-tenths of a second so instead of the detector displaying "LASER" it should just display "PULL OVER"

...wouldn't there be a lot of reflected and refracted LASER radiation bouncing around a highway if a patrolperson was zapping every 5th or 6th car??
...i mean, there must be SOME reasoning for even including a detector on a band which would really only tell you "you've been caught" if you'd find out in the next 20-40s anyways, right??

Originally posted by quicks8
There is nothing like speeding along at 85-90 down I-75 and have your V1 report a false LASER. I can't count on two hands the number of times I have almost wrecked my Miata b/c some shit brick in his crappy Trail Blazer hit his breaks in front of me.If you nearly wreck when trying to wash off enough speed to get under the limit, then either[list=a] you're going wayyy over the limit and there's no way you're going to wash off enough in time, or
you're unable to control your car at the speeds you're travelling, and thus shouldn't be going that fast in the first place,
or both.
[/list=a]Given the truism that the cop already has your speed before you even get a chance to react to a Laser alert, I don't really see the benefit. If my 8500 falsed that often, I'd just disable the Laser detection.

Originally posted by wakeech
...wouldn't there be a lot of reflected and refracted LASER radiation bouncing around a highway if a patrolperson was zapping every 5th or 6th car?? That's the thing about laser, the amount a laser beam is reflected and refracted is sooo small, that you have better odds of seeing the trooper before the laser detector goes off. The laser beam is so narrow, and so little of it refracts, that when a front license plate is targeted at normal targeting distances (some 500-1000 ft), a windshield mounted laser detector will normally not even detect it.

---jps

Originally posted by Sputnik
That's the thing about laser, the amount a laser beam is reflected and refracted is sooo small, that you have better odds of seeing the trooper before the laser detector goes off. The laser beam is so narrow, and so little of it refracts, that when a front license plate is targeted at normal targeting distances (some 500-1000 ft), a windshield mounted laser detector will normally not even detect it.

---jps

exactly, the only way your even going to detect the lazer is if the cop has the laseron constantly and you come over a hill or around a turn and the laser sweeps over your detector. And yes, even with a beam as intense and focused there are reflections, but they are soooo rare that i have never even picked them up.

About the "$250" upgrade. That's crap. Don't get me wrong an upgrade clause on a detector is great but why not take the 250 bux, maybe spend an extra 20 bux, and get a top of the line new detector that isn't 5-10 years old. Yes i know the internals 'may' be recent but it just doesnt settle right with me

Originally posted by Farsyde
About the "$250" upgrade. That's crap. Don't get me wrong an upgrade clause on a detector is great but why not take the 250 bux, maybe spend an extra 20 bux, and get a top of the line new detector that isn't 5-10 years old. Yes i know the internals 'may' be recent but it just doesnt settle right with me That's the thing, unless the "upgrade" is merely a software upgrade (in which case it will NOT cost $250), you will get a completely new detector, not just internals. Read quicks8's post again.

---jps

Originally posted by Sputnik
That's the thing, unless the "upgrade" is merely a software upgrade (in which case it will NOT cost $250), you will get a completely new detector, not just internals. Read quicks8's post again.

---jps

Somewhat true. But remember that these detectors are designed by engineers (and sometimes also embedded software designers). I doubt that $250 could ever buy just software, but the software design is usually the most expensive design process of any system. Radar has simply not changed in 50 years and neither has the means to detect it. Only the systems have become "smarter" for lack of a better word. Things like DSP are designed by people (a lot of people) and they most definately get paid crazy amounts of money. Lets say a team of 20 engineers and embedded designers make up the V1, Escort, whatever team. At a national average of $74k a year thats $1.4 million before anything is done. Radar detectors are simply loosing the race since laser has come to the market, and something will eventually replace lazer that is better. $400 to throw out for a detector that doesnt have any real advantage over current technology just seems pointless. Add to that the $250 upgrade cost and your up to $650 of which will only get you maybe 5 more years of confident driving. Don't get me wrong, i swear by my detector but i won't be giving up anymore money untill there is a solid advantage again. Sorry bout all that but its late and i've been up 3 nights studying for tests

going back to the kia.....

ill have you know that my moms sephia went 205k miles, and she hardly ever even changed the oil lol
________
HOW TO USE A WHIP VAPORIZER (http://vaporizers.net)

wow, just looked at that snooper s6-r, that thing is incredible, and for 700+bucks, it better be lol. even detects cameras and other stationary forms of speedtrapping
________
Herbal store (http://herbalhealthshop.com)

From all that I've read, it doesn't even seem reasonable to get a radar detector because the chances of actually detecting a radar does not warrant the actual cost of buying one? Is that right?

No, no...that's just laser. Decent radar detectors work quite well, its those damn lasers that people are complaining about.

If you're going to get one you need to get a good one however, unless you're only worried about highway driving. Years ago I bought a Maxon POS and it falsed so much around town my average speed was probably 10 mph less than when I just turned the damned thing off. So, I guess it did work in that it prevented me from getting a ticket...but only because it falsed me into constant paranoia.

jds

Originally posted by JaChTsai
From all that I've read, it doesn't even seem reasonable to get a radar detector because the chances of actually detecting a radar does not warrant the actual cost of buying one? Is that right?

It sounds to me like you should be thinking of a more comprehensive system like the one sold by Valantine. You can have a built in radar and lazer jammer. It will work to let you know that someone is trying to get you and at the same time give them an error message on their read out. My experience has been that unless you are going at some gawd awful I am in a hurry to hell rate of speed most police units relying on this form of detection won't waste their time pulling you over. Especially if they get a reading on the poor bastard behind you :D .

Valentine One for over 5 years!!!.....just ordered my second one for my other car.....I have had and tried them all.......Valentine rules!

DG

That is the brand going in my car when I save up enough. I want laser jammers and all.

keep in mind radar and lazer jammers are illegal in almost every state. Also, the valentine (along with almost any other "jammer") doesnt jam the signal as is advertized. They use what is called "passive jamming" in which the original radar/lazer signal is NOT changed. However, a "chirp" (or other buzz word) is sent back along the same band thus making it more difficult for the gun to read your speed. Keep in mind this is an extremely false sense of security. Let me tell you why. Every gun maker has switched over to DSP (digital signal processing) This really only needs to be used for radar due to doppler shifts. Anyhow, DSP allows the gun to scrutinized every signal received by the gun on the same band and filter all signals that cannot be represented by a reflection of the original beam off you car (hence the "chirp" is ignored) This is not to say that the "jammers" don't ever work. On older radar guns they may shorten the distance the cop has to lock onto your car, but they will lock onto your car far away (because the jammers arent high powered enough to send a signal over long distances) or possible close up, due to the opposite. I'm going to say this for the last time though, Lazer jammers (same principles as passive radar jammers) will not work, almost ever! Period. Laser guns record your speed by taking thousands of distance measurements per second. In instant on mode laser guns can detect your speed in 4 thousandths of a second. Given the calculation speed of detectors, the cop will prolly have your speed before you even hear your detector. The only silver lining here is that lazer guns cost 5-10 times the amount of radar guns, and thus most depts. will opt for 10 very advanced radar guns over 1 laser. Be warned, any reasonably sized city will have sherrifs or highway patrol using laser. Be warned. Untill there is a major improvement in detection technology (and there hasnt been in a good 5 years) just get a good detector. the 8500 and Valentine are both great, so pick one based on the vanity features and you'll be fine.

The instant on feature, otherwise known as VG-2, has been defeated by most advanced radar and laser detectors. I had a VG-2 guard system on my last detector (which was stolen out of my car) and I had it go off several times in the Portland Metro area, from Olympia to Seattle, and in the So. California region. Most of the time I would find the officer parked on the side of the road a little bit up the highway. Never was pulled over and I used to speeeed let me tell you. I did get nailed just getting into Olympia once by aircraft. No hiding from them spotters. The VG-2 guard works by detecting the VG-2 signal and shutting down the radar detector instantly while yelling and screaming and flashing at you. Mine even had an LCD screen that saidn VG-2 WARNING!!! That was your cue to slow the hell down.

On a side note many jurisdictions are disallowing the use of VG-2 or "instant on" radar detection units because of the lack of accuracy in the readings. Apparently that is not enough time to get a real accurate speed rating about 35% of the time as I understand it but you might want to check that info out before you start quoting it too much.

Originally posted by rxeightr
I've had my cheapo Uniden detector set off in lazer mode when I pass the Louisville airport, which is right next to I-65.

This has happened several times there as I travel that route.

WOW what a coincidence I drive past the louisville airport daily and my cheap Uniden goes off with laser detection.

I believe it is the Radar Pulse from the GPN-20. I was a radar technician for the airforce for a few years and our radar AN/TPS-75 would do the same thing. When your cranking out 3 million watts radiation detectors kinda overload :D

Originally posted by 93rdcurrent
The instant on feature, otherwise known as VG-2, has been defeated by most advanced radar and laser detectors. I had a VG-2 guard system on my last detector (which was stolen out of my car) and I had it go off several times in the Portland Metro area, from Olympia to Seattle, and in the So. California region. Most of the time I would find the officer parked on the side of the road a little bit up the highway. Never was pulled over and I used to speeeed let me tell you. I did get nailed just getting into Olympia once by aircraft. No hiding from them spotters. The VG-2 guard works by detecting the VG-2 signal and shutting down the radar detector instantly while yelling and screaming and flashing at you. Mine even had an LCD screen that saidn VG-2 WARNING!!! That was your cue to slow the hell down.

On a side note many jurisdictions are disallowing the use of VG-2 or "instant on" radar detection units because of the lack of accuracy in the readings. Apparently that is not enough time to get a real accurate speed rating about 35% of the time as I understand it but you might want to check that info out before you start quoting it too much.

No, no, no. Oh yeah, no. VG-2 is NOT instant on detection. "Instant on" is a mode that allows the radar gun to be turned off [or in a low power mode] so detectors can't pick up a signal therefore alerting you to radar ahead. Then the cop will turn it on and get an almost "instant" reading. There is definately a larger error factor with instant on as opposed to continuously on. VG-2 is what cops use to find out if you are using a radar detector. As all electrical device seap an electric field, so do radar detectors. Most detectors seap a field on a very narrow band that VG-2 detector-detectors can read. Only a few states have banned radar detectors. For sure, DC [the capitol], and virginia have banned them. Check your state laws reguarding detector laws. The feature that turns of your detector is useless outside of these states b/c your detector will shut down thereby making you vulnerable to any signal.

Originally posted by Farsyde
keep in mind radar and lazer jammers are illegal in almost every state. Also, the valentine (along with almost any other "jammer") doesnt jam the signal as is advertized...

Valentine does NOT claim that their unit is a laser jammer. It is only a laser/radar detector, and it performs as advertised.

Passive radar jammers have NEVER worked in an independent test. Most of the companies that make them change names every so often to dodge all of the lawsuits for false advertising.

Active radar jammers are illegal in [EVERY state. In fact, it's a FEDERAL FELONY, with the possibility of some huge fines (up to $100k). This is because it falls under an FCC regulation, which covers radio piracy among other things (henceforth the heinous fine amounts, so I doubt that the maximum will be applied to a speeder with a traffic radar jammer). Your heterodyne radar detector is not strong enough to be regulated, but traffic radar is, so police units do have to get a license to use their radar guns.

Laser jammers are not only illegal in some states, but are also illegal in some counties/cities/municipalities. That means that while a state might not have any laws against them, a town might. In an extreme situation, some podunk town could make them illegal, and your equipment could be confiscated on the spot.

Also be careful of the states where they are illegal. For example, in Virginia, it's not only illegal to use them, but it is also illegal to have them accessible in the car. You have to put it in the trunk, or packed away very very deeply in your luggage.

A "Heterodyne" detector (of which all commercial radar detectors are nowadays) will transmit a low power signal, which amplifies the radar signal, increasing the detector's effective range. That's what Farsyde meant by "seaping". Several years back, practically all radar detectors used the same frequency. A VG2 unit (which is a radar detector detector) simple listens for radio waves in that frequency. The range is not far, but if you drive past a VG2 unit, you will definitely be detected. To thwart this, heterodyne detectors now transmit on a different frequency, making them invisible to VG2 units. There are radar detectors out there with "VG2 detectors". This is because the VG2 units are also heterodyne, making them detectable at short distances (in other words, it's a radar detector detector detector).

But beware, there are VG-2 type units that were in testing, and could now be on the street, that can detect each and every radar detector available.

---jps

Question? Do laser jammers even work? From what I have read, the answer is no, but I will keep and open mind.

I will state that in my defense the areas I was driving in had VG-2 systems with the "Instant On" or "Pulse" feature. Sure they can just get an instant reading from anyone but they targeted people with radar detectors. It was an effort to try to get people to stop using them. My experience with this was that even speeding I would not be hit by the "Instant On" radar if my VG-2 Guard alarmed and my Radar Detector shut down.

I also had the blue tinted license plate covers. And several times while I was in a group of cars driving North on the I-5 going into downtown Portland at about 90 mph I would see a motor cycle cop up on top of a bridge with his laser gun zapping all the cars in my group. I never was pulled over in this kind of speed trap. I would see the officer trying to get a fix on my license plate with the laser and give up going to the next car. 4 or 5 cars would get pulled over around me but I never did. Obviously the officers were relying on there speed detection equipment in order to prosecute and with out getting a reading back from me they didn't want to waste their time. Whatever the case in my 6.5 years in Portland I received 3 tickets all of which were in the 1st 2 years before I got my detector. I upgraded at every chance I got and considered it to be a bargain in comparison to my tickets and insurance premium increases. I am highly interested in the laser jammers but I am not going to mount them in the license plate frame (I don't even have one on the front of my car). Instead I plan on conceling it so chances are it won't be seen. My biggest concern is that I go to BC about 3-4 times a year and if anyone was going to find it they would. I will have to try and figure out a switch that I can turn it off with incase they have radiation detection equipment at the border crossing.

thanks for clearing up what i said sputnik :D You're right valentine doesnt have a jammer, i was too caught up in my rant to reallize that. Just so everyone is aware, and hopefully will stop asking, i'm letting out a PSA:

PUBLIC SERVICE ANOUNCEMENT:

Things that DO NOT work, are NOT true:

-Passive Radar/Laser Jammers
-"Anti radar/laser" licence plate covers.
-"Anti radar/laser" mirror, tinted, or otherwise plates
-Any friggin diet drug that does not need an Rx or FDA approval
-stickers will not make you go faster
-radar, like all EM radiation (ie: light) suffers from cosine error. This means if the Valentine side arrows go off (and they are right), the officer read your speed as ~0mph. This isn't a licence to speed when you see it, just keep in mind he can't pull you over for it if it was from the side.
-93rdcurrent, you are one lucky guy. If it were me I'd have been pulled over each and every time. Just remember, all the times you described not being pulled over were absolute coincidences. If the cops really did get you with laser, you'd have a ticket.
-in addition to what me and sputnik said about being illegal:
--Active Jammers will put you in jail if not a heafty fine.
--ANY DETECTOR/JAMMER used in a vehicle registered as a commercial vehicle is illegal. Confiscation, and beleive it or not possible impound of you car/truck/spaceship can also happen. This is a federal law so when you get in your companies car, leave it out.
-Without an Active Jammer, radar and laser cannot be defeated under NORMAL conditions.

Things that BEARLY work:
-Almost any detector under 100 bux. Chances are you're still gettin the ticket. You get what you pay for, don't cheap out. This is one of thsoe times where more money = better detector. Valentine retails around $400 and the 8500 retails around $300. Either can be picked up (as each are getting old: Valentine > 10 years old, 8500 > 7 years old) for around 100-150 off retail.


I think that about does it, feel free to add to the list :D

Originally posted by PHA RX-8
Question? Do laser jammers even work? From what I have read, the answer is no, but I will keep and open mind. Yes, laser jammers do work. There are cheapo units out there which are as effective as $50 radar detectors, but in general, they are effective. Illegal in some places, but effective.

There are some units that will only turn on the jammer when it receives laser. This is only effective if the laser detector is located where the vehicle is being targeted, so normally, you would mount this near your license plate. Contrary to urban legends, there are other target areas (depending on car, color, etc.) which are also effective. If the officer decides to target an area other than your license plate, there is a good chance that the jammer unit won't sense it, and so it won't activate. Just beware of that weakness when considering one of these units.

Some tinted license plate covers actually are effective, to a point. The thing is, they only decrease the amount of laser reflected to the gun (kind of like putting on sunshades). So the officer cannot get a reading on your plate from a far distance (obviously, it's not effective on other aiming points ;)). But since a car is normally targeted at close range (~500ft.), it will rarely have any effect, which is why most people consider them useless. Besides, there are some locations with specific laws against them (carrying fines equal to a speeding ticket), and anywhere that there isn't a specific law against them, you can be ticketed for "obscuring a license plate", but that alone is normally much less than a speeding ticket (so some places made a specific law to make it a more substantial fine).

---jps

Thank you sputnick. I can only go off of my personal experience since I am no electronic engineer. I know what worked with my MR2 and I know that without the license plate covers I had and the radar/laser detector with VG-2 Guard I would be paying a whole lot more for car insurance now.

keep in mind radar and lazer jammers ... Lazer jammers .

Small point (not to quibble) but Laser is with an S not a Z. It is an acronym for Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation.